View Full Version : XRAY M18 Performance
03-08-2004, 12:41 PM
Does anybody here own one of these cars? Has anybody driven one?
I just drove one of these cars last week at a race here and the car was very planted. The track was a fairly rough outdoor asphalt surface. My BRP did not work no matter what I did but the M18 tracked straight, did not hop and had great corner speed.
Anybody else have any thoughts on the M18?
03-08-2004, 03:41 PM
Have not seen one run here several guys have them but never finished setting them up.
03-08-2004, 09:49 PM
Good car, especially if the surface isnt smooth.
I still think on carpet my Penguin Equiped Micro RS4 is faster than my M18. The M18 has a few issues that will eventually get resolved.
03-09-2004, 11:39 AM
Yeah, I just built my M18 last night.
I have seen the M18's run on carpet and I have never seen a micro that could keep up.
The M18's on five cells with stock motor were faster than the HPI cars on 6 cells around the track.
The BRP on carpet can definitely compete with the XRAY.
WHat issues with the XRAY are you referring to pat?
03-09-2004, 01:34 PM
We run the Xray micros at our track every Wednesday and on Sundays. Our track is ozite carpet, and we run them with the TRC micro foams. I myself am running purple fronts and pink rears. In general, the M18's at our track with the foam tires suffer from too much bite (imagine that). So, what most of us are doing is gluing the outside edge of the tires and a very small band along the outer tread. After that, they are pretty well hooked up. We tried to run the cars with the kit tires, but there was too little grip and the cars were rallying around the corners (fun, but not fast). The HPI cars aren't even close, by the way. One guy is fast with his HPI, but it has the Ratzas chassis and 6-cells compared to our box stock chassis and 5-cells, and he is at least a lap off the pace. We do have a couple of guys with BRP cars, but they don't run them. I believe they would be close, because they seem to be pretty quick when they are playing around.
03-09-2004, 06:48 PM
The XRay tends to wander on long straights, it seems to be because of the excessive rear toe-in but a fix is on the way with the new 2.5 degree toe links. Quite a few people are having problems with the tranny using foam tires on carpet and big block motors. The gear diff causes the car to do a rapid turn around if all the weight is transfered to the outside tire in a high speed tight turn. They need some stiffer springs for those of us who race on a smooth ozite track.
If a M18 on 5 cells is faster than an HPI based car on 6 cells the person runing the HPI doesnt know what they are doing.
I run my M18 in mod and my HPI/Penguin P3500LM in stock and consistantly get the fastest laptimes in the stock class.
On asphalt I would wager the M18 would definately be the better car but on a smooth carpet track they are quite comparable.
03-09-2004, 06:51 PM
I don't know where you race but I have results which show the differences in lap times between the XRAY and the HPI cars.
Simply put, the HPI is an inferior car. These XRAY cars are being run stock with five cells versus modified HPI's and take a look at the outcomes.
Check out this thread http://yourmicro.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=10004&goto=newpost
03-09-2004, 06:55 PM
I have a solution to the wandering.
Your wandering may be due to your servo, servo horn or the increased toe in the rear.
I think that it is an issue with both the toe in the rear and the bumpsteer links. Try removing the links from underneath the wheel hub and diff case and place it on the upperside of the wheel hub and on the top of the rear diff case.
This will help alleviate that wandering issue and appears to decrease a bit of that toe.
03-09-2004, 07:41 PM
Interesting, by keeping up do you mean to have the same straight line speed the micro needs an extra cell to have the same straight line speed as the M18?
In the stock class I have been runing my Penguin with 6 cells against M18s with 6 cells and I am ever so slightly faster than them in terms of straight line speed and the car handles like a dream going exactly where I want it.
In mod I run the M18 with 5 cells and a speed 300 and only see the wandering when the track has a long straight. Im going to stick my Elite Mod in and see if I can equal the M18 lap times.
I was doing 8.3 second laps in mod and 8.7 second laps in stock FYI. I had the fastest laptimes in stock but not mod, the fastest guy in mod was doing just under 8's.
I think most of the difference lies in the fast that most serious racers view the M18 as more of a race vehicle and therefore better drivers are runing the M18 than the micro.
03-09-2004, 07:48 PM
I am not referring to straight line speed at all. five cell M18 is definitely slower in a straight line than a six cell micro as it should be.
Many of the drivers racing the M18's at the Rialto track were previously running HPI micros.
The M18's set a track record within one month of their release at that track.
The track surface there is Ozite.
You should seriously try that mod I mentioned. It will only take five minutes to do it and if you don't like it, you can always go back.
03-09-2004, 07:57 PM
I have been planing on trying it this week. Where is Rilato? Do you all run micros throughout the year? I am going to be in Ocenside sometime this summer and might bring one of my micros to race. We only run them in the winter here.
03-09-2004, 08:44 PM
Rialto is in Rialto. It is fairly close to San Bernardino. This is a micro only track and it is carpet.
From Oceanside you can probably get there in an hour.
We also race at SoCal raceway which is less than an hour drive from Oceanside.
So how does the M18 stack up against the BRP with the ball diff? I used to run 1/18 scale but no one around here runs them. The BRP blew away the HPI micros since I could actually turn without flipping and they couldn't. Seems the rear of the HPI micro is way too stiff.
03-10-2004, 02:25 PM
I will need to run each of them on carpet to find out.
I can tell you that the M18 is definitely the more versatile of the two cars.
03-10-2004, 09:23 PM
I think i found some of my wandering problem, had a bad bearing already.
03-11-2004, 09:41 AM
Cain >> the ball diff in the BRP SC18 makes a hugh difference.
Yeah, I bought the ball diff for mine right away and it was a blast. Really only issue I had with your vehicle Bud was that the screws stripped too easily and the motors were very finicky. I got a tuned version from you that blew up on its first run, but since you are a standup guy you replaced it right away.
03-12-2004, 10:20 AM
Don't understand the screw trouble, you have to have the right size bit. Motors are Fine if you follow the instructions on making sure they are not bound up. I tell and show racers this all the time. trouble is they feal fine thru the gears but may still be bound and it does not take much to mess them up.
03-12-2004, 12:15 PM
Have any of you guys raced against the M18's yet?
I just drove mine last night and one thing that I notice about the M18 is that the springs are too soft.
Just one con I have noticed about the car.
Intelligenasia--- I have raced my M18 once and it seemed pretty good out of the box. Stock tires,stock motor 4 or 5 cell was good.I haven't ran a 45 turn or big block yet but tuning parts are becoming available.If you have oval racing in your area look at pan car front springs,I bought a bag of Wolfe Motorsports springs $11.00 for 7 pairs from 4 to 16 lbs in 2 lb incriments.They appear to be the right diameter maybe a little short though(1/16 of an inch or so).hope this helped.
03-15-2004, 12:11 PM
Thanks for the info.
We don't run oval here unfortunately.
03-15-2004, 02:26 PM
Once you get past the stripped gear diffs, the stripped spurs, the ultra-flex chassis and the overly flexible arms, the M18 is a decent car. I agree 100% with pat that a well-equipped Micro RS4 is comparable to a well-equipped M18. I run both...fully tricked out...and the P3500LM Micro RS4 is just a smidge faster on a smooth Ozite track. It may be a different story when we move outdoors on pavement.
Whoever says the Micro can't keep up has never seen a well put-together, and well-driven Micro...and vise-versa.
The BRP cars are also very fast...and they should be as they're like little 1/18 scale pan-cars.
03-16-2004, 02:07 PM
What do you mean well equipped M18? By well equipped do you mean stock? Or a $30 lower chassis? I know that XRAY's hopups for the car aren't in stores yet so how "well equipped" can a M18 currently be?
You compare both cars stock to stock and the micro doesn't stand a chance. You compare a stock M18 to a modified micro on carpet and the M18 is still right there even with the flexy stock chassis.
I have already posted results from our Ozite track. You can view the results for yourselves.
I am not saying that hopped up the micro is an inferior car but stock it most definitely is.
03-16-2004, 03:46 PM
I know that XRAY's hopups for the car aren't in stores yet so how "well equipped" can a M18 currently be?
Penguin R/C P7500 hop-up kit (not just a chassis, either...)
Team Penguin R/C
03-16-2004, 04:28 PM
That chassis is not yet available to the general public.
Looks rather promising I must admit.
03-17-2004, 12:22 PM
That chassis is not yet available to the general public.
Looks rather promising I must admit.
You're right, but it will be soon...and "revolutionary" is not too strong a term!
There have been many changes and additions to the one you have probably seen...all for the better. It will be like the P3500LM...well worth waiting for.
03-17-2004, 12:24 PM
When do you feel it is better to run a stiffer chassis such as this new Penguin?
03-17-2004, 03:55 PM
Stiffer on high bite, flexi on low bite! I ordered a M18 today with spare diff gears :eek:
03-17-2004, 03:59 PM
You ordered a M18? Wow... Let us know what you think of it.
03-17-2004, 05:53 PM
Hmmm Im guessing chassis, drive shaft, stiffer springs, and a better steering system.
03-21-2004, 09:43 PM
The stock BRP's finally ran up against a Mod X-Ray M-18.....lets just say the X-Ray was no were in the top 5.....even with the baja motor.
03-21-2004, 10:36 PM
On what surface were you running? We just ran here today on outdoor asphalt and the BRP's don't stand a chance.
03-22-2004, 07:19 AM
Indoor carpet...still snowing up in Cleveland!
03-22-2004, 10:36 AM
I'd definitely take a BRP on some nice carpet...Even smooth high bite asphalt.
Unfortunately the track that we raced on yesterday proved a bit too bumpy for the BRP's.
03-22-2004, 11:32 AM
my brp couldn't handle the bumps. placed 5th in the first qualifying heat. switched to the xray, picked up two extra laps and place 2nd in the main. this was the first time i actually drove the xray too. :p
03-22-2004, 05:24 PM
Man you change your avatars like every day :)
The main issue with the motor I had that blew up was the comm just came apart. The motor wasn't as fast as my old one, and next thing I know I see metal on the ground.
As for the screws, I had the correct bit, but they still stripped. Do you have any plans to offer an allen screwhead conversion or can provide a list of the sizes needed? If I do micro again, I probably will change to that instead.
Overall though your vehicle was a blast. Only issue I see some places having is that its not a true touring car and they will use that to keep us from running with them.
On the asphalt, anyone running the HPI wheel conversion from BRP so they can use rubber tires? maybe that will hook up better?
03-23-2004, 08:02 PM
I have run the HPI wheels but they didn't help me too much on the track that I was running at.
In my street however they were a much better alternative to the foams.
03-23-2004, 09:55 PM
Hey intel, long time no see. I've been meaning to get into the 1/18 scale racing, but I've had other things that had to be taken care of. Would that krystal3 motor work in the m18, or does it only take the smaller motors (which is my guess)? I take it you haven't had a chance to run it at socal yet. After you do, do you think you could give me your recommendation? I'm leaning torward the brp, but the m18 seems more planted and easier to drive.
03-23-2004, 10:20 PM
Nice to see you again after a few months!
Yeah, I have a Krystal 3 in my M18. You just need a motor mount to fit the motor.
I won my race on Sunday with my M18 by two laps.
The M18 is definitely easier to drive especially with that ever so forgiving stock chassis.
What did you want to know about the M18?
03-23-2004, 10:27 PM
Just whether or not you liked it compared to the brp. How much did they other motor mount cost? I've seen some m18's for $80 NIB. Might go for it.
03-23-2004, 10:32 PM
I got my M18 for $75 brand new with some race bucks that I had from SoCal.
So far I really like the car. It is pretty tunable like a 1/10 touring car. The suspension works rather well even with those friction shocks. The car has plenty of steering and some hopups on the way.
The motor mount you can find at www.unitedrc.com as well as cells for the car.
You will really like this car. The corner speed is excellent. and it feels rock solid on the track.
03-23-2004, 10:34 PM
Thanks. When will you be at socal next?
03-24-2004, 02:07 AM
haven't been at SoCal lately. Been hitting up some of the local parking lot tracks around the SoCal area. I may be up at SoCal on April 10, I will be in Norco this Sunday hopefully at RC Heat. Visit http://www.rcheat.com for more info.
Maybe you can bring your 1/10?
03-24-2004, 09:54 AM
I just checked out that site. Typed the address in on mapquest and its only a 20 minute drive from my house. I'll have to look into that.
03-24-2004, 10:35 AM
Sweet! It is an hour and twenty minute drive from me. That is cool that it is much closer to you.
03-31-2004, 12:45 AM
I just bought an M18 sunday and got it put together (minus the electronics). I already of the krystal3 motor, I'm gonna pick up a hitec receiver and microservo, and i'm thinking about an LRP Quantum Micro. What do you guys use for batteries? I'm probably gonna order some of the URC cells, but what do you guys use for battery bars? thanks.
03-31-2004, 06:19 AM
JB do yourself a favor and get a regular Quantum Reverse that way you can use it in a 1/10th scale car. Not much more money, practically same size, and a whole lot better.
03-31-2004, 11:45 AM
Make sure you get a metal-gear servo, like the HS-81MG.
For battery bars, I use shunts from worn out brushes.
03-31-2004, 11:59 AM
Congratulations on the purchase!
JB, I would highly recommend that you do not purchase a 81MG servo. Since the motor has been sitting for so long, be sure that you lube the bushings with some bushing/bearing lube.
United RC has the cheapest KAN cells that you can buy right now at $1.20 each. They are blue shrinkwrapped to match the XRAY hopups scheme.
As far as battery bars, it will kind of depend on how you will solder your cells. For a stick pack configuration I use a different type than I use for side by side.
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