As most of you know, The landing gear parts that will be included with the Moebius J2 kit are based on the design from the full scale mock up. This decision will benefit those who place a priority on the interaction of the model with future scale figures.

My communication with fans over the years, however, has clearly indicated that there exists a large group who would prefer the external look of the "hero" J2 miniature in all respects, with full proportional integrity. Toward that end, I am pleased to announce that I have partnered with Paul Bodensiek and ParaGrafix to make the "hero" J2 landing gear available as an after market option. This is an officially licensed product of the highest quality, with the design and artwork approved by Kevin Burns. See images attached, and take special note of Paul's expert 3D rendition and refinement from my original hand drawn plans. Prototype images will be forthcoming.

The price has not yet been set, but expect it to be something in the range of Moebius' new gear set for the Flying Sub. Notice, in fact, that I decided to do the box art in that same basic style, as the "highlight against white" approach, originally introduced to me by Frank, also seemed like a perfect fit for this project. Paul will chime in soon with more details on the design, construction, and materials involved with this new product offering.

We tried very hard to hit a certain date for this announcement, but due to issues beyond our control, we missed it by a couple of days. That would have been September 22nd, which was the 44th anniversary of the original airing of "The Derelict." This, of course, was the episode during which the "hero" landing gear was revealed for the first time. The unforgettable SFX shot in question still holds up very well, in my opinion, even by today's high standards.
Ron G.

Sorry to be out of the loop, Ron. I've read lots of material here, but never really caught on to the differences. For us dum-dums, can you explain what this all means? or can anyone provide a visual comparison? Thanks for all your awesome work. You are highly respected!!!

Ron,
I've been working with this shot recently. It appears there are some wedge-shaped projections between the bottom of the fins and the lower surface of the core, to the left of the near gear leg. They're in all the frames of the shot. They don't seem to be due to a lighting anomaly. Can you tell us anything about them?

[IMG-LEFT]http://www.hobbytalk.com/bbs1/attachment.php?attachmentid=91262&d=1253829432[/IMG-LEFT]

Sorry to be out of the loop, Ron. I've read lots of material here, but never really caught on to the differences. For us dum-dums, can you explain what this all means? or can anyone provide a visual comparison? Thanks for all your awesome work. You are highly respected!!!

Your wish is my command ... As a quick comparison: the full-sized set's landing gear is more slender and "dainty", while the hero miniature's gear is "beefier".

Here's a study Ron did of the two gear, based on drawings Moebius made of the kit gear. I superimposed the two images to make the comparison easier:

http://photos.hobbytalk.com/data/647/thumbs/J2_Gear-Comparison2.gif (http://photos.hobbytalk.com/showphoto.php/photo/36741)

Also, here's the exploded view of our gear showing all of the pieces:

http://photos.hobbytalk.com/data/647/thumbs/Exploded-View.jpg (http://photos.hobbytalk.com/showphoto.php/photo/36740)

I'm still working on the final quotations for casting the metal parts (the left-hand portions including the landing pad, the lower portion of the main arm, and the upper bracket to attach the rod to the ship) and the laser cut pieces (the main gear portions).

One slight change we decided to make from Ron's original study is to alter the angle of the arm so that the top of the rod mates to the ship at the same mounting hole as the kit gear.

I hope to have the prototypes of the gear ready tomorrow and will post images as soon as Ron and I have a chance to go over them.

..SIGH...more money to Paul. ;)

Ron,
I've been working with this shot recently. It appears there are some wedge-shaped projections between the bottom of the fins and the lower surface of the core, to the left of the near gear leg. They're in all the frames of the shot. They don't seem to be due to a lighting anomaly. Can you tell us anything about them?

I always assumed that it was a lighting anomaly, but now I will study it further.

Sorry to be out of the loop, Ron. I've read lots of material here, but never really caught on to the differences. For us dum-dums, can you explain what this all means? or can anyone provide a visual comparison? Thanks for all your awesome work. You are highly respected!!!

kdaracal,
In addition to the superimposed image that Paul provided, I am reposting my A-B comparison image for your convenience. Note that we made a few changes since I did that study. For example, my first inclination was to retain the proportions of the hero gear, but then "dress them up" with familiar details to which one might be accustomed from seeing close up shots of the full scale gear.

Notice the flexible "shock absorber" joint in lieu of the ball and socket suggestion on the drawing. Also, the lower angled front section of the leg is closed rather than being open as it was on the hero gear (as seen on another view). But then we decided that it would probably be best to just do the hero gear in all of its original detail, and leave the "dressing up" option up to the individual. All things considered, I think this is the right choice. The point is that whatever one decides to do with this new gear, the proportional integrity with respect to the hull contour will be fully intact. That means that you will be able to accurately duplicate the classic SFX scene on the J2 landing on the circle, if that is your preference.

Thank you for your efforts on this, Ron and all involved. I agree with you that the hero proportions are ideal. The Moebius J2 with this gear has to be a high water mark for model kits. Can't wait!:thumbsup:

Paul, Thanks for the superimposed image.
Ron, Thanks for going the extra miles to make the very best model possible. The more I see, the more I can't wait for this to come out. About the only extras I will be getting is a nice decal kit (because I stink at painting small buttons) and a nice light set because it is just so COOL! Thanks again to Moebius and Ron for really making childhood dreams come true for this 46 year old. :)

Hi Paul, Ron,
I love all the work that went into this and you can count on me getting three
sets.....:thumbsup:

..SIGH...more money to Paul. ;)

He needs to pay for that Roll's he has.....;)

He needs to pay for that Roll's he has.....;)

To keep people from thinking I'm doing too well, I've replaced the Rolls hood ornament with a medallion that says "Kia". :p

Paul, Thanks for the superimposed image.
Ron, Thanks for going the extra miles to make the very best model possible. The more I see, the more I can't wait for this to come out. About the only extras I will be getting is a nice decal kit (because I stink at painting small buttons) and a nice light set because it is just so COOL! Thanks again to Moebius and Ron for really making childhood dreams come true for this 46 year old. :)

You're quite welcome. I hope the image cleared up any confusion.

Decals are in the works along with an etch set to make lighting much easier. I'm sure that Randy will have a lighting set that will work perfectly with this kit so it would be similar to working with the Flying Sub etch/decal/lighting set.

Those wedges look like shadowplay to me. Why would they only be on one quadrant of the core? They can easily be explained as shadows from the fins caused by a light from below/behind.

Well I would've bought these, except that you missed the anniversary of the first showing of "The Derelict". Now? Pffft, forget it!



Can't wait to see how this aftermarket kit comes out. Nice Job!

Decals are in the works along with an etch set to make lighting much easier. I'm sure that Randy will have a lighting set that will work perfectly with this kit so it would be similar to working with the Flying Sub etch/decal/lighting set.

SWEEEEEET! :woohoo:

Love the Flying Sub set (now if I can find time to USE it)

This is really great - we're getting a look at an accessory kit for a model that is months away from being released. I know where part of my end of year bonus will be going....

I love the level of detail in all the drawings. I can't wait to see what the finished product looks like!

Bryan

This is really great - we're getting a look at an accessory kit for a model that is months away from being released. I know where part of my end of year bonus will be going....

I love the level of detail in all the drawings. I can't wait to see what the finished product looks like!

Bryan

You can always count on Paul to be lightyears ahead of the game and with Ron being a part of it, it will just be sick......:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup: Can't wait for what he does next.

Those wedges look like shadowplay to me. Why would they only be on one quadrant of the core? They can easily be explained as shadows from the fins caused by a light from below/behind.
I don't know John, but it was a stupid idea to post my question in this thread. Sorry.

Ya know untill Ron posted that comparison of the 2 types of gear I did not think that there was much of a difference! I do not as a matter of course add that much aftermarket stuff to my builds. I am mostly an out of the box kind of guy but I think in this case I may have to get the "hero" gear set for my Jupiter 2. Exelent!:thumbsup::thumbsup:

The challenge is to make Ron's "Hero Gear" Work. I can't wait. Nice photo of that Jupiter 2 too......I think thats the one I removed the stage hand from...:wave:

The challenge is to make Ron's "Hero Gear" Work. I can't wait. Nice photo of that Jupiter 2 too......I think thats the one I removed the stage hand from...:wave:

Y3a,
As a matter of fact, Paul and I discussed the fact that some may tackle this possibility, and I mentioned you specifically because of your many interesting and informative posts on this subject. I think that the basic elements in our product do exist for adaptation into working gear for those who so choose. The actual mechanism, however, may have to be a little different than the original.

As such, I also think there's a possibility that it could be done without gutting the entire interior. It would mean opening up the floor behind the bulkhead walls in a significant manner to accommodate the legs and whatever mechanism is deemed necessary. However, the tightness of the perimeter that defines the upper deck on this model makes this a real possibility. Although working gear is not necessarily my thing, I will be very interested to see what you come up with.

Great! job Ron/Paul, this add on accurate landing gear will take an already excellent version of the famed intergalactic vehicle to the level of 100%.

Hey! guys can i get you all to do the lower deck ?

Ron, Thank you for bringing us the HERO kanding gear ! YOUR landing gear will now make the correct profile for a great model ! I am thankful for a new, bigger Jupiter 2 but i was going to be forced to have it built gear up, so it would look correct. Now, with all of your dedication to the jupiter 2 that I highly respect, I will have a legs down Jupiter 2 that will be 100% acurate, Ron, I consider you to be the ultimate authority on the Jupiter 2 and without YOUR input & hard work on the Jupiter 2 model project, the model would have NEVER been possible in my opinion.THANK YOU RON, !!!THANK YOU PAUL !!!!
Bert

THANK GOODNESS for this upcoming accurate set of gear for our wonderful Jupiter 2.... Now the model will have have the full integrity, in appearance, to the 4 foot filming miniature ......the look we all loved on the small screen.... Ron THANKS for sharing your glorious talents with us!

:thumbsup:Ron, Thank you for bringing us the HERO kanding gear ! YOUR landing gear will now make the correct profile for a great model ! I am thankful for a new, bigger Jupiter 2 but i was going to be forced to have it built gear up, so it would look correct. Now, with all of your dedication to the jupiter 2 that I highly respect, I will have a legs down Jupiter 2 that will be 100% acurate, Ron, I consider you to be the ultimate authority on the Jupiter 2 and without YOUR input & hard work on the Jupiter 2 model project, the model would have NEVER been possible in my opinion.THANK YOU RON, !!!THANK YOU PAUL !!!!

SAME HERE, while i look forward to the kit like a kid waiting for Christmas, I was gonna do legs up mainly becuase the legs were a big turn off, Ron and Paul have come thru to make this kit 100%

many Thanks guys.


Bert

Sounds like you turned a lot of guys on with your legs Ron and Paul!... those sexy, strong, Jupiter 2 legs! .. now to make some 1/35th scale stockings and garter belt to slip over them! LOL

I won't be using the interior on the working gear model, so I have as much space as I'll need.

I'm still thinking of a jack shaft system to pull wires to lower the legs and lift & slide the doors.

I won't be using the interior on the working gear model, so I have as much space as I'll need.

I'm still thinking of a jack shaft system to pull wires to lower the legs and lift & slide the doors.

Considering what you intend to do, I think you're right about that decision. However, I'm visualizing that a few may want to construct some sort of manual retraction system, similar to the old Lunar Models add-on gear, or the Trendmasters J2 "toy." For those people, I still think it might be possible to work something out with the interior intact, as long as they are willing to perform the fairly drastic modifications required to the floor area behind the bulkhead walls. But then that's the beauty of this model. You can do pretty much whatever you want with it. Paul and I simply made another level of choices a little bit easier.

Ron, Thank you for bringing us the HERO kanding gear ! YOUR landing gear will now make the correct profile for a great model ! I am thankful for a new, bigger Jupiter 2 but i was going to be forced to have it built gear up, so it would look correct. Now, with all of your dedication to the jupiter 2 that I highly respect, I will have a legs down Jupiter 2 that will be 100% acurate, Ron, I consider you to be the ultimate authority on the Jupiter 2 and without YOUR input & hard work on the Jupiter 2 model project, the model would have NEVER been possible in my opinion.THANK YOU RON, !!!THANK YOU PAUL !!!!
Bert

Wow, Bert, I'm not sure quite what to say, how to respond, or even if I should. I may refer back to this again sometime, because there have been quite a few players in the area of the J2 over the years who deserve their own special attention, not to mention everyone involved with this new model kit. However, for now, allow me to express my sincere thanks for your very kind sentiments. Yes, it's true that I've been pounding the table on the subject of the J2 on the internet alone for more than a decade, trying very hard to answer all e-mails along the way. A response like this from someone like you makes me think it has all been worth it.
Ron G.

I have also been one of those "vocal sticklers" for the hero J2 landing gear, so this is really good news. Please put me down for two sets.

How much more would it cost to either go straight to working gear, or providing flush (raised gear) inserts?

Thank you Ron and Paul.



91302

I wanted to say here, that I found out what the story is. It took some serious sharpening of the video, but I discovered that the wedges are, indeed, a mirage. When the spinning light is in a wedged frame, the wedge disappears, so the wedges are due to the set lighting. :o

Ron,
I've been working with this shot recently. It appears there are some wedge-shaped projections between the bottom of the fins and the lower surface of the core, to the left of the near gear leg. They're in all the frames of the shot. They don't seem to be due to a lighting anomaly. Can you tell us anything about them?

[IMG-LEFT]http://www.hobbytalk.com/bbs1/attachment.php?attachmentid=91262&d=1253829432[/IMG-LEFT]

I have also been one of those "vocal sticklers" for the hero J2 landing gear, so this is really good news. Please put me down for two sets.

How much more would it cost to either go straight to working gear, or providing flush (raised gear) inserts?

Thank you Ron and Paul.

You're quite welcome, GimiJimi!

Ron and I have discussed developing a working version of the gear, but in the end decided that we would just be doing the static version.

I hadn't checked on the doors, but just checked the kit and with the lip provided it would be far simpler (and less expensive!) to cut some thin sheet plastic to fit rather than purchase pre-cut pieces. To make the curvature correct for the hull, the pieces would need to be cast rather than cut, and that would mean making them fairly thick to provide good molding.

P.S. Your gear looks great!

Great! job Ron/Paul, this add on accurate landing gear will take an already excellent version of the famed intergalactic vehicle to the level of 100%.

Thanks! Yes, this kit is a fantastic replica of the ship. I opened the box a few weeks back and just said "wow"! I'm going to be sad to send it on its way come Monday.

We're going for as near 100% accuracy for the hero miniature version of the gear as is possible, though on the other tentacle, the gear that comes with kit is pretty much dead-on accurate to the full-sized set piece.

Between the two, people have options for building whichever version of the ship they'd like.

I have an idea on how to do the gear for this model....IF.... you want to do the "Hero" version cockpit, possibly the 6 spinning lights in the core and the "V" spinner in the bubble looking like the real thing. The reason you have to do the box stuck to the viewport interior is for the other stuff.

I have been thinking about how to stop the attachment block and not have to have some convoluted wiring and relays. A jack shaft is a threaded shaft with a block with attachment points on a side or two and a threaded hole through it that matches the thread of the shaft. all you need to do is set up "Stops" for the end points of the block. the torque is immense so be careful! I just figured a way to run the jackshaft without this wiring by allowing the motor to have a rubber tire on the output, and put another rubber tire on one end of the shaft. the slipping will do the same thing as turning off as far as stopping the blocks travel back n forth on the shaft.

I will use one set of wires to the footpad doors and another to the gear legs. The delay required between pulling the footpad doors open and dropping the gear legs is done by adding weak springs into the wires.

the footpad doors start right away by pulling the door up out of the pocket and sliding it out of the way. the spring needs to be stronger than the one used for the legs themselves. It is attached between two points on the wire. The door is pulled back to it's stop point on a rail and the wire continues to be pulled by the jack shaft while the spring (kind of like a small screen door return spring) is stretched. the spring was strong enough to pull the footpad doors open, and pull harder than the return spring on the door.

The leg drops after the doors have opened, using the same type of spring arrangement, but with a really wimpy spring. it just has to stretch while the door opens, and then the spring can be at its end where the wire has been let out to the point that it now pulls the gear down. The wire would attach to a control arm like the Hero used that can be fabricated from block plastic with a threaded tip to attach the wire and make fine adjustments.

You're quite welcome, GimiJimi!


P.S. Your gear looks great!

Thanks, but actually its not my gear.

I believe this a picture of the final mock-up, pre-fabrication, pre-metal, version used by Custom Replicas for their 18-inch hero Jupiter 2; or the ICONS version. Custom Replicas purchased ICONS' Jupiter 2 when ICONS went away, so its the same model, essentially. Both were based on the filming hero version used in filming of the "Derelict" episode.

I just wanted to be able to offer a picture of working landing gear to plead my case for the same for the Moebius Jupiter 2.

My thanks to the both of you for the hero landing gear add-on.

Y3a,
How do you activate your gear?

Cant wait for these new gear Ron and Paul. Great job.:thumbsup: Thanks for the time, effort and speed in which you guys put this together.:thumbsup:

...and speed in which you guys put this together...

:freak: I've got to say that developing this *really small* accessory set gives me a whole new appreciation for what Frank, Dave, and Gary have gone through to give us the Jupiter 2 (and all their other great kits). Ron and I went back and forth for ages before I ever even got the test shot in my hands to make sure it was right, then went back and changed tons and tons. I know that Moebius goes through that level of work on the rest of the ship (the detail is AWESOME) and their commitment just boggles my mind!

So will this be cast in resin or injection molded styrene?

So will this be cast in resin or injection molded styrene?

There will be cast metal and laser cut plastic pieces.

I will control the motor from the support wires. For that model I can get by with single thin steel wire (K&S) to support the model and provide power. no batteries needed, you can run it off about 4 volts from a radioshak power block. I plan to make both a "Lydecker" style rig in the spring to do some video fer fun. If I get anything of interest I'll post it. I also plan to use a 12 foot 2x2 for the control boom when I wanna do the other stuff. To make it stronger, you cut it down the center and epoxy it back together. I'll use a base of 4x4's and a mounting point about 6 feet up so the wires and boom can be out of the frame. A 5 gallon paint bucket filled with bricks, about 3-5 feet in back of the pivot should work as a counterbalance. The powerblock can be taped to the boom along with the wiring and switches.

The boom would be suitable for the lift off from Henry's Launch tower...

The Lydecker rig will be fun to use to have the jupiter 2 lift off from a pile of dirt and such and retract the gear and hover about 2 feet off the ground and float forward while gaining speed and altitude. I can attach the ends of the rig to trees in my next door neighbors! the winch can be controlled by a model railroad transformer with momentum to both smoothly move the rig and set the specific speeds needed. I think I'll film it at night so I can really control the light! (Thanks to the inspiration from O. Winston Link.)

This all sounds very interesting. Looking forward to many photos, and maybe even YouTube videos?

I coudn't get you to ADD SOME PARTS into your photo etch for the control arms at the top end of the leg could I????

Y3a,
Paul has control of those decisions, but I suspect there will be a cost concern involved. The situation is pretty tight as it is in terms of price point.

Ron, Thank you for bringing us the HERO kanding gear ! YOUR landing gear will now make the correct profile for a great model ! I am thankful for a new, bigger Jupiter 2 but i was going to be forced to have it built gear up, so it would look correct. Now, with all of your dedication to the jupiter 2 that I highly respect, I will have a legs down Jupiter 2 that will be 100% acurate, Ron, I consider you to be the ultimate authority on the Jupiter 2 and without YOUR input & hard work on the Jupiter 2 model project, the model would have NEVER been possible in my opinion.THANK YOU RON, !!!THANK YOU PAUL !!!!
Bert

THANK GOODNESS for this upcoming accurate set of gear for our wonderful Jupiter 2.... Now the model will have have the full integrity, in appearance, to the 4 foot filming miniature ......the look we all loved on the small screen.... Ron THANKS for sharing your glorious talents with us!

I couldn't express myself better.
Thanks Ron and Paul.

I may make a balsa shape that will fit into the back end of the leg and stick out about 2 inches, then I'll make a mold and produce the finals in Alumilite.

I will try to keep the leg components intact so the original designs structural integrity will remain intact.
If I make a part that slips into the back end and also slips over the back of the top step and is snug against the sides I can maintain the squareness and provide a sturdier spot for a brass tube as pivot bearing.

This kind of arrangement suggests stronger mount points for the rod going through the back of the leg.
I'll buff and graphite mine before installation.

An "A" frame will also be required for the hydraulic rams shaft to rotate from.
I will most likely use thin Model Airplane style plywood for the backing for the gear wells.

"IF" Moebius provided removable footpad doors the rest will be a piece of cake. If not............ I dunno. I need to see it.

The gear well frames inside make a good mounting point for the rotation stuff.
I use a small model railroad motor and NWSL after market Steam Engine gearox. Usually 36 to 1 ratio. The plastic gear axle hole should be 1/8 inch in diameter for easy part locating.

You can add in 2 RC Car ball bearings on either end too. I did that on the Lunar Models mechanics.
http://photos.hobbytalk.com/data/509/thumbs/IMG_1910.jpg (http://photos.hobbytalk.com/showphoto.php/photo/36800)
http://photos.hobbytalk.com/data/509/thumbs/IMG_1919.jpg (http://photos.hobbytalk.com/showphoto.php/photo/36798)
http://photos.hobbytalk.com/data/509/thumbs/IMG_1918.jpg (http://photos.hobbytalk.com/showphoto.php/photo/36797)
http://photos.hobbytalk.com/data/509/thumbs/IMG_1915.jpg (http://photos.hobbytalk.com/showphoto.php/photo/36796)
http://photos.hobbytalk.com/data/509/thumbs/IMG_1914.jpg (http://photos.hobbytalk.com/showphoto.php/photo/36801)

Use a small bit of rubber tubing to connect the motor shaft to the gearbox.

The "V in the bubble is just a circle of polished metal bent into a "V shape as seen from the side, and attached t the top of the 1/8" brass tube.
You can solder it to a 'Wheel Collar' so it can be removed.

The fusion core can be 6 bright white LED's mounted on a thin plastic circle with the thin batteries powering them on the other side.
you can even mount the switch on the battery side for easier access and control.
It can also have it's own wheel collar in the exact center that allows it to be removed from the rotating shaft.

The "V" is lit by 6 bright white LED's pointed up at the bottom of the "V".

They are mounted on the top side of a frosted plastic circle that also illuminates the back side of the cockpit scrim for that characteristic sillouette look to the crew.

The Tossing and pitching clip of the Jupiter 2 from Lost in Space Forever gives you a glimpse of the close spacing of the lights looking into the bubble.

The Model RR motor ang gearbox are not under any resistance so they will last 20-50 years. How long would an LED version hold up?

My God!!
Every time a see posts like that, I feel like the smallest worm of the plastic modeling world.
Fantastic!!
Thanks for sharing Y3a.

Thank you very much for the complement, and I hope you can improve on my crude stuff done in haste when I had a day or so.

I have NO LIFE so doing this sort of thing has become my life lately. The stuff you're looking at was done when I was starting my computer maintenance business and had more free time than I needed. Lucky my parents are here to help.

This solution to the landing gear and spinner stuff was mostly a product of my environment. I live outside DC near Leesburg VA. I work IN DC. The commute is over an hour both ways and I have lots of time to work out this stuff. Its more legal than using a BAZOOKA on the idiot drivers. I figured out a flying sub drop mech for the BIG Moebius Seaview, and a suspension for the Chariot the same way.

The model railroad takes up even more time.

BTW - My Lunar Models two foot J2 is waiting for me to add the support stuff inside so I can use it to 'perform' all its tricks. It has working gear and footpad doors, and the lights n stuff really spins, not just a chaser. It looks like the Derelict version. The support will let me pick it up and move it by wires like the original Hero.

I have a 4 foot hull from the 'restored' Azarian Hero. The hull looks 3rd year, as the lower hull is 'fatter somehow. I have only built the jackshaft mechanics and bought the NWSL gear boxes for mine. I have drawn out the fusion core fins, and footpads, and "A" frame inside for the "Hydraulic" rams. I don't know if I'll ever get to 'fly' that 4 foot model though.

I thought I should take a minute to extend a special note of thanks to Frank for his support of the Hero J2 Landing Gear Project. He was respectful of my opinion for the viability of and the need for this product from the start, and was prepared to help me see it through by any means necessary. We are very lucky to have a man at the helm of Moebius who displays such a level of interest in support product offerings.
Ron G.