Is THIS how to fix the Brushless / Lipo situation...

Let's get the Two LARGEST R/C Companys in the U.S. to each import/sell/mfg. a Brushless Motor Teardown, and a CASED LIPO Pack.

Then, other SMALLER companies can BUY those 'Pre-Built' Units - Add a Fancy Sticker with THEIR name on it, maybe they can DNYO the motors, and Bench Test the Batteries and put Performance Data on those Stickers....

Then those smaller companies can sell these products as THEIR OWN.

You'd basically BLUE PRINT the motors, and have Two choices.

We could call one a YOKOMO tear down, and the other a Epic tear down...although they would already be built to the proper specs. You'd be able to do your DYNO Tuning Magic...as long as nothing was MODIFIED.

Just for the heck of it, we could call the Batteries SANYO CELLS, and even though they would only be available in ASSEMBLED Hard Case Packs - they could be matched (I'm not sure what you would match them too..but that's ok)and the price could be raised over Non-Matched.

Racer's could get stuff from their sponsors, there'd be more companies to be able to SPONSOR events...and it would really (honestly) make the racing EVEN better.

The resticker and 35% mark-up sure doesn't make sense to me. Back in the stock days the motors co. atleast had a little labor involved for the 40% increase in price.

It's starting to happen already. Smaller matchers are buying from larger importers and putting on their own labels. BL motors are coming (if not already here) that are just relabeled major brands.

Sounds good to me hey anything at this point could only help I think..........

OR......

we could continue to do what we do now......

we have 100 different lipos manufacturers we "could" buy a lipo pack from...but we choose to use only one flavor......

we have 7 or 8 different brushless motor manufactures that we "could" buy motors from but we choose to use only one........


we have 7 or 8 different esc manufacturers that we "could" buy esc's from but we choose to only allow two.....

there are 100 different car manufactueres and we "choose" to allow any to run

there are 989 different charger manufacturers and we "choose" to allow the use of any of them......


there are only 3 speeds we can go...but we "choose" to have 1000 different classes to go 3 speeds in the end....stock 19 turn and open mod.........




i see a huge problem with "choice"

roar rules as far as lipo batteries goes would be a good start.........

there are two organizations that set-up rules and regulations for r/c racing

BRL- sonny does great common sense rules..but only updates these rules for his needs...

roar - hasn't done a damn thing for oval racing rules in 20 years and has priced there nationals out of reach of most racers pockets....BUT does has a procedure in place for submitting products and clearing them to be used in all types of racing...a one size fits all attitude....


we choose to go somewhere in the middle of all that......

we shouldn't be allowed to choose...we need a real governing body...cheaper gas prices and a 10.00 an hour raise at work! oval racing would be on the upswing than and only than...

we have 50 states and each state has different rules...hell i know there are pockets of 6 cell stock racers out there........they look like freaking geneius's right about now!


i can't drive 100 mile to georgia and know what i got in my pit box will allow me to race!

forget snowbirds forget oval masters........this is georgia 100 miles from my house....

so we can keep going down the path of what works for you is ok...forget what they do in ohio and new york...we have too many damn choices for our own good.


to put it real simple like......

imagine if stop meant go in ohio and new york...but hear in florida red meant go and green meant stop......KISS needs to go into effect real soon or you can forget about a "outsider" coming racing in your stae anytime soon....


i'm off to wal mart where on my way i'm going to blow a green light! just for fun!

Kat you are good about putting thoughts down on these boards. I do my best with Jack and Chilis.

I was watching the (busch) race last night and was thinking - when they make rule changes it is still the same series name.

It would be cool if RC was the same way where we have something like: Stock, Sportsman, Pro. And when technology changed it would be adopted into the class rather than forming a whole new class? And over a given period of time to allow some sort of timeline for racers and budgets to follow.

BRL- sonny does great common sense rules..but only updates these rules for his needs...



Sonny updates his rules more often for what isn't needed. His vision is that of the racers and not of the manufacturers. I know his vision has saved me a ton of senseless spending last season. Did I have any less fun then the 100 manufacturer crowd? I don't think so.


"Fun"......Yea we forget about this sometimes.

sonny has very good rules...he has rules for his series..not realy intended for all oval racing though...and yes he has kept costs down...

In the real world fixing the demand to have only one supplier wille create alot of risk for the comsumer(US) and little incentive for the supplier to improve customer service, price or products. The supplier may even interrupt the supply for other more profitible interest knowing that the demand will not change and will backorder.

In a free economny, when a supplier knows they are perfered over the competition they will continue to improve customer serivce, prices, and products to maintain perference over the competion. Products will be in inventory or suppliers will risk losing a sale to the competition.

The point is in a small club economny it may serve well to "fix" things to reduce cost. But the R/C market is larger than just a 6 people making circles.

Any set of rules to govern the products for our hobby need to allow any company to compete so that hobbyist can have the best deal.

To illustrate fixed deman, look at Oil. The demand is Fixed by the laws of physics. Automoblie makers designed cars to last for 10+ year on the road. Not surprising DOT says the average vehicle is in service for 8years. The fuel efficency of the vehicles only affect the total demand, not the elasticitiy of the demand. As long as that vehicle is driven it creates demand for oil. Even if consumers wanted to shift the demand lower with more fuel efficient vehicles, it would take every bit of 8 years to accomplish that task since vehicles last 8 years or more. The demand for driving is caused from Urban sprawl. Urban sprawl is caused from cheaper land being farther from the center of townships. Physics says in order to go from point A to point B, work must be done. The work is done by oil.

90% of the population does not live in a centric community where all the daily needs could be met just by walking a short distance. Centric living could reduce the demand for oil if the cost became prohibitive. Since the oil companies know that demand is fixed in the short run (8years), they will continue to have poor prices, customer service, placement and inventories. Do the hobbyist want the same by creating fixed demand because the rules said so? Even if problem manufactures and suppliers were weeded out, the bittern taste of a crappy product outlast the memory of the cheap price. This will just lead to more racers quiting and doing something else.

yea he does have a great series with great rules Sooooooooo if it ain't broke, don't fix it is what I always say.sonny has very good rules...he has rules for his series..not realy intended for all oval racing though...and yes he has kept costs down...

Is THIS how to fix the Brushless / Lipo situation...

Let's get the Two LARGEST R/C Companys in the U.S. to each import/sell/mfg. a Brushless Motor Teardown, and a CASED LIPO Pack.

Then, other SMALLER companies can BUY those 'Pre-Built' Units - Add a Fancy Sticker with THEIR name on it, maybe they can DNYO the motors, and Bench Test the Batteries and put Performance Data on those Stickers....

Then those smaller companies can sell these products as THEIR OWN.

You'd basically BLUE PRINT the motors, and have Two choices.

We could call one a YOKOMO tear down, and the other a Epic tear down...although they would already be built to the proper specs. You'd be able to do your DYNO Tuning Magic...as long as nothing was MODIFIED.

Just for the heck of it, we could call the Batteries SANYO CELLS, and even though they would only be available in ASSEMBLED Hard Case Packs - they could be matched (I'm not sure what you would match them too..but that's ok)and the price could be raised over Non-Matched.

Racer's could get stuff from their sponsors, there'd be more companies to be able to SPONSOR events...and it would really (honestly) make the racing EVEN better.


what I think is if you want to "specify" keep it in your neck of the woods. don't try to paint the rest of the country into the "spec" box


having 1 class of spec is ok but making them all "spec" is ludicris.

All racing is spec, even open mod because you have to abide by the specifications set forth for the class. I don't understand the stigma around the word "spec".

my def of "spec" is same type of "motor, battery, tire, bodies, speedo, ect....


I understand what your saying is we have rules that the different manufactors follow to make there products. but that doesn't make a Tekin 10.5 the same as the novak 10.5


these round and round discussions sicken me. so many people want "one type" of motor battery speedo. because in there head " Because one manufactor has made it, there all the same." WTF ever.

Got it, and I think people are finding what you just said to be true for the most part but you know as well as I do, the perceptions must run their course.

Leave the SPEC racing where it belongs at track clubs not national, not regional or even state events. This also inlcludes sportsmen class racing, leave that for the clubs to decided.

hey now...we are getting on the same page.....i like this.

I disagree, why exclude the newer racers from the bigger events?Leave the SPEC racing where it belongs at track clubs not national, not regional or even state events. This also inlcludes sportsmen class racing, leave that for the clubs to decided.

For these reasons.

1. The event is already long enough, why add more classes just to make it longer
2. The premise of sportsmen class racing is "breakout" style racing. I don't think we want a whole field sandbagging till the main.
3. Not all clubs use the same rules for sportsmen and spec racing.

4 The point of racing is to showcase the driver and the equipment. SPEC racing removes the showcase of equipment. If you want to remove the equipment aspect get a XBOX 360 and race there!
5. It gives incentive to newer racers to improve skills and "bump" up to a faster more competitive and acknowledged class if they want to prove their skills at any level higher than club.

All racing is spec, even open mod because you have to abide by the specifications set forth for the class. I don't understand the stigma around the word "spec".
sorry, Not all racing is SPEC

All racing is classified into groups. AKA Race Classes.
These classes can be of age, gender, driver weight, car weight, motor size(displacement, windings ect), car eras, drive(FWD, RWD, AWD), transmission style the list just goes on and on. Racing is Classified into competitive groups.

Not all racing is specified, AKA SPEC racing. SPEC differs from class rules by defining specific makes, models and brands in order to compete.
An example of spec racing would be: All go-karts have to use a Briggs&Stration 5.0HP engine. Another example of SPEC racing is manufactures exhibition. A tire manufacture may hold a race for a certian race class open to anyone but the Tires are SPEC to be those of the manufacture.

1.More classes (by one) means more racers. Back in the day @ the Whip there was 300+ stock racers. Fortunately they made time for these unimportant drivers.

2.I doubt you would see any sandbagging as we did not ever get that @ the MSA race in Crossville TN. You still have to do your best to make the show.

3.You are correct, an even better reason for a breakout class

4. The point of racing is to have fun, period! Telling people to go get an X-Box is part of the problem these days, you are an arrogant (**^&(*7)

5. not even worth a response
For these reasons.

1. The event is already long enough, why add more classes just to make it longer
2. The premise of sportsmen class racing is "breakout" style racing. I don't think we want a whole field sandbagging till the main.
3. Not all clubs use the same rules for sportsmen and spec racing.

4 The point of racing is to showcase the driver and the equipment. SPEC racing removes the showcase of equipment. If you want to remove the equipment aspect get a XBOX 360 and race there!
5. It gives incentive to newer racers to improve skills and "bump" up to a faster more competitive and acknowledged class if they want to prove their skills at any level higher than club.

Semantics!sorry, Not all racing is SPEC

All racing is classified into groups. AKA Race Classes.
These classes can be of age, gender, driver weight, car weight, motor size(displacement, windings ect), car eras, drive(FWD, RWD, AWD), transmission style the list just goes on and on. Racing is Classified into competitive groups.

Not all racing is specified, AKA SPEC racing. SPEC differs from class rules by defining specific makes, models and brands in order to compete.
An example of spec racing would be: All go-karts have to use a Briggs&Stration 5.0HP engine. Another example of SPEC racing is manufactures exhibition. A tire manufacture may hold a race for a certian race class open to anyone but the Tires are SPEC to be those of the manufacture.

these round and round discussions sicken me. so many people want "one type" of motor battery speedo. because in there head " Because one manufactor has made it, there all the same." WTF ever.


Dave,

Actually, I was 100% opposed to ONE Mfg when working on the BL/LIPO deal last year.

I contacted 4 major companies about making products that would run virtually EQUAL on track, products that it wouldn't matter WHO's you ran - NOBODY would feel "Out Gunned" on performance.

EVERY ONE OF THEM told me - No Way. We will ONLY make a product if we can make it BETTER than our competition.

All that leads to is HE out did YOU this Week....YOU out do HIM next Week...and the racer suffers by having to keep following products to KEEP UP with the same 10 guys...

THEY SAID NO! THEY SAID NO! THEY SAID NO!

I said FINE - we'll go this road WITHOUT YOU. They said the OVAL MARKET IS TOO SMALL for us to worry about, so we won't NOTICE... What they didn't understand was I was trying to make a push for ALL electric racing to have a choice for some SLOWER brushless motors. THEY didn't care - UNTIL they were locked OUT and saw...OPPPS maybe there WAS a market!

Echeconee, no offense is sounding arrogant, you are calling as you see it. If you are for removing the "product showcase" from racing then the racing might as be on a simulator where all you see is the driving wheel.

One of the reasons why I race is that I want to see improvement in our race technologies. I can only see that when others are racing something different than me.

If you take away the product choices for racers to make, they will not know how to make choices when they are shopping for new race gear. They will end up letting someone tell them what they need to buy instead of taking the time and researching what they need to buy.

trailranger...if i ever see you at a race track..



















i'm gonna buy you a huge beer!

right on!

Just for fun - thought I needed the answer on this one:

Why the push for Lipo to replace Nimh now? And what is THE advantage?

Why the push for Lipo to replace Nimh now? And what is THE advantage?

We had planned to only try ONE class w/ BL and LIPO , but SO MANY of our racers were PISSED off at the quality and expense they had been incurring w/ NiMh battereies...so when they got WIND of what we were doing - THEY wanted in too.

A little over a YEAR later, I would say 95+ % of them are happy as clams w/ the change..and the redirection they got to have with their racing budgets. Most are still running the SAME pack or maybe their 2nd pack. MOST have not hurt their original if they are running a 2nd, they bought a 2nd to have a spare.

NEED for overnight change? In some areas...maybe not, in other areas it has made racers HAPPY or at least HAPPIER. ( Can you ever really make a racer HAPPY?)

My advantage - 5 packs run mine and my sons 4 cars. I've had more, but rarely do they come out of the box...and on a few occasions when they did - it was to LOAN them to somebody.

BEFORE to run 4 cars on race day - I had 3 packs PER CAR, it SUCKED. Then when cells started going DEAD w/o warning in the middle of a race day....FRUSTRATING as HECK. I WASN'T LOOKING for LIPO - somehow IT FOUND ME!.

(My LAST NiMh puchase of 4200's were SMC's - in 3 months 2 of the 3 packs had at least ONE dead cell. The 3rd pack stayed AWESOME for 6 months. Then one week after it ran strong...it was DEAD.) I then bought some USED packs that were only a couple months old... they lasted me about the SAME amount of time. EVERY 4200 pack I had went bad in less than 6 months. 2 races a month = 12 races per pack (average) SORRY - that don't work for ME and/or MY budget.

i'm gonna take some wild guess(s)

#1 eliminates the avg joe from feeling he can't buy the 4 cell pack you are beating him with....


#2 just like brushless it gives the avg joe the fals hope of making that A main for once

#3 the avg joe feels like he needs to only buy one pack and be competitive all year long with it...

#4 cost...with a years worth of crappy nimh cells guys have a realy bad taste in there mouth and want something different and now!

#5 safety...20 cells exploded in the entire us...and once it gets on the net it grew to 3000000 nimh cells killing thousands of racers....bloody ugly mess

#6 they fit into all the other genres of racing...

#7 we will get new racers crossing over growing ovals numbers into the millions in just a few short weeks

#8 0 Maintenance no matching...no dis charge trays no balancing trays no dead cells

#9 less gear to haul around no dpd's no battery nurses

#10 it's new an it's cool.we need it now! we will figure out rules later

#1 eliminates the avg joe from feeling he can't buy the 4 cell pack you are beating him with....
Some may feel this way, but I doubt the majority, but people like to THINK that's a reason for the change

#2 just like brushless it gives the avg joe the fals hope of making that A main for once
I don't think MOST feel this way - but I do believe it has helped some (not all) who were incapable of BUILDING a strong BRUSHED motor become more competitive.

#3 the avg joe feels like he needs to only buy one pack and be competitive all year long with it... Nope - I think the AVERAGE JOE feel he can run as competitive as HE wants to be at his CLUB races with ONE to TWO packs.

#4 cost...with a years worth of crappy nimh cells guys have a realy bad taste in there mouth and want something different and now!
I would say there are a fair amount of people who would AGREE with that

#5 safety...20 cells exploded in the entire us...and once it gets on the net it grew to 3000000 nimh cells killing thousands of racers....bloody ugly mess
I don't think TOO many people looked at the change for SAFETY reasons....but they WILL be the first to SLAM the exploding NiMh's down the throats of those who TRASH Lipos.

#6 they fit into all the other genres of racing...

They are making their way into other racing - but don't really FIT anywhere yet...and ALL forms of racing are having their own debates on types, sizes and weights.

#7 we will get new racers crossing over growing ovals numbers into the millions in just a few short weeks
Very doubtful, OVAL will NEVER generate what it had as long as it's perceived that oval racers are ARROGANT and CONDENSENDING towards other types of racers...and as long as cars are hard for NEWBIES to understand and set up.

#8 0 Maintenance no matching...no dis charge trays no balancing trays no dead cells
They DO and WILL have their OWN issues...because RACERS will make Sure of this


#9 less gear to haul around no dpd's no battery nurses
My favorite - NO Soldering Iron , and a much smaller BOX of BATTERIES

#10 it's new an it's cool.we need it now! we will figure out rules later

Ok, that works... LOL



LOLOLOL

No offense taken, I like new goodies and most of the time I can afford them but there are a ton of guys who like racing for different reasons and can't afford to keep up with all the hype. Most here that know me know that not only do I race but I have run a track since 1992 so I am obligated to look at both sides of the coin. A lot of things that I advocate are not my personal preferences but they are preferences of the majority, the average racer who just likes to come play with their toy race car (some people see it that way) cook some brat's on the grill and hang out with their friends and watch the big dogs go at it. Some days (most race days) I like running with the big dogs but it's fun to run break out as well and just laugh, talk smack and generally have a good time without a care in the world about how me or the car does. It takes all kinds to make this hobby fun and we have fun so I guess it (whatever it is) is working. BTW watch out for Katf1sh and his beer lure, the thong thing is TRUE!:freak:Echeconee, no offense is sounding arrogant, you are calling as you see it. If you are for removing the "product showcase" from racing then the racing might as be on a simulator where all you see is the driving wheel.

One of the reasons why I race is that I want to see improvement in our race technologies. I can only see that when others are racing something different than me.

If you take away the product choices for racers to make, they will not know how to make choices when they are shopping for new race gear. They will end up letting someone tell them what they need to buy instead of taking the time and researching what they need to buy.

#5 14 packs at the last Snowbirds and that's just the ones I saw and I heard the number was more than double that from the rumor mill. i'm gonna take some wild guess(s)

#1 eliminates the avg joe from feeling he can't buy the 4 cell pack you are beating him with....


#2 just like brushless it gives the avg joe the fals hope of making that A main for once

#3 the avg joe feels like he needs to only buy one pack and be competitive all year long with it...

#4 cost...with a years worth of crappy nimh cells guys have a realy bad taste in there mouth and want something different and now!

#5 safety...20 cells exploded in the entire us...and once it gets on the net it grew to 3000000 nimh cells killing thousands of racers....bloody ugly mess

#6 they fit into all the other genres of racing...

#7 we will get new racers crossing over growing ovals numbers into the millions in just a few short weeks

#8 0 Maintenance no matching...no dis charge trays no balancing trays no dead cells

#9 less gear to haul around no dpd's no battery nurses

#10 it's new an it's cool.we need it now! we will figure out rules later

I would have to agree with a lot of the points Katf1sh made. Why now? Who knows, maybe it's just time for the change. Maybe the poor nimh crop for the last year coupled with the availability of a virtually maintainence free battery with longer runtime and better durability was too much to resist. I know I won't miss the nimh stuff of course I may be saying the same thing about lipo in 5 years, who knows.Just for fun - thought I needed the answer on this one:

Why the push for Lipo to replace Nimh now? And what is THE advantage?

well mike the same damn 3 guys are the only guys defending/pushing/talking/explaining?????


nobody else cares..that is until we ask them for 35.00 and tell them what "our" rules are! kinda funny in a twisted sorta way.......

Kat, because they don't responde to you, does not mean they don't care!

And they respond better if I told them?

Many don't care to respond unless they are being forced to change. Right now it is just open discussions of what would be a better direction for the rules. Untill the rules are written, most everyone one will keep quiet then complain that they were not involved with formulating the rules.

... a lot of guys won't respond because they don't want to be involved in the POLITICS of R/C, some will NEVER comment, instead they will just STOP showing up.

It's always a FINE LINE when working politics of ANY kind.

well mike the same damn 3 guys are the only guys defending/pushing/talking/explaining?????


nobody else cares..that is until we ask them for 35.00 and tell them what "our" rules are! kinda funny in a twisted sorta way.......

Well F1shy, I am not one of the three guys. I do care. I run the brushless/lipo combo in oval, onroad and off road. That is all I run now. NO 4c or 6c for me. Oval is and will be the exception to the rule in r/c. Everything has to be within specs or there will be a perception that the other guy has an unfair advantage.

I have three 3200 lipo batteries and a 5000 pack. My 3200 is for my 21.5/lipo, a touring car, and off road truck, the 5000 for my trans-am touring car. I made the switch to lipo after running 2-3 year old 4200 and refused to buy new ones. Lipos came the right time for me. No one forced me to switch, it was my choice. Before I race any of my cars at any track, I got the permission of the race director and other racers. The other racers came by and asked me what it was like and how I like it. I gave them my opinion. I raced our state on road series and it was moving towards lipo. I again gave my opinion on how I liked it. The off road and onroad crowd run 3200, 3600, 5000 lipo together go figure.

Well, enough of my rant. :wave:

My Rant Is For The 17.5 Class Not The 21.5 Spec Class.

Other than the MOTOR why should the 17.5 SPEC class have different rules than the 21.5 class?

with lipo 17.5 will become the top class and should be painted into a box by limiting the motor battery or speedo to one company there are to mainy great companies out there with great products to leave them on the outside looking in

Thank you Cliff~

Oh and Dave - the 17.5 class is the top class according to YOU?

Out here... the TOP dogs and the REGULAR dogs run it...

21.5 is growing pretty quick too, but 17.5 is the most WIDELY run class outdoors right now out here.

You want OPEN and FAST and Elite...run 10.5/OPEN all you want. (Like yours...that is MY opinion...)

all right then I've been reading this thread for awhile now so now I'll throw in my .02 of opinion.

LIPO is now in the stage that brushless was about 1 1/2 years ago as far as oval racing goes anyway, by that I mean deciding if its a good thing to switch to, getting guys that are happy with the current situation to switch to something new etc etc.

We the OVAL community are BEHIND the times as far as technology goes in comparison with other forms of r/c racing etc ...... dirt oval, on-road and off road ALL run lipos currently and everyone doesnt seem to miss NIMH batteries......batteries will need to be bought and updated regardless of type ......... otherwise I'd still be running my 1200sce Sanyo's in my Bolink Eliminator.

(BTW ALL batteries can be dangerous NIMH or LIPO so lets put that dumbazz arguement to bed for good )

I know LIPO is coming sooner rather then later but I'm also happy running 10.5 and nimh right now ....... ATTENTION LIPO RACERS OF THE CURRENT DAY THIS PARTS FOR YOU. I as a NIMH user are just as concerned with my wallet as anyone else ........ this is why I will wait and see how LIPO rules and what available batteries etc will be deemed legal when I Feel its time to switch over, this way I dont buy the wrong lipo pack to switch and then have to buy another because its either not available OR another track I want to run at doesnt allow that pack etc etc .......... this is very much the same arguement you guys have against nimh, you dont want to waste your money and either do I.

Right now......... as long as someone has found their niche in oval racing regardless of what battery type thats awesome. Purchase and use what suits you best personally for whatever reasons .......... it doesnt matter to me as long as you come out and race and support your local track.

I know this .......... we all used to race 6 cell nimh and 27brushed motors, we had fun racing, then some guys switched to 4 cell 19T motors, almost the same speed ....... I was like what the hell ? ........ I'm never racing that crap ....... when I finally did, I had fun .......... brushless came along I was like .....ok, lets see if this lasts ........ it took off, when I finally switched I was hooked ........ about the same speed as 4 cell 19T, no motor lathes etc etc needed anymore ....... guess what....I had fun...... when batteries and rules work themselves out enough that I feel my INVESTMENT to try lipo wont be need to be made again a little while after I but a lipo pack and apporopriate motor ......... guess what I'll race and have fun and not need all the stuff to massage my NIMH, cause by then I'll need some more new stuff for my LIPO pack .....lol.

How about this analogy ......... the rest of R/C is in the LIPO pool, us the oval racers, some guys are standing on the steps testing the waters and the rest of us are on the pool deck in a loung chair going, damn that water looks cold, I may drown if I go in...............lolololol.

Right now......... as long as someone has found their niche in oval racing regardless of what battery type thats awesome. Purchase and use what suits you best personally for whatever reasons .......... it doesnt matter to me as long as you come out and race and support your local track.


That right there is THE most important part...oh and the "Having Fun" part...

This part (The POLITICS ) isn't for the faint of heart

that water looks cold, I may drown if I go in...............lolololol.


i was thinking...where in the heck is that hot pool guy at? the pool needs to be skimmed ..it's full of garbage and dead leaves...:rolleyes:

or was i thinking someone peed in the pool? :woohoo:

or did i forget my thong?:p

or is the water so cold that there is severe shrinkage?:freak:


what was it you just said?

...I know LIPO is coming sooner rather then later but I'm also happy running 10.5 and nimh right now ....... ATTENTION LIPO RACERS OF THE CURRENT DAY THIS PARTS FOR YOU. I as a NIMH user are just as concerned with my wallet as anyone else ........ this is why I will wait and see how LIPO rules and what available batteries etc will be deemed legal when I Feel its time to switch over, this way I dont buy the wrong lipo pack to switch and then have to buy another because its either not available OR another track I want to run at doesnt allow that pack etc etc .......... this is very much the same arguement you guys have against nimh, you dont want to waste your money and either do I.....

This was my concern when I switched over. Luckily we have it good here in Florida. Our local racers were just tired of the battery situation and a few of us tried the lipo and liked it. FSEARA (Florida on road series)allowed it in the last Masters class and we liked it. Like I said previously, it was just good timing for me to switch over.
So far there are three tracks in Florida running 21.5/lipo. It started with the HW racers running the same specs. They inturn ran it at Stricklands with the same specs. Now MTR has a group running it with the same specs. All three tracks are on the same track (no pun intended). That's what we need in the oval community to take charge and set the standards as Florida oval racers have thanks to the race promoters/directors Mike Bean, Mike Boylan and George Ramos.

lucky enough for us boylan is leaning towards a mah limit for 17.5

joe 5% of oval racers can run 10.5 lipo and look good doing it...

a safe speed for me is 17.5/lipo that is the current speed i'm running now...

i have 0 interest in open mod..if i did i could care less about rules...


trailranger you are the MAN! i think it...you put it into words...a picaso of hobby talk!

In a perfect world 4cell 10.5 and LIPO 17.5 would be the same and run them together... looks like some testing needs to be done!!

In a perfect world 4cell 10.5 and LIPO 17.5 would be the same and run them together... looks like some testing needs to be done!!

One of the fast guys at our local cap tire track did a back-to-back run with a 17.5/Lipo and a 4-cell/10.5. He used a Reedy 5000mah Lipo which was almost the exact same weight as his 4-cell Nimh. The 17.5/Lipo combo ran about 2 sec faster over 4 minutes than the 10.5/4-cell combo. Also, he was not heating his Lipo pack at all, and just kept it in the car and repeaked. I'm guessing if he ran an SMC or Promatch 5000mah Lipo, wrapped in heating pad during charge, he would probably pick up a little more.

Not sure if this will apply to all tracks, but I felt it was good comparison. Same driver, same car, same weight, both runs within 30 minutes on the track so track conditions didn't change. Any others tried a similar test yet?

i like the idea that the reedy pack was almsot the same weight...that is a plus!

Same out west in "good cars" 17.5 lipo outdoors has been just a little bit faster than 10.5 4 cell cars,it's been getting better with the lipo cars getting them to turn.

One of the fast guys at our local cap tire track did a back-to-back run with a 17.5/Lipo and a 4-cell/10.5. He used a Reedy 5000mah Lipo which was almost the exact same weight as his 4-cell Nimh. The 17.5/Lipo combo ran about 2 sec faster over 4 minutes than the 10.5/4-cell combo. Also, he was not heating his Lipo pack at all, and just kept it in the car and repeaked. I'm guessing if he ran an SMC or Promatch 5000mah Lipo, wrapped in heating pad during charge, he would probably pick up a little more.

Not sure if this will apply to all tracks, but I felt it was good comparison. Same driver, same car, same weight, both runs within 30 minutes on the track so track conditions didn't change. Any others tried a similar test yet?

In my best Hogan's Heroes voice ......... "very IN-teresting" .