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Discussion Starter #1
I was checking out a really neat build of the T.O.S. Enterprise on eBay when I came to a surprising realization. This model has a completed bridge that can be seen through the upper dome, and I discovered that the only way for the bridge to sit correctly within the hull and line up with the "turbolift" shaft is for everything on the bridge to be cocked at a 30 degree angle. I don't know why that trips me out so much, but it just seems WRONG! Lol

Since I was a kid, I've always thought of the forward view-screen and the captain's chair as facing directly out of the nose of the ship. After all of these years to suddenly realize that as the Enterprise is majestically sailing forward through space, everyone on the bridge is actually riding sideways, just seems BIZARRE! Every time Kirk has faced the view-screen and stared down a cranky alien race, he's actually been looking sideways out of the ship!

Am I the only one that never realized this? Does it bother anyone else? It's the same feeling I got when I found out that there weren't ever really any "yellow" command shirts, they were all actually green. It just feels odd when you realize that you've been wrong for all these years over something you took for granted. Lol

Green line is how I thought the bridge faced.

Red line is how it actually is!



 

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Since the TOS Enterprise uses a view screen and not a forward window it doesn't matter to the crew. With the ship's inertial dampers active they wouldn't be the wiser. I like it though like an optical illusion. Another sci fi classic that plays tricks with perspective is 2001: A Space Odyssey. On the Discovery bridge, the pilots basically have to look upwards at quite an angle from their seated positions to see forward out the cockpit windows!
 

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This has been heavily discussed on this forum. The bridge will be modeled to face forward or be offset depending on your choice. In other forums this is discussed as to why they did this.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Oooops, lol. I was so excited by my discovery that I just rushed to share. ;)

I did do a search but didn't see any other threads on it. Just chalk it up to the enthusiasm of a new discovery. :)
 

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Oooops, lol. I was so excited by my discovery that I just rushed to share. ;)

I did do a search but didn't see any other threads on it. Just chalk it up to the enthusiasm of a new discovery. :)
Happens to everyone the first time..............try thinking about baseball next time! ;)
 

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I'm amazed... the entire exchange without a single cry of "JIHAAAAAAAAADDD!!!" :mad:

Seriously, it's remarkable how obvious this is once you start to look at things in 3D.

For the OP... the bridge set was originally planned to be built all in a line. The director of photography, and likely the actors as well, found that having the entrance to the bridge directly behind the actors made for poor photographic composition, and was also more than a little bit unsettling for the actors (how do YOU feel when someone enters a room directly behind you?).

My own preferred "in universe" explanation is based entirely on that second bit... many commanders didn't like having to turn entirely around to see who just came in (and thus having to lose their attention to what's going on with the helm and main viewer). So someone... who knows, maybe it was Captain Pike... decided to have the various computer consoles making up the bridge re-arranged a bit. Since everything, including the main viewer, is just a computer, and since the inertial movement of the ship is supposed to be entirely masked to the crew (otherwise, the first time you hit full impulse, you'd turn the entire crew into a thin red film on the rear wall of whatever compartment they were in!)... it's not like you'd be able to "steer by feel."

In my own explanation, any commander can, with a short period of downtime, have the bridge re-arranged into any configuration he/she/it wants. The only things that are "fixed" are the location of the indented region in the middle, and the location of the lift tube. Everything else can be rearranged to taste. (They actually played a bit with this, in ST-II... remember, the Reliant had a single lift tube, aft and at the centerline, aligned with the viewscreen.)

Other people disagree, and come up with a variety of other ways of putting things together... usually involving the turbolift being a TARDIS, or ignoring the scale of the ship, or shifting the bridge downwards out of the dome... none of which seem reasonable to me, personally.

That said, this is one of two topics which has been raging among Trek fans since the series was first on the air, it seems. (The other topic is "where is Main Engineering?" and as an addition to that, "where is the power generated?")

Both of these are ones that, in my opinion, are pretty fruitless to discuss... because the people on either side have already made up their respective minds, and are totally inflexible on the topic.

It's occasionally something we all get dragged into, but I've yet to see anyone shift, even a hair's breadth, from their original position in any of the discussions.

FYI, MGagen determined the exact angles of the various bridge segments, and the exact offset of the lift versus the main viewer. If you want to find commentary on this, and can't find it otherwise, look up his profile and look up some of his posts.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Thanks CLBrown! That's really cool information to know. I appreciate you posting it for me. To be honest, now that I've posted this, I'm a little embarrassed that I JUST noticed this "bridge issue", when everyone else has been aware of it for a long time. :eek:
 

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Thanks CLBrown! That's really cool information to know. I appreciate you posting it for me. To be honest, now that I've posted this, I'm a little embarrassed that I JUST noticed this "bridge issue", when everyone else has been aware of it for a long time. :eek:
Don't take it personally, we have just been around the ring a few times on this one here and we are a bit "Punch Drunk" about it.
 

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This has been heavily discussed on this forum. The bridge will be modeled to face forward or be offset depending on your choice. In other forums this is discussed as to why they did this.
You mean Round 2 1/350 scale? That's just cool of them to leave an option.

I think I realized this back on my second or third build in my teens. I called my friend to tell him. He was a major ST fan, too. But not a model builder. I think you have to see and feel the model, before the "Bridge Epiphany" hits you.

Welcome, Spidey7!
 

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Ya know, just to throw it out there, it's always been one of those 'assumed' things that the tube on the aft exterior of the bridge MUST be the turbolift shaft. Why? It can't be something else like an external hardpoint for fluid/gas passover?

Yes of course having it be the lift shaft is the most simple answer. Then again, Think of the decades where people assumed that the trigger on a hand phaser was on top, right under that grid thing. :)
 

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I wanted the Polar Lights bridge to actually have the turbo car sticking off the side and having it serve as a locater pin that tucks into the exterior tube. You could still make the bridge face forward, but you'd have to snip the turbocar off the piece -- a tacit admission that the forward orientation is not really possible...

Alas, they dodged the issue.

M.
 

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Thanks CLBrown! That's really cool information to know. I appreciate you posting it for me. To be honest, now that I've posted this, I'm a little embarrassed that I JUST noticed this "bridge issue", when everyone else has been aware of it for a long time. :eek:
Since this is "new" to you, I thought I'd post (as a thumbnail... click it to see the full-size image) something I've posted before, on this issue... my 3D work on the bridge portion of the ship (thumbnailed rather than full-size so as to not annoy those who've seen this before too badly).

I did make a small tweak to this area... I increased the height of the lift tube a bit. This was something driven by my efforts to make the entire interior of the ship fit into the exterior of the ship and line up properly. I slightly tweaked a few window vertical locations... not even noticably, I think... and I altered the bridge lift tube height. But otherwise, the ship is as-seen on-screen. (I plan to modify my R2 kit to match my 3D stuff here, by the way.)



I'm absolutely not the only person to ever go through this exercise... some in 2D, some in 3D... but those who go through the exercise in 3D always, it seems, come to the same conclusion.
 
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