I'm intrested in the Moebius Seaview kit and would like to test out an idea before I purchase one. Could someone jot down the following measurements and post or e-mail them to me, they do not have to be down to the MM just close.
I know the length is 39 inches but what are:
(A) bottom of keel to top of sail.
(B) bottom of keel to base of the sail.
(C) length from the nose to the back of the sail.
(D) length from back of sail to front of sail bridge.
(E) length of sail at base.
last measurement
(F) Width of interior hull at is widest point.
Drawings show the interior pressure hull as round like a balistic missle sub, but the model is a flattened oval. When looking at the drawings from the TV show that were in the missle room there are three levels but the lowest level along the keel was blacked out and I think marked ballast tanks. But if the interior hull is round you could move the ballast tanks between the inner and outer pressure hull and the two forward wings. This would open up that lower level making the Seaview a three level submarine as shown in some of the latest designs I've seen posted here.

Here are the dimensions:

(A) bottom of keel to top of sail: 5–3/4"
(B) bottom of keel to base of the sail: 3–1/2"
(C) length from the nose to the back of the sail: 17–5/8"
(D) length from back of sail to front of sail bridge: 3–1/8"
(E) length of sail at base: a hair shy of 4–3/4"
(F) Width of interior hull at is widest point:
Maximum outside hull width at nose bulge is 4–3/4".
Hull width at constant (circular) cross-section is outside 2–7/8", inside 2–3/4".Drawings show the interior pressure hull as round like a ballistic missle sub, but the model is a flattened oval. When looking at the drawings from the TV show that were in the missle room there are three levels but the lowest level along the keel was blacked out and I think marked ballast tanks. But if the interior hull is round you could move the ballast tanks between the inner and outer pressure hull and the two forward wings. This would open up that lower level making the Seaview a three level submarine as shown in some of the latest designs I've seen posted here.The hulls of both the 8-foot and 17-foot filming miniatures have a constant circular cross-section between the nose bulge and the tail cone. The Aurora/Polar Lights model has an inaccurate elliptical hull shape -- it's about 20% wider than it should be. That was probably done because the Seaview is very long in proportion to its width, and the small-scale model just didn't look "beefy" enough with the correct hull section.

What's kind of cool is in the episode The Sky is Falling, they show an interface between the circular pressure hull and the free flow deck. In the episode they incorrectly climb the control room ladder and end up slightly behind the deck hatch that is just behind the sail. There is an inner hatch on a flat floor that must be partly recessed into the pressure hull, a small, low-ceilinged pressurized room underneath the deck, and a ladder up to the deck hatch. If anyone were insane enough to try to model a working hatch, this little room would be fun to include. Now where am I going to get a ladder the right size...

I too have Seaview dimentia. :freak:

I too have Seaview dimentia. :freak:Seaview dementia (also known as Allen's Syndrome) — A cognitive and perceptual disorder common to much of science-fiction film and television programming, but especially pronounced in the TV programs created and produced by Irwin Allen. The disorder is characterized by, among other things, dissociative spatial perception (e.g., objects seeming much larger on the inside than on the outside); inconsistent dimensional perception (e.g., the same object may appear to be 600 feet long at one moment and 400 feet long the next); and self-contradictory behavior (e.g., projectiles that face backward but fire forward)!

:lol:...

Here are the dimensions:

(A) bottom of keel to top of sail: 5–3/4"
(B) bottom of keel to base of the sail: 3–1/2"
(C) length from the nose to the back of the sail: 17–5/8"
(D) length from back of sail to front of sail bridge: 3–1/8"
(E) length of sail at base: a hair shy of 4–3/4"
(F) Width of interior hull at is widest point:
Maximum outside hull width at nose bulge is 4–3/4".
Hull width at constant (circular) cross-section is outside 2–7/8", inside 2–3/4".The hulls of both the 8-foot and 17-foot filming miniatures have a constant circular cross-section between the nose bulge and the tail cone. The Aurora/Polar Lights model has an inaccurate elliptical hull shape -- it's about 20% wider than it should be. That was probably done because the Seaview is very long in proportion to its width, and the small-scale model just didn't look "beefy" enough with the correct hull section.

Thanks for the needed numbers, now to see if I can crunch them and make a scale interior design that would work in the physical real world and turn out a workable 2 or 3 level design. I'll make a disclaimer right now, no one will be happy with this design because it will be based on a real working ship not a TV sci-fi concept. I loved the Seaview don't get me wrong but anyone going into the reactor room and pulling the control rods out by hand should have been dead before they reached the door to leave, and how did they cool that puppy. but the observation lounge my favorite area of the ship.

I've long thought it would be interesting to consider Seaview as being a radical conversion of an early generation Polaris sub. Mind you, the show's interior's make this rather a joke...but the 'view's overall length (assuming ~400') seems a rough match, while the missile section (sometimes) displays the same number of hatches...

Say, the Seaview is nuclear-powered, right?

Where's the reactor supposed to be located?

I was looking at my taped-together Seaview hulls (yup, FINALLY found one!!) and it seems to me that if you use the 16 missle tube cover piece, you'd have a better place to put the reactor, assuming a roughly central location (between bow to stern) within the hull.

Well, it's kinda gotta be near the turbines in the aft hull, doesn't it?

Not necessarily. Reactor protection is HEAVY. Wouldn't it make sense to centralize it? If not, your boat will be aft-heavy. The original movie suggests that the reactor on the way to the missle tubes during the "tour".

As an aside, man, is that movie hard to watch!! As much as I have been enamored with the vehicles of Irwin Allen, the whole movie premise is questionable at best, the acting kinda over-the-top and the characterizations tough to believe. Really, the Seaview itself is the star of the show! All those weird characters running around inside her... that's something else! LOL!

Not necessarily. Reactor protection is HEAVY. Wouldn't it make sense to centralize it? If not, your boat will be aft-heavy. The original movie suggests that the reactor on the way to the missle tubes during the "tour".Didn't the first generation of FBM subs have the reactor located aft of the missile section? In fact, isn't that where modern subs have it as well? Seems to me the safest and most efficient location for the reactor would be close to the propulsion turbines. Placing the reactor amidships would require high-pressure superheated steam piping running the length of the missile section and then some.
http://www.hobbytalk.com/bbs1/attachment.php?attachmentid=63625&stc=1&d=1217301437

As an aside, man, is that movie hard to watch!! As much as I have been enamored with the vehicles of Irwin Allen, the whole movie premise is questionable at best, the acting kinda over-the-top and the characterizations tough to believe. Really, the Seaview itself is the star of the show! All those weird characters running around inside her... that's something else! LOL!The Van Allen radiation belts CATCHING FIRE?? Where there's nothing to burn and no oxygen? Sure, it could happen any day!

Seaview dementia (also known as Allen's Syndrome) — A cognitive and perceptual disorder common to much of science-fiction film and television programming, but especially pronounced in the TV programs created and produced by Irwin Allen. The disorder is characterized by, among other things, dissociative spatial perception (e.g., objects seeming much larger on the inside than on the outside); inconsistent dimensional perception (e.g., the same object may appear to be 600 feet long at one moment and 400 feet long the next); and self-contradictory behavior (e.g., projectiles that face backward but fire forward)!
Excellent!!

Say, the Seaview is nuclear-powered, right?

Where's the reactor supposed to be located? .........

Actually, I believe it's powered by a rare Earth element called Irwinium. Can only be found under what is now Century City. It allows you to power any fictional vehicle using a simple reactor made out of plywood and flashing lights.

Gene

Just purchased a Seaview kit, I do enjoy how a simple question can generate light hearted and informative conversation. I figured this thread would die out after just one or two replies and there are how many now? And big kudos to the artist that put the side by side of the Balistic missle submarine and Seaview together really nice.

http://cheddarbay.com/0000celebrityfiles/tv/amosandy/amosandy.jpg[/IMG-LEFT]

Actually, I believe it's powered by a rare Earth element called [I]Irwinium. Can only be found under what is now Century City. It allows you to power any fictional vehicle using a simple reactor made out of plywood and flashing lights.Yes, I'm familiar with that stuff. IIRC, it's a product of splitting the Unobtanium monocle. The by-products are protons, neutrons, fig newtons and morons!




Just purchased a Seaview kit, I do enjoy how a simple question can generate light hearted and informative conversation. I figured this thread would die out after just one or two replies and there are how many now? And big kudos to the artist that put the side by side of the Balistic missle submarine and Seaview together really nice.I appreciate the compliment, but I would never presume to call myself an artist. I'm just a cut-and-paste Photoshop monkey!

I'm sitting here chuckling, and reading the informative parts too! This is how all the threads should be! (and don't forget to use spellcheck Robert! LOL!)

New to the board, old to Irwin Allen. Thought I would put up a "litle" drawing I made of a cutaway Seaview. I wanted to see if things would fit. Took about a year. What do you think?
63669

Very nice RSN.:thumbsup:

I'm sitting here chuckling, and reading the informative parts too! This is how all the threads should be! (and don't forget to use spellcheck Robert! LOL!)

Duh, now which button is that again, oh yeah the X. Where did my message go?

[QUOTE=RSN;2464543]New to the board, old to Irwin Allen. Thought I would put up a "litle" drawing I made of a cutaway Seaview. I wanted to see if things would fit. Took about a year. What do you think?
QUOTE]

When I first looked at your drawing it was hard to see all the detail, then I found the enlarge key, a lot of great detail work including the air vets in the hallways, you left out the pariscope platform (yeah I now it would block the view of the control panels). Now I know VTTBOTS was on when I was a kid and I never missed a show (loved them giant sea monsters when they would carry the Seaview around to show off to their firends "look what I found"). But either my memory is going or something is wrong in the control room of your drawing and a set of plans I printed. The big computer with all the square lighted blocks that moved across the large face in shifting patterns, I'd swear it was on the other side of the control room across from the radio room, not next to it. Or am I suffering from old timers disease?

Here are the dimensions:

(A) bottom of keel to top of sail: 5–3/4"
(B) bottom of keel to base of the sail: 3–1/2"
(C) length from the nose to the back of the sail: 17–5/8"
(D) length from back of sail to front of sail bridge: 3–1/8"
(E) length of sail at base: a hair shy of 4–3/4"
(F) Width of interior hull at is widest point:
Maximum outside hull width at nose bulge is 4–3/4".


Again thanks for the measurement, last night I started tinkering with my scale drawing of the Moebius Seaview just to see how things would fit in a rough pencil draft, and I'm going to have to wait for my kit to arrive and double check the measurements. With these numbers the sail comes out taller than the main hull. I'm seeing problems all ready with a machinery room (a place the show never took us through, to much noise couldn't hear the actors speak their lines) located behind the reactor and trying to jam a torpedeo room into that same space. Even moving the drives for the two propulsion units into the two outer hull tubes to save space isn't helping much. Now where's my Irwin Allen DDG Dimentinal Displacement Generator? I know I had it sitting right here a minute or was that an hour, maybe I had it last week. Oh well it will show up some time.

Glad you like the drawing. You are right the island was left out, along with the position map, so you could see the control panels. Good catch on the oversized air vents too, how else would you escape all those plant monsters! The computer wall was on the side you see in the drawing during the movie and the first season. In the second season, when the control room was "moved" to the observation window level, it was moved to the port side next to the raidio shack. And just to be clear, the Flying Sub slides back into position in the launch bay, from the hatch in the observation nose!

. . . With these numbers the sail comes out taller than the main hull.. . . (A) bottom of keel to top of sail: 5–3/4"
(B) bottom of keel to base of the sail: 3–1/2"Subtract 3-1/2 inches from 5-3/4 inches and you get 2-1/4 inches for the height of the sail. That's less than 3-1/2 inches.

Or are we doing Irwinian math? :hat:

Subtract 3-1/2 inches from 5-3/4 inches and you get 2-1/4 inches for the height of the sail. That's less than 3-1/2 inches.

Or are we doing Irwinian math? :hat:

No discovered my problem, good thing they only let me play with pencils. It helps when you use the measurement (B) for your height of the hull, and not measurement (F) the width of the general interior for your hull height.

Just to show I'm not totally nuts and maybe I can't measure so good but I do okay in the drwing area. My Grandson just turned 4 and wanted a special birthday gift from Grand-pa, he loves Wall-E from the Disney movie and wanted me to do another drawing for him this time of Wall-E. so here is his almost finished 18 X 24 picture he's coming to get this weekend (if I get it finished in time).

http://img205.imageshack.us/img205/5480/wall5bt5.jpg

Thats some great art work ! I bet he will love that!

Solex227

He saw the rough penciled starter, but he knows what I can do, from his other drawing I've worked up for both Grandsons. Michale has a framed Speed Racer and his Mach-5 and a Missouri-Kansas-Texas GP38-2 along with the present Wall-E. Max likes super heros and has Wolverine, Galactus and the Silver Surfer along with a drawing I did for him of his mother and aunt. I have a large framed The Thing and Human Torch in my work room that I enjoy darn drawing took me two weeks to finish all the rock parts on the thing made me cross eyed at times.

Michael will be very happy this weekend I finished his birthday picture yesterday and framed it, I'm only 3 weeks behind.
Also still waiting for my Seaview to come in the mail slow boat from China must have sprung a leak.

My Moebius Seaview kit showed up yesterday morning and I’ve been working on trying to squeeze a scale interior inside the kit and I’ve run into several obstacles. With an interior measurement of 2-1/2 inches that gives the ship slightly over 24 feet of height inside the hull, for a three level submarine the upper level has no width and lowest level has no floor space. This seems to seal the fate for a three level vessel, but may leave the door open for a 2 level vessel with ballast and trim tanks in the belly along with some equipment storage areas. Another possible idea instead of opening up the whole side of the vessel may be to just open specific areas like the torpedo room or all of the missile room or just a section of it and of course the bridge, the observation nose would take care of its self with the 4 view ports. But the kit is great I test fitted several areas together using masking tape and its been a great fit, I really like the tail fin design and the way it makes assembly mistake proof, no fins to keep checking the alignment on while the cement dries. There is almost no flash to clean off the parts and the control room control surfaces are full of clear details, a really fantastic piece of work.

My man, triple check your measurements, sir. In the Seaview inaccuracies and fixes thread that I started, you'll see a really poor quality picture of my Mobeius Seaview with its decks cut off and circular bulkheads cemented inside to ensure that the hull stays round as I destroy it. Those bulkheads are 2 6/8" in diameter, which at 1/128 scale makes it 29.33 feet ID (unless I messed up my measurements). Plenty of room for 3 very tightly spaced levels. One idea that I like is that the levels don't necessarily have to stay level all the way along (kind of like a split level house in places). In the episode The Sky is Falling, they used a cool set to represent the space between a hull water tight hatch and the inner pressure hatch that would have had to have been inset into the pressure hull, possibly a section with a smaller diameter? Don't give up, keep doing what you're doing, you're going to have a lot of fun.

. . . With an interior measurement of 2-1/2 inches that gives the ship slightly over 24 feet of height inside the hull, for a three level submarine the upper level has no width and lowest level has no floor space. This seems to seal the fate for a three level vessel, but may leave the door open for a 2 level vessel with ballast and trim tanks in the belly along with some equipment storage areas.Check your measurements again. The actual inside diameter of the hull is 2-3/4 inches, which scales out to 29 feet 4 inches. That makes a 3-level layout do-able, if a bit cramped. But then, real subs have pretty cramped accommodations. They don't need compartments and passageways big enough for a camera dolly, cables and a film crew!

http://www.hobbytalk.com/bbs1/attachment.php?attachmentid=64233&stc=1&d=1218413922[/IMG-LEFT]
Of course, this hypothetical cross-section only works with the movie and first-season TV version, since the level of the observation lounge is offset from all 3 deck levels. Well, that's what that spiral staircase was for.


I really like the tail fin design and the way it makes assembly mistake proof, no fins to keep checking the alignment on while the cement dries.It's a brilliant piece of engineering. No fragile glue joint to worry about, and the fins automatically sit at the correct angle. Makes you wonder why no previous [I]Seaview kits had the fins done that way.

I just spent an hour opening up all the limber holes in the deck and then another hour cleaning up all the little bits of plastic and getting the bench ready for the next stage. As I was putting away the control room blueprint (I think I posted them on the my seaview drawings thread, I noticed that while the control room is 10' high from floor to ceiling, the angles of the sides of the girdered ceiling precisely match the angles of the sides of the deck. The ceiling isn't as wide as the deck of course but it's almost like the original designers meant the control room to fit under the deck, following its contours, protruding up toward the sail from inside the round pressure hull, as the room between the watertight door and the pressure door does.

. . . it's almost like the original designers meant the control room to fit under the deck, following its contours, protruding up toward the sail from inside the round pressure hull, as the room between the watertight door and the pressure door does.That was quite possibly the original intent, although that hypothetical layout was trashed when the control room and observation lounge were made into a single adjoining set for the second season. Kind of like the Enterprise's engineering section fitting nicely into the contours of the secondary hull of a 500-something-foot-long ship.

If Moebius wanted to expand his retail market for the Seaview kit he might consider a slight adjustment in the instruction booklet. To get into the USSR market if he added a third design by flipping parts #13 & #14 or #15 you come up with a configuration that looks like a Russian fleet submarine See attached photo.
http://img385.imageshack.us/img385/8906/sv2ee4.jpg

Then by changing the following colors the main hull Flat Black or Grimey Black.
Keel White or Lt. Ghost Gray
Flying Sub from Yellow to Red.
And they could place a disclaimer on the box "We invented it first".

Check your measurements again. The actual inside diameter of the hull is 2-3/4 inches, which scales out to 29 feet 4 inches. That makes a 3-level layout do-able, if a bit cramped. But then, real subs have pretty cramped accommodations. They don't need compartments and passageways big enough for a camera dolly, cables and a film crew!

Yes there is slightly more room than the 2-1/2 inches I listed but 2-3/4s is stretching it a bit tight. Most ballistic sub hulls are 33 feet in diameter and cutting it down to 29 is a squeeze, and as your drawing shows the control room control panels would require major surgery to fit inside the upper level space and leave room to walk around the periscope island. The roof of the control room could be extended up into the flood holes area to get the needed extra height at the periscope island, but is not wide enough to do the same for the control panels. At 8 feet or even 9 there is ample space in most areas and I do have the observation lounge raised a couple of feet above the second level deck to allow for the flying sub bay. This shrinks the area above it to stooping level, so I was thinking of placing the acoustic sound heads in this area. I'm still playing with my design idea but its looking like the end result would be nothing close to the idea of the Seaview

http://www.hobbytalk.com/bbs1/attachment.php?attachmentid=64387&stc=1&d=1218603006[/IMG-LEFT]



I was just checking the Moebius [I]Seaview interior against the set blueprints. I realize now that Moebius took some liberties with the original dimensions to make the interior fit into the hull. They made the control room BIGGER! The kit's interior width from port to starboard bulkhead, measured at the periscope island, scales out to roughly 22 feet 8 inches. According to the plans I used in my copy-and-paste cross section, which I believe are taken from the studio blueprints, the control room set was only 17 feet wide. And the periscope island was about a foot narrower than it scales out to on the kit. So, long story short, the kit interior CAN fit into a 3-level Seaview the way I've shown it without doing major surgery. A nip here and a tuck there, maybe.

Alternatively, you could always ignore the official scale of 1/128 and assume the model is in the more common 1/144 scale, which, coincidentally, would make the interior hull diameter exactly 33 feet! Of course, then the complete interior, including the control room and observation lounge, would have to be built from scratch.

My head is spinning . . . I see plans within plans within plans . . .

When the control deck was on the upper level, it had a different floor plan that would fit into the upper deck. If you don't want to do major surgery on the kit parts, place it in the 2nd level.

Well, yes, you could always do that. :cool:

First thing is I did a 2-3/4 hull template, and was surprised it did fit inside the Seaview hull, after all the looking at it and measuring across the hull of the model I did I was sure it couldn't be done, ah well my wife proves me wrong all the time and gets much pleasure from it, so what's new...
With that said I made a couple of corrections on the interior drawing and started in again on an interior that could fit inside the model. Right now all I have is the control room, flying sub bay and observation nose sketched, in the control room the plotting map and periscope* (now there are two*) have swapped places to give the staff entry up to the sail bridge. And those crew members that had chairs to sit in while on duty at their consoles now need to stand at their duty post, isle issues. The radio room has been moved to the front of the control room and will be joined by the crew members that man the sound head listening equipment this makes room for the missile room to move forward a little. The observation lounge has become a large room allowing crew and guests to enjoy their off time in this area or host meetings or events. The entry hatch to the flying sub has been moved to directly over the sub and I left the floor at the same height this allows a double floor and extra support in case of a docking accident with the flying sub. In the compartment above the observation lounge I put the forward sound heads and some of the equipment to support that system will also be in there. I'm still not sure a working drawing can be done without moving the sail and missile room forward to make room for a regular size reactor and machine room for all the drive and power equipment.

http://img367.imageshack.us/img367/5659/sv4sg4.jpg

Looking good so far. See, I told you it would fit!

I posted these in the forum about building a full Seaview interior. They
are from the episode "Day of Evil". The quality isn't good, but I managed
to un-distort and clean them up somewhat. Enjoy.

I’m still working on an interior for the Moebius Seaview model and the biggest problem I’ve found is the location of the sail, the Seaview is similar in size to a ballistic missile submarine but on those boats the sail is located roughly 40 feet forward of where it is mounted on the Seaview. That space would go a long way to adding a machinery space and more realistic reactor to the kit, but working with the kit as it is here’s what I’ve come up with so far.
Starting at the sail I’d get rid of the giant radar dish and cut it down to a more usable unit that could be retracted into the sail, and I’ve added a second periscope. In the void between the pressure hull and the deck there is a forward hatch that would need an escape trunk, but it is in the middle of a hallway so I did a small double hatch with an air lock, for use with a rescue bell. There are still lots of fill in work to do yet but looking at the side view of the boat and the top overhead view in the drawing looking directly under the sail is the control room and moving forward is the radio room (top) and acoustic listening equipment room and stair well (lower). Next you come up to the Captain and Admirals quarters (top) and they do not get the luxurious quarters they had in the show, the next room is the armory and weapons officer office. The (lower) section is the Officers ward room and officers quarters the last section before you reach the nose of the boat is filled with the electronics for the sound heads and towed array. The rest of the hallway (top) is unknown at this time.
Moving to the 2nd level below the sail is the galley with the trash room for dumping garbage into the sea. On the (lower) side is the infirmary with a procedure area and a small doctors office / equipment room then the stair well, the next sections (small disclaimer in a ballistic sub the crew quarters are located in the missile room between the missile silos, found to be the most quite area of the boat). But with all the space I needed to fill I place a section of crew bunks here that reaches to the wall of the observation nose. This I kept right where it sits on the model and kept the height the same, and raised the deck area above it, the lounge I lengthened and moved the hatch for the flying sub directly above the subs hatch.
3rd level below the sail is the oxygen extraction / fresh water equipment room, moving forward is the diesel motor (for generating power should the reactor fail, or need to be shut down) and the diesel fuel storage tank, next are high pressure air storage tanks for blowing the ballast tanks, fresh water storage tank, forward trim tank and flying sub compartment. That’s it so far.

http://img229.imageshack.us/img229/4694/sv5af4.jpg

Last night I threw together a paint booth using a 4 x 5 piece of masonite board I has sitting around, its 44” wide 18” deep and tall I tacked it together with a nail gun then went back and added some screws to give it more strength now to install the blower and vent hose.

http://img229.imageshack.us/img229/7243/paint1sg6.jpg