140168899594 (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=140168899594)

I assume this is a fake one as nobody has placed bids on it....

I remember to have read somewhere here a good explanation on painted Aurora to detect the counterfeit, but haven't retrieved it (it was maybe done by Georges Warner, but not sure...)

Zanza man,

Although I'm not an expert I'm gonna say yes. Pics arent very good but the striping appears waaay to fresh when compared to the over all wear on the other painted surfaces. It could be a trick of the camera as well. The roof however is a different shade altogether.

Rear bumper looks awfully fresh, the individual red lense detail looks too good! The pony on the front bumper looks very bright and does not reflect the age of the rest of the car. The patination of time doesnt show on the bumpers. This car has had some tumbles but the bumpers really dont show it.

The small silver details appear too heavy which was never the case on molded or painted originals. Again the wear on those details is not comesurate with the overall paint wear we see on the other panels. Look closely at the amount of scuffing on the side views, there's now way the silvering could survive such an onslaught unless they had been dotted.

The rear post appears to be completely painted which I find odd especially when combined with the fact that there is not much overspray or shadowing around the internal wheel wells. If you look closely you'll see a telltale goop or glue smear on the underside where the driverside index pin for the roof is. In almost all cases the factory glue daub is round looking rather than scraped or dragged.

Again, please keep in mind that I'm NO expert. What I opine is based on some rather crappy pics and halfassed knowledge. More than likely a fake or at best a re-do.

On a last note the dead miss along the driver hoodseam is kinda funky too.

Let the stoning begin. LOL.

ITS GOT A BID. Someone may be very disapointed.

ther seller offers a 100% money back... so maybe it's on the level

If I were to bid on something like this.... and if I could afford one I would also go to a show and buy in person.... I would have more recourse than the seller's guarantee alone. I'd love to know the truth here.

could be original, they're out there

Seth is right, a great predator get it at 585$

Which could be a real steal if it's a real one....considering that the last one I saw went for 3500 dollars, the highest price I've ever seen on the Bay for one single car

Updated, as I get my hands on this, from Ho-Slotcars Mailing list, which was coming from Mike Vitale with added infos from George Warner. It's quite long to read but it's really complete and interesting.


Nice time to repost some info Mike Vitale put out a couple years ago on
this list about a black Mustang ragtop that was on ebay. George Warner
also added some stuff:



Here are some things to look at:



1) Look at the front bumper. The passenger side 'end-point' should a
have a

black mark from where the bumper was removed from the tree for assembly.
It

is chromed at the end. The MM one had the 'tree connections' underneath
to

better hide the removal mark.



2) The screws underneath should have some 'age' to them similar to the
copper.



3) All cars I've ever seen that came in an original snap box had the
original solid rivet chassis.



4) The stripes!! They are set way to far apart for an original Aurora.
They

also are painted on the bottom lip of the roof that sits on the trunk
lid ..

Aurora never did that.



5) All original Aurora cars were factory painted black. Insist on a
picture

of the underneath without a chassis to see some 'underneath' plastic
color

(Can't tell in the available pictures).



6) The taillights are very nicely etched with red leaving a nice chrome
rim.

Aurora Mustangs didn't have that sophistication.. they just painted the
whole thing red.



(added by George)



7) On the side of the car, near the front bumper, there is an emblem

that looks like a "V" with a bar over it. On Aurora, this bar almost

touches the "V". On MM, there is a gap. This is the quick check I

always look for on Mustangs.



8) On MM Mustangs, the door handle is shorter. It is about 75% of the
length of a genuine Aurora handle.



9) Aurora Mustangs have more texture in the front grille -- like little
pebbles. MM Mustang grille texture look more like "noodles" (for lack
of a

better word). Also, the Mustang emblem on the front grille is more
obvious on Aurora; it's more like a blob on MM cars.



-----------------



Subject: HO> Repro/Real on Ebay





1) Paint Job: Look at any paint jobs that Aurora would have given a car.
All paint jobs used one or more stencils that at times leaked a bit.
The paint jobs are very fine with no sharp 'end' lines which signify a
tape job. Chargers used a two piece stencil which meet at one corner
and you will see a transition between the two. Any modern/redone
charger would have been taped and sprayed together or tampoed from the
factory (JL). Camaros used a one piece across the hood and have the
stripes fading off on the fenders. Any silver paint jobs are very hard
to get that even spray that aurora did so well.



2) Bumpers: All Aurora bumpers were removed from a master tree and left
little 'plastic colored stubs' on the left and right ends that had no
chrome plating on them. Rechromes/Repros have those chromed and JL/MM
has those stubs underneath. Original bumpers will have 'slash' melt
marks to fasten them in. Chrome studs just sticking through are a good
sign of reproduction. Swirled melt marks are often somebody reattaching
the bumper with minimal stud left to melt. Could mean removed for
rechromeing and reattached.



3) Roofs: Mustang/Galaxies etc where glued in with a very 'watery'
solvent that usually left a very shiny stain by the studs underneath.
Repros don't have that. Also, those studs are smooth on the ends ..
resin repros are not.



4) Flashing: Resin repros of course would have flashing and some would
have 'micro-bubbles' near the parting lines of the mold. Originals
would never have the 'micro-bubbles' but some might have flashing. Often
the cars sides vary in thickness due to the quality of the resin caster.
Look also at the mounting end of the screw post .. this requires venting
in the casting procedure and often leaves scars to that effect. As the
Aurora molds aged though .. the cars produced when the mold was 6-8
years old do sometimes show a small amount of flashing. Camaros even
had 'mold break lines' on one door on the very final runs.



5) Chassis Origin: Older cars would have solid rivet chassis and the
earliest would have those short stubby pickup shoe skirts on them. Of
course chassis are switched all the time but a car with claims of 'new'
should have a chassis consistent with its point of manufacturing. Also
the 'correct' wheels should be on the correct cars. Some cars .. like
Dune Buggies had yellow dimpled wheels as wheel as chrome versions.



6) Other sale items: See what else is being sold by the seller. If he
has other tjets .. check them. If he has no others .. see if he has
other merchandise coming from the same point in time.



7) Wheel well cuts: In this case .. knowing how the well should look is
your best bet. Keep in mind chargers have two rear well looks. All
mustangs have the left side varying slightly from the right. Look for
small flared cut edges at the bottom of the wells .. aurora usually made
sharp turns at the bottom



8) Colors: There tough to tell if accurate from a computer image.
Certain colors would signal production era which you could then tie back
to screw post height/size and other markings. Camaros .. for instance
have long rear screw posts when made in AFX colors (lime,maroon). '63
Vettes had skinny screw post when made in later colors .. Std Green and
Dark Blue. All Makos in the AFX colors (Orange, Maroon) have large
wheel well openings but you would never find an Olive with those large
openings since that color was discontinued in '66



9) Window alignment/breakage: If you find a car missing a window or
broken .. make sure you scrutinize the window post closely. Often the
car was 'stepped on' or alike and the window hit the chassis and broke.
The window post might be repaired or damaged.



10) Dimples: Those pesky divets above screw posts and window stubs that
just make the car look so 'toyish'. This happened in injected molded
cars in the sixties due to pressure/heat issues during molding. Modern
cars don't seem to suffer that fate. Of course .. reproductions often
have them since they copied a car that had dimpling already in place.

As with anything, if you want to be 100% sure you really need to see it in person or know the seller, but IMHO, I would say this is a vintage car, but not a vintage paint scheem.....every factory painted black car I've ever owned from the Porsche and Ford J cars (Two of the more common) to to the AC Cobra and Mustang (Two of the more rare) have had a TON of overspray on the under side of the body.....this car has little to non and as mentioned the stripes look funny.

JMHO

--------------------------
www.SlotCarJohnnies.com

I am surprised that no one has mentioned that the melted tabs are missing from where the roof is attached.....
Oops...
I just did...

Scott

How would we know if he brought it to a factory to paint it or not?

Thanks for the checklist Zanza!
Valuable intel for sure.

This is the picture of this "suspicious" Mustang

http://img88.imageshack.us/img88/8969/paintedauroramustangcd7.th.jpg (http://img88.imageshack.us/my.php?image=paintedauroramustangcd7.jpg)



And that is the picture of the one that went for 3500 dollars in May 2007 (I have checked the feedback of buyer and seller of it and apparently the transaction was good for both of them, which tend to proof that it was undoubtely a genuine one

http://img128.imageshack.us/img128/4171/17290bo4.th.jpg (http://img128.imageshack.us/my.php?image=17290bo4.jpg)


I let you judging, if possible

My opinion is the same as SCJ. Vintage car but not vintage paint scheem.

I have a baby blue Firebird Thunderjet. The original color was green. The only way you can tell it was green is the paint is thin on top of the passenger door revealing the green color. The windows and bumbers were removed and the body painted inside and out.

Every show I had a table selling at, the car was picked up and looked at. Almost sold it a couple of times. Had it priced at $20.00 everytime. But as soon as I told the potential buyer it had been painted or they discovered it they but it back. I've been told an original baby blue goes for alot more. Randy.

..........I've been told an original baby blue goes for alot more. Randy.

YEA....about $5k more! :D

-------------------------
www.SlotCarJohnnies.com (http://www.SlotCarJohnnies.com)