[stanmmx]

Dear All:

By living in Greece I witnessed the activities of one of the Major Greek vehicle producer,that being Biamax.

The name stands for Vehicle Body Building Industry but in reality that did not concentrated their activities in Bus Body Building only;other types of vehicles were made.One of the most known models is the 0-302S2 Transit and Coach buses which were a combo of the 0-302 and O-303 Mercedes Benz Bus models.

The original owners were,in the 1930's,importers if Mercedes Benz vehicles and by 1956 activities started by making bodies for Mercedes Benz buses;chassis would be developed by the 1960's.

This company which offered a large range of bus products would also be involved on railway wagon production,and assembly of other vehicles and were involved on other activities as well such as Research and Development and nowadays it operates on the real estate area only.

The R models series were introduced in 1960 and were the first unitary construction buses in the world (e.g.,no chassis) and came on interurban and coach format.

This is the R514 coach.

This the R495 Transit Bus bus.

This one I rode and remember vividly:1962 Biamax trolleybus with Lancia Suspenison (Lancia/Casaro and CGE electrical components) from 1960.I liked to ride it because I knew it was a very rare unit and was still running when I left the country.

As a chassis was developed by 1960,the most known models to be produced would be these ones:

Most of these buses were exported;there was a time that 50% of Biamax production was exported.There was also a rugged model for the Middle East,called the Biamax desert bus (1960's again) and some of them are still running over there.

Desert bus (above) this being a 1964 model.

And finally the 0-302S2:

This site shows some of the greek bus bodymakers.Jane's Urban Transport Systems list some more besides these.

Buses in Greece

 

[Lummox]

Wow, so do you think Biamax built this beauty?

Lancia suspension...very interesting for sure.
Did Mercedes make bus bodies themselves in any great numbers???

 

[stanmmx]

Wow, so do you think Biamax built this beauty?

Lancia suspension...very interesting for sure.
Did Mercedes make bus bodies themselves in any great numbers???

Dear Dave:

The Matchbox model is from a Mercedes Benz bus produced in Germany.

Daimler Benz is the largest producer of commercial vehicles (trucks and buses) and in the bus scene,they manufacture the whole bus (called integral bus) or bus chassis (which are equally suitable for trucks and these are non-integral buses) which will receive a different body but since this is a Mercedes Chassis the body will have the body manufacture's name on it plus the Mercedes Benz star.

Brazil as an example has a large bus industry;consequently no foreign buses are seen either as coaches or Transit Buses.All of them are non integral type and chassis (as of now) come from Mercedes Benz,Scania,Volvo.

Mercedes Benz classify their integral buses with letter O;hence,O-302,O-303,O-405 and so on.Their chassis for different bus bodies have the LP,LPO,OF classification.

CAIO (Companhia Americana Industrial de Onibus) started activities in 1946 and up to now is a major Brazilian Bus Body producer.As you will see below,the CAIO name is stamped under the window at the left side and the Mercedes Benz star at the middle of the grille.The board states which Mercedes Benz Chassis it was built on.

More details on that issue coming later.

Nick K

 

[stanmax]

Dear All:

And then,some maniac will steal a bus and do that as is shown in the video below (this one is a MCI Coach).The pursuit lasted for hours.Oh,and these are rated at 27,600 pounds curb weight so the CHP really had a problem here.....

 

[stanmax]

Dear All:

LADOT - Los Angeles Department of Transportation - had the usual Gilligs,Neoplans and TMC RTS,Eldorado National minibuses at their fleet.However their were the sole Authority to feature the Stewart and Stevenson Apollo T-40 which was a Brazilian rebuilt Mercedes Benz O-371 Transit Bus and these were introduced in 1992 but remained in service to until 2012.A demonstrator Apollo remained in Houston and used by the local transit Authority for a short while.

Stewart and Stevenson Apollo T-40

Stewart and Stevenson started operations in Houston,Texas in 1902 and main core of the business was repairs (at first on horse-powered vehicles) and custom vehicle modifications.

As time passed their were involved with Marine,Aircraft,Mining,Turbine operations by either manufacturing components and setting domestic and international sales outlets for these products.Their Transit Bus operation was brief and went from 1987 to 1992.

They also offered an array of military vehicles and truck cabs.

Their rail operations included the Rail King,a mobile rail car mover

Rail King Mobile Wagon mover.

LADOT started operations in Los Angeles in the end of the 1980's and the Commuter Express were routes from downtown to many neighborhoods and were classified as express routes.

Close to 1990's DASH - Downtown Area Short Hop minibus routes were introduced and it expanded to many other areas besides downtown.

And this is the Brazilian Mercedes Benz O-371 transit bus:

Utube film about the Apollo T-40:

 

[Lummox]

Always very informative Nick. :thumbsup:

Makes me think; Brazil must be among the top automobile producers in the World
next to the U.S., Japan, and Europe. (?)

 

[stanmax]

Dear Dave:

Their car industry is not at the top of the charts (because,as an example,while 14 to 20% the residents of Los Angeles uses public transit on a daily basis,around 45% of Sao Paulo Brazil residents uses public transport on daily basis).Of course car ownership increased tenfold on the last fifty years and there were many,many multinational and local makes which appeared and disappeared in this period.It is actually the eight producer of vehicles.

Their bus industry is a major commodity and import of buses are not allowed.Some MCIs will be seen because they came for other countries.The vehicles are rugged and dependable because as the GMC RTS from North America they will reach a million plus miles quite easily.Hence there are the imports and sharing of technology/components of these vehicles.

The Stewart and Stevenson Apollo T-40 was a major rebuild of the Mercedes Benz O-371;this company started business by doing exactly that.

Nick K

 

[Full Flaps!]

Their car industry is not at the top of the charts (because,as an example,while 14 to 20% the residents of Los Angeles uses public transit on a daily basis,around 45% of Sao Paulo Brazil residents uses public transport on daily basis).

And around 45% of Sao Palo residents are probably all the better for riding public transit too. From what I've read, Sao Palo has quite the robbery and carjacking problem.

I enjoy your bus thread Nick, you're quite the scholar on the subject. I too am a big fan of buses, and it probably comes from riding them extensively as a child, because we never had a car. I rode the Flxible Metro, which because of it's steep rake I referred to as the ''hot rod bus". The composite windows rattled like hell in their frames because they could all be slid open, letting in lots of cool air, to me that was all part of the drama.

The GMC RTS felt very bulky, and not particularly spacious inside, but the ride was good. They were considerably more quiet than the Flxibles, mainly because the windows were fixed, so no riding with the wind in your face. They opened only for emergency exit.

I even got to ride the last of the GM New Looks, those were great! Very solid bus, the interiors were straight out of the 60's, green vinyl seating (with real padding!), in fact the whole bus smelled of vinyl. Aluminum fixtures and trim everywhere, the windows were tinted blue, including the panoramic back window. And sitting atop that growling two-stroke Detroit Diesel as we navigated the city streets always put a smile on my face. These are pics of the very buses I rode back in the early-80's

 

[Lummox]

Neat to hear someone's bus experiences as there were none where I grew up in the sticks.
And how cool is that...you taking pix of them back then!

The red mid '60s Chevy pickup has some strange hub caps I can't I.D. - Where's Dr. Hauler?! He would know.
Some crazy inboard exhaust stacks on that truck too.

 

[Full Flaps!]

I wish I'd had a camera back then, but I grabbed these pics from a bus site that just happened to have a few from my home city.

I was noticing the pipes on that truck too.
The caps have a fluted piecrust look around the centers.

 

[stanmax]

And around 45% of Sao Palo residents are probably all the better for riding public transit too. From what I've read, Sao Palo has quite the robbery and carjacking problem.

I enjoy your bus thread Nick, you're quite the scholar on the subject. I too am a big fan of buses, and it probably comes from riding them extensively as a child, because we never had a car. I rode the Flxible Metro, which because of it's steep rake I referred to as the ''hot rod bus". The composite windows rattled like hell in their frames because they could all be slid open, letting in lots of cool air, to me that was all part of the drama.

The GMC RTS felt very bulky, and not particularly spacious inside, but the ride was good. They were considerably more quiet than the Flxibles, mainly because the windows were fixed, so no riding with the wind in your face. They opened only for emergency exit.

I even got to ride the last of the GM New Looks, those were great! Very solid bus, the interiors were straight out of the 60's, green vinyl seating (with real padding!), in fact the whole bus smelled of vinyl. Aluminum fixtures and trim everywhere, the windows were tinted blue, including the panoramic back window. And sitting atop that growling two-stroke Detroit Diesel as we navigated the city streets always put a smile on my face. These are pics of the very buses I rode back in the early-80's

Dear Sir:

Many thanks.

I drive cars in the Los Angeles area but I love buses - the vehicles - and from 1979 to 2009 I was between the 14% who rides public transport.Now I do not came out much but if I have to cover long distances I would go by public transit.

SCRTD - Southern California Rapid Transit District - had,in 1979,a combination of GMC old and new look,Flexble New Look and AMG Metrpolitan plus vehicles from minibus co. which were minibuses on Dodge Chassis.They also just acquired the AMG/MAN Articulated transit bus.The Flexbles and GMC would have 20 years life;the first bus I rode in this Country was a GMC Old look which was already quite aged and these were decommissioned in 1980 as the RTS series arrived.SCRTD lasted from 1964 to 1992 and was replaced by LACMTA - Los Angeles County Metropolitan Transportation Authority.

The RTS were used until 1999 and are considered tough buses.Other that came after 1980 were the Neoplans,Carpenter minibus,Flexble 870 and Metro,Neoplan Double Decker,considered by drivers the Rolls Royce of buses,New Flyers and Orions (the latter are used on a single area only).NABI and a new generation of New Flyers came around this Century.There were also second hand Gilligs,Thomas Built Buses,Bluebird and Ford with Eldorado Body and Eldorado minibuses and these are all retired.So are all the Neoplans and the older Flyers.

4XXX fleet number were composed of Neoplans and 35 foot Flexbles at first,and by 1982 GMC RTS on that length.These were decommissioned in 2007/2008 and were the buses who lasted the longest on the SCRTD/LACMTA combo.

Nick K

EDIT:These are videos from the various Transit Authorities of Los Angeles and the equipment used by them in 2015 and 2016.

Below,my favorite bus of all time and as of now extremely rare:the 7100 fleet number from SCRTD - Flexble New Look buses with Cummins 903 engines.I loved these so much that when I would ride one I'd go to the back to hear the engine (and the tranny shifting).These were retired in 1984 due to a dispute with Cummins.I was aware that this museum in Northern California had acquired one of them in the mid-2000's but I discovered this video in 2013,nearly thirty years also I heard the last of them.Most of the Flexbles had Detroit Diesel engines;only a very few had this Cummins engine installed.SCRTD fleet 7100-7199;the one on the video is unit 7103.

And finally,the one below is from 2007,filmed near Los Angeles Union Station and shows many buses (such as the Neoplans) that been retired.The movie maker did it right by focusing at the fleet numbers as the buses passed.

NOTE:the MCI bus with Santa Clarita Transit markings.I rode this Authority when I worked in Santa Clarita,a community located north of my neck of the woods,part of Los Angeles County,not City (so is Sheriff Department territory).

Love this videos.....as much as the train videos.

 

[stanmax]

Dear All:

Is known as AMG -AM General - and they are still active building Military vehicles and got the rights to produce the vehicle from Vehicle Production Group which manufactures a new generation of Taxis and are equally used by Paratransit corporations,such as Acess Paratransit because it has a lifter for the handicapped.

In basic terms AMG had the Metropolitan Transit Bus and offered that between 1974 and 1979 and at that period,American Motors and General Motors were actually building Transit Buses.In Brazil as the 1990's,Ford had a chassis that being the B bus chassis and was applicable to mount Transit Bus bodies on that.

This story starts when Overland was added to Standard Wheel Company in 1903 as an automotive division.Willys got Overland in 1908 and it became the Willys-Overland which was winner of the military contract for the production Jeep.Of course,American Bantam - read it American Austin - also had a prototype but was incapable to produce it in large quantities.As the war went forward past 1941,Ford also produced the Jeep (as the GP version) because this time Willys was not able to deliver high quantities but the patent was given to Willys.

Kaiser Motors purchased Willys-Overland in 1953.As the war ended,Willys was selling the Jeep to the general public (not a M model but a CJ model).To expand the lineup,a Station Wagon and Pick Up were introduced (different chassis and design than the Jeep) and as they produced cars before,an Automobile Called the Aero came to be;all this at the beginning of the 1950's.

Kaiser also had a (recent) line of cars and some of them were extremely practical because it had a fastback capability - i.e.,the whole rear end would go up - making a sedan with the same capability of a Station Wagon and equally all seats would go flat so one could actually pass a night there when doing a long trip.

But Kaiser was mostly looking at the Jeep and its military contract possibilities.That being said,the Kaiser and Willys automobiles were retired by 1955;the Station Wagon and pickup remained but tooling was kept in case these would be built abroad.The (beautiful) Kaiser Manhattan became the Kaiser Carabela in Argentina being built between 1958 and 1962 and was considered a top of the line vehicle (as a Buick in the USA).The Aero would be produced,on the original tolling in Brazil between 1960 and 1963;by 1964 a redesigned model,the 2600 was introduced and production of this one up to 1971 alongside its badge make Itamaraty.

By 1964 Kaiser bought Studebaker's General Products Division (its military arm) and formed the Defense and Government Products Division in 1967 and at the same time they received a contract for Military Trucks.

As 1971 approached and American Motors secured the patent of the Jeep the Defense and Government Products Division was renamed AM General which would produce buses,large trucks and the bodies for the Jeep from USPS.On the end of the 1970's the High Mobility Multipurpose Wheeled Vehicle (HMMWV or Hummer) was developed.

They are known as the New Flyer industries and started business in 1930 and was founded by John Coval as the Western Auto and Truck Body Works Ltd. in Winnipeg,Canada.Due to the fact that the company was struggling it was acquired by the Canadian Government and renamed Flyer Industries Limited.

By 1986 the owner of Den Oudsten Bussen BV - Dutch Bus Manufacturer lead by Jan den Oudsten - acquired Flyer and now is called New Flyer Industries Ltd. Oudsten buses were produced between 1926 to 2002;the company ceased operation due to bankruptcy but bus enthusiasts are preserving the (older) units.

The AMG Metropolitan transit was based on the Flyer Industries Ltd. D800.The 1971 contract specified that AMG would build and market Flyer buses in the United States;however the front end of redesigned so it was a Flyer by licence but a whole different vehicle.40 and 35 foot lenghts,96 and 102 inches width and the model nomenclature would follow these data -10240 would indicate a 40 foot long bus,102 inches width.Produced from 1974 to 1979.

AM General Metropolitan 10240 Transit Bus

Flyer Industries Ltd. D800 Transit Bus

AMG Metropolitans were also offered as trolleybuses for SEPTA -Southeastern Pennsylvania Transportation Authority and Metro Transit of Seattle.All were model 10240T.

An articulated bus was also - should we say - assembled.MAN from Germany would send the bodies and the rest of the manufacture will be carried by AMG.Buses had 55 or 60 feet lenghts and produced for a short time - 1977 to 1979.

AM General Articulated Transit Bus

Another AMG products:

The postal Jeep

Vehicle Production Group MV-1

M-151 A2 Utility Truck

M809 Military Five ton truck.

You tube video of an AM General Metropolitan Transit Bus.

 

[Full Flaps!]

Vehicle Production Group MV-1

A local taxi company uses these things in their fleet, white with pink trim.
Without a doubt, one of the homeliest looking vehicles built today.

 

[Lummox]

I sorta like that homely MV-1 mini van because it's not trying to be trendy with a giant angry front.
It's not even trying to be good looking.

That's more than I would ever learned about AMG on my own. Nicely done!

 

[Full Flaps!]

That's one way of looking at it, it's not trendy or angry looking, it just is. I can appreciate that.
But actually seeing them on the street makes you wonder what the automotive world has come to.

 

[Lummox]

Heard.
And seeing most the stuff on the street makes me think the same thing

 

[stanmax]

Dear All:

A very current video from buses of MTA New York Bus.New Flyers,Orions some Nova Bus and some Nova Bus RTS still running.

This one for Chicago CTA buses.

A good quantity of Nova Buses.

 

[stanmax]

Dear All:

This is how the majority of the Brazilian roads are (out of the Sao Paulo - Rio de Janeiro Axis but even there roads like that will be the case) and what the bus drivers (or truck,car drivers) have to do to pass them.

The most developed part of Brazil is the Southern part of the Country but that does not mean that roads like that will not be met;the Northwestern part is where the jungle is.Roads were made to traverse even the Amazon jungle but that does not mean that asphalt will be present.The Northeastern part of the Country have almost desert conditions and drought is always present.

The President Juscelino Kubitschek introduced the Auto Industry in Brazil (1956) on a era when the country was mostly agricultural but Industry was at full steam in parts such as Sao Paulo which is still one of the major industrial parts of the country.The city of Sao Paulo had (and certain municipalities close to it still are like this in name of the environment,that being the Municipality of Rio Grande da Serra) mostly unpaved roads;in the 1960's and 1970's a great part received asphalt but still many areas and neighborhoods and municipalities were and are lacking it.Equally,roads at times will be half built with asphalt at times featuring very dangerous features such as exposed guard rails which if hit it could tear your car apart.

Railways never caught much in Brazil;there was a Sao Paulo - Rio de Janeiro passenger railway connection but most of the travelers preferred ( and still do) bus travel.Hence,that rail travel is no longer available and rail is seen,as in the USA as a freight operation but still the overall mileage is not that large and entire section of the country do not have a single mile of track.Hence,these roads.Urban centers - Sao Paulo is the most interesting case:they had trolleys in the past and as in Los Angeles they were the main transport arm but since that town had grown irregularly certain trolley lines would just block traffic and these lines were gone people were happy;some other lines that had isolated paths were also removed and as of now many question this decision because these areas have very bad traffic flows (as the rest of the city) and the trolley would had more sense.The trolley mode was all gone by 1968 and nowadays the subway and heavy rail routes are connected and serve most of the city and many external municipalities close to Sao Paulo.

Even today what is seen above is the rule.

And on a second note,this is the reason of the Ford F-100 be built as a sedan - it was and is the better choice for the roads from cities/municipalities/intercity.

 

[Lummox]

Seems like I've heard some think they own the road and make no effort to make a safe passage...especially if they are not on the cliff side of the road.

Maybe some cultures have a different attitude about death, but it seems more than homicidal to squeeze a whole bus load of innocent people over a 100ft. cliff.

 

[stanmax]

Seems like I've heard some think they own the road and make no effort to make a safe passage...especially if they are not on the cliff side of the road.

Maybe some cultures have a different attitude about death, but it seems more than homicidal to squeeze a whole bus load of innocent people over a 100ft. cliff.

Dear Dave:

In this case is all politics.These roads are the only link to these communities as railroads are absent hence buses have to transport people and trucks have to carry freight on these conditions.My Uncle would tell me all about that and I had the good idea to take notes.They made the road and several places depend upon it because there isn't any other way to reach them.But asphalt and improvements are absent and the most common excuse will be lack of funds for this.It is a 'no care about' case coming from the Authorities - something that is quite well known worldwide.

Nick K