Well...has anyone thought about providing a service of Installing NEW Bearings and running Dyno, LCR and Rotor Readings for Brushless motors?

All of my motors still have the STOCK bearings in them...and a couple are starting to get noisy...so this idea popped into my head....

I have been doing this for quite awhile now for all my racing buddies. Bearings help more then one might think. The biggest thing is resetting the timing for max HP on the Dyno, usually all the motors I get have the timing cranked all the way up. I have yet to do a BL motor that made max HP with the timing maxxed.

1-2 watts on my turbo 45 isn't really noticed on the track.......3-4 watts is seconds......if geared correctly.


Brian Deel

Can i use the facts machine dyno to determine that too?

Ok, most know that I am returning after about a 16 year leave of absence. so if this is a stupid question then so be it.

If you use a Dyno to do brushless motors, Wouldnt you have to use a BL motor as a slave?

The reason, I say this is because I broke out an old tekin 900 dyno and looked at the difference from a stock epic stamped 91roar handout and a stock motor that was given to me recently.

the new motor pulls less amps and 67% more rmp's compared to the old one.

I was wondering with the slave motors being weaker are you truly obtaining good load numbers?

When I purchase that old tekin I believe I paid 80.00 for a calibrated slave motor. It was supposed to be a full tuned, I even once pulled it out and raced it. Not sure what they did to it at tekin but it was very close to setting a track record before going back into the dyno........

The fantom dyno does not have a slave motor.

But honestly i have no answer to your question.

I noticed the CE45 dyno does or looks like it does. that is why I was asking.

Fantom has a Brushless dyno in the works that should be out by the end of the year, January at the latest.

It doesn't really matter about the slave motor. Dynoing the motors is only for your own knowledge. With dynoing brushless motors you need to use a speed control, and every one of those will give you a different reading. Because there are so many variables with dynoing brushless motors you really can't compair numbers that easy with your buddies.

It doesn't really matter about the slave motor. Dynoing the motors is only for your own knowledge. With dynoing brushless motors you need to use a speed control, and every one of those will give you a different reading. Because there are so many variables with dynoing brushless motors you really can't compair numbers that easy with your buddies.

Exactly, it is for your OWN comparison. Also remember, if you are adjusting timing to find a "sweet spot" in a certain motor or speedo, allow all components to cool to room temperature before dynoing again. That way you will get more accurate numbers.

You don't need a brushless motor for the slave motor on the turbodyno. The main issues with dyno testing them is the high torque on on the 17.5 and 21.5 motors. It is really pushing the limit on what the slave motor can apply.

We are selling our brushless motors, (10.5, 13.5, 17.5, 21.5) dyno-tuned with the results included, along with rotor gauss measurement recorded.

Our Blueprinted Line Includes:

-Dyno Results Printout
-Rotor Strength (Gauss Measurement)

Ceramic Bearing Upgrade / Installation is also available for $20.

:thumbsup:

Todd Putnam
Putnam Propulsion
518-452-0422

nice job mr. putnam!

with danny putting gfx numbers on the lipos and putnam doing dyno labels for the brushless motors were right back where we left off,lol.

...........

Brushless/LiPo was going to eliminate what?? I forgot, LOL. :D

brushes and repeaking!

Oh, got it.

Brushless/LiPo was going to eliminate what?? I forgot, LOL. :D

Revenue that the tracks/shops make selling brushes,springs,motor spray, etc; that helped them pay the overhead for the tracks we all enjoy...as well as a bunch of tuning options... heh heh

:thumbsup:

I hear ya Todd!

I do not begrudge you one bit for having a motor service. I applaud it.

I just think it is ironic that when all of the "LiPo/Brushless" craze first hit that there was the propoganda that it was "going to even the playing field", "no more battery of the week", "end of the motor of the week" & "make things simpler".

Come on!! We are RACERS!! Anyone that thought for one second that the fast guys were still not going to be the fast guys or that suddenly because "little Joey" could not keep up that this was his "ticket" were just fooling themselves. Or that RACERS were not going to "tinker & tweak" until the end of time is just not living in reality.

Did you guys really think for one second that a "tester" for motors would not be developed? How long did it take Zubie to adapt a tool that has been used forever in Slot Cars to R/C?? A few months? How many batteries have already been available in LiPo? How many guys are popping them by trying all manner of weird things to charge them? Now there are rumblings about Fantom making a BL Dyno. Did you really think that these things were NOT going to happen?

I know I am stuck on this but IMHO, TOO MANY CLASSES.

21.5 LiPo
Open Mod LiPo or 6cNiMh

21.5 LiPo too fast for you? Take some gear out of it.

Done. :D:D:D

The above class suggestions are mentioned tongue in cheek. Although it would be cool to put the throttle finger back in the equasion don't you think?

There is NO MAGIC PILL.

We are selling our brushless motors, (10.5, 13.5, 17.5, 21.5) dyno-tuned with the results included, along with rotor gauss measurement recorded.

Our Blueprinted Line Includes:

-Dyno Results Printout
-Rotor Strength (Gauss Measurement)

Ceramic Bearing Upgrade / Installation is also available for $20.

:thumbsup:

Todd Putnam
Putnam Propulsion
518-452-0422

Todd,

What's the web link to purchase some of these? Went to your site and couldn't find where you were selling them or the prices.

Bill

Scott: Totally understood - no worries, no offense taken. I voiced many of those very points as well. Manufactured products=variables.

Bill: Kinda outgrew the old website, and our new one isn't finished yet. Feel free to call the shop M-F, 9-5 EST for details and ordering info...:thumbsup:

Todd Putnam
Putnam Propulsion
518-452-0422

Todd -- we need to get you guys involved in Nitro Pan. Talk about no battery issues!! A matched pack to us is one that looks good sitting in the car! :D

Once you go Nitro, you laugh at battery wars!

Todd how does the 21.5 motor compare to novak on the track? Has anyone out there run one yet? A couple of us tested a trinity based 21.5 this past weekend at easley and couldnt make it run anywhere close without making it super super hot. Anybody have any thoughts?

Thanks
Nick Bell

PS this wasnt a putnam motor

Since Scott asked how they compare on the track ... how do they compare on the dyno?

I hear ya Todd!

I do not begrudge you one bit for having a motor service. I applaud it.

I just think it is ironic that when all of the "LiPo/Brushless" craze first hit that there was the propoganda that it was "going to even the playing field", "no more battery of the week", "end of the motor of the week" & "make things simpler".

Come on!! We are RACERS!! Anyone that thought for one second that the fast guys were still not going to be the fast guys or that suddenly because "little Joey" could not keep up that this was his "ticket" were just fooling themselves. Or that RACERS were not going to "tinker & tweak" until the end of time is just not living in reality.

Did you guys really think for one second that a "tester" for motors would not be developed? How long did it take Zubie to adapt a tool that has been used forever in Slot Cars to R/C?? A few months? How many batteries have already been available in LiPo? How many guys are popping them by trying all manner of weird things to charge them? Now there are rumblings about Fantom making a BL Dyno. Did you really think that these things were NOT going to happen?

I know I am stuck on this but IMHO, TOO MANY CLASSES.

21.5 LiPo
Open Mod LiPo or 6cNiMh

21.5 LiPo too fast for you? Take some gear out of it.

Done. :D:D:D

The above class suggestions are mentioned tongue in cheek. Although it would be cool to put the throttle finger back in the equasion don't you think?

There is NO MAGIC PILL.


here here give that man a prize and i thought i was the only one who had the balls to say this on line

I just think it is ironic that when all of the "LiPo/Brushless" craze first hit that there was the propoganda that it was "going to even the playing field", "no more battery of the week", "end of the motor of the week" & "make things simpler".

I have not ran LiPo, but...um, I think all of those are TRUE about brushless.
Except, not sure about "no more battery of the week"....there hasn't been a battery of the week for like a decade now.

I guess it's a matter of perspective, if you believe everything you read on here then you might think you need a heap of rotors, a meter checker, inductance checker, and dyno to be fast, but that just isn't the case....they aren't a requirement to being fast. It has been proven.

I know several racers that have TQ'd and won big races or were in the A in 13.5 at the birds, like Kenny Roberts and Jason Nick, that don't use those gadgets.

They are good tools to learn more about what you have for a motor and great to mess with at home.

Just saying you don't HAVE to have them to be competitive, or win major races.


Did you guys really think for one second that a "tester" for motors would not be developed? How long did it take Zubie to adapt a tool that has been used forever in Slot Cars to R/C?? A few months? How many batteries have already been available in LiPo? How many guys are popping them by trying all manner of weird things to charge them? Now there are rumblings about Fantom making a BL Dyno. Did you really think that these things were NOT going to happen?

Tom -- No battery of the week? Ok how about month?

There have been "date code" wars forever. Also the "poppers" that were the NiMh. Then there have been several LiPos to hit the market, from different maH to "c" ratings.

I never stated you "had to have" any of the mentioned "gadgets", you did not have to have them to run brushed either, but it sure helped. It always helps to know what is the better of the things you have to race with, right?

I would venture to bet that the "top" racers at any race, definately a "major race" will have some way of testing their stuff.

It always helps to know what is the better of the things you have to race with, right?.

No, it doesn't always help.

Actually it often hurts racers because it detracts them from what is actually important....setup.

I would venture to bet that the "top" racers at any race, definately a "major race" will have some way of testing their stuff.

Wrong (I apologize for not knowing how to be nice about this). Like I said I know of a couple racers that made the A-main at the birds in 13.5 and only own one 13.5 motor, much less any of that stuff to test equipment. One finished 3rd.

Also, I TQ'd the first NEOT race and finished 2nd to Steve Salvas in the main, he was using a borrowed motor from the hobby shop. My CAR sucked and he beat me.
BUT MY POINT IS REALLY THIS....I borrowed a meter and checked my 4 rotors the week after out of curiosity....the (positive) numbers were 1258, , 1228, 1207 and 1166.....guess which was in my 13.5? yes the 1166. I put the 1258 in for the next neot race and didn't notice a difference.

Sorry to go off on you but it kills me when I talk to someone that hasn't raced in years and hear them say "oh I don't know about this brushless stuff all I hear is there just like brushed". All because they bought into the hype. (That they read on here).

I don't mean to take away anything from anyone that has a rotor checker or dyno.
I do think a dyno was a NECESSITY for brushed racing though (because the tolerances were FAR greater).....although after running BL, I wonder if the DYNO was taking MY mind off chassis setup back then.

Tom -- I do not take it as you going of on me, not at all.

If this is you going off, you are the most polite guy I have ever met on here!

I did not make my point well, I see.

My point is this, if anyone thought for one second that "gadgets" were not going to be invented or that a way to match LiPo's or test BL motors was only fooling themselves.

I will concede that at the start, with no way to test things, set-up was VERY KEY. It has always been. We just chose to "dyno-race" alot back in the brushed days. Me, Iliked brushed, I thought it was part of the game, to get your motor the best you could, now it is plug-n-play, for the most part.

FWIW, I only get a small part of my isight into the BL world from here. I have several very respected friends that race this and I trust waht I hear from them.

I do race BTW, not electric, Nitro. Setup is PARAMOUNT, so I get what you are saying. Again my point was not if it was needed, just that the "gadgets" were coming.

nickbell putnam motors are trinity based motors...and so far the trinity based 17.5 motors with the timming set at max on the motor fly and are every bit as good on the track with novaks or better...i can't imagine the 21.5 motors being that much different?

Some very good points about having additional tuning equipment.

No matter what source the power is, we will want to know what is the potiental amount of power it will make.

With the decline in brushed motor use, I'm glad Putnam has been able to offer an alternative service whether everyone wants it or not.

Tommy is right on the money. 12 years ago I cut out my own chassis out of a piece of grafite plate. I played with that chassis until it was on rails. THEN GOT STUPID! Turning better laps I started buying into what was sitting on the tables in front of the faster guys, chassis of month, dynos, zappers, lathes, juices, boxes of batterys! Know what, I forgot about what had made me better. Last season a friend wanted to jump back into a 2nd pan class that most of us were running. I dug out that old chassis from the bottom of the closet for him and put the set up from twelve years ago notes. Handed it to him and he blasted us off the track that night. On ride home that night we laughed at how foolish this game is. Money and gadgets don't put you in the A. Tinkering, knowing your ride, and practice do. Unfortantly I am now 11 years behind the curve!!