AS SOME MAY KNOW ALREADY THE MIDWEST TRICLONE HAS BEEN CHOSEN TO HOST THE 2004 PAVED OVAL NATS....

check out www.triclone.com for pics of the track.... i know it is still aways away but u can post questions here for people to answer.. also hotel info is below... THIS IS A CAP TIRE RACE i HAVE talked with alot of people latelt who think just because it is asphalt that we run foams... we do not and have never.. we have always been cap tires.. we run blues and greens just like most the other tracks...



Due to the LPGA Golf Tournament being held in Kohler Wi. the same week as are the Roar Paved Oval Nats at the Mid-West Triclone in West Bend Wi.August 13th--14th--15th Hotels are filling up fast some are full already. I was able to block 20 rooms at the West Bend Inn which is a half mile from the race track just mention the Triclone and Roar Nats for the rates. No other hotels would block rooms but do have rooms available.
West Bend Inn--1-262-338-0636

Super 8 Motel--1-262-335-6788--half mile from track

Country Inn and suites--1-800-456-4000 4 miles from the track There is a three night min. $10 for each extra person in the room

Bonne Bell Motel--1-262-626-8414 6 miles from the race track,clean, best rates, 10 rooms left

Hope this will help you out and I'll keep in touch

Thanks Dave J. Mid-West Triclone

Mike
Any word on a handout tire yet?

Nope no word yet.. From what i heard john from bsr will be coming up a few times this summer to test... him and a few of his drivers... they need to find a tire that will work the best in all classes across the board.... i would imagine it would be blues and greens.. this is what we run now.... blue wide right rear..... green narrow left rear..... blue left tire for right front.... blue or green left front

HI Mike mark me down, with a guest! hope to make it up soon as the weather breaks.
The MB, B&B still got a vaccancy?..LOL!

got an e-mail from David. racers will be able to use personal tansponders at the Nats,Entry flyers will be out soon as well.

yes u can use them we just got the new amb and compuer system.. it is as current as u can get,,,

i belive they will have a rulle this year for personal transponders also.. the must be mounted behind the front end.... ie steering arms.. meaning no bumper mounting... we do this so the reeding are fare when people cross the lione at the same time.. no win because u had your transponder mounted 3 inches further forward....

So you're not going to be able to run that 4 foot long bumper with the transponder mounted on the front anymore, eh, Burbs? Can't wait for practice to open.

Damn...I was going to mount mine on the end of an extension arm from a 3rd servo that I could use to swing just ahead of Bruce's car! Bruce!! I am hyped as the sun is now out and no snow.. Time for Tri-Clone! I need to get a car built (typical) ...but I will be racing this summer!

I can practice now..."...Bruce leader on you!" :dude:

Can't be there this Saturday as we have been mandated to be at work for project manager training since corporate America has been "adjusting" financials!

See you guys at the track! :wave:

Kenny

u guys prolly wont see me till mid summer...i have some other things i am concentrating on right now...roadcourse and getting my new job and company off the ground is my main thing..

i figured id give u guys a few weeks at the front...


http://kgbracing.com/phpBB2/images/smiles/new_snipersmilie.gifKGB SNIPER U CAN'T HAVE MINE... BUT I CAN SHOW U WHERE TO GET ONE http://kgbracing.com/phpBB2/images/smiles/new_2gunsfiring_v1.gif

Well as usual Kenny, You got it partially right. It goes " Bruce Says,leader on Ya, comin' through, Oops, pardon me."

now i may partially agree with the bruce up on yah thing< but if i remember last year u had some first turn issues...
now if we can get u to make it through turn one the passing would put u a lap up and not back on the lead lap.. HA HA HA HA SEE U BOYS OUT THERE..

ill be out hackling ya before i race... i started my new job now so i am working a ton ... im no longer bubey the truck driver.. im burbey the welder...

http://kgbracing.com/phpBB2/images/smiles/new_snipersmilie.gifKGB SNIPER U CAN'T HAVE MINE... BUT I CAN SHOW U WHERE TO GET ONE http://kgbracing.com/phpBB2/images/smiles/new_2gunsfiring_v1.gif

Bruce pretty good call from the B-main! ;-)

It's nice to see newbies at the race tracks (Kenny) :roll: :tongue:

Good one, Hock. I can hardly wait to hit the blacktop again. Time to let those rug burns heal. L.O.L.

Barooose hitting the blacktop ???????????? NO you hitting the blacktop ,cars , walls the people in the infeild the pace car should I go on.:p

Okay, Triclown. You just earned yourself a trip to the wall. Hahahahahahahaaa.

Prety simple....just follow Barooose!

but i dont want to hit the wall???????????????????

The track just got sealed and new lines put down for the ROAR NATS WE WILL HAVE A NICE GROVE LAID DOWN BY THEN. I hope to see all you their.

need my tires Burbs.
I'm gonna start making plans for the trip up there for some cap lesons bro!
Got to head to TN in the middle of June for a wedding then, I'm all race.

your tires were ordered doug.. just get me the cash and ill get the tires from dave at the track...

AWESOME! You da man Mike!

Hey on a side note, I wonder if that dinner we ate at last time has aymore of that coffee creamer? It might make for some good traction compound...LOL!

The first practice day for the season was yesterday.The track was excellant with the new sealer down.A lot of bite and good tire wear.

yeah track looked good.. stock guys hit 32 laps, and 19 hit 38 laps... at this time last year it was 1-2 laps slower... im thinkin some records are gonna fall this year...

Mike
Whats the modified record on the old surface? should be around 41 4:03 or so?
see ya in a few months..

dude LOL i dont even know.. no one runs mod here.. i will se if they have one from regionals or somthing.. but stock and 19t is what we run weekly...

no biggie,just curious,nobody runs mod?why not what else is there? lol.. see ya ,hey my kids loves that tc3..
see ya

The mod record from the 2000 nats was 41 4:02?? i think we have only ran mod there once since then and it wasn't pretty 39 laps...booo...we should see fast 42's and some 43's, then when the rubber is laid down the week of the nats look out. we will be up once they decide the handout tire. Or are they keeping it a secret this year, so nobody cries about it till the week of the nats.

dannny... im not posotive, but i had heard it will not be released till nats....that way everyone will be in the same boat.. i guess... john is supose to come up and do some testing so he can find the right tire for all classes...

the track seems already to be faster then last year.. i havent run, but i was up there the first day and the guys were almost as fast as they were at the end of the year.... at this time last yuear we were not as fast... the new sealer seems awesome...

Danny,

Sent you my reply e-mail. I forgot last years nats we ran into problems with the announcement of what tires were going to be run, but prior to the race a different compound of the tire was workign best for mod. It raised the issue of published verses changing. We kept the published. I recall John and I talking about not even marking compiunds on the tires and jsut saying you must run this on the right front, left rear, etc....tough issue I will work out with John and Dave (Tri-Clone). I plan on being in the iddle of the tire decisions especially for the stock and brushless classes. I will be relying on John for mod along with everyone's input locally. The key on handout is breakin time and practice wiht those tires. Even if they are annoucned...you know as well as I do the compounds can vary.

Regarding the short stack mod issues. I have a ROAR ExComm meeting July 16-18 in California. I will be able to sit face to face with Bob Ingersoll (Technical man...) to review motor armature approval tolerances and etc. So toss me any thoughts. I personally do not want to take "short stacking" away from the winders, as I understand they often use that as "tuning" tool.

Trying hard to keep the field fair for all!

Kenny B

Kenny B

From www.triclone.com


2004 ROAR Paved Oval Nationals
8/13/2004 thru 8/15/2004




Entry Deadline July 9, 2004
($20.00 late fee after this date!)
Limit 350 Entries!
ROAR Classes offered:
1/10th 4-cell Stock (w/ 1 handout motor & 1 set of tires) $110.00

1/10th 4-cell Modified (w/ 1 set of tires) $95.00

1/10th 4-cell 19 Turn (w/ 1 set of tires) $95.00

1/12th 4-cell Modified $40.00

Exhibition Classes offered:
1/10th 4-cell Novak Brushless (w/ 1 set of tires) $95.00

1/10th 4-cell Outlaw Stock $40.00

Additional items:
Stock Motors (2 Max) $22.00 ea.

Discount for multiple class entry $10.00 per class

Additional sets of handout tires available at the track.
Race Trailers welcome, but must have generators to run Air Conditioning


Four qualifiers and 1 main for each class
We will do a re-sort after the second and third qualifiers
Single A Main format




Exhibition Classes:
Outlaw Stock - Bring your own 27T, locked endbell, machine wound, hybrids allowed - Bring your own cap tires or buy at the track
Novak Brushless - A limited amount of brushless systems will be provided at the track, or bring your own

Danny,

Sent you my reply e-mail. I forgot last years nats we ran into problems with the announcement of what tires were going to be run, but prior to the race a different compound of the tire was workign best for mod. It raised the issue of published verses changing. We kept the published. I recall John and I talking about not even marking compiunds on the tires and jsut saying you must run this on the right front, left rear, etc....tough issue I will work out with John and Dave (Tri-Clone). I plan on being in the iddle of the tire decisions especially for the stock and brushless classes. I will be relying on John for mod along with everyone's input locally. The key on handout is breakin time and practice wiht those tires. Even if they are annoucned...you know as well as I do the compounds can vary.

Regarding the short stack mod issues. I have a ROAR ExComm meeting July 16-18 in California. I will be able to sit face to face with Bob Ingersoll (Technical man...) to review motor armature approval tolerances and etc. So toss me any thoughts. I personally do not want to take "short stacking" away from the winders, as I understand they often use that as "tuning" tool.

Trying hard to keep the field fair for all!

Kenny B

Kenny B

Kenny,

As far as motor sugestions I think that there needs to be the ability of tuning invloved through stack size and the like. This will allow each brand of motor to be tuned to work the best rather then one brand workig best at one track and another brand at another track. The the biggest thing I think needs to be done is arm weight. This is an easy way to tell if someone is drilling out the insides or if someone is adding weight for whatever reason and it works. That and the meter that is used for onroad mod should really help keep things fair.

I also think that with the current technology that any brush should be allowed and that 4 mag cans also be allowed as this seams to be a trend but also a tuning aid to go with the 2 mag cans.

If I can make any other sugestions is it would be to make sure the entire rule book is very clear and concise with no grey areas. And that at the ROAR races especially the NATs that the rule book is inforced as it is written and not superceed by the hosts track rules.
Thanks for all the great work.

Brian Anthony

The rules clearly state that short stacks are allowed ......Some winders do not want to take the time to do this ....DONT BE A HATER if your motor guys does not make short stacks then buy someone who does ...Short stacks have been around for a long time ...Nothin new


SRM

from another site about the brushless class at Nats.
--------------------------------------------------------
Some questions have been asked about the Novak brushless class at the ROAR Paved Oval Nats. The system will be run in the open configuration, this would be similar to a 13- 15 turn mod motor, the heats and the mains will be 7 min. Novak will be sending us a system and Jeff Skomski will do some testing and then we can pass the info out to everyone It sure has been fun working with the folks at Novak with this deal and at this time both Bob Novak and Charlie Suanka and his dad will be attending the event.It will great to see Charlie going around the TriClone again!!

Looking forward to seeing everyone at the Jim Wick Select this weekend---weather still looks good!!

What is the track length for the Tri-Clone?

We use 366-375ft for the dyno. The line is everthing on this track.

The track is 360-368 run line. The track is sealed with 4% sand and real good bite we use 3 blues and a left rear green . The track has banking from 6-14 degrees fast in stock is 34 and in 19turn 39 :thumbsup:

Thanks! Got a new track in TN that's similar where we're practicing for the nats. Hope to see you guys in August.

Hey just heard a rumor that BSR is not making 1/12 scale caps. I was just wondering if we can make it a foam class for the nats or not run it at all. It wouldnt be fair if not everyone could get their hands on caps. Especially if they are not available.

Just food for thought!

Jason, Missed you at the 1st Wick Race, Hope you have a good excuse.

Hope to see you soon..

I can't run the nats, but I'm going to try and come up one day as a spectator.

Later,

AJ

Hand out tires are

lf blue L
rf blue S net
lr green L
rr blue R net
BSR

Has A Handout Motor Been Decided Upon Yet. Don't Care What, Inquiring Minds Just Want To Know. :)

What day do we get tires? tuesday or weds.?

Wed for motor and tires

From: Dave J
Date: 7/29/2004 5:27:00 AM Eastern
There were no pre-registrations for the Novak brushless class but there were questions and some enterest, so with the OK of ROAR and Novak we have changed things a bit.The cost of the class has been reduced to $40.00 if you run it as a second class $30.00 with the discount. There will be no hand out tires you can bring your own or buy them at the track. The folks from Novak are still coming to the event and will be bring 12 systems for racers to use or you can bring your own. They are also giving out some great prizes. The hand out systemes will be given out on a first come first serve bacis so either e-mail me at djansen@execpc.com or give me a call at 1-262-338-3809.
There were also no pre-registrations for 1/12 scale mod some poeple suggested that we could run foam tires in this class---- we have never allowed foam tire racing on the Triclone.

At this time 75 entries have been received, the hand out motor for stock will be the Reedy MVP 3 The trophies have been ordered. If you are coming and still have not registered if you could give me a heads up that would be great so we can stock the hospitalty tent and order food for the TQ party----Thanks Dave J.

I was just informed that these rules are in effect now and would be used at the up coming ROAR nationals



ROAR Oval Committee
Memo
To: ROAR 19-Turn Modified Motor Builders (Oval Motors)
Mid-West Tri-Clone (Host 2004 ROAR Paved Oval Nationals)
ROAR Membership
From: ROAR Oval Committee
CC: Files
Date: July 28, 2004
Re: 19T Modified Class Rule Clarifications – Oval Classes
Attached for your reference and implementation, are 19T Modified Class Rule Clarifications that will be
enforced immediately and in effect for the 2004 ROAR Paved Oval Nationals hosted by the Mid-West
Tri-Clone.
These clarifications replace Rules 5-65 through 5-68 of the 2004 ROAR Rule Book.
Rules as printed in the 2004 rulebook were intended as an enhancement to the 2003 19T Modified
Class Rule Clarifications not a replacement. Prior to the 2004 ROAR Carpet Oval Nationals and
immediately after publication, there were several Internet postings trying to provide clarification as to the
motor specifications as shown herein. As a result, the P-94 brush was allowed at the event since
complete clarification was not provided nor published on the ROAR website, Rev-Up, letter, or available
through the host track. To maintain consistency with the intent of the class, as well as substantial
agreement in specifications with other national R/C organizations, only standup brushes (3.75 mmx 5
mm) brushes will be allowed.
If you have any questions, or wish further clarifications, please contact Kenny Bergschultz at
kenny@team1rc.com or at (920) 918-3299 (cell).
Thank you for your time and continued support of ROAR.

19T Modified Class Rule Clarifications
Effective July 28, 2004
***The following clarifications and specifications supercede those published in the ROAR 2004 Rule
book or those previously applied at past ROAR oval events, carpet or paved.
Armatures
All armatures shall be based upon ROAR approved modified motor armatures as shown on the
ROAR website under Products.
Armatures: 3 pole armatures only with a minimum stack length for Epic of 21.3 mm; Yokomo 21.3 mm;
Top Core 21.5 mm; Vortex 21.5 mm with a minimum stack diameter of 22.9 mm. Full stack armatures
only, no split rotors or tri- rotors permitted. Minimum web thickness shall be 0.170 inches (4.33 mm)
including manufacturing applied epoxies to secure stack wafers. No removal of stack wafers (i.e. short
stacking allowed). Armature shaft diameter will be 0.125in.
All 19T armatures will be wound with the Mabuchi wrap, with round 19AWG wire with a maximum size
of 0.0355 inches (0.902mm) bare. A minimum of 19 continuous turns per pole. No error factor in the
number of winds per pole/stack will be allowed. Wire length will be a minimum of 134 inches total, or
44.60 inches unwound per pole. No shorting of any wind or winds allowed.
Armatures may be hand or machine wound, and must bear a mark or tab identifying the armature and
winder. Example: NAME 19X1, NAME 19T. Marks may include etching or engraving on the armature
stacks, and/or tags epoxied between the stack spacing and must be permanent, as to see any
tampering. If it is found that these markings/tabs/tags are not legible, or tampered with, the armatures
may be deemed illegal. Unmarked arms will be deemed illegal and may result in forfeiture of main or
qualifier.
Commutator slots must be aligned to neutral with the center of the individual poles/segments. No
tolerance allowed on commutator timing. Skewed commutator segments are not legal
Full stack armatures made only of magnetizable material. No modifications to the stacks will be
allowed other than the normal drill balance holes. Any modifications to the original OEM
Importer/Manufacturer configurations, including but not limited to, excessive drill holes/milling/turning to
lighten and/or enhance the performance from that of the full stack will not be allowed. No linear
separations of the stack segments will be allowed.
No split or tri-rotors will be allowed. Vertical slots will not be allowed on any armature manufactured by
the original OEM Importer after January 1, 2002. Vertical slots on all armatures manufactured prior to
January 1, 2002 will not be modified from the original configuration as manufactured by the original
OEM Importer. At no time will any material be removed from the armature, whether hidden or visible,
except those from normal balance holes as specified here within. No skewed armature laminations
allowed.
Balancing may be done by either epoxy and/or drill balancing. Drill marks shall not exceed two holes
per pole with a No. 1 or No. 2 combination drill/countersink. Holes may not be any larger 4.76 mm
(0.1875 inches) in diameter and may not exceed 6.35 mm (0.250 inches) in depth. Any large drill holes
of the same size, on all three stacks, shall be suspect to excessive drilling for the purpose of lightening
and/or enhancing the performance.
Any arm to be found in blatant violation of these specifications will result in the OEM
Importer/Manufacturer/Builder to be banned from any ROAR approval product for a period of one year.
This shall include, but not be limited to, smaller wire gauge and less wraps than specified.
ROAR will annually re-evaluate the above specifications based upon quality of race competition,
present manufacturing processes and materials, changes in technology, and track performance.

Cans and Endbells
Only ROAR approved modified motor cans with approved endbells may be used and meet
these specs within. Approved products can be found on the ROAR website under Products.
Can and Endbell: Can based on the 0.05 industry standards, maximum diameter of 36.05mm and a
minimum diameter of 35.5 mm. Maximum length of 36 mm and a minimum length of 35.5 mm
measured from mounting face to the open end of the can. Length from the mounting face to the furthest
point of the mounted endbell shall be a maximum of 53.5 mm and a minimum of 52.2 mm.
Motor mounting holes will be on 1-inch centers. The space between magnets will be centered at one
set of the mounting holes that will be marked to indicate zero degrees (0) centerline. Can must bear the
mark of the original OEM Importer/Manufacture.
Magnets must be permanently affixed/epoxied to the can and not removable. Ceramic magnets only,
no Rare Earth or Cobalt magnets permitted. Honing of the magnets or reforming the can will not be
allowed. Two magnets or four magnets (quad or split magnets) are allowed. Two magnet cans shall
not be cut or emulate split magnets. Quad or split magnets must be of equal size and glued into the
can in such a way that they do not advance the magnetic timing of the motor.
Motor will have adjustable timing. Timing rings shall not be drilled to allow increased timing other than
those drill holes from the manufacturer. Timing for motors shall not exceed 36 degrees.
Ball bearings are allowed. Brush hoods will be STANDUP (3.75 mm x 5mm) brushes only. Brush
hoods may be changed from approved ROAR can/endbell combinations to allow for STANDUP brush
hoods.
"L" cut/timed brushes will not be allowed. Only 3.75 mm x 5 mm brushes and brush hoods will be
used. Trimming/modifying or reducing the size of larger brushes to standup brush size is not allowed.
Slotting and/or elongating the brush hoods mounting holes to cock/shift the location or change the
alignment of the brush is prohibited. Endbell must be secured to the can with the screws. No gluing of
endbell to can allowed. Endbell must bear the mark of the original OEM Importer.
Final Assembly
Swapping of components from one Manufacturer to another is prohibited. All 19T motor combinations
(armature/can/endbells) shall be manufacturer specific (i.e. Epic/Epic/Epic, Yokomo/Yokomo/Yokomo,
etc.)
Pricing
Suggested retail price for a complete motor shall not exceed $65. Armature may not exceed a suggest

Bill,seeing that i am kinda unaware of this stuff,is this a bad thing?So,if i decide to go,will my D5's with standups be legal and competitive?

It is a good thing. Yes and no on the D5's they will be legal but because the D6 can is legal and it has quad magnets I think they would be a little better. I haven't tested them yet but the D6 with laydowns are nasty.

If you can get some D6 cans that would be all you need.

The current ARCOR arms in those D6 cans would then be ROAR legal.

Bill

Guess i'll just stay home and spend the 64.95 on a killer dinette set! Should make the NORRCA state race the week after at C&W a better draw!!!!