Just wanted make sure it wasn't me, but it feels like I am seeing a lot of new members posting stuff for sale without even introducing themselves.

Is it just me or should we have something in place that doesn't allow you to sell things until you have made a certain number of posts?

I'm not trying to suggest any of these folks are doing anything shady, it just feels suspect to me that your first post is to try and make money out here. Why not make an effort to post some things, ask some questions, answer a few, or just comment on someones work before going into sell mode?

If I'm off base here, just tell me, I just like knowing who I am dealing with, and starting with a for sale post puts you in a different category altogether....

It's not just you, Marty. I have noticed the same trend in the past few weeks.

I have a few posts but I haven't sold on the swap/buy/sell section. I have bought items listed from members who I have come to know. I joined this Forum to become part of a virtual community of people with similar interests - to find a place where "playing with little cars" is understood and accepted. I tried several and selected HT since it was by far the best fit for me. The ability to buy/sell/trade is more or less icing on the cake from my point of view.

It appears that some have recently joined with an all together different purpose - to find a market for their products. IMHO that is the main purpose of ebay, Kraig's List, the Toy Pedler, etc. and not the goal of HT.

I'm not sure if there are any site rules regarding this practice. This Forum does tend to "police" itself by members pointing out undesireable behavior. One way of dealing with this trend is to 1) place comment posts in the sales thread as has already been done and 2) not buy from people who seemlingly join only to sell. If a person's motive in joining is merely to sell, they will be soon persuaded to punt if they don't make sales. At least, that's how it appears in Hutt logic.

:drunk::hat::freak::dude:

Hi Marty and Russ,

I see HT the way you do: In the first place it´s a community of grown up kids sharing the fun with their hobby. Lots of information, exchange of experience, spreading news, reviews etc., but this community is only working through and because of all the guys (and girls) contributing!

It takes some time (and time invested) to earn a little "respect" and confidence instead of just trying to milk the cash cow instantly. Although I myself from time to time post some for sale stuff here, too, I´d never ever even think about signing up on a hobby board with the only intention of making some $$$ (errr: EUR)!

Every hobbyist or collector is gathering surplus stuff over the years, so why not offer these things to your fellow board members?

And I don´t have any problems with well-known collectors, dealers (who are hobbyists themselves) or manufacturers (who are close to the "base" here) offering their items to their target group the direct way for nice prices instead of paying fleaBay fees. But who am I to blame anybody as I´m somehow guilty in the first degree... ;)

In the end it´s everybody´s own decision wether to feed these "FS-only-posters" or not. If nobody´s paying attention to their offers, they´ll disappear as suddenly as they showed up...

Greetings from Germany,

Claus
(who´s letting his Spock-like right eyebrow down again now)

It may be a sign of the times as people are desperate for cash.

I've been getting a ton more more sales related emails and cold calls for people selling stuff, every single day. The spam filters do a pretty good job of keeping Smiling Bob and his friends, supposedly long lost female friends who want to party, and infinite sources of cheap Canadian pharmaceuticals at bay. My gmail spam box has 25-50 new entries a day. But even with contacts who are totally legit, business decorum has fallen victim to desperation and the cold calls and emails from contacts and their affiliates are ramping up in a big way.

Agreed!....With all a ya's!

If yer a business you have to pony up to hang around here.

If yer a one hit wonder...you'll find the grazing rather sparse here. We are a rather tight knit bunch as cyber families go.

For the record, this is not to say that we dont welcome newcomers with open arms; but they do have to pass the initial sniff test.

i think y'all hit the nail on the head.i signed up for info.plus to witness some amazing modelling skills by all here!a welcome by product,was some comraderie along the way,and a good laugh when i needed it.

I pointed out that exact thing in the swap & sell area... first post 2 race sets for sale... Really? Hopefully no one is dumb enough to fall for that... I feel the swap and sell is for me to not only sell something, but to help someone here get what they need too, without being ripped off.

there should be a at least 25 post min before being able to sell in the sell/swap forum

basically,we are relying on our own comraderie to make sure everyone is on the level when selling something/buying something....seems to me a minimum amount of posts before you go on the swap and sell makes sense.at least then you know a bit about who it is,and get a feel if you can trust that person or not...we don't have the protection here that we would on feepay,etc...its all based on mutual trust and respect for others,is it not?i think it is a good rule to put out there,so this doesn't become a fleamarket site...

Well, I am over 800 posts with no sales posted so that might be a reasonable limit - 800 posts and then you can sell...

:drunk::hat::freak::dude:

resinmonger......sounds like you are hoarding everything you have!........I don't ever part with much either. It's amazing how I keep finding room to squeeze more into the race room and it was full 20 years ago.
There is a lot of knowledge around this board and if someone is unreasonably selling there's probably not going to be any takers & the problem 'll go away. Just 'cause someone is new here doesn't mean they might not want to get rid of just the thing that someone else wants at a reasonable price. You kind of maybe have to look at each case on it's own merits. That said, it still seems kind of "in your face" for a first post to be "for sale". but that is what this thread is for. Keeps it away from other topics.

I think a min. time as a member should be the ticket. You can join today and blow thru 25 to 50 posts to start selling, ahh but time, now thats a hard one to beat. I sell stuff here and have had nothing but good experiences, bought stuff too, same deal. It was very easy to join, start hanging around and getting to know the people here. We are fortunate to have a solid group here that look out for each other. It would be a shame to loose that, if it is a cash problem sell it locally on craigslist or a want ad. Not everything needs to be fee bay, but it is an option for the new guy. I got a warm welcome here and hope to do the same down the road to the next member. As always the buyer must beware, it's just good common sense...

I understand where you guys are coming from, and my first reaction was just like you guys... but then I thought more about it... the more products we can find here, the better chance we all have at bypassing ebay fees to get what we want, right?

Just use paypal and protect yourself. If they really bother you, don't click on their threads... the originator of the thread is listed under the title of the thread, correct?
If you see a name you don't recognize... then skip it. Seems easy enough to me.

I don't know, maybe it's the capitalist in me. Let them sell, if they suck, they'll be exposed quickly and mocked endlessly ... and if you used paypal to pay for the stuff... you have nothing to lose. If paypal tries to screw you, your CC company still has your back.

Anyway, that's my 1.5 cent opinion..
it used to be a 2 cent opinion, but you know, the recesession.

I actually agree with Jimmy as long as the stuff they are selling is slot related. If you don't feel comfortable with the seller or trader, just ignore the post.

I never gave it a thought Marty. Thanks for the heads up. Could be a sign of the times, or a pruning of the herd. Like many hobbies, some get in quickly, and burn out at various times or economic problems, TM problems on and on. But on the other hand in tough times, rip off artists are at work also. With ebay you have a rating system and a process you can go through in the case of a bad buy or sale. On this list and many others, you don't have that. I know on another list a guy had a proxy race. He kept all the cars that were sent to him and ripped everybody off. What a puke. For myself, I would rather buy something from someone that has been here for a while.

I don't think the 800 posts would work. Because people would be posting to anything & everything. What about the old guys like me that has been on here at least once a day since 1999. I hope I'd get to be grandfathered in. I think they should be a member for at least 6 months before allowed to post something on the sell/trade site. I've seen so many people come & go on this board. If they're still around in 6 months they know the members & vice versa & there's a better chance they're here to stay.
I don't post much b/c I don't like to type. It takes me too long. I appreciate the guys that do post a lot, they're a wealth of information.
Thanks,
Old Man on the block, fordcowboy
fordcowboy

Thanks for chiming in guys, glad I'm not the only one.

I'm all for new folks coming on, I would have to agree with some of you in that a post and/or time limit should be in effect before you can sell just to ensure we don't get too many drive bys.

And, as a couple of you have also stated, if I don't want to buy from a brand new poster, I can certainly ignore the post as well.

If it doesn't change, i'll just keep buying from the guys I like and trust and be good to go I suppose.

I don't think the 800 posts would work. Because people would be posting to anything & everything. What about the old guys like me that has been on here at least once a day since 1999. I hope I'd get to be grandfathered in. I think they should be a member for at least 6 months before allowed to post something on the sell/trade site. I've seen so many people come & go on this board. If they're still around in 6 months they know the members & vice versa & there's a better chance they're here to stay.
I don't post much b/c I don't like to type. It takes me too long. I appreciate the guys that do post a lot, they're a wealth of information.
Thanks,
Old Man on the block, fordcowboy
fordcowboy

I was kidding about the 800. I should have made the joke more obvious. I didn't think people take a guy with a Jabba the Hutt avitar comments very seriously. Sorry.

If it doesn't change, i'll just keep buying from the guys I like and trust and be good to go I suppose.


Marty,
I share your concern but I think your philosphy is probably a more sound solution. You know who you can deal with after you've been on the board awhile. The members I have gotten to know through the board and eventually dealt with have been the best. :thumbsup::thumbsup: rr

I was kidding about the 800. I should have made the joke more obvious. I didn't think people take a guy with a Jabba the Hutt avitar comments very seriously. Sorry.

There's always a back up plan Russ!!! You got the :tongue: and the :jest: and the :lol: ready to throw in there just in case there's any doubt!! :lol:

The post number shouldn't be a factor for one reason:
Post 889..........Happy Thanksgiving Bill!!!
Post 890..........Happy Thanksgiving Coach!!!
Post 891..........Happy Thanksgiving Nuther Dave!!!
Post 892..........Happy Thanksgiving Resinmonger!!!
Post 893..........Happy Thanksgiving SCM!!!!
Post 894..........Happy Thanksgiving Scott!!

Time is only slightly better. The best thing to do is look at all the factors and run from there. Use you judgement with all listings, and let the buyer beware. Someone selling might just be trying to put an attic find into the hands of someone who will really appreciate it, and others have been banned from ebay for bad dealings and need a new place to pawn their goods. Sometimes it's hard to tell one from the other, because you don't have much to work with. It isn't hard to download someone elses picture's and call them your own. And computers are free to use in any library. Make up a Yahoo name and you're selling (or scamming). Interactions build trust over time, but some can tell you first hand even that is no protection. Best advice is as mentioned... Use your judgement, and if it looks too good to be true.. it prolly is!!

Uther....Hutts are the bestest :thumbsup: in my book...Joe

why not impose a post min. before selling.. is this fleapay??? no just a slot board that Hank has ALLOWED us to sell on. I feel if your just here to get rid of your goods, take it to fleapay. Why allow people to just "USE" the board for their own financial gain, why not make them contribute to it before selling. Alot of other non slotcar BB's im on do this to keep the ripoff artist an the ones just to make that quick buck off the site. If they abuse the posting min by just posting B/S their post are removed. This makes for a safer BB for all of us that contribute/sell/ an just generally have fun here

If you guys are talking about me...I am just an old racer that is selling off all of my accumulated stuff from over 12 years of racing :) including both of my routed tracks.

I dont have space or time for this hobby anymore :(

I thought I would try to give you guys some good deals... but I can move everything to ebay...not a problem :)

Just LMK

thanks,
Mike Pierce (andiamo-racing)

You guys have money to buy slots???? :eek: I must be in the wrong economy.:jest:
I have too noticed that there are a lot of newbies here....some appear to be sellers only....others freinds of the habbit ( i mean hobby).
Don't you have to be a supporter of HT to sell?? Is that only for E-business?? Maybe that's the answer...if you wanna sell...pony-up some dough to support the boards. That would probably keep some of the seller only folks away.
I agree with most of what's been said. We are a pretty close knit group that welcome newbies with open arms.....BUT fool us once....shame on you....fool us twice....shame on us. :lol::jest::freak:
As for me, I find it much more fun to trade than to sell.

I would rather trade than sell all so, but I don't want to part with any of my "Preciouses", and if we went to a barter system the wemen would rule the world! I believe a little of both, time and post. I don't stop by to buy, I check into see what the latest and greatist is, and to check on the "Boy's in the shop" to see what they have been up to.

If you guys are talking about me...I am just an old racer that is selling off all of my accumulated stuff from over 12 years of racing :) including both of my routed tracks.

I dont have space or time for this hobby anymore :(

I thought I would try to give you guys some good deals... but I can move everything to ebay...not a problem :)

Just LMK

thanks,
Mike Pierce (andiamo-racing)

Mike, this wasn't directed specifically at you, there seems to be a lot of new users doing it lately. Some may just be trying to make a quick buck, others like yourself are just trying to unload something from a long time hobby.

Everything you have done to this point is within the board rules so I have zero issues with you selling anything out here. I also appreciate the fact that you have chimed in and told us a little about you and why you are selling, which is clearly better than just posting your stuff and not telling us a thing.

We'd obviously rather have new members hanging around and joining the community, but if you don't have the interest, that's ok too.

Maybe new folks like yourself who are strictly just selling, should at least give us a background and a link to your ebay feedback or something else to give us an idea of who you are.

Either way, welcome, hope you'll stay a bit longer!

Marty

What's the big deal here? The thing I have a problem with is that these people are somehow being labeled "dishonest" or "trying to pull a fast one".

So what if their first post is trying to sell something. When all of us registered to be a member of HobbyTalk we had to click that "agree to terms" button. So they're not doing anything wrong, (per HobbyTalk).

If anyone does buy from these new members remember this, BUYER BEWARE. If you do get a bad deal, that's the chance anyone of us takes. It's much harder to fix the online sales, than the face to face sales. And "No I'm not buying from these folks."

Some of you here have griped about Ebay and PayPal fees and schemes. These folks are eliminating that. Maybe there's a good deal to get here. Maybe the seller will take less. Who knows? Don't stifle the opportunity for someone else. There's alot of lurkers on this board.

Don't mean to upset anyone, but I had to get this off my chest. Randy.

well put.taking the high road and giving these guys the benefit of the doubt would encourage membership to grow,i guess.i think any info the new sellers could give however is a great idea,like stated already,a link to ebay feedback,etc...i know i for one would much rather spend my money with a forum member than someone on ebay,i just don't have any money!(the big "D" word)all my slot bucks are off to the TM!

No sweat Randy.

The big deal is that HT is like a second home for many of us; so when someone flits in and treats our living room like a rest stop bathroom, then sells a few trinkets in the parking lot on the way out. Some of us are gonna raise an eyebrow.

While I agree that the glass can be both half full AND half empty at the same time; what said glass is filled with is of greater concern.



Note: Happy Thanksgiving to U...Joe!

I've directed individuals I've come across to try HT if Craigs List failed - some Craigs List markets are small without many buyers. I figured this would be a good place for people looking to get rid of slot stuff where they don't know the value to someone who does. That said, I have not seen any of them actually post.

I thought it would be a win for both parties but I'll follow the direction you guys suggest. I would think it would be okay for private parties to list here one time, wouldn't we want first crack before Craigs List/eBay or should it be more geared towards swap?

Is the concern there will be just too much crap getting listed? As I said I'll abide by majority rules.

Tom

All good Tom, nuthin wrong with feedin' the bulldog.

Marty just brought an interesting observation/question to light. The bottom line is adherence to the terms of service.

I agree bigtime with Randy and others who have voiced concerns over a for-sale-post-count policy for new-er members.

I'm not seeing the problem with someone joining, and making their first post something for sale. They should not be required to post a bio or provide references. It might benefit them to do so, but it shouldn't be required.

We all might be surprised how many long-time members there are here, who have never made a single post. They visit, read, learn, and just enjoy reading the insights and experiences of the vocal members.

From the New Member Introduction Thread:

"My name is Bob and have been enjoying hobbytalk for a few months now and though I would finally leave my first post." Just one example easy to locate - I believe you guys have seen similar posts over the years.

Joe mentioned a scenario of someone simply trying to unload an attic find to a buyer who would appreciate it. A post-count-policy would eliminate that, and that would be bad for both the well-meaning seller, and the buyer. And this scenario doesn't seem far fetched to me. I know that if I was to find an attic collectible, I would be more inclined to seek out a forum of enthusiasts to sell it. This I learned from HobbyTalk. It may not be the best way to maximize profit, but I think it would be more enjoyable.

I'm not bagging on anyone who posted in support of a policy, nor am I bagging on Marty for starting this thread. I am glad to see the discussion.

Jeff (walks through the living room, uses the head, and sells his opinions for free in the parking lot)

I understand both sides of this issue, but I don't think it is anywhere near being a problem. There is an implied etiquette about selling on the HT Forum, you could call it a "right of membership," but pragmatically it basically comes down to you being a member before you can sell. That's a very low hurdle to jump over, and for site management and integrity reasons, it keeps the automated ad bots from filling the buy & sell forum with junk. Bottom line: It seems to be working remarkably well.

The unstated and unenforced etiquette side of the picture is subject to personal interpretation. I know a lot of us value our relationship with the HobbyTalk community, and seeing someone new to the neighborhood throwing up a lemonade stand on their first day in the hood, even before we've gotten to know them, seems a little brash. But as others have stated, we all have a different way of interacting with this community. Some people just read a lot, some people just write a lot, some people do both, while some people just want to sell some stuff to a captive audience they know will appreciate what they have to offer. Based on what I'm seeing, some of these newbie sellers have some sweet deals to offer on stuff that is right up our alley, so giving us a first crack at these deals is entirely forgivable. Plus, as I mentioned earlier, plenty of folks just need some cash and recognize that they have an audience who is appreciative of what they have to offer.

The membership of this board covers a very wide spectrum and different folks are here for different reasons. It's an open board, and hopefully, an open minded board as well.

Hind sight and all, How many off us here have paid the extra $10.00 to get inside the hall of the show, as an early bird an hour before the doors to the general public, or made most of their deals the night before with the venders in the hotel parking lot? I don't buy alot, but the opertunity to have first crack at it here is a nice thing. Drive by's should introduce themselves and type out the sells pitch, "I lost my job", I'm getting Divorced", I'm switching scales.........

Drive by's should introduce themselves and type out the sells pitch, "I lost my job", I'm getting Divorced", I'm switching scales.........

I disagree, their personal business is none of my buisness.
If they choose to offer that info fine, but there should no requirement to do so.

If they rip me off, they will be mocked endlessly ... we'll all get the messege and they'll never be able to sell here again.

Besides, as I mentioned earlier... if I use Paypal, they won't be able to rip me off anyway. Even if paypal doesn't cover you, your CC company will.

IMO, this much ado about nothing. If you guys are uncomfortable buying from them, that's your business... but please don't undermine or try to limit my choice to buy from them if I choose to with these "sandbox" rules

LMAO Jim!

As the undisputed King of "Someone took my lunch money!" I'm now blowin' soda outta my nose.

See ya at Scaf's place VJ... we're all dropping by unannounced.

If you guys are uncomfortable buying from them, that's your business... but please don't undermine or try to limit my choice to buy from them if I choose to with these "sandbox" rules

.... really? I'm not trying to undermine anyone here, re-read my first post and my reply to the new guy who chimed in.

All I was trying to do is get folks opinions on the matter, so thanks to the folks who were able to do so without passing a judgement either way.

Just to be clear VJ, I have ZERO authority to make any changes on this site about anything having to do with anything, let's all just relax a little, nothing to see here bud.

Marty, I know that your intention was right, but all this "they need to do this" and "they need to that" stuff, or the suggestion that they tell us their life story before they're "allowed to sell here" is just nonsense to me. When I read some of the replies, it made me cringe.

"Allowed to sell"
Really.... is that what this all about, getting the blessings from the Lords of Hobby Talk?
According to some, it seems to be. It seems because some post here more than others, they feel they have certain rights they don't think others should share in.

Marty, I mean no offense to you. I understand the fair minded nature of your orignal post and your reply, my response is to those who took a "this is OUR sandbox, you're not allowed to sell until we decided you're worthy" stance.

And Bill, really ... how did soda come out of your nose when you had your finger jammed up there?

hehehehehe

Ok, Ok I'm the bad guy... whatever you guys think must be right and I must be wrong. Maybe we should get them to provide us with fingerprints before they're "allowed to sell" here. Why not, right?

I guess I should have know better than to state an opinion the HobbyTalk Lords didn't share.
Silly me.

Aw come on Jim,

Kickin' the carp out of this is how we've always sorted things out.

The HT Lords know I'm an idiot! So hearing opinions that differ from my own narrow views can only help. The old adage that opinions are like belly buttons ... everyone has one and no one wants to hear about yours... That DONT fly here. It's part of what makes this place great.

Bring it on. Stay cool...and like "Too" said, "Open yer mind"

Kangaroo court is in session! So long as we dont enforce vigilante justice it's all good!

Maybe we should get them to provide us with fingerprints before they're "allowed to sell" here. Why not, right?

Actually VJ, I was thinking more along the lines of internet retinal scanning.... :rolleyes:

I appreciate your opinion bud, just don't take it so personal, it's all good. I'm not an HT Lord yet, I was hoping to move up from HT Whipping Boy though. :)

:eek: Whew!! that's the last time I read HT without my glasses.. I thought for a second you said internet rectal scanning.. My USB port would never look at me the same way again.... :rolleyes:

Hey Marty ... I'm just keeping things lively.
No Offense

Cool?

I thought I made it pretty clear with the smiley faces and the the "it's all good" comment that we were cool bud! I promise not to get worked up over slot car stuff my man! :)

See, hit it right and this bunch can argue about want ads LOL.

I have bought, sold and traded in swap, but it's like ebay or anything else. For HT members I know or recognize, or someone new who is referred, a check or paypal cash transfer is fine - I don't want sellers losing money in fees. I look really skeptically at first posts with no background, and would only use Paypal with the Amex on a transaction like that. No desire to fret about it, and if something goes wrong the card takes care of it with a phone call. If a shyster wants to post a sale item I don't care if he takes the time to make up a bio or not, just common sense employed.

Funny though, as much as I like good deals the last thing I want to do is look at margins and run a P&L statement for slot transactions. I put a bunch of 1:32 tires up for sale a while back and a member asked a question that I couldn't really answer. So I sent the lot to him and said if they met his approval he could send me payment. If he thought they were less than advertised he could tell me and we'd negotiate - he sent a money order for the whole amount. I have come out on the "less than expected" side of a trade on occasion, and try to send more than expected. It's just not something I want to worry about.

Kangaroo court is in session! So long as we dont enforce vigilante justice it's all good!


Dang...uncocks weapon....

No sweat Randy.

The big deal is that HT is like a second home for many of us; so when someone flits in and treats our living room like a rest stop bathroom, then sells a few trinkets in the parking lot on the way out. Some of us are gonna raise an eyebrow.

Sorry Bill, I don't agree that at all. If there first post is in the Swap and Sell forum. And they're trying to sell something, so be it. I believe that's called freedom of choice.

[QUOTE=Bill Hall;

Marty just brought an interesting observation/question to light. The bottom line is adherence to the terms of service.

Show me in the terms of service where your first post can't be to sell something.

Marty, I know that your intention was right, but all this "they need to do this" and "they need to that" stuff, or the suggestion that they tell us their life story before they're "allowed to sell here" is just nonsense to me. When I read some of the replies, it made me cringe.

"Allowed to sell"
Really.... is that what this all about, getting the blessings from the Lords of Hobby Talk?
According to some, it seems to be. It seems because some post here more than others, they feel they have certain rights they don't think others should share in.

Marty, I mean no offense to you. I understand the fair minded nature of your orignal post and your reply, my response is to those who took a "this is OUR sandbox, you're not allowed to sell until we decided you're worthy" stance.



I guess I should have know better than to state an opinion the HobbyTalk Lords didn't share.
Silly me.


Well said VJ. I agree with this 100%. Randy.

Uhhhhhhh.......never said it was in the terms of service. Did I ? I merely agreed with an observation and added my own comparative observation, then re-itterated that the original observation was interesting.

No where did I advocate public decapitation, rescinding one's freedom of choice; or pencil whipping the terms of service to deprive YOU, or ANYONE, of your right to snatch good deals before they hit the masses on the bay.

As for freedom of choice, I choose freedom of expression in the form of tongue in cheek and devil's advocacy. My personal apologies if this wrankles you. :wave:

Maybe I misunderstood what you said in post #30. There was a number of comments that I don't agree with on this thread. My, apologies if I mad you mad. Randy

Mad? Naw Randy! Fugedaboudit!

I'm gonna get Jimmy after school though...for that finger up my nose comment. Me and the lock and joiner gang are gonna toss him down stickerbush hill for that one!

Always with the negative waves Moriarty, always with the negative waves.

Once again, I have been forced by negative waves to show you all this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=duwz5y4jONE.

Hutt