well what do you think looked pretty deliberate to me. i'm thinking maybe they should pull him for the rest of the yr. he could've hurt somebody real bad with that move.

yeah looked pretty dliberate to me from the angle the broadcasters showed. I'm sure they'll have more footage to review for that one. Seem's like he has a cool head or just realized he'd gone over the line afterwards,lol. Poor Jose Sanchez or whatever his name is.........

He shouldn't even be in nascar. If it wasn't for Michael Waltrip or Sam Hornish he would be the worst driver on the track. He causes more accidents than anyone. He is a scrub. Even more than that Jesse Bean person!

I dont disagree about the crash but montoya is on of the first guys to blame it all on someone eles. Its never his fault according to him. I cant stand him.

I dont disagree about the crash but montoya is on of the first guys to blame it all on someone eles. Its never his fault according to him. I cant stand him.

He admitted doinking Gilliland to show him he didn't appreciate being
raced so hard while he was a lapper... a justifiable move.
But he didn't wreck him...

So there is a difference there in quality of drivers.
And men.
JPM was able to make a point and move on... no damage to anyone.
Gilliland could have killed someone.

I didn't get to see a replay of the "bump" going into turn 1. But I can't think of a more blatant take out in Nascar history and it was done in the worst way in a non-softwall area of the track. I expect NASCAR to lay down record setting fines, hopefully suspend him and park the 38 car for the year so they aren't in the top 35 in owner's points at Daytona. If I were Doug Yates I would also fire Gilliland immediately. I'm not a real big fan of JPM either, but that was a screw job there.

well, what Gilliland did is typical of SATURDAY NIGHT Short Track Racing...at least in this area.

If you think roughing someone up to get your point across...be prepared to get STUFFED if you piss that guy off. Just because YOU are having a good run doesn't mean the other guy is going to lay down and DIE for you.

It did look blatent as heck - and should get a severe penalty for it - and those who say Gilliland can't drive... I'll argue that point... he's just still green and he'll have to learn somethings the hard way - - but everyone said the same thing about JPM just about a year ago...and now the only time you even hear HIS name mentioned is when he's crying that someone else caused HIM to crash. KARMA?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rWsv0yNmM0c

just watched again and can't believe one driver could do that to another at the speeds there running. don't penalize the car though just the driver.

well, what Gilliland did is typical of SATURDAY NIGHT Short Track Racing...at least in this area.

I'm glad I don't race in your area....
Intentionally "wrecking" someone, is viewed differently here,
than "sending a message"....

JPM sent a Saturday night message, imo.
Gilliland sent a bad message. That being,
I don't give a sh!t about anyone else on the track.
Around here, they'll throw you out for that.
And they should.

If that were Martinsville or any other short track on the schedule there would not have been much said about it, you should expect it. BUT that was at or over 200 miles an hour! If equipment had failed someone could have been killed.

If you have a problem with another driver, be man enough to put your face in his when the deal is over don't try to settle things in a 3000 pound machine at that speed. That was no better than sneaking up behind someone and hitting them with a 2 by 4!

Gilliland needs to be parked!

Agreed. NA$CAR needs to park him. Yates needs to can him.

i thought i heard tonite on nascar now there were to be no more penalties. to me that is disgraceful. all of the panel on the show seemed to think he needed to be parked at least for the rest of the yr. and yates will probably have a harder time getting a sponsor for next yr. with him behind the wheel. they also brought up the incident at watkins glen that he was involved in.

Many good drivers sitting in the Busch series that have way more talent. Green or not.. Cup side has no room for racers with low talent with the $$ being spent and the lack of for some teams. That Team alone has no room for error. I would can his butt and hire some vetran racer to get that team back in line so they can maybe secure better backing for the future.

i thought i heard tonite on nascar now there were to be no more penalties. to me that is disgraceful.

More disgraceful, is that had JPM said,
"I'n not gonna take dat sh!t from nobody"

He'd of been fined 50 grand....

Put Montoya in a Roush/Gibbs/Hendrick/RCR car instead of that POS he's carried every week, he'd have more than a few cup wins by now.

Sure looked like the Gilligan kid tried to intentionally hurt or kill Montoya. If they were in the old cars JPM probably would not walked away after hitting on the driver's side like he did. NASCAR sure dropped the ball on this one.

Is Gilligan's dad a big sponsor or big wheel at NASCAR?
:dude:

JPM sent a Saturday night message, imo.
Gilliland sent a bad message. That being,
I don't give a sh!t about anyone else on the track.
Around here, they'll throw you out for that.
And they should.


Oh they'll throw you out here too - but that doesn't stop a guy from just moving to the next track.

THIS was one of the WORST years I've seen for violence in the pits, and ON TRACK incidents in the local Dirt Oval scene. One young kid got BANNED FOR THE SEASON the 2nd race of the year...when the flagman black flagged him for rough driving, the kid FLEW around the track (UNDER CAUTION) then aimed at an official standing on the track...and swerved away at the last second.

Then couldn't understand why HE didn't get a warning.

There were at least 5 incidents at 2 tracks that took the drivers (and the car owners) OUT of those tracks for the season, in classes from local STREET STOCKS, LATE MODELS and IMCA Modified.

(I hadn't seen this much On and Off track drama since about 1979.)

You know, it's amazing what you can blame on a poor handling car, even though it was sorry ass driving. The NASCAR gorrilla's had him in the trailer for a long time and I'm sure that they called it for what it was no matter what his lame excuses could have been. The killer, this goob was 4 laps down the Juan Pablo Montoya and he himself was running very clean, un Pablo like race.

Too bad Juan.

You guys just need to either accept the penalty that Nascar hands down or find something else to watch. :freak:

The reason behind the whole fiasco?... Texaco Havoline brand is in their final year in Nascar. Nascar's call sends a message to the rest of the sponsors.:rolleyes:

You guys just need to either accept the penalty that Nascar hands down or find something else to watch. :freak:

Pretty much why I don't watch NA$CAR anymore. The coverage of WoO Late Models and Sprints is getting better- coundn't have come at a better time.

Pretty much why I don't watch NA$CAR anymore. The coverage of WoO Late Models and Sprints is getting better- coundn't have come at a better time.

Yep the coverage from Charlotte Saturday night was great :thumbsup:

Beside the massive Fine NASCAR needs to lay down

JP Montoya should sue David Gilliland for wreckless indangerment, attempted murder and property damage in civial court.

Then after, JP Montoya can change his Name to JP Morgan. I'm Rich Bee- atch :dude:

Yeah, then he can sue Nascar, the track, his sponsors, his team and the fans.:rolleyes:

JPM is not whinning about, so why should anyone else.Beside the massive Fine NASCAR needs to lay down

JP Montoya should sue David Gilliland for wreckless indangerment, attempted murder and property damage in civial court.

Then after, JP Montoya can change his Name to JP Morgan. I'm Rich Bee- atch :dude:

Pretty much why I don't watch NA$CAR anymore. The coverage of WoO Late Models and Sprints is getting better- coundn't have come at a better time.

Todd,

You are comparing racing (WoO) to a puppet show (Nascar). I stopped watching puppet shows when Jim Henson died.

There is only two times a year I actually think NASCAR driver's race, by my definition:

1) The Winston, or what ever the hell it's called this week.
2) At Smoke's Eldora / Victory Junction Gang Late Model Race-

Balls out, no points, no gas mileage-gloves off racing. :thumbsup:

Todd,

You are comparing racing (WoO) to a puppet show (Nascar). I stopped watching puppet shows when Jim Henson died.

There is only two times a year I actually think NASCAR driver's race, by my definition:

1) The Winston, or what ever the hell it's called this week.
2) At Smoke's Eldora / Victory Junction Gang Late Model Race-

Balls out, no points, no gas mileage-gloves off racing. :thumbsup:

Bingo! Thats why your the man TP!

he's just still green and he'll have to learn somethings the hard way - -


Huh?????
This retard started in the Nationwide cars in 2005, Nextel in '06, and is at the end of his 3rd. year......How many more years of him making stupid moves will you consider him "Not Green" anymore?????

There is nothing outlaw about WOO- they have almost as many rules as Na$cart. Seems like just another bunch of identical "IROC" cars except on dirt. Same with so-called late models nowadays. Sometimes they put on a pretty good show, but if a track dry-slicks off (like usually happens thanks to our pals at the EPA), its probably just gonna be a parade. Sure it takes more balls and skill to drive wide-open all the way around on heavy dirt in traffic or slide job the cat in front of ya' than it takes to play follow the leader saving gas in a cheated-up store-bought extra-safe generic stock car on a super smooth soft-walled speedway. But the real outlaws like Dick Gaines, Rick Ferkel, Jan Operman ran unlimited aluminum big blocks (even a few HEMIS!), tipped the nitro, Drag 500 humpers, no weight limit, etc, etc. The REAL outlaws ran what they brung and hoped they brung enough!
:dude:

Todd,

You are comparing racing (WoO) to a puppet show (Nascar). I stopped watching puppet shows when Jim Henson died.

There is only two times a year I actually think NASCAR driver's race, by my definition:

1) The Winston, or what ever the hell it's called this week.
2) At Smoke's Eldora / Victory Junction Gang Late Model Race-

Balls out, no points, no gas mileage-gloves off racing. :thumbsup:

LOL! So true...

Speed had some great coverage Saturday night... Some Late Models... Outlaws... Modifieds... All great racing. We need to get Speed and some big screens at the track!!!

Huh?????
This retard started in the Nationwide cars in 2005, Nextel in '06, and is at the end of his 3rd. year......How many more years of him making stupid moves will you consider him "Not Green" anymore?????


Well if you consider the...as you put it RETARD that he was involved with...who's been known for some really STUPID moves over the past few years...and he's the SUPERSTAR F1 and INDY driver with SOOOO much more experience..I'd have to say DG is still pretty green.

He's out there trying to survive...how ever many laps down he was - he was still out there DIGGING trying to get the best top 20 finish he could. JPM who's been a BACK MARKER most of the year..for the 2nd week in a row had a GOOD RUN - but with the bad LUCK he's had...you'd think maybe he'd be a little smarter than to rough the kid up a couple time...then think he wasn't going to get HIT back.

Yeah - so Gilliland screwed up and hit him TOO hard - that what happens when guys do stupid things - -but if JPM hadn't hammered DGs ass.... DG wouldn't have dumped him.

RESPECT is Earned...not taken

We need to get Speed and some big screens at the track!!!

I'd like to get that in my den....
We don't get Speed...... :(

who's been known for some really
STUPID moves over the past few years...
Well... last year was his first year, so I don't know about
the last "few"...
In his first year, he won a race, and had 6 top tens.
And with a team of not tremendous resource.

He's out there trying to survive...how ever many laps down he was
he was still out there DIGGING trying to get the best top 20 finish he could.

which is fine, but when you are 4 laps down, you shouldn't be 'racing'
ANY leaders.. you just don't do that.
You gain NOTHING until you pass the leader.

Yeah - so Gilliland screwed up and hit him TOO hard -
that what happens when guys do stupid things - -but if JPM hadn't hammered DGs ass.... DG wouldn't have dumped him.
Stupid things?
Please.... that's ridiculous justification for walling someone.
Your paybacks should be in kind.
If JPM bumped the kid, and the kid 4 laps down thinks he was mistreated
then bump him back. The SAME way.
You don't wall somebody, and risk causing a huge pile up and/or serious injury
because you were doinked for holding up lead lap cars...
That's moronic thinking.

RESPECT is Earned...not taken

Well Gilliland sure needs to do some earning.
He's no hero in most peoples' eyes.

Yeah, then he can sue Nascar, the track, his sponsors, his team and the fans.:rolleyes:

JPM is not whinning about, so why should anyone else.

It was joke a Tim, I kept reading JPM and JP Morgan comes to mind frist for me than Jaun Pablo.

The intent is still there. Does not matter where you screw up, if you are liable and wreckless, someone can end up rich and you can end up broke.

There is nothing outlaw about WOO- they have almost as many rules as Na$cart. Seems like just another bunch of identical "IROC" cars except on dirt. Same with so-called late models nowadays. Sometimes they put on a pretty good show, but if a track dry-slicks off (like usually happens thanks to our pals at the EPA), its probably just gonna be a parade. Sure it takes more balls and skill to drive wide-open all the way around on heavy dirt in traffic or slide job the cat in front of ya' than it takes to play follow the leader saving gas in a cheated-up store-bought extra-safe generic stock car on a super smooth soft-walled speedway. But the real outlaws like Dick Gaines, Rick Ferkel, Jan Operman ran unlimited aluminum big blocks (even a few HEMIS!), tipped the nitro, Drag 500 humpers, no weight limit, etc, etc. The REAL outlaws ran what they brung and hoped they brung enough!
:dude:Your telling me all WoO Late model cars are like IROC cars that makes me laugh.

Granted the WOO late model rules are a bit more "outlaw" than their sprint rules, but they all look the same- slab sided wedges. And they all seem to go thru the corners the same, looking like they might tip over! Sure do miss the good old days when the winner of the World 100 had a vinyl top, chrome bumpers, genuine sheetmetal, stock clip, home-built engine, eight lug wheels....
:dude:

Granted the WOO late model rules are a bit more "outlaw" than their sprint rules, but they all look the same- slab sided wedges. And they all seem to go thru the corners the same, looking like they might tip over! Sure do miss the good old days when the winner of the World 100 had a vinyl top, chrome bumpers, genuine sheetmetal, stock clip, home-built engine, eight lug wheels....
:dude:

Sounds to me like your stuck in the 70's and don't like modern technology.

I agree... :)

The intent is still there. Does not matter where you screw up, if you are liable and wreckless, someone can end up rich and you can end up broke.

Dan Agreed.

Sounds to me like your stuck in the 70's and don't like modern technology.

You are mostly correct. If it can't be fixed along the side of the road with duct tape and a hatchet, don't want to drive it. "Modern technology" ain't whats its all cracked up to be. Look what air bags galore, passive safety items with little if any safety factor, almost hobby grade ABS brakes, cell phones, blackberries, MP3s, etc, etc, combined with lowest-bid driver training and certification has done for highway safety- still killing 50,000+ and injuring many 100,000's a year just like in the '70s. The only real difference is that the gov't knows exactly what you were doing 5 seconds before your airbag deploys if you are driving a vehicle made after 1999! If only people really thought a big ol' spike might pop out of the steering wheel in a crash instead of a pillow, you'd see most people drive way differently than they do now (Even in Na$cart).
:dude:

Classic Nascar? That would be awesome! 79-80 body styles with today's safety features. Steel bumpers, full factory sheetmetal, no wing, ground clearence...ect

How bout we go back even further than that...

http://www.daytona500.com/uploads/1962_robertslorenz.jpg

Back to FIREBALL and FAST FREDDIE

That works but i don't see the auto manufactures putting out a car like that.

...do you see one putting out a COT car? LOL

you got me there

How bout we go back even further than that...


They had a couple of those cars at a summer's end car show at a local
dealership...
One thing that I think we all sort of lose track of,
is how BIG those babies were!!

Now you guys are talkin'! Make it 70's era (before downsizing) with guys like Petty, Pearson, Yarborough, Foyt, Allison, etc, running unrestricted and that'll do just fine. And run a half dozen or so Cup shows on dirt while your at it...
:dude:

I had a 63 Pontiac for a brief time, it was something I wanted to turn into a resto looking FIREBALL ROBERTS car, that car was a TANK

The 63 Galaxy - I think was something like 22 ft long - another TANK

I couldn't believe how SMALL the cars got in what...88 or so when they went to the LITTLE body style - they reminded me of watching the "BABY GRANDS"

-----------------

...good thing JPM doesn't make STUPID moves....

That he his in-direct way of paying Gilliland back. :)

LOL Indirect..and taking 8 INNOCENT cars out with it....LOL

The 38 car did make a nice hood ornement though.... OUCH that could have really been ugly if it went THOUGH the windshield