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Discussion Starter #2
yea, his cells come with detailed directions on how to charge and care for them. My uncle bought three of them, and i wanted to check them out to make sure the numbers arent false. didnt want to take a chance.
 

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looks to me that he's playing with the voltage numbers.... not running the GP's out to the end of the cycle. he's calculating them at 360 seconds. beware
 

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Well I bought 2 packs and I asked for the run time I was looking for and he got it for me. The numbers were true on my turbo 35 matcher. Voltage was not as important for mod 12th. As far as the voltage goes, from what I understand he was trying to give comparable voltage numbers to 3000's which max out about 360 seconds. Take it for what it is worth. I will definately by the rest of my packs from Chuck in the future. Besides that he told me if I wasn't happy with the batteries he would refund my money. You can't beat that!!!
 

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Why are you guys saying they seem to be playing with discharge figures? They state that they all are at 30 amps and go to .9 volt cuttoff...

The numbers are not much differnt then what SMC is saying... 1.13, 1.14, 1.15.... Heck SMC is saying 1.16s are seen regularly on the high end even before the 'new shipment'.

I really don't see anything to indicate the numbers from World Class are not to be beleived.
(innocent till proven guilty and all).
 

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tempest, i agree with the runtime issue here. i run 4 cell stock, and mod. for mod, i need packs that have good runtime. but for stock, voltage is king...... and you can't compare a cell that does NOT have a full runout on voltage. quite franky, i don't understand why CE even offers that option on their matchers.
 

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dyno, look at the fine print on the GP3300 page. is says that they use a 360 second voltage cutoff. this means that the discharge average voltage stops calculating at 360 seconds. you get the "good" voltage at the beginning of the discharge curve, without the "bad" voltage at the end. the runtime runs out to .90 volts like everyone else does. integy does the same thing with their voltage numbers.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
runtime really isnt that important for me since i run a buggy on an indoor offroad track. its a tight curved track, so the Internal Resistance is one of the most important numbers for me. the packs my uncle got were rated between 20-22, which isnt bad for stock racing. i think i might try them out.
 

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Ah... I didn't see that 360 cutoff... The letters are lite blue on my screen and very hard to read. Previously when I looked at the fine print I didn't see that part...

You know I like the idea of using some cutoff numbers like that, but they should also give the full runout numbers as well...


Quite frankly if those numbers are at a shortende cutoff... (360 seconds) they are not very good numbers. Like I said before, SMC is reporting simmilar numbers with full runouts...

However it we all also should be aware that there are many other variables that effect discharge numbers... room temp, equipment, charge parameters, etc... so it's really not 100% possible to compare ANY numbers from one Matcher to the next... Basicly you buy the best you can afford and hope for the best.
 

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To all that are concerned, the reason why Chuck cuts the GP's off at 360 is so that you can have/make a true comparision with the 3000 cells. Give him a call before you accuse him of playing games. You know what they say about assumptions...

Fred Hubbard
 

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fhubbard said:
Give him a call before you accuse him of playing games. You know what they say about assumptions...
I didn't accuse or assume any thing, he tells you that he manipulate's the #'s on his website! So atleast he is honest about it. :rolleyes:

I don't even think Integy tells you. :mad: Which is why I will stick to Pro Match, I trust Jeff. He also has a a money back guarentee! Plus he doesn't manipulate the numbers.
 

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rowle1jt said:
I didn't accuse or assume any thing, he tells you that he manipulate's the #'s on his website! So atleast he is honest about it. :rolleyes:

I don't even think Integy tells you. :mad: Which is why I will stick to Pro Match, I trust Jeff. He also has a a money back guarentee! Plus he doesn't manipulate the numbers.
rowle1jt- why are you being defensive??? First of all I was mainly directing my post to panacartom, if you read his/her post you will see the connection. Athough I DON'T care for Integy management, I understand why they also choose to adopt this method of matching cells. There is sufficeint evidence to support both methods for matching cells. If we only run for 5 minutes I would want to know how my cells would perform in that time frame. Truthfully, anything after 5 min can be considered irrelevant. But then again I also want to know the max potential of my cells. Calm down pal, but hey if the shoe fits...

Further more, when you use the term manipulation in the way you have it has a negative connotation.
 

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Ok "manipulation" = bad choice of words on my part. :cool:

But I still don't like it. I see where your coming from with the 5 minute thing, but I would still rather know the WHOLE run out. It just seems like some matchers do things to make their packs look better. Some still do 20amp #'s, fine but at 30 amps you can weed out weak or bad cells. Is a pack of GREAT 20 amp #'s with 1 weak cell gonna run as good as a 30 amp pack with no weak cells? No it won't, if they are fairly equal to begin with. Discharge rates and cutoffs are the two biggest ways for slime-ball matchers to get better numbers, Chuck is not a slime-ball. I am not saying World Class is doing this, I know a lot of people locally that I repsect highly that run World Class batteries. I know he has decent stuff, I just think he could convince more racers to run his cells if he changed to more standard and accepted matching process. :)

No, the shoe doesn't fit. Its size 11 and I wear a 13. :D
 

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fhub.... i read chuck's disclaimer as to why he cuts off the voltage at 360 seconds, and it's admirable that he's up front about it. my question is, what do i care how his cells compare to old HV's? when i buy cells, i want to have at least a fair comparison of voltages of the same type of cells, by reputable matchers. i can't do that with chuck's cells because of the way he rates them. again, his stuff might be the total answer, but from my chair, i can't tell whether that is the case or not.
 

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pancartom- Then say that, but don't make statements that makes this man and his products appear as if he is playing games, that's not cool. Again I think it's only fair to him and others if you say what you mean and not make a statement with so much ambiguity that also has negative undertones. That kind of stuff is damaging to his reputation. Why am I concerned, because I own a small business and word of mouth accounts for a significant part of our business and it's the same for Chuck and other companies alike. Be nice;)

rowle1jt- I can tell you and anyone that I know for a fact that Chuck is very honest about his products. On the other hand, Integy, just from my dealings with their drivers I would say that their cells are SUSPECT.
 

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For what it's worth... SMC is saying they are getting 1.14 volt cells and 1.15 volt cells routinely with full runout. Danny also says that he also gets the ocasional few cells that go 1.16 or higher... This is even without considering some of the cells he recently obtained were up over 1.17 volts per cell... again with full run out...

So to me 1.13, 1.14, or even 1.15 with a 360 second cutoff doesn't sound all that great. Basicly you should be able to get numbers that good with a full run out.
 

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I set our 4-cell stock record with a 3000 sanyo World Class "Factory Boys" pack. Right now it is my best pack even better than my GP 3300's. But I ordered 2 more of those factory boys packs and they are dogs, so for me it was hit and miss. But I think the last batch were the last he had so the numbers were down a bit.

Alot of guys run his packs at our track. I have heard though he hasn't been getting real good numbers though lately but that could be all hearsay.
 

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Dyno, you beat me to it. 1.13-1.15 voltage calc. at 360 seconds is terrible. I don't think ANY GP cell would be that bad.

I have a friend who races World class batteries and all his cells come with 5000 runout numbers. Are they accurate??? On his T-30 they're within reason.
 
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