Hello, all! My name is RCNERD and I'm from calgary, Canada. My local track is a very small and informal scene where we race 1/12 scale and 1/18 scale (up til now this meant HPI micro RS4). I've raced 1/12
for a while, but I was reluctant to join the 1/18 class since I had watched my friends drop huge coin to make their HPI micros handle well for racing. I've seen a lot of people talking about the relative merits of the BRP SC18 vs. the Micro RS4, and as someone who has been in the hobby nearly two decades, I thought I'd throw my $0.02 in!! In my opinion the micro was never designed to race on carpet. It is a much better car for playing around (i.e. unprepared or inappropriate surfaces such as asphalt, gym floors, your driveway, basement, etc), but the SC18 is a carpet racing pan car, and in this environment it will excel. Has anyone out there ever tried running a 1/12 pan car in an unprepared parking lot or parkade? I was hardly able to get mine up to top speed when I tried. What I am trying to say is that pan cars rule on carpet, and even a 4-cell 1/12 car can be competitive on carpet against a 6-cell 4WD touring car or mini (not micro).
HEY BUD!!! I'm sorry to hear that advertising dollars=fair magazine coverage, but I should have guessed it was so, why should our industry be any less corrupt than the rest. I want you and all readers of this board to know that the BRP sc-18 kicks ass, is very cool, fast, etc, AND handles great with no extras (yes the ball diff is an option, but other than that!)
Anyway, I'll quit rambling and close like this: Thanks to all!!
RCNERD

Hey All, :wave:

I am interested in getting into 1/18 scale racing, but don't know where to begin. I am pretty impressed with the BRP cars, and I think I will go with the Fun WONs. I just have a few questions:

1) what performance difference will I notice between teh SC18 and the Fun WOns?

2) stock setting wise, what is faster out of the box, micro RS4 or SC?

3) what hopups do you recommend right away to have the car perform correctly on carpet?

4) are there any bodies I should steer more too for handling?

5) what would be a good cheap servo to use, one that you don't mind cutting the ears off of ?

6) What battery packs do you recommend for the kit? buying BRP's or building your own NIMH packs? If building your own, what are good cells to use?

7) what exactly is the motor that comes with the kit?

8) what are weak breakage areas of the vehicle that I should look out for?

9) how well does the kit go on thicker household carpet?

10) What is a good speedo to use?

11) what gauge wire do you recommend?

12) what amp should I charge the packs at?

13) I currently have JR XR3 reciever and a novak cyclone speedo to use, would these work well or is this overkill?


I think that about does it for now. I am really interested in this so feel free to give suggestions and experiences.

Thanks!

1. Perhaps none. K1m has both and may have a better answer for you.

2. SC18 on carpet.

3. Ball Diff, that's it!

4. I don't believe so. We have many styles at our track and none seem faster than another.

5. I'm a Futaba guy. The standard 3003 fits fine. You could spend about the same $ for the 3101 which is a mini servo(less weight).

6. Any. Many use the 700Mah nicads. I use 1200Mah nimhs.

7. Parma 16turn slotcar motor. I believe they come with the XP magnets installed.

8. There isn't any, these things are tanks!:thumbsup:

9. It's bumpier going on household carpet.

10. Any with reverse. Many at our track are using the Futaba MC230cr($50).

11. Which ever you feel comfortable working with.

12. Somewhere between .5 to 2 amps should do it.

13. The Cyclone is overkill. And no reverse. I use a Novak XXL reciever.

Hope that gives you some idea!

I'll add to the answers I guess or agree with Don on most of them.

1. Not running a SC18 much I have no definite answer but it seems they are pretty similar. The SC18 does appear to have one disadvantage, it seems a little "unstable" as compared to the SC18 Fun Won. Like Don said, K1M should give you a better feel on this one.

2. SC18 from our experience.

3. Ball diff like Don said. They work well without it but better with.

4. With a SC18 FW I would say no. With a SC18 there are probably some that handle better than others just like with a TC. I would say the stock car or vette body would give you a little more speed handling whereas the truck bodies a little more steering.....all theory however. :)

5. Futaba 148, 3003, or as Don said, mini servo.

6. Most of us run 1200 mah NiMH cells at out track but from what Bud says they have good luck with 1000 mah 2/3 As also.

7. Actually, I believe the name is Super 16D slot car motor. :) According to Parmas catalog, the Deathstar is a 16D (70T) and the Super 16D is a 60T.

8. Break areas? There aren't really any. The stock tie-rod and collar setup is a little prone to bending but other than that like Don said they are tanks.

9. SC18 FW would be your best bet on thicker carpet because of the bigger tires (more ride height).

10. Futaba MC230CR. Tiny size, smooth, and cheap.

11. Amp draw isn't a problem so like Don said, work with a comfy size.

12. Agree with Don on this one. I just got some new packs and started charging at 1.5 amps, previously I charged at .80.

13. I'd say it was overkill but since you have those items already it will save you some $$$ to start. The only problem is not having reverse if you are just playing.

Good luck with your purchase!

1) I had always heard the the fun wons were a little faster but the lower sc18 had better cornering. this is only what I picked up, though. I run SC18's

2) Out of the box there is no comparison, you'll blow the doors off the micro

3) I concur... ball dif

5) I use tock futaba's i also tried the tower house brand. No problems with either.

8) i use these cars for rentals and therefore have 6 yr olds crashing and bashing all day long. The only weakpoint I found was the front mount but on one of the other threads there was an easy fix.

Those were the only ones I could weigh in on. Hope that helps! Go BRP and you won't be sorry. They are great cars.

Madd Matt
www.maddmatts.com

While it is true the Cyclone will be overkill you can use it with no problems. If it is lying about unused or you don't want to go buy another, then use it...
There are smaller and lighter ESCs on the market if you want to buy one. The LRP Quantum Series with Reverse is good or you can pickup the MC230CR ($50) for less money for a reversing ESC. I've used the Cyclone and the MC230CR.
The Cyclone can potentially give you faster lap times by providing higher output since it is a racing or competition ESC, but given it's older design it does sacrificing the reverse capability. (Reverse must be turned off or not used for most racing venues.)

Most of the micro servos can be mounted without cutting off the ears.
They can pose other mounting issues if you use the stock front body mount method because of the very small contact area.

If you don't mind the weight the standard size servo can be used without the mounting ears... Given the inexpense of standard sized servos these day ($8) it is a small cost.

As far as packs go...if you intend to race then you need to build or buy what will be legal for racing in your area.
If you are just playing around, then high capacity NiMH would be the way to go if you have a charger that can properly feed them and care for them...

RAFster
David

You've already got alot of answers, they're all good ones. Where else can you get service like that? We like to help out new mini racers because we know you're going to have a good time.

The SC18 is more scale in appearance, lighter, and faster in the right hands. Fun Wons offer a certain look all of their own with the big tires and are more forgiving to drive. The added ground clearance is a plus if the surface you run on is very uneven. They're both awesome in their own way and most of the main parts are interchangeable.

Hopups? Ball Differential - first.

The only thing I've broken so far is servo gears (before I put on a servo saver) and a body post.

Unless you have a BIG house, stick to the ozite or backtop.

Have Fun!

K1m has brought up an exellent point:thumbsup:with the servo saver. I had taken that one for granted.

Just a quick tip on building batterys for sc-18: SCX slot car pickup braid makes graeat, light, thin "battery bar"-great for our scale!! Part #SCX86140, $1.00 is four pcs. of brai, which can be cut in half to make 8 batt braids. HOPE THIS HELPS!!
:wave:

Thanks for all the answers. Its great to see all the responses. I have been considering these kind of vehicles for awhile now as I run a XXX-S but the smaller car appeals to me and my wife, plus, with a baby on the way its not much in the cost department compared to other things.

So, for the battery packs, I am assuming assembly pretty much goes the same as when assembling our sub-c cells? Are there any types I should stick too?

I am considering getting a XXL reciever to use, will my stock XR3 reciever be too big if I use my cyclone?

what gauge wire do you guys run? I right now use 14 gauge (12 too much for my powerpoles).

Thanks again for all the great answers. Any mail order places you recommend?

Cain I run the Cyclone with a standard size Airtronic servo with no problem. We use 700 Sanyo AA in stock class and you can run 2/3 A cells in mod. I build my own packs but a lot of racers buy Buds packs. I don't use the tamiya type plugs. I switched to the gold Trinity post type,they give you more room. Most of us use 16 Gauge wire for 1/18th and 12th scale. BRP also stocks the wire. Everyone has given you good advise glad to help.:thumbsup:

Hey all, I got my SC18 off of ebay directly from Bud. Excited to try the kit out. Now to organize the parts. I am picking up the following right away:

1) Ball Differential
2) Front Orange Compound Tires

I am going to hold off on the big block kit till I get better at racing :) Also need to find out what the spec battery pack is at the track for the stock class. Few more questions:

1) what is the stock pinion that comes with the car?
2) does it pay to have a complete set of pinions for the car or do you pretty much stick with just one size?
3) anyone know of a good site with examples of making your own battery packs?
4) any motor maintenance recommendations? (spraying it out, lubing, etc?)
5) how much of a difference do you notice with a big block motor on? (later down the road :devil: )
6) Anyone recommend some micro sized servos for a good price that will work with JR stuff with minimal modification?

Looking at the racing examples on the website the cars seem to handle really well. Probably won't have the kit racing for little over two weeks, but still will be fun to get it all ready :)


Thanks for all the info.

Hello, Cain! I'm new to the BRP cene, but I'll take a stab at the questions I can answer!
1)9 tooth (I think)
2)no-the easiest way to gear is high (stock spur from ball diff, 46 tooth) or low (optional 52 spur) If this doesn't do it for you, then use pinions, but it is best to have a motor for each pinion, since the pinions are press on.
3)no
4)Bud reccomends not messing with it too much, just clean every week or three, don't even take out the brushes, oil very lightly weekly.
5)Lots!(or so I've heard) I am currently experimenting with several motors-orion big block, elite mod, speed 300 6v, sp 300 7.2v, speedex 300 6v, chubby,etc. I willpost my results.
6) I don't reccomend a micro servo, they are not strong enough for cars (even metal gears)if you do not use a standard size then you have to use a post type front body mount, the stock one sticks to the servo and doesn't get enough grip on smaller servos. I reccomend a mini servo (1/12 size) such as th futaba s132h and a regular front body mount, which incedently makes body height adjustment much easier.USE A SERVO SAVER!!!
Good Luck!!

Cain 9 tooth is the stock pinion We usually only change pinions on the oval. And as rcnerd said its much easier to change spurs. I know some have changed in on road but I think all went back to the 9. Stay away from the big block unless you love speed.I have one and couldn't handle the power. I will try again with te new chassis. Good luck with your new car, Ithink you will be impessed. :D

hmm, didn't know there was a difference between mini and micro servos. I try to stick with hitec brands, any recommendations on which servos are good from them?

Also, what servo savers do you recommend?

I am going to go with a standard size servo, just hate having to cut off the ears so my 945MG won't get used. How low a transit time is good for the vehicle? How much torque do you think is needed as a minimum?


Thanks again!

Cain, in my opimion, the only advantage to a smaller servo is less overall weight. Any servo mini or bigger ( ie the size of a fut 132h and bigger is fine. Transit time not really an issuse, torque neither.
Important: Dual Rates!

It can be difficult to set up the car to get full steering w/o the sevo stalling (not good)!! Dual rates are good , steering EPA (end point adcjustment) better!!
I do not personnally reccomend HITEC servos for cars, except for their full size ones, or extra heavy- duty mini ones. I Have had many broken hitec servos being broughtin to the hobby store where I work part-time. I reccomend airtronics servos for quality!

Don't waste money use a $10 std servo to start.:roll:

SERVOS:
Standard: you know the big ones, like a fut s148 or 3003
mini: 1/12 size, like fut 132h/s3002-good for 1/12-1/18 scale
micro:like fut s3101-not durable enough for cars
sub micro:even smaller and fragiler (yeah not a word i know)
nano: freakin' tiny for 280 and smaller AIRPLANES only!
hope this helps!

PS most servo cases are available to replace your Van Gough (earless wonder)!!
GOOD RACIN"

thanks for the advice guys.

I have had good luck with hitec servos, but I will keep what you said in mind and make sure to get a servo saver. any recommendations for one?

Ok, so transit time isn't important? Sounds good then. I will just pick up some cheapos and go from there.

ok, here's a question:

1) where is a good place to get battery braid or whatever I need to assemble my own battery packs? (ie- tower hobbies).

2) what size shrink wrap tubing I should use over the batteries?

3) What cells do you recommend to build the packs with?

4) I am looking at the MC230CR, anyone know of a good speedo with 6V output to the servo? I hate to have to get a MC330CR for that but I like the extra power.

5) how well does velcro-ing the reciever work? I am budgeting this so I don't want to pick up another FM one right now (i have a XR3 FM radio). If it works well, any particular brand to go with and any available on RC mail order places?

I just want to make sure I get everything I need right away.

Thanks again. I am excited to get my kit in. I also downloaded the building tips they had on the brp website. I probably will still race my XXX-S to see how that goes but I am excited about running the micro too :)

Some folks take 12 gauge copper house wire and hammer it to 1/8 inch wide. I've used Radio Shack desoldering braid for AA cell packs.
I use shrink wrap designed for stick packs that my local hobby shop has for sub-C packs. I shrinks fine for AA cells.

If you go with Nicads, just fine for stock and general use, Sanyo 700AAC cells perform well. Tower normally has Sanyo 700s on sale often. Buy a dozen and build 2 packs.
If you use the lighter NiMH cells you wil l need a charger capable of handling the cells appropriately and the 2/3A cells perform pretty well. The ProMatched Racing cells are good but you would probably be happy with the cells Bud mentioned to find the cells.
http://www.batteryspace.com/product.asp?3=204
It is a good deal and the cells perform very well.

MC230CR has performed well for me. You don't need a fast servo or a high torque servo. Increasing the voltage increase both the speed and torque output of the servo.
You need dual rates and end point adjustments on the steering to turn it down enough.

Velcro works ok but servo tape can be removed as easily.
The Novak XXL is a nice FM receiver that is very popular with racers.
www.hobbypeople.net has pretty good prices on some radio gear. Please note, I think the JR uses a negative shift on
the frequency instead of the positive shift that Futaba and Hitec use. I may have it reverse... So, if you have a JR radio you need to check that you get a JR compatible receiver and use JR crystals in the receiver and transmitter.

RAFster

RAFSter:

What do you think of the 1600mah NiMH AA cell packs that the website you referred me to used to sell? I am able to get some of these off of somebody I know new, but want to know how good they are first. I have an integy 16x3 v2.5 Pro charger so i can set the amp rate and monitor the voltage, capacity, etc with the charger.

what is the advantage of the 2/3A cells over the AA cells? I see that one website you referred me to (batteryspace.com) has a wide selection of cells, some with tabs, some without, etc. What do you guys recommend? for the prices, a lot of the cells are easily affordable. But what do you go with? 1300mah, 1600mah, ,1800mah? Nicad vs NiMh? Anyone with some answers on this? I just want to make sure I get the right stuff. Thanks!:roll:

Cain: I'd pretty much agree with RAFster on all. I reccomend kimbrough servo savers. Tamiya are also good. I use the braid to build packs, but buy it as slot car power pickup brushes. It is very similar to the desoldering braid. I keep my packs in plastic organizers and they can't touch so I don't wrap, just ca together. I have had good luck with the sanyo 700 yellow cells and with the green (ni-cd) KR-1100-AAU. Great voltage w/ both, the 1100's cost a lot more. If I did not have a line on cheap cells (as I do) I would probably choose BRP's packs for both convinence and value. I personally am not a big fan of ni-mh, except for TX (my opinion only) I think ni-cad offer better value, punch, reliability and longevity. As well some of the "ni-mh friendly" chargers that are in use at my track seem to heat the packs excessivly. Stay away from ni-mh that is not speciffically reccomended for rapid charge and discharge, or they will not be punchy.

THESE ARE MY OPINIONS ONLY!! GOOD LUCK!!!

thanks for the advice.

Anyone with experiences with the 2/3A or other cells I wrote about?

Thanks again!

I was wondering how come the guys that run the 2/3A battery only run 4 cells insteaad of 5 cells ( AA pack)?

melchman:cool:

Bud and Don I think have used the cells from the site which I made reference. They found the cells to have good performance.
I have some of this brand of cell and it is pretty good.
The Nicads will provide more punch than the NiMH cells. You trade duration for punch.
The 1000 or 1100 mAH NiMH cells provide enough duration for modified class motors for the 5 minute runs typical.
Would a 700 mAH or 600 mAH cell provide
enough power?

RAFster

Melch: Everyone I know who races, runs 6 cell 7.2V packs whether they're AA, C, or 2/3A. Voltage is speed. Some people run less cells if space is limited, or to keep crash damage low.

Cain: Man, you DO have alot of questions!
A pack of 2/3A cells weigh about .5 oz less than AA's and their capacity (1000mah) seems to be plenty to power even the big block motor for racing. I've done alittle testing on my own and find the two very similar on and off the track. Price and longevity will be the next thing.

RAFster: Try the Shoe Goo yet?

yeah, i am the question king :)

I just want to nail everything down to make sure I got all the stuff I need.

I read some of the posts and I noticed that people were going to the super magnets, should I look about doing this right away or just run the car as is to see how things go first?

I think that about wraps it up. I probably will go with AA NiMHs, probably 1600MAH unless anyone has a reason why not too. Thanks for all the help.

I got 4 packs of the AA 1600mah NiMH coming in. Now to get a speedo and cheap servo. My wife is pretty cool about all this, she wants me to still race my XXX-S I was thinking of selling it.

SC18 review at one18th
http://www.one18th.com/reviews.php?action=view&id=57

Originally posted by DSI
SC18 review at one18th
Sounds like a "Yes" to me.

This was a very good review! I liked the part:
"I wouldn’t suggest putting it together without the on-line color PDF you can get off BRP’s website"

;)

Good review...but it's not that hard to assemble!!!

If you've built any car before you'll likely find it easy.

I would disagree with you rcnerd, i have built my fair share of vehicles and at times the instructions leave you in the dark, even the online ones. I think more pictures of what goes in to what would work better, the color manual is good, but they do leave out some things. Been spoiled too much by losi and associated :)

The car is amazing though, and I got my fun wons all set, and love the sc18 still. Really great cars.

Nice review and web site.

Well I'm almost ready to go.....just finished shortening and routing the servo, ESC and switch leads and took a couple pics. A new mini servo saver and the front body mount will be the last parts to get mounted.....by monday night I figure I'll be finished painting the body and then tuesday or wednesday can be test day.

Took it to the local micro track saturday in nearly the state it's in now, lots of eeww's and aahh's :thumbsup: Expect it will see lots of use next saturday too !!

The LRP Quantum Sport I have in the car came with a diode, do I need to use it on the 16D motor ?

I don't think you really need it, but give it a try and see if it runs cooler or the brakes work better and let us know.

Mr.Bartos , My kit just came Great Service and thanks for emailing me back on kit # I ordered . Placed another order today but I should have called in the first order and asked for help with what I would need but I think im good to go now :confused: ,, Thanks again, :thumbsup: Ed

ERL: Bud's almost as fast at shipping orders as he is on the track!

Well, after a night of racing (or, in my case, kissing the boards), I have a set up that has kept the HS81MG in place on my SC18. After taping it down, as usual, I put a layer of ShooGoo all around the front and sides. It seems to be holding well.

I am using a turnbuckle set up similar to 1/12 cars, and body mount posts instead of the bent plastic mount. I hope to get pictures up soon.

You've already got alot of answers, they're all good ones. Where else can you get service like that? We like to help out new mini racers because we know you're going to have a good time.

The SC18 is more scale in appearance, lighter, and faster in the right hands. Fun Wons offer a certain look all of their own with the big tires and are more forgiving to drive. The added ground clearance is a plus if the surface you run on is very uneven. They're both awesome in their own way and most of the main parts are interchangeable.

Hopups? Ball Differential - first.

The only thing I've broken so far is servo gears (before I put on a servo saver) and a body post.

Unless you have a BIG house, stick to the ozite or backtop.

Have Fun!


I don't know kim all I did was change my pinion and got me too the 30 lap culp sure it help but it helps more is first learning to drive like rick told me that a wise man once said to drive fast you must first learn to drive.

Very wise grasshopper. :)

BRP + Improve products = Still #1
Maybe I'm missing a point but The $ value is defently BRP, there has been a couple of high $ other brand here that recieved the SMOKED syndrome from the BRP OLD style... thus saying to me they are a waist of time and effort.
Just to add a new entisement to the 1/18 scale racing, here at the Schoolyard this year all 1/18 scale will have a flat $2 per car entery fee when racing on Saturday or Sunday 11:00am.
240ft concrete oval Stock & Bigblock/Mod & 6 cell packs.
Perhaps I just havent seen the best of the other brand perform.. but at this point I'll keep banging my chest for BRP and tarzan yelling the VICTORY celibration of Bud's being UNBEATABLE in cost and performance.
On my carpet flat oval they dominated and out on the super slab they TOTALLY RULED.
With non-peaked 6 cell 1100ma nicd batteries I turned a 7.21 on the concrete. I took a used set of foams (kit std) and caped them with a bicycle inner tube glued with plyobond rubber contact cement and that did the trick.
Id love to get a supper rubber like what BSR uses on thier caps for them.. but untill that time this will work and work well.
Wana see the track? www.rcspeedway.net

I just won a sc18 on ebay.. new in box... I'm hoping it will arrive by next weekend.. Maybe next payday I can order the rear diff. But I was wondering is it possible to put in larger motors??? I have a few lay6ing around.. What Id like to use is the modifyes orion corless... On my old rs4 it flew..... That and about 150.00 worth of hopups were needed to beat my friends brp.... lol Guess the rs4 just doesnt have it stock anyway....

BRP makes a Big Block conversion kit #325 for the Speed 300 type motors. I'm sure you'll like your SC18. You can also get hubs that will fit the micro's wheels/tires.

Pythonracer - The 16d motor with the XP magnents are very fast. I turn better lap times with the 16d! But if you must, the Big Block or Speed 300 work the best in the SC-18. I tried my friends Orion corless, it just diden't have the top end the Big Block does. Plus the Speed 300 you can get for less than $20.00!

The Groupner Speed 300 is the best ticket I have found to get high speed and long runtime, as it was stated all you need is the bigblock pod conv, pack and you'll love it... I out ran a 1/10 RC10 TC3 RTR right out of the box with 3000 matched 6 cells and the RTR 19t motor on my track a couple of days ago.
MAn was his eyes popping out and is jaw hit the ground... and me, well I LOVED IT!
I think he is ready to get one now!
:devil:

Also I'd like to add that at cromwell ( carpet 100ft oval) the Bolink Legands had a record of 50 laps and with the BRP we had 51.
They where in the ballpark with most of the classes raced except the pancars.... they had 70.
The Brp's where running 6 cell and big block and stock gears except for the funones ( big tires ) they had 8/52, and even 1 of the older models was in that 51 lap range running the big block/6 cell... older version but still a winner!

Ricks track is the best so far. To me anyway