Does anyone collect old Marklin 1/43 from 1950s - 1970s?

See their RAK range at this very nice site:
http://www.erichs-modellbahn.de/maerklin_h0/Autos/autos-rak.htm#teil2

What did they plan for 1827 and 1836? I have always wondered?

Karl
(newbie)

Anyone have the new 1/43 reissues from 2009?

http://www.rocousa.com/detail.asp?product_id=18103
http://www.tototrains.com/2009marklinreplica.htm

Prices are $$$! Yoazaa!!

These modern re-issues are available in my local Railway hobby store priced at 249dkr each - not cheap but their wheels do look cheap and plasticy instead of the wonderful original tin hubcaps. I think the whole set of 12 is over the top.I will not buy any of these as I have a mib original Capri ,a fine Pilen Opel Manta which is a better effort than the Marklin, and solido BMW2002 which is good enough and dont like the Audi at all so find it easy to ´leave in the store............

I think that 1827 would have been a Porsche 916 - odd to make only the 4 cylinder version instead of the glamourous 6 but then the expense of a new engine casting was deemed not worthwhile.
1836 could be a new tool which was never completed or more likely it was the another version of the Opel Manta - it came with twin round lamps or rectangular ones, both versions could have been made, or a race version

Did someone post some where recently that Märklin had their 1/43 RAK cars made in Italy by Mercury? Is that a rumour, or is there a reference to that? I would like to learn more details about the arrangement, as I wrote an article for MAR UK a loing time ago about the RAK series...

Did someone post some where recently that Märklin had their 1/43 RAK cars made in Italy by Mercury? Is that a rumour, or is there a reference to that? I would like to learn more details about the arrangement, as I wrote an article for MAR UK a loing time ago about the RAK series...

That was me Karl. I first read about in Model Auto Review before your article was published. It has since been confirmed from a toy fair dealer whom I have known for many years.

Here are a few reasons why this could be true:

Mercury and Märklin had a close working relationship before WWII. Mercury where the official importers into Italy for the Märklin train sets. One of the first Mercury die-cast vehicles issued in 1945 was a copy of one of Märklin's 1930's designs.

Märklin's 'new' die-cast vehicle 8000 series were introduced in the early 1950's. Some items from this range even lasted into the mid '70's. However, despite the quality of the 8000 series castings they were obsolete by the early '60's. Why didn't Märklin update these at this time?

I have a Mercury Chaparral in a Märklin box so it appears that there was still a relationship between these two firms in the '60's. I doubt that Märklin had the capacity or the funds to bring out a brand new die-cast range.

They had already bought out a slot car system to try and take on world leader Tr-ang's Scalextric and their German rivals - Carrera. But they put this onto the market at a time when interest in slot car racing was waning. Why would you change system anyway? Unlike today when all the slot track available can be used with Scalextric track that was not the case in the '60's.

I reckon they went back to their core business - model railways and try to keep afloat. So they offered the tender to Mercury to make on their behalf a series of die-cast cars and kept some of their older 8000 series commercials to bolster the range.

The 1800 series didn't last long because Mercury hit problems and went bust. Without Mercury around the 1800 series almost suddenly disappeared. If Märklin had the capability to produce these models why didn't they bring out new models after Mercury's exit?

Cheers Chris

Chris has made a plausible case.
And I think that it is likely that some parts, including the diecast bodyshell, were likely subcontracted out to a trusted partner like Mercury.
However, the legend ´Made in Western Germany´ would have been an unthinkable lie had not at least final assembley of the components into toys taken place in Germany. Secondly, looking at the finish of Marklins, clues like the baseplates with the gun tone finish suggest a connection to whatever factroy made Gama 1/43 through the 1970s and 1980s.Also the paint quality, very thin but extremely high quality coverage of metal, this is nothing like the thick glossy Mercury paint but it is like Gama paint right through the 1970s and 1980s. I dont know the relationship between Gama and Marklin but they are both German, use the same kind of painting gear and the same material finish for their baseplates, and unlike all other brands from those days, both Gama and Marklin perfected the art of casting the opening parts realistically scale thin without any prohibitive wastage at the foundary, unlike well known Corgi and Dinky and Lesney who cast all opening parts in rather thick metal to give shape keeping strength during the production process.
I think the cancellation of the Marklin 18xx series was more to do with the agreement with their production partner and the huge decline in the premium diecast market that hit Dinky and Corgi very hard in the mid 1970s turning their new products into crude 1/36 scale toys targeted only for kids aged 3-8.
The rather thick paint and gray plastic wheels on this new expensive re-run of 4 Marklins makes them look like some other knockoff brand to me.And I thought all car guys world over knew that if you put cool wheels on any old bomb then its much much easier to sell.:tongue:......wheels and paint let these new Marklins down................

IF GAMA and MARKLIN turn out to have been made in the same factory or even owned by the same people then the reason for dropping Marklin diecast is clear. Gama survived the 1970s market collapse simply by specialised making diecast primarily for sale through car dealerships by the manufacturers of the 1:1, with the automakers commissioning each model and likely paying for the tools so no risk to Gama of unsold stock.

Perhaps similar to Chris' Mercury-in-a-Marklin box, here is an Alfa Canguro sold by Marklin in Germany:
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm12/kschnelle/other_diecast/MercuryMarklinAlfa.jpg
It has the speed/whizz wheels so dates to 1971+, I think.

I tend to think that Marklin made their own 1800 series because:

1. Their HO locomotives from 1968 were crisp castings, nice paint, flat black baseplates, similar printing to teh RAK series, whcih points to Marklin doing the molds.
http://oskosk.homeip.net/marklin/image/marklin3021_0001_small.jpg
source: oskosk.homeip.net/marklin

2. The Mercury and Marklin castings/baseplates/wheels are very different. Perhaps Marklin made the molds and subcontracted the production to a 3rd party like Mercury.
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm12/kschnelle/other_diecast/MarklinUNIMOG-1.jpg

3. Chris and Mick - do you want to split the Euro160 cost of the Mercury book? [gasp] http://mercury.cortinalibri.it/mercury_index2.html That may tell us the answer? :-)

Just my opinions - perhaps Chris or Mick are more on the ball than me, who knows?

Sorry Karl, thats way too much money for a delightful if obscure brand in my collection. Teknos imported Solidos in the 1960s and added Tekno stickers to the boxes to compete mostly with Corgi and Dinky in Scandinavia, and quite possibly Solido may have sold Teknos in France if they swapped toys rather than cash! However they used their own tools in their own factory. Offering more glamourous Mercurys alongside Marklin in German shops would help strengthen the Marklin customer loyalty if anything, and who is to say that Marklins were not sold in Italy as Mercurys to balance the deal?

... Teknos imported Solidos in the 1960s and added Tekno stickers to the boxes to compete mostly with Corgi and Dinky in Scandinavia, and quite possibly Solido may have sold Teknos in France if they swapped toys rather than cash!
Yes, Solido did market Teknos in France:
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm12/kschnelle/tekno/teknosolidop2.jpg
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm12/kschnelle/tekno/teknosolidop1.jpg

Perhaps similar to Chris' Mercury-in-a-Marklin box, here is an Alfa Canguro sold by Marklin in Germany:
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm12/kschnelle/other_diecast/MercuryMarklinAlfa.jpg
It has the speed/whizz wheels so dates to 1971+, I think.

I tend to think that Marklin made their own 1800 series because:

1. Their HO locomotives from 1968 were crisp castings, nice paint, flat black baseplates, similar printing to teh RAK series, whcih points to Marklin doing the molds.
http://oskosk.homeip.net/marklin/image/marklin3021_0001_small.jpg
source: oskosk.homeip.net/marklin

2. The Mercury and Marklin castings/baseplates/wheels are very different. Perhaps Marklin made the molds and subcontracted the production to a 3rd party like Mercury.
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm12/kschnelle/other_diecast/MarklinUNIMOG-1.jpg

3. Chris and Mick - do you want to split the Euro160 cost of the Mercury book? [gasp] http://mercury.cortinalibri.it/mercury_index2.html That may tell us the answer? :-)

Just my opinions - perhaps Chris or Mick are more on the ball than me, who knows?

:thumbsup:Great Post Karl !
These diecast pieces were so heavy and beautiful in terms of construction they have and will stand the test of time.
As We collectors and admirers of these pieces collect and buy,The re-edditions like Atlas Dinky , Norev, are nostalgically remaking many of these greatly loved older issues again.
Their simplicity and sturdy construction give them the iconic collectability the so richly deserve

Perhaps similar to Chris' Mercury-in-a-Marklin box, here is an Alfa Canguro sold by Marklin in Germany:
http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm12/kschnelle/other_diecast/MercuryMarklinAlfa.jpg
It has the speed/whizz wheels so dates to 1971+, I think.

3. Chris and Mick - do you want to split the Euro160 cost of the Mercury book? [gasp] http://mercury.cortinalibri.it/mercury_index2.html That may tell us the answer? :-)

Just my opinions - perhaps Chris or Mick are more on the ball than me, who knows?

That's the box type I have for Mercury's Chaparral 2J Karl. Now why would Marklin bother to make and print special boxes for Mercury products? Just a sticker on an ordinary Mercury box could have sufficed.

Talking of Chaparral's I have both Marklin and Mercury versions of a 2F and they are totally different models. So there goes that theory!

Cheers Chris