Hi guys,

Over on HOWORLD list we are seein if we can get enough commitments on paper to raise enough money to have the TJET chassis reproduced. Share will be $50.00 each. A share will allow you to buy TJET chassis at whole sale prices. As of 6:00 we had 60 shares committed to with 940 to go. If you are intereseted post on HOWORLD and let everyone know. So are there enough hobbiest to do this? That is the question

Roger Corrie

Hey Roger, tried looking through the massive pile of posts over there and couldn't seem to find the start of the thread, maybe you can answer a few questions?

So what do you get for $50 and what will the whole sale price be?
Does that $50 per share actually go towards the chassis purchases?

I would LOVE to be able to buy the perfect recreation of the t-jet, but have obviously seen the attempts made the last few go arounds and they have not been good (MM, JL/AW), what makes this version a better investment?

Are they going for an EXACT reproduction, or are they going to try and improve a few things (i.e. pop in rear axle)?

Inquiring minds would love to know, thanks!

Here is whated started everything. We are now seeing if on paper we can raise enough to get the chassis made.

Fellow slotters,

A new chassis would be nice and I have thought about it a number of times.

Here are some problems, and trust me, i know from what I speak!

start up costs for a duplicate of a solid rivit tjet chassis. $35,000.00 That means no testing yet and no purchases yet. That means after your 35K investment offshore, you now have to buy product, say at $3.00 per complete rolling chassis. If I wanted 1000 it would cost me $3000.00. If I sell them for $10 each I made $7000.00 back and to get out of the red so to speak, I would have to buy 5000 total chassis.

My total investment would have to be$50,000 (35K tooling 15K product) to produce 5000 chassis at $3.00 each..

What if the ohms and performance were not up to par? No guarantees on my $35K tooling costs. Word would spread on the internet so fast I would be H.Woodrow II in about one minute. My investment would be gone and no chance to turn a profit.

TOO RISKY in todays market.

consider the alternatives: original tjet chassis ARE available. AW makes a decent replacement. Why re-invent the wheel?

Anyone want in? I will not risk the chance for a return.

Bob Beers

A number of people have asked for exact detail. Please see the quote below. Bob was referring to a match of the genuine article. :)



... a solid rivit tjet chassis...

:thumbsup::thumbsup:

Hutt says this is an honorable way to hit 1000. :drunk::hat::freak::dude:

You only need to buy like 10 chassis at $6 each to recoop the $50 investment.

Are there 2 proposals on the table? Bob's posting sounds like he's soliciting opinions, not investors. Where's the 1000 investors proposal coming from and who is the person running the deal forthe 1000 investors? Getting 3 guys to agree on something is hard enough, 1000 sounds impossible.

Here is how it got started Geoff anwsered Bobs post and I anwsered Geoff's post then Bob came back In order Geoff, Roger then Bob shown below. It will be interesting to see how close can we get to what is needed to produce the TJET Who knows if we keep it going we might just get there :)

Fellow Chassiphiles....

Okay, add your name and number of $50 shares for investment.
ROI (return on investment) is chassis purchase at cost.

Bob Beers 10 shares
Roger Corrie 4 shares

CUT AND PASTE YOUR REPLY IN THE BODY OF A NEW EMAIL RESPONSE!

thanks,

CEO Bob



I'll kick in :) Lets take a head count and see how many would be willing too. Say 50.00 a share in Bob Beers TJET Factory I'll take 4 shares Who else lets see how close we can get to the money needed on paper. Fringe Benefit of buying stock is TJET chassis at wholesale? What do you say CEO Bob

Roger Corrie



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: howorld@yahoogroups.com [mailto:howorld@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of ghdrake@aol.com
Sent: Tuesday, April 07, 2009 11:09 PM
To: howorld@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [HOWL] new chassis?



Hey Bob,
Using your math, there are almost 1000 guys on this list. I'm sure there must be 1000 hardcore Thunderjet fans left on the planet. If 1000 organized, elected a committee, and pitched in $50, we have a tooled chassis (and maybe a sample in everyone's hands).

I guess the biggest catch is the "no guarantee" on the tooling, which there must be either some way around, like finding a machine shop sympathetic to the cause(?).

Doesn't seem an impossible amount of money to raise, but you are correct that there are still lots of original chassis to be had. I think a bunch of them were hoarded toward the end of the end of the REH supply, but I don't see them appreciating much in the current economy, so they may get sold off fairly cheap.

Geoff

Bob stated that one could get the T-Jet reproduced for $35,000 and could produce (or have produced) 5000 chassis at $3 each for an additional $15,000. The investment would be $50,000. If the 5000 chassis were sold by Bob at $10.00 each, he would break even (if one ignores the cost of money). He further speculated that any error in the part of the manufacturer (like 50 ohm arms when your requirement was for 16 ohm) would tank the investment in a heart beat ala the Model Motoring Thunder Plus.

So, one of the HOWorld members suggested there were 1000 guys (and some gals) who would plop down $50 apiece to see a new 100% T-Jet reproduction made. This led to guys "commiting" to anywhere from 1 to 10 "shares" of $50. 1000 investors is not the true requirement. A collection of people willing to throw down a combined $50,000 is the theoretical requirement to get a chassis into production. One person risking $50K could do this in theory as could 2 with $25K each or five with $10K each. The larger the number of investore, the lower the risk per investor.

Think of this as more of a survey as to how many people are truely interested in having a fresh supply of NNS (New New Stock) chassis.

resinmonger said it right....... I have established that a complete new chassis may be $3 to make. It might be as much as $5. Your investment gets you those chassis back at cost. In other words, invest $100 anf get 20 chassis at $5 each or 33 at $3 each. all in fun but who knows......... CEOBOB

Even though this sounds more like one of those Friday night beer logic (FNBL) schemes, I am interested in seeing how many people actually "sign up" for the shares. I've always wondered how large the market really is. I suspect the market is fairly small but this small number of people purchase a disproportionately large amount of product compared to some of the more mainstream hobbies.

If I'm doing the math correctly, at the $3.00 per copy cost, the out of pocket cost for each investor is still $10.00 per chassis for the first batch of chassis. If subsequent batches are $3.00 each, you would have to manufacture vast quantities of chassis to get the actual price per chassis down a lot. If the second batch was for 50000 chassis, the total out of pocket cost per chassis would still be $3.64. What would the effect be of flooding the market with 55,000 new chassis?

resinmonger said it right....... I have established that a complete new chassis may be $3 to make. It might be as much as $5. Your investment gets you those chassis back at cost. In other words, invest $100 anf get 20 chassis at $5 each or 33 at $3 each. all in fun but who knows......... CEOBOB

I would propose a test run.......
Why not see if you can get enough capital to do just the gearplate?

This is an easy mold and is a good way to see if you get the matchup and fit required. It would also be a great way to build on success and investors.

I would also propose that the mold work and the manufacturing be done in country. There are THOUSANDS of little mold shops and plastic houses that would love to get in on this.
Try looking in the rural areas of the U.S. and not in the great northeast. No offense, but the manufacturing base has shifted a little to the west.:wave:

http://www.rucoproductsinc.net/main.htm
This is a little place just up the street..... many more like this one.

Just a few ideas.....
I will lend a hand if you need it, I can do the dwgs if reqiured.

Tim Leppert

To Roger Corrie, I dont know how to post on the HOWORLD List, but you can include me in for 10 shares
Thanks

DOC: to be included we need to know who you are.....

Tim: good ideas, let's let the shares theory run first.

In country is my preference too......... I also have manufacturing abilities in both design and fabrication of molds.

CEOBOB

You guys should get up a separate website and see if you can get that many real people together...

I might not interested in the chassis per-se...but my share could be raised by someone selling me some inline stuff they dont want...etc..

I'd imagine quite a few people would be in for more than one share...that will cut down the number of people need by quite a bit...

:thumbsup:

After my experience with trying to get a chassis
made in China,I think you will end up with a whole
bunch of JL/AW lookalikes.

After my experience with trying to get a chassis
made in China,I think you will end up with a whole
bunch of JL/AW lookalikes.


I believe the intent is to produce them "in country"...meaning here in the US...

And I concur..with the current state of the economy I'm sure there are quite a few small shops that would like to do the work...:thumbsup:

Interesting can-o-worms.

Given the current state of affairs; whether or not the project stays in the good ole USA might affect this project's outcome in more than one way.

Certainly one cannot throw too many stones at modern inlines produced out of country. Problem is that the complexities of the pancake's monkey motion have arguably left us O-fer-two in the reproduction area. Corners have been cut in the past with no guarantees of accountability.

I will concede that the original T-jets werent perfect either. BUT! Until someone can, at a minnimum, reproduce their ORIGINAL quality, let's not change ANYTHING. In order to build a better mouse trap one must first complete the original mouse trap.

On the upshot though, who better to ramrod the project than the godfather, Bob Beers, backed by last bastion of Pancake fanatics. I'm in. :thumbsup:

DOC: to be included we need to know who you are.....

Tim: good ideas, let's let the shares theory run first.

In country is my preference too......... I also have manufacturing abilities in both design and fabrication of molds.

CEOBOB

I will participate in the shares thing soon. This is a great idea.

The place were I just started working is willing to talk about running the electrics. ( they specialize in minature electrical stampings) I can draw up the dies for the hanger plates, Both brush springs and the shoes pro bono (sp). I can also get a pretty good line on springs if needed.
I would hope to get these done for $1.50 per chassis. This is not a quote, just a goal, would this be doable number?
We also have a very accomplished assembley crew, they could be very handy.

I would be in it for two shares, but wonder what kind of deal do you get after that on chassis pricing? I would much rather have a US made chassis as well.

Hey CEOBOB, put me in for 2 shares, thanks for the answers! Sent you a PM with my info.

Thanks,

Marty

I'm in.. And Make them in the U.S.A because we all know darn wellif you go to China they will just use AW Molds and stamp your name on it.. they won't even tool a new mold. leaving you with zero way to prove it either.. Just look at all the offshore Tyco's that have come into the country the past few years..Plus we employee a bit of Made in the USA pride.. lol...

If we make it here in the USA you can count me in for at least a share. I don't use t jets but whats another box in the closet if it helps to put Americans to work.
Besides when you use China your supporting Communism. Seems people forget that little fact these days(myself included).

OK,You guys are trying to torture me.Now when we head to Ohio I'll have to listen to Bob talk for 8 hours about the new BOB-JET.I guess it will be better than listening to him sing.He is one of if not my best friend but there limits to what I can put up with.Dream on.
Thanks Tom Stumpf

OK,You guys are trying to torture me.Now when we head to Ohio I'll have to listen to Bob talk for 8 hours about the new BOB-JET.I guess it will be better than listening to him sing.He is one of if not my best friend but there limits to what I can put up with.Dream on.
Thanks Tom Stumpf

Ohhhhh, now you've done it. CEO Bob will spend the trip taking about the B-Jet AND singing "Dream On"!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BYojs78Tf9Y

Please be sure to record Bob's cover of Steve Tyler's crooning. :drunk::hat::freak::dude:

when we head to Ohio I'll listen to Bob sing Dream On

.... You've just had your first request for the looong roadtrip ! ! nd

If I'm doing the math correctly, at the $3.00 per copy cost, the out of pocket cost for each investor is still $10.00 per chassis for the first batch of chassis. If subsequent batches are $3.00 each, you would have to manufacture vast quantities of chassis to get the actual price per chassis down a lot.

With a $1.50 'non quote' thrown out there for just springs, shoes and hangars, the chances of getting to $3/chassis are slim to none. I''d love to see the estimates come back for this 'US Made' armature, magnets, gears, axles, tires, brushes and last but not least, assembly.

If the second batch was for 50000 chassis, the total out of pocket cost per chassis would still be $3.64. What would the effect be of flooding the market with 55,000 new chassis?

Keeping in mind that there are probably well over a half MILLION JL/RC2/AW T-Jet chassis out there, and that they still sell for a decent buck in spite of their lame out of box performance and total lack of quality, the affects of 55,000 more chassis would be minimal.

As far as manufactured in the USA, keep that in mind the next time you shop at Wal-Mart for a screw driver, T-Shirt, DVD, television set, camera, iPod, X-Box, spark plugs, backyard pool or water slide, socks, jeans, car tires, yada, yada, yada...

As much as you hate to admit it, our economy is propped up by goods and services provided by third world or communist countries. It's the truth.

And it's absolutely a riot that some of you guys want to 'rebuild' the Aurora factory in New York.

Lenny,

If my memory is correct, you've spent time seriously looking at the effort required to produce a direct copy of the T-Jet as well as the Slim Line and the HP7. If I may ask, what was your experience with trying to work with Chinese companies?

BTW, please keep producing your awesome line of bodies. I've got a far share of them but it's like an itch: the more you scratch, the more you itch. In the case of Dash bodies, you more you have, the more you NEED. Say, there wouldn't be a little crack in that plastic compound...

:drunk::hat::freak::dude::tongue:

With a $1.50 'non quote' thrown out there for just springs, shoes and hangars, the chances of getting to $3/chassis are slim to none. I''d love to see the estimates come back for this 'US Made' armature, magnets, gears, axles, tires, brushes and last but not least, assembly.



Keeping in mind that there are probably well over a half MILLION JL/RC2/AW T-Jet chassis out there, and that they still sell for a decent buck in spite of their lame out of box performance and total lack of quality, the affects of 55,000 more chassis would be minimal.

As far as manufactured in the USA, keep that in mind the next time you shop at Wal-Mart for a screw driver, T-Shirt, DVD, television set, camera, iPod, X-Box, spark plugs, backyard pool or water slide, socks, jeans, car tires, yada, yada, yada...

As much as you hate to admit it, our economy is propped up by goods and services provided by third world or communist countries. It's the truth.

And it's absolutely a riot that some of you guys want to 'rebuild' the Aurora factory in New York.

Hell I was just guessing at a price, with no idea of quantities. I'm pretty shure I'll beat that.

I'm pretty shure that the $3.00 chassis won't happen, but why not try?


I guess I'll just crawl back in my hole now.

put me in for at least 1 share.

Lenny,

If my memory is correct, you've spent time seriously looking at the effort required to produce a direct copy of the T-Jet as well as the Slim Line and the HP7. If I may ask, what was your experience with trying to work with Chinese companies?

BTW, please keep producing your awesome line of bodies. I've got a far share of them but it's like an itch: the more you scratch, the more you itch. In the case of Dash bodies, you more you have, the more you NEED. Say, there wouldn't be a little crack in that plastic compound...

:drunk::hat::freak::dude::tongue:

I've spent about 2 years so far trying to get quotes, samples, prototype parts, etc. Last year right around this time I was probably the closest, I actually had magnets and armature samples that I sent to SwamperGene. The magnets were great, there were some things with the arm that needed to be worked out. The factory was less than willing to do any further work on the armature until I paid 50% of the tooling. I was unwilling to pay anything towards tooling until I had a solid, good to go prototype. So it went nowhere. And I've approached other companies and have received better estimates and lower tooling costs, which will sting alot less if the product truly sucks.

Overall, I've had great success dealing with the Commies. Their communication is better than what I've experienced with US companies. In particular, I approached Paramount, the US company that produced the chassis for Model Motoring. If their communication with me was any indication of how they dealt with Harrison Woodrow, I feel very sorry for Harrison. They are probably one of the most unprofessional outfits I have ever dealt with.

The same is true for some companies that I've approached in the past 2 years to try to do some of what I do, back to the US. It would literally take weeks to get a reply, after multiple emails. I haven't had that same lousy experience with overseas companies. If anything, they are a bit too aggressive in trying to get business.

I just think it's hilarious and hypocritical and way too easy to dump on overseas firms and to jump on the 'Made in the US' bandwagon. There's a reason US firms are outsourcing production overseas, mostly to cut costs.

Tonight I took my daughter to gymnastics and spent an hour walking around a local Wal-Mart noting where items were made. Here's a brief list, in no particular order other than where the items were as I walked around:

PAAS Egg coloring kits - China
Stuffed Bunny - China

Nicoderm gum - Denmark

Various pet toys - all China
Pet beds - China
Aquarium filter - China
All Glass Aquarium - US (actually Milwaukee, I've heard the founder/owner drives a yellow Saleen)

Brita water filter - pitcher made in China, other parts made in Canada. Assembled in Canada.

Black and Decker Hand Vac - China

Black and Decker Coffee Maker - China

Black and Decker power drill - China

Stanley crescent wrench - China

Master Lock padlock (a milwaukee company) - this surprised me. Masterlock had a production facility in Milwaukee for years. The lock I picked up was made in China

Here's another WI company that puts out a quality product that many people on this board use. Dremel. For years these were made in the US, in Racine, WI. The one I picked up today was made in China.

Peerless faucet - China

ATV Battery - China

I was finally able to find some US made items in the paint aisle, and Goodyear tires were marked as made in US

Bosch Spark Plugs - Germany

Fram oil filters - US

Champion spark plugs - Mexico

Shakespear fishing reel - China

Almost all toys - China

Magnavox DVD player - China

and on and on...

US made items were few and far between.

How did we get to this point as a country?

Hell I was just guessing at a price, with no idea of quantities. I'm pretty shure I'll beat that.

I'm pretty shure that the $3.00 chassis won't happen, but why not try?


I guess I'll just crawl back in my hole now.
This wasn't an attack, why react like it was???

You said your 'goal' was $1.50. To me, that would imply that you would be working down from a higher number.

But regardless, if $1.50 is spent just on some stampings, consider what the cost will be for the other items. I've received armature estimates from overseas that range anywhere from 40 cents to $1.18. I've approached US companies about this pancake arm and the tooling costs alone would put me into a well made American car. And the kicker with some of these american companies estimates is that they would STILL outsource much of the work overseas. So much for 'made in the US'.

Ferrite Magnets. estimates from overseas companies have been 16 cents a set to 50 cents a set. So if I take the higher of the arm and mag estimates from overseas companies, that's over $1.50 right there. Then there's machining, molding, rubber wheels, gears, brushes, assembly, testing, etc.

I'm not trying to say you CAN'T make this chassis in the US, but I seriously doubt that you could do it for much less than $10. And the $35,000 that Bob estimated for tooling was probably not considering using US companies.

Still you would have to admit .To have the first made in the USA chassis ever be born right here would be cool as heck!

Still you would have to admit .To have the first made in the USA chassis ever be born right here would be cool as heck!

Wizzard makes his stuff in the US, I believe.

And if that's your goal, then go for it!

Hi Dan, What a concept having a hundred or so people funding a project and taking a collective risk as opposed to one guy sticking his neck wayyyyy out there. If it fails, everyone lost a little bit. If it succeeds then everyone wins. This is more fun than watching my 401K disappear. CEOBOB

Hi Dan, What a concept having a hundred or so people funding a project and taking a collective risk as opposed to one guy sticking his neck wayyyyy out there. If it fails, everyone lost a little bit. If it succeeds then everyone wins. This is more fun than watching my 401K disappear. CEOBOB


Bob: This was my take all along.


Lenny: I'm sorry that I took your terse attempt at a response as an attack. I'm just a tooling guy GUESSING at costs with no real numbers. You have way more knowledge of the marketplace and what it will handle than me.

I just know what it will take to do the stamping side of this deal, and I'm trying to help as I can. As I would for you if you wish.

If any of you are interested in adding your name to the list please contact me. CEO BOB has kind of assumed that I am the "recording secretary" for this. Please give me your name and how many shares you would like and I will add you to the list ASAP. And please first, last name, and board were you can be found, just Dave or Fred is not going to cut it, especially when we come to look you up later. Thanks much, partspig

They are probably one of the most unprofessional outfits I have ever dealt with.

Seems to be a lot of that going around lately, but I'm all in favor of finding one that isn't and giving them the business. nd

Hey Dan are you still trying to get a t-jet chassis made or not?

Hi Dan, What a concept having a hundred or so people funding a project and taking a collective risk as opposed to one guy sticking his neck wayyyyy out there. If it fails, everyone lost a little bit. If it succeeds then everyone wins. This is more fun than watching my 401K disappear. CEOBOB
Hey Bob,
It's a GREAT concept. Good luck with it. :thumbsup:

The 'made in the USA' posts seem to be picking up steam.

As CEO are you prepared to go back to the investors and tell them that your original $35,000 offshore tooling estimate will now actually be in the $70,000 to $100,000 range, if made domestically? And that instead of a rolling chassis possibly costing $3 to $5, it will actually be more like $10...

Or are you a strong enough CEO to stick to your original plan of doing this offshore, the costs of which are the basis for your $50 share price?

Hey Dan are you still trying to get a t-jet chassis made or not?
I can't really answer yes or no. It's been a 'part time' activity in the past two years with nothing really coming from it except some magnet and gear sets, some armatures with great potential and tons of estimates, which in itself has been very time consuming.

Hey Bob,
It's a GREAT concept. Good luck with it. :thumbsup:

The 'made in the USA' posts seem to be picking up steam.

As CEO are you prepared to go back to the investors and tell them that your original $35,000 offshore tooling estimate will now actually be in the $70,000 to $100,000 range, if made domestically? And that instead of a rolling chassis possibly costing $3 to $5, it will actually be more like $10...

Or are you a strong enough CEO to stick to your original plan of doing this offshore, the costs of which are the basis for your $50 share price?

I would add one more to this list:
If you do go offshore, have the fortitude to SEND IT BACK if it's not right. I believe that is what got Harry.

Good points about price and volumes Lenny. I understand the sentiment on both sides of this proposed venture. Spreading the risk across many investors makes it more palatable financially but you still need a single, strong, driven project leader to get the work done, make real time decisions, make real time corrections, and make sure the manufacturer delivers on the promise without coming back with more cost adders or delays, regardless of the circumstances or who is considered to be at fault.

Basically, it comes down to, are you the investor willing to fork over $50, $500, $5000, or whatever, for an outside chance that you'll hit a home run on the first swing of the bat and recoup you initial investment and position yourself for proportionate downstream rewards? At the $50 level, maybe. At higher levels, hmmm, maybe not so certain. As an investor I'd expect my allocation of the downstream "at-cost" production would be proportional to my up-front investment. If I invest 25% of the up-front cost I'd expect to have 25% of the downstream production volume, at 25% of the downstream production cost, of course. If the big investors are looking to make a profit on their investment then this could put the big investors in a situation where they are competing against one another with the same exact product in the same exact market.

My gut feel is that those who have been down this path are no dummies, especially Tom Lowe, and that getting the kind of quality that you expect at the cost you are willing to absorb, and doing a better job than what Tom was able to do, will be extremely challenging. I'd expect that Tom made a trip or two to China at some point in the negotiations or follow-up. While not his sole responsibility, the project oversight was clearly part of his regular job and not something done as a side hobby. He probably has some expertise in dealing with overseas manufacturing and import/export compliance laws and other such gritty details. He also could not afford to dump mass quantities of marginal product like Aurora did back in the day, or go through many revision cycles on the designs and prototypes.

All this starts sounding more like a business than a hobby to me. I can live with the minor "imperfections" of the products that are currently being manufactured by AutoWorld, Tomy/RaceMasters, Life-Like, Wizzard, BSRT, Slottech, MM, et al, if it means my hobby stays pure and simply a hobby. I don't need a perfect rendition of a piece of history to achieve a state of perfection in the hobby.

Best of luck with the venture.

When people have a passion for something or someone,we are often blind to what's right in front of us.I know from experience.The most diehard group of HO enthusiasts are the t-jet fans.I think there was a song out years ago "When a man loves a t-jet" it can do no wrong.This is not a ompetition between Bob Beers aka.Mr Aurora aka Tonto and my personel roadie and Dan Cashmere aka Mr.Dash aka lenny.Everyone would like to see a t-jet chassis that would be less then $10.The price of these little gems is climbing every time you look around.Both of these guys know what they are talking about.Bob has set goals in this hobby and reached them and more.Ford Aurora King.Dan set out a few years ago to become a name in manufacturing for the hobby we all love.Dan and I have discussed this chassis for 2 years.The search for a company that could make this chassis exact has been very difficult.He knows that if its not perfect he will be just about tarred and feathered.Trying to find competent manufactures is just not that easy.He gets crazy sometimes when people think it's so easy to do.If it was Bob.Danny Esposito and myself would have done it years ago.Dan is spending everything he has to accomplish his goal.He is extremely anal about this.If he wasn't it would haVe been out already,but it would have faults..I cant think of a better person than Bob to have a new chassis named after them.The B-jet.Who is going to run this new group of investors.Who will be accountable for collecting the money ,meeting the reps,paper work,shippping,warehousing and future products.Will he be compensated.Its a great idea on chat talk but I just need to have something to talk to Bob on our next trip.I'm an optimist and would love to see a new product come out but there is a lot to think about..I lost thousands of dollars a few years ago with the best caster out there but i didn't have it in writing..Get it all in writing. Good luck.Tom

Man!this post is to advanced for me!but i'll read- on i'm very sure i'll need it!(love this sight!):thumbsup:

Hell...I've spent 50 bucks many times over on the lottery....never got a damn thing for it...

You know...the first thing you guys are going to do with them is dissassemble them and put them back together...

As long as the parts are all good...why not just send them as a kit and save of assembly costs?

Just throwin it out there...

I work for a major helicopter company and they know you can not be competitive in business without manufacturing and assembling offshore. We may not like it but it's a way of life. Designing and manufacturing quality into the product is the most important thing and then getting the cost down. The best way to get the quality in and the cost down is make the manufacturing shop accountable for their work. Step payments usually can do this. One of the problems dealing with China or other offshore locations is they are cutthroat and never loyal. They would make chassis for me and use AW molds. The market is tight over there and they are extremely clever, cunning, and devious.
Making an item in the USA is attractive to me. Of course costs are the biggest factor but the capabilities and controls are there. I, too have the ability to design and manufacture and there is a vast hungry pool I feel I could draw on. I would love to keep the process in the USA but it's all about cost, quality, and delivery. all this is moot anyway. We are miles away from actually acting on this fun thread. CEOBOB

Here's a novel idea...... What if Dan (aka Lenny) who has already done a lot of leg work on getting a new tjet chassis made and Bob (aka Mr. Aurora) and his selling shares to reduce risk of loss factors joined forces??? They always say: "Two heads are better than one". I know nothing of manufacturing costs, so i won't throw numbers around. I just think that the more people with knowledge of this type of venture the better chance for success.

This is a business venture, with the outcome being making a profit, so maybe a partnership of sorts is not so far off base.

Just an idea from the depths of my abused mind.

Hell...I've spent 50 bucks many times over on the lottery....never got a damn thing for it...

You know...the first thing you guys are going to do with them is dissassemble them and put them back together...

As long as the parts are all good...why not just send them as a kit and save of assembly costs?

Just throwin it out there...

That's how you get ideas and solutions

I work for a major aerospace company. My program is based in California. I have heard that "we can't do business in the USA" and "we can't do business in California" all due to cost. An awesome supplier of machined parts is in Gardena, CA. They fabricate parts for Airbus as well. The owner has top notch equipment and top notch people. He can go toe to toe with anyone, anywhere. During the downturn of the early 90s, he invested when others went out of business. Much of the aerospace work sent to other companies is for offset. Since the B-Jet is not an airframe, this is a little tangental. However, I have experienced what can be done on-shore and it is good.

Here's a novel idea...... What if Dan (aka Lenny) who has already done a lot of leg work on getting a new tjet chassis made and Bob (aka Mr. Aurora) and his selling shares to reduce risk of loss factors joined forces???

On the surface, this is a great idea. But now you have 50, 100, 200 (or whatever the final number turns out to be) 'investors' who have expectations to buy rolling chassis at cost. So now you essentially have that many 'distributors'. The chances of me making any cash on a 'partnership' like this is zero.