Was wondering what lipo pack guys are running with the 21.5 motor and how to gear it?

Was wondering what lipo pack guys are running with the 21.5 motor and how to gear it?

Team Orion or Team Peak 3200

w/ the Orion 3200 - fairly good size track- FLAT ASPHALT - Short Tires (about 2.20's) I believe we were geared about a 88/57 or 58

How about indoors 140 runline the rollout for 13.5 was 3.10 - 3.30 how close would that be?

How about indoors 140 runline the rollout for 13.5 was 3.10 - 3.30 how close would that be?

i was running pretty close to the same rollout as a 13.5 4 cell would run and it didn't seem to matter if it was a 140' runline or a 300 ' run line.

Is it the race spec 7.4 volt
In the carbon fiber case?
Also what charger are you guys using.
I have a duratrax ice that will charge lipo, is that ok.

I ususally drop my roll out by about .15 from 13.5 to 21.5 with lipo if that helps and I am equal to what the 13.5 was running.

most guys here at easley use the ice charger for their lipos and they work great. we have been charging at 2c without any problems thats 6.4 amps. as for gearing becareful we have found that every motor is different depending on how your car goes through the corner. A free car can handle more gear than a car thats tight so spend the time on the chassis and the motor will run cooler and be happier.

nick

250ft. flat asphalt-4.20- 4.30 rollout
210 ft. flat asphalt-3.75-3.85 rollout
300 ft.banked cap tire track-4.85-5.05 rollout
178 ft. flat carpet track-3.45-3.60 rollout

using orion 3200,which most clubs run

there ya go-info from fast effecient cars.

The battery you want is called "Race Spec" from Orion or Peak Performance, it is the battery in the carbon fiber look case. When setting up your ice charger tell it that you have a 6400 mAH battery and it will allow you to charge at 6.4A (or 2C).

You also should balance the battery on a regular basis. I use the thunder power balancer and I built an additional charging lead that has the balancer tap built in. When a battery is new the balancer does a lot of work, but the more you use it the less work the balancer seems to do. I balance mine every time cause its easy.

Bob

This is new for me so.....
What does the balancer do and is it used at the same the charger is in series?
Just need the right info so mistakes arent made.

In The Orion Spec Packs There Are Two Cells. When You Charge Them One Of The Cells May Take A Better Charge Than The Other. With A Balancer In Line It Will Make Sure That Both Cells Get A Full Charge. I Haven't Balanced Mine Since Their First Charge And They Are Very Strong But I Could Balance It Any Time Just To Make Sure. On The Orion Packs And Ones Like Them They Have Three Holes. One Hole Is Positive The Other Is Neg. And The Middle Hole Can Be Either. To Single Cell Them Hook Your Pos. Side To The Pos. Charger And Use The Center For Neg. When That Is Charged Disconnect Both Wires And Reconnect The Pos. Charger Side To The Center Hole And The Neg. Charger Side To The Neg. Battery Side. This Will Fully Charge Both Cells Balancing Them. I Have Found That A Male Tamiya Pin Fits Fairly Tight In The Center Hole.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by MIDWESTRC http://www.hobbytalk.com/bbs1/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.hobbytalk.com/bbs1/showthread.php?p=2368232#post2368232)
LD, Does Greenfield hobby have the Checkpoint lipo balancers in stock? I will be down there this weekend, just wondering. Thanks

I'll just mention this one more time here -- you do NOT need a balancer.

I have a Checkpoint balancer and I NEVER use it -- if anyone wants it, it's for sale -- it's brand new, I just have no use for it. If anyone wants it, PM me.

I have found that the best "care and feeding" of the Orion LiPo is to do as little as possible. Here is what I do after each weekend of racing (I do not do ANYTHING between races -- just recharge it):

1) check the individual cells in the pack with a good volt meter.

2) if the cells are more than .08V apart, then use my CheckPoint 1030 charger to charge each cell individually. If they are not more than .08V apart, then do NOTHING.

3) put the pack back in the pit box for next race.

Ditto..

I'll just mention this one more time here -- you do NOT need a balancer.

...

1) check the individual cells in the pack with a good volt meter.

2) if the cells are more than .08V apart, then use my CheckPoint 1030 charger to charge each cell individually. If they are not more than .08V apart, then do NOTHING.

...


But why do manually what the balancer does for you automatically? All a balancer does is monitor voltage on each cell and direct the chargers current flow accordingly to allow the cells to equal out.

The same thing you are doing by hand with a volt meter and individual cell charging.

Every few weeks, throw the balancer in-line during your charging cycle and you're good to go. Fast, easy and foolproof.

I wondered that myself. I guess for the lazy and/or less technically inclined the balancer is a good thing for a few extra bucks. For the guys who don't mind spending the time but don't want to spend the money, the manual way works just as well. I would think a balancer would suit someone who has a couple kids racing as well and time is at a premium with trying to keep up with fixing cars and keeping everyone charged and such.

Well, for me, the balancer is one more thing to buy, and one more thing to carry to the track. If I can do it manually with my GFX that I already own and already carry to the track, then why buy something else? I've run my 3200 pack quite a bit, and it's never been any more than .04 out anyways.

Fair enough. But for someone just getting into LiPo, I personally think recommending any method other than a balancer just doesn't make sense.

Once they are comfortable with it, sure the manual way works fine.

I would probaly start off with the balancer and see how it works out.
Thanks for the info for a newbee. Are you also charging in a lipo charge back or is it a track owner preferance?
How many times do you have to charge the pack in a race night?
I have heard that you could run all three heats without a charge.
Is it true or false?

bart,check and see how much mah you are using on a run,minus that from the mah of the pack and see if there is enough to make another run or all 3 heats..
i've seen offroad guy's do it charge every 2 rounds.
personally racing oval i discharge after every run and charge right away,lipo's like a little heat.
Note after 30 runs,discharge cycles,my orions were only off a few hundrendts..

Our local clubs require a sack

Usually track preference on LiPo sacks. I actually charge mine in the car so I don't have to un-tape it, but there are many that frown on that.

A 2S pack will not drift out of balance as fast as a 2S2P (higher capacity packs) will. My MaxAmps have to be balanced nearly every charge cycle. My Orion can go weeks and only be .04 off. I do it as a matter of LiPo common practice though.

For oval, you'll want that pack to be fresh each run. Voltage still drops over the pack cycle, so if your voltage is down, you'll run slow. You can charge it as many times as you need in a given night.

I also don't ever discharge mine. I'll run it down in the car, but as soon as it starts to slow or the voltage cut-off kicks in, pull it and recharge it. Don't ever run it down flat or lower than 3v per cell (6v for the pack)

Thanks for all the info guys.

EEEk Those rollouts are very high for 21.5 lipo whoever just mentioned that. Hobbyworld in Jacksonville Florida is a Slight Banking 350ft run line asphalt track. 4.0 rollout is about the highest Ive ever been. Usually somewhere between 47-50t pinions and an 88 spur with 2.15-2.25 tires. With that rollout were running 6.0 and 6.1 second lap times up front and 6.3-6.4 second laps out the back, and Considering the 10.5 class is running 5.8-5.9s up front I think were pretty close on the gear.

Ryan- proven rollouts from fast guy's ,effecient cars..

I'm running a few 5.8s and 5.9s up front until around lap 7 or 8 and ending with 6.2s. Concrete banked oval. 365ft runline. Spec cap tires. 4.78 rollout. Motor is coming off the track around 140 degrees. This is with a 21.5/LiPo.

I'm running a few 5.8s and 5.9s up front until around lap 7 or 8 and ending with 6.2s. Concrete banked oval. 365ft runline. Spec cap tires. 4.78 rollout. Motor is coming off the track around 140 degrees. This is with a 21.5/LiPo.

Thats hard to believe. Dose banking make that much of a difference. What is the ambient temp where you race.

Stoney, banking make a HUGE difference, with banking your car exits the corner at a much higher speed and more freed up than on a flat track. So the motor does have to work as hard to accelerate on the straights.

stoneman it was about 70.

It had cooled down to low 70's or so.

Those runs were done after it got dark, so the track cooled down quite a bit. He had 2 laps up on me easy...but I got something for him on the way ;)

Our 21.5 class had a new record set on the velodrome this past Sunday.

820 ft. track in 10.2 seconds fast lap time (2 years ago, you'd have LOVED those speeds in 4 cell mod)

The run was a 28/5:00.05 - by BUCK VanPATTEN (great run Buckaroo)

Oh and our 17.5/LIPO class set a new record too - going 31 laps

www.allstar-shootout.com
www.southwesttour.com

how much more snot is there with lipos then 4600s
?

So how do i set my Ice charger to stop discharging at 6.0 volts?I've never discharged my 1 lipo pack,and i balance every charge.

In your menu if your set up to charge a lipo go down to volt cut off and set it for 3.0 volts per cell and set the discharge rate....it wont let you discharge higher than 10 amps.

Lets get this back on top looks like some of us are going to need some more input on this hole lipo thing.

Bart,
How many people do you think will be running lipo at Marshall's this year? Also, what are we thinking rules may be for batteries? Looks like the 3200 is going away, maybe the 3400?

Chuck

Not sure Chuck I've heard a few might try it, we'll have to feel it out up there and see what the other tracks are going to do.

at marshalls i think it will just be whatever you guys decide to show up with and start the class. i have no idea about what everyone is running for the lipos, but i hope the class grows id love to join it! right now im not sure what class ill be running in the fall. somthing pan car thats for sure!

Get a turbo 35 or a gfx and get it upgraded. 12 amps baby wooohooo I think the ice only goes up to 3 amps?

As for 21.5 Lipo I ran it for the first time yesterday and had a blast. One battery all day I never even untaped it from the battery tray, more time to wrench on the sled!! I think that 17.5 is coming quick down in Fl.

Get a turbo 35 or a gfx and get it upgraded. 12 amps baby wooohooo I think the ice only goes up to 3 amps?

As for 21.5 Lipo I ran it for the first time yesterday and had a blast. One battery all day I never even untaped it from the battery tray, more time to wrench on the sled!! I think that 17.5 is coming quick down in Fl.


I knew it would be a matter of time before everyone gos lipo.

Never had it so easy racing!!!:woohoo:

Get a turbo 35 or a gfx and get it upgraded. 12 amps baby wooohooo I think the ice only goes up to 3 amps?

As for 21.5 Lipo I ran it for the first time yesterday and had a blast. One battery all day I never even untaped it from the battery tray, more time to wrench on the sled!! I think that 17.5 is coming quick down in Fl.

Up here the Mid West Tri-Clone requires a Lipo Sock for charging purposes. Therefore it has to come out of the car each time you charge. I'm sure more tracks will be doing this for safety reasons. Good Idea! :thumbsup:

What are all the facilities doing for tech? I heard of people overcharging the Lipos (btw, VERY DANGEROUS!!). Also, what does everyone think a proper battery is being that the 3200 will no longer be available?

Thanks,
Chuck

What are all the facilities doing for tech? I heard of people overcharging the Lipos (btw, VERY DANGEROUS!!). Also, what does everyone think a proper battery is being that the 3200 will no longer be available?

Thanks,
Chuck

SMC is coming out with a 3200 and others have 3200s available. I hope places to stick to the 3200 limit.

What are all the facilities doing for tech? I heard of people overcharging the Lipos (btw, VERY DANGEROUS!!). Also, what does everyone think a proper battery is being that the 3200 will no longer be available?

Thanks,
Chuck

First, a Volt meter is all that is needed to tech a lipo....8.44v is legal, 8.45v and above don't race that heat.....and if you bring it up again 8.45v and above you go home!!! simple.......

3200s are Available! If you would like to research tha available 3200 lipos start here!

http://www.roarracing.com/approvals/lipobattery.php

SMC is coming out with a 3200 and others have 3200s available. I hope places to stick to the 3200 limit.


SMC 28c battery should NOT be legal for the 21.5 Lipo class. 20C Max........

I'm just curious and don't want to start anything here but has anyone gotten a 21.5 motor that is just a turd. I can't seem to get any speed with mine on the two tracks I've had it on. My 13.5 car is no less than a half a second faster than my 21.5 car and my 13.5 car is running lap times similar to the others lipo cars maybe some quicker. at the two tracks here in Iowa we have been running the two classes together with pretty close times.

SMC 28c battery should NOT be legal for the 21.5 Lipo class. 20C Max........

where does it say that?

where does it say that?

It said it in my post!!!!!

How long will a battery last charging at 12 amps? Who will make the 1st 20 amp charger?

January 27th 2009 we will find out Mike.............lol



How long will a battery last charging at 12 amps? Who will make the 1st 20 amp charger?

How long will a battery last charging at 12 amps? Who will make the 1st 20 amp charger?
From what I have read it looks like a standard pack will last ~50-100 cycles. I would guess at 12A, that will get cut in 1/2 or so (~25-50 cycles).

Chuck