This question was posed to me today about rookie racers; How long does one stay in the rookie class?

I could not answer the question directly. So, I thought it might make for a good dialog on the subject?

What should Rookie Guidelines be based upon _______?


Timeline
Performance
Ability to meet a set lap time?(If so, is one lap at this time good enough to move up?)
Wins
All of the above
??your thoughts??

I would say performance. Definitely not time line as we all progress at a different rate.

Performance! I also believe that that this criteria should be used to move people up to grand national from sportsman. Just my opinion!

As I am new to 1/4 scale. I think it should be performance. I can be fast one day and not another, or even 1 heat to another.
20 years racing 1/10 scale carpet does not carry over to 1/4 scale.

As I am new to 1/4 scale. I think it should be performance. I can be fast one day and not another, or even 1 heat to another.
20 years racing 1/10 scale carpet does not carry over to 1/4 scale.it carries over more than you think you have 20 years of wheel time verses someone with zero

you are correct about wheel time. but driving style and timing and setup and on and on...
having alot of fun learning, and racing.

I agree with performance. I also agree with Dick K. Once you have reached a certain performance level you should move up to GN. I myself have run both classes on the local level and would love to run GN more but not against 3 or 4 guys. I like the feilds of 18, 20 or more...... Just my 2 cents worth

Performance!!!!!!

Performance! That should encapsulate Years in the class, driving ability and wins.

This is what Freddie did for his track:

http://freddies.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=tf&action=display&thread=82

Yes brent freddie did a great job with the rules for advancement all tracks needs to go buy those guidelines for driver placement

I would rather see a performance scale verses a race director decision. Now, I could possibly see a committee of racers making a decision to move a new racer backwards or forwards.

IMO...guidelines would need to be track specific.

I agree with performance. I also agree with Dick K. Once you have reached a certain performance level you should move up to GN. I myself have run both classes on the local level and would love to run GN more but not against 3 or 4 guys. I like the feilds of 18, 20 or more...... Just my 2 cents worth

I will have to agree to disagree on the Sportsman - GN issue. I think GN should be the drivers choice just like Sprint car.

Sprint cars are more demanding and less forgiving than the fullbody cars and require more skill to keep the wheels on it one little mess up is all it takes to bring your car off the track in a 5 gallon bucket

Yes brent freddie did a great job with the rules for advancement all tracks needs to go buy those guidelines for driver placement
????????????yesman???????????

Car control is more important than lap times, IMO. I was thrown to the wolves from the start and had to learn to keep my car under me and out of the way. I've seen some cars that were plenty quick, but out of control, So i think it's the ability to drive consistently rather than how quick you can turn a lap.

I would like to see a veteran driver "sponsor" a guy that want's to move up a class. Be his crew chief for a race or two to coach the new guy a little. When to move up out of the groove and let someone go by, driving within your setup, and when to simply pull it from the race.:thumbsup:

David

Car control is more important than lap times, IMO. I was thrown to the wolves from the start and had to learn to keep my car under me and out of the way. I've seen some cars that were plenty quick, but out of control, So i think it's the ability to drive consistently rather than how quick you can turn a lap.

I would like to see a veteran driver "sponsor" a guy that want's to move up a class. Be his crew chief for a race or two to coach the new guy a little. When to move up out of the groove and let someone go by, driving within your setup, and when to simply pull it from the race.:thumbsup:

David
I second that David....common sense and car control should determine what class a person can or should drive in, not lap times or speed!

David, You got it right on the button.

I agree 100%. I would give my fastest lap away everytime for 10 consistant laps. :thumbsup:

I've seen some cars that were plenty quick, but out of control, So i think it's the ability to drive consistently rather than how quick you can turn a lap.
David


My idea of a gauge for rookie ability and perfomance to move up:

Total of races in a half/full season
Total laps completed in a half/full season
Total of races with lap consistancy
Average lap times in best 10 race finishes
DNF's
WinsMeasure the areas above by percentages. This might work for other classes too?

Another option is the scoring programs themselves. Many have an ability program built into their software. It measures the drivers performance & abilities over a set period of time/races.

I agree again. :thumbsup:A racer could go out and set the track record with one good lap, but might not be able motivate his way thru traffic without a wrecking himself or others. I second that David....common sense and car control should determine what class a person can or should drive in, not lap times or speed!

Me too Tim. I would glady give up a 5.8 for 10 5.9's anytime.

I would rather have 75 6.0's than hear caution caution, repediatly.Slow down and go fast. IMO

AMEN brother! :thumbsup:

I hate to hear caution, especially when I make the bonehead move that brings it out.:freak:
I would rather have 75 6.0's than hear caution caution, repediatly.Slow down and go fast. IMO

Old thread, new question: How many 2009 rookies will be 2010 Sportsmen?

I'll be a sportsman forever... LOL :tongue:

I'll be a sportsman forever... LOL :tongue:

Hey! What about that new sprint car? Come have some real fun.....

Hey! What about that new sprint car? Come have some real fun.....

Fred you guys are BRAVE! Sprinters have way too much stuff hanging off of them for me to give it a go. Besides they got no stinking fenders.:tongue:

Hey! What about that new sprint car? Come have some real fun.....

I plan on it. If I can ever get the time to go get it. I've been down south ever since I found out that I WON it. As a kid, did you ever get a new bike for X-Mas and had to wait for all the snow to melt, before you could ride it? :freak: It's driving me crazy. LOL

I will be a rookie for few years. This year I've only been on track 3 times, twice for a race at Freddies, and once at Texas to play and get seat time. I do plan on making it for the Boyd Hughes Memorial race at L.P.R., but with my job, you can never make plans to far in advance.

You think that I could get WILLY talked into me driving his sprint car? That way when I do get mine, I know what not to do! LOL :tongue:

2009 was my first year racing 1/4 scale but I may have been a rookie, I raced all year with the regular racers... no rookies but me...

I will be running Sportsman for 2010 just like 2009.

Chuck #3

I hear ya Chuck. I started in with the GN guys myself. I pretty much ran the second groove back then to stay out of the way.

I'm glad for the new guys who's local track has enough for a rookie class.:thumbsup:

So far, I've heard of two Limited Sportsman racers at LPR moving up in 2010...might be more?

Hey Tim,

You going to have a rookie class for the BH race? I'm going to try and make it this year. For my first race ever, I got thrown to the wolves at the Freddies 500. I did OK, came home with the car still in one piece. Didn't make anybody too mad at me. :thumbsup:

Stop dipping your toes in the water and jump in head first!! i have seen you drive so get out there and GET ER DONE!!...and when you are there you can put willy back in his dress!!! ROTFLMAO

Yes Sir, Limited Sportsmen will be running.... Sportsman rules apply.....come on!Hey Tim,

You going to have a rookie class for the BH race? I'm going to try and make it this year. For my first race ever, I got thrown to the wolves at the Freddies 500. I did OK, came home with the car still in one piece. Didn't make anybody too mad at me. :thumbsup:

Yes Sir, Limited Sportsmen will be running.... Sportsman rules apply.....come on!
Tim
dont you let him drive rookie class that boy owns a sprintcar for crying out loud, that he has never seen..LOL

Hey, if he's never seen it, that means he's never driven it....he's good to go!:thumbsup:

Tim
dont you let him drive rookie class that boy owns a sprintcar for crying out loud, that he has never seen..LOL

I am stuck,I think as for me and me being new,I would like some time to learn the car and a bit how to drive it better.I believe if I can do this my performance may get better.I had a great example 2 weeks ago,willy got my car and made it look like it was dialed in perfect,when I got it back in hand,I was all over the track.When I grow up,I want to be a good 1/4 scale driver.LOLOLOLOL

I really don't care what I do or race. I'm just there to have a good time and try to help out a good cause.

I really don't understand why anybody would want to see Will in a dress. :drunk::freak:

Yuk. Can't you guys find a good looking female to put in a dress? :thumbsup:

I really don't car what I do or race. I'm just there to have a good time and try to help out a good cause.

I really don't understand why anybody would want to see Will in a dress. :drunk::freak:

Yuk. Can't you guys find a good looking female to put in a dress? :thumbsup:

Mike's always tryin to get them out of there dress, so I hear.
Stivy Run the regular sportsman class you'll fit right in. Go for it. Oh, by the way.

Mike, I'd love to dive right in. I wish that I could get more track time.
Back to the original topic. I don't get much time to race because of my travels. I don't think, I'm that bad driving. I'm good enough to stay out of the way, but some of the guys out there are really fast. For me to be that fast, I will need some time.
I like the idea of putting drivers in a class based on there lap time avarage. I understand that the car count may not support that idea. I guess the question that I have is. How long do you keep the new guys interested, while they go through the learning curve and are not competitive? Some learn faster than others. Some never learn at all. I myself, am in this hobby to have a good time, but some are in it to win it and forget about having fun.

We have a great group of rookies this year. We had a few guys with samll car experience run a couple of limited races and the move right up to sportsman and be competitve, we have a couple that will be ready next year, and we have a few that will need yet another year.

These guys are every bit as competitive amongst themselves as any class we run. They probably get even more excited about their accomplishments than the "good" guys do. They race hard, and are learning how to manage the race, gaining car control, when to give a little, when to go for it, ect...

As with anything, If you want to be good at it, you have to practice, practice, practice, and race, race, race. Racing is a lot different than turning laps, so it's a big help for these guys to be able to participate in actual races, with guys of similar abilities.

My first 2 years I got very good at getting out of the way, not a lot of fun in that. The next 2 years I was able to run at the back of the pack, and finish within a few laps of the leaders. This year, I've been pretty fast, and just now beginning to learn how to pass fast cars.

I guess all I'm saying is, for most people, it take a lot of track time, both practicing, and racing. And a lot of help from our friends.

David-#3 WCM

All good points in there you guys!!

I'm thinking that there is a stigma of "having a Bush or biginner class". It all depends on the track as to what they want to do. If there is enough sportsman to support this, you can have an "A" and a "B" set of heats and let the fast guys be in the A. If you have enough to get a "C" or "D", that's even better. You don't have to have 10 in the A if the guys want to race in the B. That way it can be a natural progression and everyone races with the people they are confortable with. Again it is up to the track and local club.

Just an idea.

Lucky for LPR, it hasn't been a stigma in the least. I don't think I've heard one thing from our rookie racers that would lead us to believe they have been left with anything but good results. I only regret we didn't do it two or three seasons sooner.

The way we look(ed) at our Limited class is; it wasn't breaking up our numbers but more or less it was a step to grow them. If we had one, two or three racers that dropped down from Sportsman into the limited class because of abilities or lack thereof, it wasn't a loss but a gain in latter seasons to keep those guys racing with us period. The very guys that would have been ran over, felt like they were being dominated and thinking like David once did "My first 2 years I got very good at getting out of the way, not a lot of fun in that." No Sir, it's no fun for the new guy nor is it for the guys that feel he is in the way.

And to echo another area David posted; there has been some very competitive racing in the Limited class. It doesn't matter to those racers if their a second slower than the sportsman, they are racing hard, gaining experience and having a blast. I can't tell you have many times I've pulled away from the track and the Limited guys were still standing at the back of their pickups talking about the race day & just basically bench racing...LOL. Now that is just plain cool in my eyes!:thumbsup:

I can't tell you have many times I've pulled away from the track and the Limited guys were still standing at the back of their pickups talking about the race day & just basically bench racing...LOL. Now that is just plain cool in my eyes!:thumbsup:


Now that is what I'm talking about!!!

I agree, got to keep the slow guys interested. This is what helps the hobby grown in my opinion.

the one time i came with kenny and he said i had to be at his house at 5 am, i woke up at 3am and sitting in his front yard at 4:30am just waiting on him to get his old butt in the truck sso we could do some racing. and that night after i drove his car, BAM!!! i was hooked. now i'm waiting anxiously for my WCM cage car to get here so i can stare at it while i wait for the next time i get to dive into a corner and pray it stays going the right direction. So you guy can count me in for some limited sportsman.

You did a great job with kennys car after the mains it will not take you long to be beating the veterans

That's the lure of the LPR monster!the one time i came with kenny and he said i had to be at his house at 5 am, i woke up at 3am and sitting in his front yard at 4:30am just waiting on him to get his old butt in the truck sso we could do some racing. and that night after i drove his car, BAM!!! i was hooked. now i'm waiting anxiously for my WCM cage car to get here so i can stare at it while i wait for the next time i get to dive into a corner and pray it stays going the right direction. So you guy can count me in for some limited sportsman.

thanks but i have alot to learn to keep one on the track on my own with me doing the setup and tuning. but i do learn fast. " 1 turn = 1 degree" i can't remember who said it but it stuck in my head.

i know i have been dying just sitting here waiting.