When Novak first released the 13.5 brushless motor, their web site said they had done "extensive testing and research to develop a 27T brushed equivalent". They have taken that down, but there are still 2 web pages that are touting the 13.5 as a 27T equivalent.

"SS13.5 Pro Stock Brushless Motor (http://www.teamnovak.com/products/brushless/sspro_motors/index.html) is 13.5 turns and similar to a 27-turn racing stock brush motor (#3413)"
"EX13.5 Extreme Sport Brushless Motor: (http://www.teamnovak.com/products/brushless/ex_motors/index.html) 13.5 turns; similar to a 27-turn stock brush motor (#3432)"

Well, Novak really dropped the ball on their so called "extensive testing". How little testing did they really do? They must have never geared up during their testing. You would think that would be common sense to try. Even their dyno showed 195 Watts of power (http://www.teamnovak.com/products/brushless/motor_spec_chart.htm) at 7.2V, whereas a perfectly tuned 27T brushed will only produce around 130 Watts of power at 7.2V.

Anyway, I've reading reports that the 17.5 (when geared properly) is also a little faster than the 27T brushed. Who has had experience running the 17.5 with 4 cells?
Has anyone tried the 18.5?

When Novak first released the 13.5 their web site said they had done "extensive testing and research to develop a 27T brushed equivalent". They have taken that down, but there are still 2 web pages that are touting the 13.5 as a 27T equivalent.

"SS13.5 Pro Stock Brushless Motor (http://www.teamnovak.com/products/brushless/sspro_motors/index.html) is 13.5 turns and similar to a 27-turn racing stock brush motor (#3413)"
"EX13.5 Extreme Sport Brushless Motor: (http://www.teamnovak.com/products/brushless/ex_motors/index.html) 13.5 turns; similar to a 27-turn stock brush motor (#3432)"

Well, Novak really dropped the ball on their so called "extensive testing". How little testing did they really do? They must have never geared up during their testing. You would think that would be common sense to try. Even their Dyno showed 195 Watts of power, whereas a perfectly tuned 27T brushed will only produce around 130 Watts of power.

Anyway, I've reading reports that the 17.5 (when geared properly) is also a little faster than the 27T brushed. Who has had experience running the 17.5 with 4 cells?
Has anyone tried the 18.5?

The 13.5 is actually much more comparable to a stock motor in offroad and road course applications, which is where a lot of that came from. Also, when they first first released the 13.5 it did not come with a sintered rotor which put it closer to stock.

For all intensive purposes I'd say the 17.5 is equal to a good stock motor. A bit slower up front and a bit quicker at the end.

Novak does not make a 18.5.

I'm sorry, but I've tested the 13.5 on road course and it's much faster. I can only assume that for offroad, it's not as noticeable because you can't lay down the power as well?

Novak has made an 18.5 for a long time. You can see the 18.5 here. (http://www.teamnovak.com/products/brushless/3419_crawler_sintered_motor/index.html) Marketed for the crawler community, but it's the same technology as all of the other motors in their line up.

I forgot about the crawler thing. They recommended not using it for oval.

At the ovalmasters last weekend Jody TQ'd at 55/403 in brushed stock. The 17.5 TQ was 54/403. But I'm guessing if Jody had run 17.5 he probably would have run real close to the Stock TQ.

James35

I guess Novak just royally screwed up......

I apologize.

The 17.5 like pat said. A very well tuned brushed motor is a tad faster at the beginning of a run but towards the end of a run the 17.5 does not fall of and is a bit faster then a brushed so there is a close comparison but overall a 17.5 is faster then a run of the mill stock brushed motor but not by much.

James35,

These are the qualifying results from the MASTERS last weekend...and when we were testing the NEW crop of motors we found similar. Someone noted that the 13.5 when the original press release came out....was a NON SINTERED rotor...and that does make a HUGE difference.

MASTERS QUALIFYING

54 laps in 17.5 4.30 fast lap
55 laps in STOCK 4.20 fast lap
58 laps in 13.5 4.00 fast lap
61 laps in 10.5 (with a 4:00) 3.79 fast lap
66 laps in MODIFIED (with a 4:00) 3.49 wicked fast lap

James35

I guess Novak just royally screwed up......

I apologize.

Naaaah not really, when I first started running 13.5 I was just a little bit faster than my best stock times......but now that I,ve had some time to really work on what makes a car Fast Its alot faster!!!
Thanks for a great product! I think my 13.5 is great! My 17.5 is fun/stock speed and I cant wait to run a 21.5 Lipo race :)

Why is everyone so into making a BL motor equal to a brushed motor? We have been running the 5800 (8.5 ) since 2003 and built the class around that motor for our pan cars. It was the first motor and we were told it was like a 19t with 4 cells. The 4300 (10.5) was sold as a stock motor. I can't fault Novak for making these claims. We have 13.5 for novice, 4300 for most and the 5800 for the original crowd. Since the motors have been built for about 4 years now the 13.5,17.5 and 21.5 have showed up. They built an excellent product and are second to none for customer support.

Ken,

Being I've been a strong force pushing for these new speed motors...I can tell you it's inpart due to needing a B/L motor that is the speed racers feel comfortable with.

Not all drivers are comfortable with FAST cars...and would like to be able to run Brushless too.

Personally, I stayed away from brushless for over 3 years because at the speeds they would run - I didn't feel they were the right direction for OVAL racing.

Once we were able to find the right combinations to offer speeds similar to the classes we already had...the table changed.

The 17.5 class at the Ovalmasters had a alot newer racers (welcomed site) but was a tad quicker on the straights than the 4 cell stock class it is compared to. No doubt with more experience that the 17.5 qualifying results would be better than the stock class, atleast at this track.

Even more so than this, decent 13.5's were "hard to pass" with 10.5's on the straights.

Regardless, the 17.5 class had the guys who bump walls every couple laps, which is perfectly fine, that is the right class for their ability. Had the class been filled with the more experienced crowd, probably would have never seen these guys run at all. No matter how close the classes are, leaving the beginners class to the beginners works.

No matter how close the classes are, leaving the beginners class to the beginners works.

So true!

Good job on your 10.5 win.

I forgot about the crawler thing. They recommended not using it for oval.
Where did you see that? It's my understanding that the 18.5 is identical technology to the rest of the motor line up, it's just been marketed for the crawler community.

Where did you see that? It's my understanding that the 18.5 is identical technology to the rest of the motor line up, it's just been marketed for the crawler community.

The Crawler is the same but doesn't have thermal protection like the rest.

...the 18.5 was actually the direction I wanted to go with the slower motor deal...because it was a product NOVAK was already making. A couple of racers tested it (even though it didn't have the thermal shutdown) and it was actually faster than the speeds we were looking for (That was tested with LIPO) and NOVAK informed us about the thermal deal...and said they would make us a 17.5.

I personally like simplicity, and the LESS products the better...which is why I liked the 18.5 idea...although I love the 17.5 too.

I see the NEW 21.5 also has a Crawler version too...that to me was a good move.

has anyone tried the 21.5 with crawling?

...I don't know anyone who crawls...except after LOSING a big race...and then leaving the Bar~