Pics brightened to bring out details -- standard issue Super G+ on the left, new chassis on the right and bottom.

Discuss:

http://photos.hobbytalk.com/data/500/MG-SGTOP-Web.jpg

http://photos.hobbytalk.com/data/500/MG-SIDE-Web.jpg

All armiture, all the time... Look at the size comparison...

Good job but why do we need 2 threads?

Good job but why do we need 2 threads?

I didn't want to bury the pics deep in a different thread and have anyone miss them, so I started the new one with a different header.

I'll add the brightened pics to the other thread too so we can all drool no matter which thread we are looking at. :roll:

I want one now!

skinny as a rail, nice long wheelbase. This is awesome, I can just imagine the versatility this will have while fitting bodies. 30s hot rod coupes will slip right onto this.

All armiture, all the time... Look at the size comparison...

It's an illusion. The clips and magnets of the Super G+ are hiding some of the armature. I'll bet the arms are the same size, but the motor mags on the new chassis are much shorter than the Super G+. If 10 to 15% of the arm is sticking out the top, it's probably sticking out the bottom as well, which is wasted space. This new car could get by with a much smaller diameter arm which could move the center of gravity in towards the middle more and could drop the motor mags lower in the chassis. It looks to be too much arm for the mags. Plus the mags extend way too far down past the bottom of the arm laminations, providing no real usable flux. It looks like the motor box could be 'revamped' a bit. Look at the gear box and tell me if the gear boss is even needed. It doesn't look like the nub of the pinion gear will ever contact it...

Lenny, it looks like the rolling stock is all just swapped in placeholders. The front axle appears to be from a tyco 440, and the rear wheels are obviously pinched off a turbo. That gearset also looks to be from a tyco 440. Whats wierd is the thing is riding ass-low.

the possibilities for custsom with this chassis is really exciting.
It's begging to power some lucky Hot Rod

the possibilities for cussom with this chassis is really exciting.
It's begging to power some lucky Hot Rodit IS exciting. It's time the HO market get's bit more 'realistic', with better detail, better interiors instead of flat panels that pass for seats... It would be cool to see an HO manufacturer create a sidewinder using a size 10 or 20 motor, which would open up even more of the platform space for real detail, creating HO 'models' like FLY creates for 1:32 scale...

I have a Dynamic HO car that has a sidewider... and it IS very cool. I think Rattaler's approach is even better. Are you familar with their chassis design? It's like an old Sizzler's car. Does anyone know what armature would have long enough poles on it so when it's sits inside a Tomy box motor, the poles would extend outside the box enough so rims can be put on them?

Also, why not a sliding wheel base? Fixed front end, with pick ups... but you adjust the wheel base from the middle, like a dining room table, or imagine a mini rail slider, like one that moves a drawer, turned sideways and flat. Tighten with a tiny screw when you'be got your wheels lined up... and you're good to go. Kinda like a mini 1/32 chassis.

It would also be easy to add swappable body clips, now the chassis can be made to fit on any hard body...AFX, Tyco, Life Like, Lexan. A chassis like that could even fit under T-jet bodies too. It would be a "one chassis fits all" .. well, kinda. As long as the body isn't thinner than the box motor turned sideways.

Man, I've been dreaming of this chassis design for years, I wish I were rich and could afford to build it.

I think Rattaler's approach is even better. Are you familar with their chassis design? It's like an old Sizzler's car.
I've seen Ed Bianchis design. He needs to swap the standard Tyco frame motor for a smaller motor that has the same power but is smaller and lighter.

Does anyone know what armature would have long enough poles on it so when it's sits inside a Tomy box motor, the poles would extend outside the box enough so rims can be put on them?

you can get any motor made with long enough 'dual shafts' if you want them. There are tons of motor companies that will do that kind of custom work cheaper than you would imagine.

My dream chassis would be a sidewinder too. If somebody knew of a decent off-the-shelf motor of the right dimensions it could be done.

My favorite inline AFX chassis is the G-Plus and this new one comes about as close to it as anything we've seen. I love the narrower profile but I am very concerned about the very long wheelbase leading to the production of even larger HO cars (larger than 1:64). We've been seeing, with the GT40s being a good example, that HO slot cars are tending to get larger rather than smaller in the quest for greater modeling detail. At some point the limitations of set track, especially Tomy, which hasn't gotten any larger in 40 years, are going to be something to contend with. At some point will current Tomy track become unusable with the newer "HO" cars?

Sources from RaceMasters have indicated that they will be producing a shorter wheelbase version. I hope that standard AFX bodies will mount on the shorter wheelbase model. (The bodies designed for the long wheelbase chassis will only work on the long chassis. This seems to follow the Turbo body model.)

All of the things Lenny mentioned about the motor and magnets are true. I too would have liked to see a smaller diameter arm, but even at discounted Chinese engineering prices developing an entirely new armature would have been a very expensive venture. One potential upside of the new AFX design is that the brush arrangement in the new AFX chassis matches that of the AutoWorld Super III, so we will potentially have a source of S3 spare arms through RaceMasters.

Great to see new investment in our hobby. Can't wait to see the final results appear in the sales channel. I hope some modern, authentic livery F1s are in the works.

The car looks Great. Can't wait to try it. This car could bring a whole new crowd into ho racing as well as please the longtime hobbyists. John Cukras should be congratulated on this one-- he has blended some new ideas with some old and the constraints of having to produce a car that seems to please the set demands as well as the aftermarket hunger for speed, handling and tinkerability. With the team of Cukras and Steve Russell working together, the body development and the rolling chassis should be free of the S3 problems. John tells me the prototype drives very nimbly with a light feel unlike say for example the heavier stuck feel of the turbo or SRT. Congrats again guys on a job well done.

No disputing the thoughtful design that went into this chassis, but I'm curious and intrigued about this statement:

This car could bring a whole new crowd into ho racing

How, why, and through what channels will a new chassis design bring a whole new crowd into the hobby?

Please, some details!

Indy car and f-1 enthusiast could get behind a more realistic offering. Also the weekly racing programs could offer a simple format to race with a good performing open wheeler to go along with the nascars. Seems a different crowd is drawn to the open wheelers. Who knows what promotions this may trigger.

My favorite inline AFX chassis is the G-Plus and this new one comes about as close to it as anything we've seen. I love the narrower profile but I am very concerned about the very long wheelbase leading to the production of even larger HO cars .

at 1.3'' wide I worked out that the 1.7'' wheelbase was very useful for lots of cars. In fact at that width an F1 car should have a wheelbase even longer than that so I don't see a problem.

Cars that don't need such a long wheelbase will be mounted on v2 of the Mega, and I guess lots of older Tomy and Aurora bodies will fit it.

As long as a 1.7" wheelbase works well with 12" and larger radius curves, I'm cool.

F1s!? I'm hoping we see some F1s, some real F1s. The Champ cars were a nice appetizer but some modern livery F1s would be a very satisfying main course. Bring 'em on.

Depends on Mr Ecclestone that one.

New Mega G chassis + DP01 body in white + Patto's decals = a "passable" modern F1 field w/o the machinations of ole Uncle Bernie!

John Cukras should be congratulated on this one--

John was involved with this chassis?

Cool. :thumbsup:

I don't know much about nothing, but I do think John should be given rock-star type status in regards to slot cars.

John was involved with this chassis?

Cool. :thumbsup:

I don't know much about nothing, but I do think John should be given rock-star type status in regards to slot cars.

Not only that...Steve took stock of what Gary Fast had to say as well...

You can bet Gary will be molding for that chassis as soon as he has one...

:thumbsup:

New Mega G chassis + DP01 body in white + Patto's decals = a "passable" modern F1 field w/o the machinations of ole Uncle Bernie!

It gets even better when you factor in that at least a couple of the resin casting crew are hoping to make F1 airboxes for the Panoz (and in due course wings etc), although it remains to be seen if they can do so quickly enough for our needs without having to resort to abusive emails and so on:dude:

Deane, you're a riot :thumbsup:

First, I would make sure I am not stepping on Steve's future lineup toes, but I would expect I will be on this like stink on stuff. This chassis is begging to get as many open wheel bodies out there possible, whether plastic or resin. I already have a (very rough) F1 version I did for the modified LL chassis.

I agree, that a great starting point, since the DP01 will be available in white, will be to fashion F1 style airbox, front and rear wings that will change the character of the DP01. The problem with transforming the DP01 to F1 is the thicker nosecone. The F1 is much more sleeker. Most likely, the best way to go is to hack up a DP01, or start a resin body from scratch.

As far as my direction, I would expect that I will be all over the '80-90's Indy car bodies. I will have to get my hands on a chassis to see what clearences there are for a low nose, as opposed to the high nose. Also the sidepods are a factor for correct Indy bodies. It looks good from the photo, but I would have to have one "in-hand" to see for sure.

Gary, I was not going to mention you by name, but it looks as if abusive emails will not be needed in any case :)

I would suggest an airbox release first, I would be happy to mod a Panoz with just that and then F1 decal it. This would sacrifice some realism for speed, but then you could release wings next, and in due course whole bodies.

I would buy some of everything!

I hopr they come with some cool bodies.The Nascar offerings on
the Super 3 and LLs are big, tall and ugly.

I like what Im seeing.

Here is another pic I edited:
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y131/racerx10990/MG-SGTOP-Web.jpg

Mike

New Mega G chassis + DP01 body in white + Patto's decals = a "passable" modern F1 field w/o the machinations of ole Uncle Bernie!

I agree; I've been thinking about the same thing. It will be nice to have a more realistic chassis to work with.

having a vision...the top runnerrs f-1 1982..prost, piquet,rosberg(dad),laffite,and of course gilles.i'll also need that marlboro chevron flashing round the track!!!bernie be damned!!

I hopr they come with some cool bodies.The Nascar offerings on
the Super 3 and LLs are big, tall and ugly.

I agree! and top heavy

Depends on Mr Ecclestone that one.

So ... let the negotiations commence!

Look at the 1:32 slot car market. They've got F1 nailed, so it can be done, and done with drool level precision. If HO slot car models are going to compete for attention and revenue at the levels currently attainable only by 1:32 scale then some high precision, authentic, contemporary and legendary body designs and racing liveries for the most popular forms of racing worldwide must be part of that equation. Names like Ferrari, McLaren, Mercedes, BMW, and Renault are instantly recognizable to most racing fans at all levels. I had to Google to figure out what a Panoz DP01 was. It's cool looking, but it's no Ferrari.

AfxToo, I agree that I would like to see the same level of choices that the 1:32 folks enjoy.

However, look at the players in that arena compared to HO. You've got Fly, Ninco, ScaleXtric, SCX, etc. They all can use similar technology with the use of can motors on a flat plastic chassis. There's just more space for all the chassis logistics to fall into place. I'm sure that's why it was easy for all the above to jump on the bandwagon. Along with all those players come the vast amounts of bodies to choose from. Now, along comes one man's company (AFX/RM) with a aggressive vision to market an open wheel chassis that will lend itself to other bodies. It required a chassis design all it's own, not unlike the Rokar M-chassis back in it's day. Make the "M" a longer wheelbase, and it was an open wheel gem. But, none of the HO'ers "loved" that chassis compared the the Tomy and older Tyco for racing reasons. And the bodies LikeLike produced???? What a joke as far as realism to say the least.

My point??? From the "styling" standpoint, we are at the beginning stages of HO evolution. Steve "IS the PIONEER" in this type of slot car production. He started with the realistic Collector Series, and is continuing from there. I don't think at this point in HO slot car history that all the current chassis producers are going to mass produce more realistic bodies. A-W had the chance to do it and has screwed the pooch out of the gate. Walther's has made new bodies, and they are producing the same style "Egg lumps" that LL did.

Lastly. If realism (aka:F1) and variety is what is being sought, then like Steve, the manufacturers have to take the chance of selling their products base on "killer looks" to entice the masses. With killer looks, we may get the minor scarifice from 100% efficiency. Getting back to the "M" chassis and it's low side armature magnets, once I extended the chassis it lent itself well to open wheel bodies. (see attachment) This was my only choice of chassis to get what I was trying to accomplish. That was realistic open wheel type cars. That's why I use the Tyco Pan for the longer wheelbase closed cockpit cars to get more realistic racers (see attachment) Like I said. Steve is the pioneer of manufacturers in thinking outside the box as far as mass production. Because if we stick to the slot car racer's mindset, we will be stuck with a 1.5" wheelbase forever. It's what they want for speed. The racers don't care if the body on their race car is a modern Ferrari or McLaren with the right proportions. They just care if there "is a body" on the chassis, but more importantly, how fast does their chassis get around the track on any given raceday. It's just their thing. NOW, have every HO manufacture come out with an extended wheelbase with realistic bodies that sell well to the masses, guess what the racers have to do? They will do what they do best. Find a way to make the new chassis go faster. When that all happens........ You've got the 1:32 scenario in HO. Everybody, as in all the racers, modelers, and manufacturers think just a little outside the box, then everybody wins. Just like 1:32.

Gar

(LT.-extended "M" to 46mm, RT.-Tyco Pan axle in LWB)

Fastlap
Love the Vette. Where can I get one?
Andy

AfxToo, I agree that I would like to see the same level of choices that the 1:32 folks enjoy.

Everybody, as in all the racers, modelers, and manufacturers think just a little outside the box, then everybody wins. Just like 1:32.

Gar


Gary,

Look at this

http://www.getyourwebsitehere.com/scratchbuilt/articles/images2005/RS_RailChas3.jpg

Can you image a neo magnet on the end (which would not have to be very big) with a small diameter motor. Snap that into a narrow plastic chassis with metal tabs to make contact with the motor brushes. Have the metal tabs have jumper wires off that go to a pick up assembly similar to a TJET that can be adjusted forward to accommodate different wheel bases where the pick up assembly, guide pin and front wheels all move together and you could have an inline slim-line that could fit any wheel base. Just an idea.

Take an old motor idea and modernize it :)

Roger Corrie

If you go to the 1/32,hard body,Scalextric based races,you see very
little open wheelers being used because of their performance and
reliability limitations.Slotcars need to look good and perform to make
it in the market place,exspecialy in HO.If the Mega-G comes with
good looking F1 bodies, it could revive open wheel slot car racing
in my area.I am looking forward to this new car more than I have
any new offering in years.

As much as I love the ultra realistic hardbody cars I would never race one. They are too expensive and break too easily. Even the so-so realistic current crop of LL, Tyco, and Tomy open wheelers rarely find their way on to the track, and my vintage G-Plus open wheel cars are effectively shelf queens. Unless replacement bodies are very inexpensive I don't see them being very useful at all for racing. Realism is cool, but unless it comes at an ultra low price it's going to be "Way Too Nice" to use. There's something to be said for toys that are still just toys. Am I missing something?

As much as I love the ultra realistic hardbody cars I would never race one. They are too expensive and break too easily. Am I missing something?


AFX2: I am not sure if your referring to stock hardbodies, or some expensive custom resin hardbody.

We recently added hardbody racing to our G-jets. For me, it was actually cheaper.

I dont enjoy painting, and most importantly, mounting lexan bodies. I can do it, but i dont enjoy it, and I usually spend $15 or more buying a ready to race lexan body. We change lexan bodies frequently, as each of our races usually has a theme (GTP, Porsche, TransAm, etc).

For our last F-1 hardbody race, I got a new Champ car body from Bud for $8 plus shipping, and I shared shipping with 3 other guys, so my cost was $10, less than if I had to buy a painted but not mounted lexan from Slotpro.

Despite a rather spectacular crash during the last lap of the race, in which I single handedly cost the 1st place driver his 1st place by driving him into the wall, allowing the second place racer to move up, my hard body survived the race undamaged. I finished 4th. Fortunately, the first place loser still talks to me.

I love hand painting lexan bodies that I buy for around a buck each. It's very therapeutic and I'm totally cool with a hand painted lexan body that looks like it was hand painted by someone who finds painting lexan bodies therapeutic. It takes me less than 1 minute to prep and cleanup so using a spray gun has never been a priority or a desire. Heck, I can and do a little painting while I'm eating breakfast. I get plenty of compliments on my work, but even if I didn't I would not care one little bit. I find no joy in buying professionally painted bodies, and the ones I've won end up as gifts or race prizes. To me, buying a painted body is like paying someone to drive my slot car.

It's all about playing where you feel most comfortable and find the greatest personal reward. I'm awestruck by some of the 1:32 cars I see, especially the F1s, but if I bought one it would never see the track if there was any danger of a wreck.

I agree that paying $5 - $6 for a hard race body is totally acceptable and have no problem with doing so as long as it is not the only one in my collection. I have plenty of hardbodies that have seen serious track time, but those are bodies that I've deemed to be less than showpiece material. The open wheeled bodies just don't stand up to the kind of abuse that racing presents. Those little wings are doomed.

The open wheel bodies are more delicate,but with a little super glue
getting a season out of one is not impossible.Maybe a series that
requires a DNF in a race that you break a body,or a green light pit
stop to repair the body would encourage better driving.

Looks like I can get a batch of ceramic traction magnets made for about $3 a pair, including a small profit for my club. Who wants some? :)

Out of what material? C8,C8B,or C10?

Out of what material? C8,C8B,or C10?

C8

whats in a Tyco?

Chinese C8,not quite as strong as the magnets from BSRT,
Slottech or wizzard.

Pretty sure what I am being quoted is chinese C8 and C8B, even though the company is a UK one. I understand (just about!) the differences between 8, 8B and 8C, it's not a simple matter of strength. What the comparison between C8 and C10 as it would relate to use in slotcars?

With the C10 you get the BH max of the C8B but retain
the permability of the C8.You have to order a bunch though
and it won't be cheap.I have been pursuing this holy grail for
years,I hope you do better than I have.

Done some digging and it seems C10 will be too rich for me too. C8B should be good enough, but at lot depends on the chassis layout....

AFXToo:Im in there with mking,I too hate fiddling with lexan bodies and tape and all that stuff.

I read what this guy thats doing the chassis says on the other forum.He seems to have a pretty good handle on whats up and what we all want.

Something tells me that these open wheel cars are going to be a few levels above the cheesey Tomy bodies we've all been smashing to bits for all these years.

MAybe something that is removable or break away.

Montoya:With all due respect,isnt it kind of soon to be looking to have magnets made for a car thats not even finalized yet????Unless you know something I dont???


Mike

Despite a rather spectacular crash during the last lap of the race, in which I single handedly cost the 1st place driver his 1st place by driving him into the wall, allowing the second place racer to move up, my hard body survived the race undamaged. I finished 4th. Fortunately, the first place loser still talks to me.

Thanks bro', love ya! :thumbsup:

Montoya:With all due respect,isnt it kind of soon to be looking to have magnets made for a car thats not even finalized yet????Unless you know something I dont???


Mike

No.

White text

Found this chassis on my display shelf the other day. Mike King found a pile of these Super lll prototypes last year and they were handed out as Gag door prizes at one of Marty B's thrash and bash events.

Note the sleek styling potential provided by a single mag and flux collector.
Metal gears run about 1 decible lower than my 024 Stihl but have a nice mesh. Motor brushes are a high tech solid wiper affair that wont back out when the pessure is on.

Also notable is the snap in rear axle...well ahead of it's time.

There's a small "T" trademark just visible on the frame...Tomico? anybody?

Need pick up shoes! anybody hook me up? I would like to do a head to head comparo with this years release.