There's some talk over at the Clubhouse forums regarding the Conan kit... rumor has it that it will be a resin kit, not styrene?

That's what I heard too.

I hope not, there are plenty of resin Conans' out there already, I'd really like to see this in styrene...but that's just me:)
Mcdee

Unfortunately it might be so.The source I heard it from,if not official,is pretty damn near.Of course,this sculpture was supposed to be released in 1/6th scale.From what I've heard,due to it's size and the fact that it becomes too complicated to mold is resulting in it's cancellation,as far as styrene production is concerned.But could the styrene production still be possible if they reduced it to 1/8th scale and took out the chick in the diorama setting.Who knows.Only the guys from Moebius can tell us if this option is viable.:(

Surely that can't be true? That would defeat the whole purpose of Moebius and the reason people are excited about these kits is precisely because they are made from hard plastic like the Aurora ones.

And I hope the female doesn't get ditched too!

I just checked out the pre order section of CultTVman and the Conan model is described as resin....? So it kinda looks like that's the case...
Mcdee :confused:

I hope not, there are plenty of resin Conans' out there already, I'd really like to see this in styrene...but that's just me:)
Mcdee


Me too!

I just checked out the pre order section of CultTVman and the Conan model is described as resin....? So it kinda looks like that's the case...
Mcdee :confused:



I see what you mean. As much as I like to support companies like Moebius I'm afraid that will be one I'll have to pass on.

There's resin, and then there's resin. Resin kits done in a production environment (versus someone's garage) are far superior in molding quality (fit, airholes, etc.) to those done in someone's garage.

While everyone agrees that the Captain Cardboard / Atomic City Space Pod is a fantastic piece of resin molding, it pales in comparison to the original issue Discovery Astronaut that he had made in China.

I'd be willing to bet that the Conan will be similarly fantastic piece of work that will require (almost) none of the cleanup that traditional resin kits do.

Hey, if it's styrene or resin, I'll buy it. Just think... it COULD have ended up in vinyl!

I saw this on Culttvman's website withing the past wek. Steve told me that they are going to be done in resin and it is still a Moebius kit. I for one was a little disappointed in the news at first but the more I thought about it I am going to like the resin kit even more. The detail of the sculpt is incredible. At least from what I can see of the pics that have been posted. Even Polar Lights did the Randy Bowen porcelain kit. I love the sculpt and I will be happy to build Conan when it is hits the stores.

I'm not interested in paying resin prices. If this stays at the price currently shown on Steve's site, I'll go for it, but that seems extremely unlikely.

Hey, if it's styrene or resin, I'll buy it. Just think... it COULD have ended up in vinyl!
haha...I missed this before I posted. Right you are!

...and what would be the problem with it being vinyl? Horizon vinyl kits ring a bell?

Tell you what guys.......I'm extremely disappointed to hear this. Why is it only now that this is coming out? Like I'm sure everyone else on here I thought this was going to be a plastic kit.

Vinyl and resin are no substitute whatsover for me compared to a proper plastic kit and I thought Moebius wasn't going down that route. I'd rather pay more to have it in plastic.

Honestly, after doing so many vinyl figures (and a couple of resin ones...not my preferred medium), I'd almost forgotten how much fun it was to put together a styrene figure kit...of course, now that I have a much better technique it's a lot more fun LOL...so I would have to think long and hard about purchasing Conan in resin...

...and what would be the problem with it being vinyl? Horizon vinyl kits ring a bell?
I am judging something that I have not fully attempted. One thing I don't like about vinyl kits is they lose their shape, you have to reshape, stuff them. Just another leg of the the job, yes. Nothing wrong at all with the detail of vinyl though. The detail is phenomenal. I have Ming the Merciless and Flash Gordon kits by Screamin' ...FANTASTIC STUFF!

I am set up around enamel paints right now. Correct me if I am wrong but you must use acrylic paint on vinyl kits. I am not real fond of using acrylic paint. I don't like the way they lose their brilliance over time. I have things that I painted a cadmium yellow 15 years ago and now it looks like ochre. That was using Winsor Newton's tube acrylics (the best or so I thought?).

Someone steer me in another direction if there is a way around my hangups using acrylics/ vinyl. You will have to school me a bit Deadmanic fan if this is your favorite type of kit and painting medium. Feel free to PM so we don't get too far OT. I could use some support when it comes to putting together my vinyl kits.

In any case I like working with styrene and resin so a Moebius kit in either material is good by me. We get more detail with resin than styrene.

I am judging something that I have not fully attempted. One thing I don't like about vinyl kits is they lose their shape, you have to reshape, stuff them. Just another leg of the the job, yes. Nothing wrong at all with the detail of vinyl though. The detail is phenomenal. I have Ming the Merciless and Flash Gordon kits by Screamin' ...FANTASTIC STUFF!

I am set up around enamel paints right now. Correct me if I am wrong but you must use acrylic paint on vinyl kits. I am not real fond of using acrylic paint. I don't like the way they lose their brilliance over time. I have things that I painted a cadmium yellow 15 years ago and now it looks like ochre. That was using Winsor Newton's tube acrylics (the best or so I thought?).

Someone steer me in another direction if there is a way around my hangups using acrylics/ vinyl. You will have to school me a bit Deadmanic fan if this is your favorite type of kit and painting medium. Feel free to PM so we don't get too far OT. I could use some support when it comes to putting together my vinyl kits.

In any case I like working with styrene and resin so a Moebius kit in either material is good by me. We get more detail with resin than styrene.




I'd rather have slightly less detail on a plastic kit than bother with resin or vinyl (which could end up with all sorts of problems in the future like shrinkage, distortion, bits being chipped off etc).

And anyway, Monarchs Nosferatu has a great level of detail and that's plastic.

I just won't even consider buying it if it's resin, no matter how good the detail and I bet there's many more around who'd feel the same.

I have certainly enjoyed the renaissance of styrene kits over the past few years, but I prefer vinyl kits for both the higher quality of detail and relative ease of assembly (i.e. lack of pesky seams to eliminate). And Duck, once you PRIME a vinyl kit, you can use ANY paint you'd like. I know Frank and Dave both are pretty familiar with vinyl kits as builder/collectors, and I'm hoping Moebius takes the plunge. There are some creatures that lend themselves to vinyl production both for technical reasons (i.e. covered in fur or scales) AND relative popularity (i.e.: more likely to sell 500 - 1,000 kits rather than the 6-10,000 kits that make for success in styrene). As for the Conan, I'm glad to see Frank is making it available AT ALL after that piece's somewhat troubled history. The price is more than a styrene kit to be sure, but the production quality will be excellent, and it will still be a bargain compared to the average two figure resin kit in that scale.
Tom

I hope not, there are plenty of resin Conans' out there already, I'd really like to see this in styrene...but that's just me:)
Mcdee

Hey I'm quoting myself:p This one should be styrene...it would be a first:thumbsup:
Mcdee

I have certainly enjoyed the renaissance of styrene kits over the past few years, but I prefer vinyl kits for both the higher quality of detail and relative ease of assembly (i.e. lack of pesky seams to eliminate). And Duck, once you PRIME a vinyl kit, you can use ANY paint you'd like. I know Frank and Dave both are pretty familiar with vinyl kits as builder/collectors, and I'm hoping Moebius takes the plunge. There are some creatures that lend themselves to vinyl production both for technical reasons (i.e. covered in fur or scales) AND relative popularity (i.e.: more likely to sell 500 - 1,000 kits rather than the 6-10,000 kits that make for success in styrene). As for the Conan, I'm glad to see Frank is making it available AT ALL after that piece's somewhat troubled history. The price is more than a styrene kit to be sure, but the production quality will be excellent, and it will still be a bargain compared to the average two figure resin kit in that scale.
Tom



Again, I'd rather have the price hiked a lot than pay for a vinyl or resin kit.

It just ain't the same having a vinyl kit compared to a proper plastic kit and vinyl kits cost less to make so why should they be more expensive?

As for the Conan, I'm glad to see Frank is making it available AT ALL after that piece's somewhat troubled history. The price is more than a styrene kit to be sure, but the production quality will be excellent, and it will still be a bargain compared to the average two figure resin kit in that scale.

That's a good point. Heck, I wondered from the start how well that sculpture could be turned into a plastic kit and was not really surprised it's not going to work out. So, the fans of resin barbarian kits will have a great addition to their collection.

I'm much more excited about the Invisible Man, Hulk and Iron Man anyway. I'm even more excited about the Monster Scenes repops than I am about Conan. Big Frankie ... eh, not so much. That's why I'm only buying three.

Hey I'm quoting myself:p This one should be styrene...it would be a first:thumbsup:
Mcdee

I totally agree Mcdee. Personally I'm not a Conan fan but I'd buy it if it was a styrene kit. If it's vinyl or resin (with the inevitable cost involved), I won't be picking one up. I don't mean that offensively, it just wouldn't interest me. I have built heaps of resin and vinyl kits, but they've been subjects that I like.

Chris.:)

The news is correct, it will be a resin kit, or it won't be released. Too many production problems, and too high a tooling cost. Plus, initial orders we received weren't what we expected. Some of you had said, "I'd pay more to have it in styrene". What you don't understand is that for the current orders, calculating expenses we would incur, it would cost the same as a resin kit. Just no way around it. This is just a way to get out what we feel is a great sculpt. We know many of you won't buy it in resin, and I am sorry for that. Licensing is in place, and I feel we'd be better off getting it out in one form or another than abandoning the project completely. Hope you understand.

WOW! I don't know how vinyl kits got this bad rep. I've got vinyl kits that are 10 to 15 years old. No chipping, no deforming none of the stuff that people are complaining about. I always liked vinyl kits. Easy to assemble, hold paint extremely well and they're actually more durable than styrene or resin kits. Give them a good coat of primer and you can use just about any type of paint on them including enamels and laquers.

Yes, Conan was originally suppose to be a styrene kit. From what I've heard from reliable sources is that kit was just too complicated and expensive to produce molds. I'm guessing that Frank decided that it would be too costly to produce a kit that might have relatively limited appeal. It's a business decision that a young company like Moebius has to make on occasion.

Considering all that Moebius has produced and plans to produce, I don't think we should be jumping down their throats because they had to change one kit from styrene to resin.

The news is correct, it will be a resin kit, or it won't be released. Too many production problems, and too high a tooling cost. Plus, initial orders we received weren't what we expected. Some of you had said, "I'd pay more to have it in styrene". What you don't understand is that for the current orders, calculating expenses we would incur, it would cost the same as a resin kit. Just no way around it. This is just a way to get out what we feel is a great sculpt. We know many of you won't buy it in resin, and I am sorry for that. Licensing is in place, and I feel we'd be better off getting it out in one form or another than abandoning the project completely. Hope you understand.



Thanks for clearing that up Moebius! I have to say though I would gladly have paid $150 or more for that kit if it was in plastic and I'm not even a huge Conan fan. I hadn't myself pre-ordered as that's not something I'd even thought of as I usually just buy when I see the kit on the shelves or on Ebay and I wonder if many others don't pre-order either.

I hope all the other kits like Hulk, Invisible Man, The Mummy etc, etc are full plastic kits but I'm afraid I'll have to give Conan a miss now which is a real shame.

WOW! I don't know how vinyl kits got this bad rep. I've got vinyl kits that are 10 to 15 years old. No chipping, no deforming none of the stuff that people are complaining about. I always liked vinyl kits. Easy to assemble, hold paint extremely well and they're actually more durable than styrene or resin kits. Give them a good coat of primer and you can use just about any type of paint on them including enamels and laquers.


Yeah. I've got Horizon and Billikin kits on my shelf that are 15 years old and nary a sag or chip anywhere.
They also fare much better should they fall off the shelf. More of a "thud" than a "shatter".

Vinyl kits are not cheaper to produce per unit, but can be produced with LESS of an initial investment than a styrene kit. Same with resin kits. LOWER cost of a production run divided by FEWER units produced, unfortunately STILL translates to a HIGHER price per unit. At least, if you want to make a profit. :thumbsup: It's all about supply and demand (or in this case DEMAND dictating feasible, cost effective creation of supply). It definitely becomes tricky in a niche market like this one, but if ANYONE can make a go of it, I'd put MY money on Frank and Dave. :)
Tom
PS: Hey Frank, you KNOW what I'd like to see in vinyl, and if you do it, I'll BUY THREE OF THEM!!!

Thanks for clearing that up Moebius! I have to say though I would gladly have paid $150 or more for that kit if it was in plastic and I'm not even a huge Conan fan. I hadn't myself pre-ordered as that's not something I'd even thought of as I usually just buy when I see the kit on the shelves or on Ebay and I wonder if many others don't pre-order either.

I hope all the other kits like Hulk, Invisible Man, The Mummy etc, etc are full plastic kits but I'm afraid I'll have to give Conan a miss now which is a real shame.


I hope I cleared it up for the most part. You are right though, with orders and what it would have cost to produce, it would have been in that $150 range. I don't think many would have bought at that price range. Tooling was outrageous for the sculpt as it was, and not enough orders to put more money into a new sculpt. We kind of have a feel for initial orders, and we know many people don't preorder. But that fact is, even if we sell twice, even three times what was preordered, it still isn't enough.

We're not a resin company, and the other kits you mentioned will be in styrene. Not sure what would give anyone the idea we're going to just change gears and put out everything in resin, but after this anything will just be dropped from the line if we can't do it in the material planned. Thanks again!

Well,we can't criticize Moebius for trying.They have guts,and since they can't produce it in styrene,it's great of them to arrange the sale of this kit in resin.But just out of curiosity just the same.If this kit would have been produced in 1/8th scale,without the woman,and with a simpler and smaller base,would it have reduced production costs to a manageable level like the invisible man,etc.Was the action pose of Conan a factor in what would have made the molding of this kit too dificult.:confused:

Well,we can't criticize Moebius for trying.They have guts,and since they can't produce it in styrene,it's great of them to arrange the sale of this kit in resin.But just out of curiosity just the same.If this kit would have been produced in 1/8th scale,without the woman,and with a simpler and smaller base,would it have reduced production costs to a manageable level like the invisible man,etc.Was the action pose of Conan a factor in what would have made the molding of this kit too dificult.:confused:

It was to be produced in 1/8. This is how it has been announced the whole time. The sculpt is 1/6. If we left the woman off it wouldn't have mattered. The base can't be simplified any more than it is, as it's a flat rock with no extra pieces. We looked at every way to do it, and more that haven't been suggested yet, and it still doesn't work.

It'll be a cool resin kit. Lots of folks will be thrilled. It's not often you see a mass-produced GK these days. Now that plastic figures seem to officially be "back", maybe Moebius can give garage-kit production a boost as well.

It doesnt matter to me resin or Styrene just bring on the Conan kit:thumbsup:

Conan in resin is fine. That great sculpt job just can't go to waste! Keep it coming, don't give up on it!

frank, just wondering: why not vinyl?
(i am not a conan fan at all, so i was going to pass on this one anyway, but, all things being equal, id buy vinyl over resin anyday. theres been many a kit that i havent bought in resin that i would have bought in vinyl.)

Well, though I would have much rather seen this in styrene, I have to say that if the list price had been $150, that's a kit that would have to be sitting on the shelf at the local HS for a very long time before I picked it up.

Gonna have to play it by ear on this one. One of the key reasons I'm not wild about resin kits is that they are just too easy to build. That may not make sense to lot of people, but I like having to deal with seams and the occasional stubborn fit that styrene brings to the experience. It's just more of a challenge. To me, resin kits are like building a picture puzzle that has 4 pieces.

Frank, would it be cheaper if you left the woman off, forgot about the base completely, and eliminated the Conan figure as well?




:freak:





:D

I'm okay with resin as long as this doesn't turn into a trend!

MMM

Scratch me from the list... thats too bad. A lot of people will be disappointed.

Frank, would it be cheaper if you left the woman off, forgot about the base completely, and eliminated the Conan figure as well?




:freak:





:D

Dang, John! You've got a fine touch for business. I think your idea will dramatically reduce production cost and eventual retail price. Heck, if they leave out the box and instructions the cost is next to nothing! :devil:

Dang, John! You've got a fine touch for business. I think your idea will dramatically reduce production cost and eventual retail price. Heck, if they leave out the box and instructions the cost is next to nothing! :devil:

I think I just saw the no woman, no base, no Conan, no instructions, no box kit at my local hobby shop. Outstanding effort(as usual)! You should have another hit on your hands!

Gene


;)

I think I just saw the no woman, no base, no Conan, no instructions, no box kit at my local hobby shop. Outstanding effort(as usual)! You should have another hit on your hands!

Gene


;)


Wait...I think you must have seen the Invisible Man by mistake...

Wait...I think you must have seen the Invisible Man by mistake...

No, that kit was just an empty cellophane wrapper on the shelf.

Gene

:p

Gene and Chris,

You guys are weird...and I mean that in the best sense of the word. :wave:

George

Well,if they can't,they can't.We can only thank Moebius for trying.I bet they won't make the same mistake twice with future figures as they now know the limitations and costs of molding some of these figures.Of course,for us the average modeler,who know little about the limitations of molding a kit,and by just looking at the Conan figure,it seems as simple as making that figure as the invisible man.We still wonder at what point they hit a snag.By the way,what would be the price of Conan in resin.Would it have the option of buying the figure only,or figure with base,or figure with the babe and base.Different prices for each option?:confused:

I hope I cleared it up for the most part. You are right though, with orders and what it would have cost to produce, it would have been in that $150 range. I don't think many would have bought at that price range. Tooling was outrageous for the sculpt as it was, and not enough orders to put more money into a new sculpt. We kind of have a feel for initial orders, and we know many people don't preorder. But that fact is, even if we sell twice, even three times what was preordered, it still isn't enough.

We're not a resin company, and the other kits you mentioned will be in styrene. Not sure what would give anyone the idea we're going to just change gears and put out everything in resin, but after this anything will just be dropped from the line if we can't do it in the material planned. Thanks again!




Thanks Moebius and as I said I'm not the worlds biggest Conan fan so even though it's disappointing as I've really got the plastic figure kit bug now (mainly because of your company and Monarch), it's not a huge loss to me like it might be for others. It must be hard for a company like yours to judge what's going to sell or not but it can be so disappointing when something's advertised and it gets cancelled etc.
If it was the Hulk then I would be truly gutted but I'm certainly looking forward to many more of your upcoming kits including the green giant himself of course!

I think Frank is making the right decision on this.. had it been a kit of the same cost as say the space pod or chariot, it would have been a no brainer for me, but if it was $150, I'd have passed on it, like I did with all the more expensive resin kits I've passed on in the past.

Well, though I would have much rather seen this in styrene, I have to say that if the list price had been $150, that's a kit that would have to be sitting on the shelf at the local HS for a very long time before I picked it up.

Gonna have to play it by ear on this one. One of the key reasons I'm not wild about resin kits is that they are just too easy to build. That may not make sense to lot of people, but I like having to deal with seams and the occasional stubborn fit that styrene brings to the experience. It's just more of a challenge. To me, resin kits are like building a picture puzzle that has 4 pieces.


But am I right in saying that you would have picked it up at some point, even if you had to save for a few weeks? I'm still putting away a bit every week for more expensive kits like Fine Molds Millenium Falcon and a few others that I will buy at some point.

I think we'll all have to be prepared to pay more for plastic kits in the future because of rising costs. I'd rather pay more for something I want in plastic than to have nothing at all.

As a Conan fan I would like to than Moebuis for still continuing with this kit.
Even though it will be in resin, I think this will still be the first and only licensed Conan model out there.
As such I think it will still sell enough to recoup costs and put a little change in Franks pocket.

Yes, it is sad that some some will not be able to afford this now, or have lost interest (I can understand that, as there are some subject I would love to build in styrene, but never consider buying a resin kit of)
But I think he will pick up a whole new group of buyers from the GK community that will jump at this kit now. (they are just the opposite and wouldn't buy things in styrene, but would in resin)

Frank, I'll pick one up no matter what it's made out of.

Buc - BIG Conan fan!