[Danny-SMC]

As most of you know I like to share info and let everyone know what is going on in the battery market. Our goal at SMC is to offer the best possible race packs. That being said there is no way for SMC to control the packs we receive from the factories. The factories make the cells using the same materials and process every time. If one of the materials is slightly different this can change the outcome of the cells but the cells. In the sub-c days it was the same as some batches would be a bit better than others. In fact Lipos are way more consistent from batch to batch than sub-c cells.

Our first batch of 7070-1S2P packs have gotten great reviews and I've gotten PMs and emails asking if I still had some packs from this first batch. We sold the entire first batch the very same day it came in. Now we have a new shipment coming in tomorrow and it's all sold. I have no way of knowing if the packs in the new shipment will be the same as the first shipment. The factory tells me they come from the same batch but I have no way of knowing if they sort out cells in a specific batch. They tell me they don't but I have my doubts on this and we will find out tomorrow.

I was also made aware that at least one pack from the first shipment of 50 had lower mAh and the same data as the lower runtime packs that we offered at a lower price.

I would like the feedback of racers who use our packs or plan on purchasing our packs.

Since pack data seems so important to racers should we start testing and sorting out the packs when we get a shipment in ? This would encounter higher prices and we would most likely stop offering our packs through distribution. Supply would be limited as we would not order as many packs so we don't get stuck with a batch that is slightly out of spec that we have to sell at the discounted price.

Should we keep things as they are now and let it be luck of the draw?

Looking forward to getting feedback on this.

 

[nickbell1390]

Quite honestly for me I think I woul pay a few more dollars to get what I was promised. There's nothing like buying a new pack running or cycling it a few times only to find out its no better than the packs you already have or worse the pack you have been running for 6 months.

 

[Danny-SMC]

In a perfect scenario a new pack should be the same as the previous one you bought but that can't be guaranteed as many factors can impact the performance of a batch of cells.

Here is an example of a difference between batches.

34 seconds less on the runtime or 330mAh. 0.2 higher IR and 0.02 less average voltage.

First batch versus second batch. The first batch packs is what we sold as the 7070-1S2PLR packs and we plan on offering more of these if the factory can send us more of these. First batch packs sold at 44.95 second batch at 59.95

The problem I see with sorting out packs is what happens if a batch comes in and the mAh is in the proper range but the IR and voltage is off ?

 

[jflack]

............

 

[jflack]

..........

 

[Danny-SMC]

This has nothing to do with marketing. This has to do with trying to find the best solution for the racers. I personally feel it makes no sense to sort out the packs but with racers PM and emailing me asking for the same packs as they got or from the same batch made me think about all of this. This is why I created this thread to see what our customers think of this.

 

[Danny-SMC]

Not sure if you guys read my thread about the fluctuation within a batch of cells.

http://www.hobbytalk.com/bbs1/showpost.php?p=4313378&postcount=21

You may want to check it out if you haven't already.

 

[Danny-SMC]

As far as battery wars goes there really isn't any war possible. All high end 1S packs come from one factory. The only thing that is different is if one batch is different than the next. This is why I created this thread as we could do something about this by checking every pack that comes in and making sure it's at the expected specs. In this case I'm talking about mAh.

I posted the difference between the lower mAh batch and the regular mAh batch. Until someone can try both packs in real race conditions in a car that has ideal setup then we don't know the impact on a full run. One thing to note is that 0.02 average voltage difference in a Lipo is only the equivalent of 0.005 per cell difference in a sub-c pack as there was 4 cells in series.

 

[mr_meat68]

you guys can go and do all you can to raise prices in this hobby when in fact thats the hole problem in r/c racing. its too expensive. the end

 

[J-Dub Racing]

How are batts ROAR approved if they are different every time from the factory?

 

[Danny-SMC]

This has nothing to do with raising prices it's about asking our customers to chime in on what we should do with one particular pack we offer.

Not sure if you use to race when sub-c were used but most racers would buy 4 packs to start a season and most likely buy another 4 packs in the middle of the season. Were talking about packs that would cost 45 to 55.00 per pack. Now 5 years later you can race with only one pack and it will last a good amount of cycles.

The nature of the racer is what makes racing expensive but that is a whole other topic.

 

[Danny-SMC]

How are batts ROAR approved if they are different every time from the factory?

There is no battery manufactured for RC use that will be exactly the same all the time. It's normal to have fluctuations. In this case were talking about a 5% difference in mAh and 10% difference in IR which results in a 0.6% difference in average voltage. I think these differences are very minor and are completely acceptable.

 

[Donnie_99]

why not grade each batch . kind of like we used to do in round cells offer diff levels of packs . set them at diff prices but dont get to high on the prices

 

[Danny-SMC]

We could do something like this and I actually did it with this new model as the 7070-1S2PLR packs at 44.95 were lower in mAh so we sold them at a lower price.

The problem I see is that normally a batch comes in and the packs are all very close to the same data. So maybe we don't have lower priced packs if the batch is good and if it's a bit off we don't have higher priced packs. Also if you look at my last post were not talking about a huge difference.

I hope everyone can understand more about all of this and see there is really no easy solution. One easy solution would of been for me to just do like our competitors and sell packs and not worry about all of this but as a racer and guy who cares I want feedback from our customers.

 

[Benracin']

If you don't have any control over production and all packs are within an acceptable range, I fail to see your logic for this. You have stated that all high end packs come from the same factory, yet in previous posts you said you were working with the factory to obtain optimum performance and longevity. How is it that you have input into your packs specs if they are all the same. Something doesn't smell right.

 

[Danny-SMC]

Here we go again everything has to be a conspiracy.

The logic is simple. Do our customers want us to test and sort out packs or do they want to keep it luck of the draw.

We deal with what I feel to be the best factory that does the best performance packs and have good reliability. The proof of this is that we first started selling packs from this factory 5 years ago and now many of our competitors buy from them.

I don't have input in the specs of the packs they send us. I just order the model I want and they send them to us.

 

[Benracin']

I didn't say there was any conspiracy. My point is on one hand you say that all the packs are the same and then you turn around and say that yours are different. You can't have it both ways.

 

[Danny-SMC]

Not sure where I said that our packs are different ? The 7070-1S2P is the latest model from the factory.

 

[Donnie_99]

on the track do u think u can see the diff between the batches performance?

 

[Danny-SMC]

I'm pretty sure there will be one in a perfect car under a perfect run. I hope to have some feedback this coming week. I have guys sending me GFX data and saying how the LR packs cycle versus the regular ones but no one has yet given me lap time differences or the impact in a perfect run. As soon as I have the real track info I will post it.