Could use a little help here fellow racers. I bought a red cap 230 rc motor
2 winters ago. The first year racing it I had alot of problems getting horse power Come to find out i had a stuck piston ring. I replaced the ring and rebroke the motor in. It took until about 1/4 of the season this year for the ponys to kick in. Now about 2 weeks ago lost power, That maybe a bad carberator. Today I went ahead and checked the ring again and it was stuck.
Are any of you experiencing the same problems. if so what did you do to correct. We run CAM 2 ful with a 40 to 1 Amsoil mixture. Thanks for the help

Make sure you are getting the proper ring. The one for the red cap is thinner than the one for the black cap motor. The red cap part number is T2071-41210 and the black cap piston ring number is T2070-41210.

Fred

Red cap is..8MM thick or.031496063 Thousandths.

Black cap is. 1.0 MM thick or .039370079 Thousandths.

Also are you letting the engine sit up for extended periods of time without running.
That can make one stick.

could be the Cam 2 and the oil with the combo of it sitting too long between runs . When I first started out I used Cam 2 and the regular AMS OIL and fouled plugs and had a sticky mess . Then again the second time around could be the wrong ring .

Fuel oil mixture will do it. We run the VP C-16 and amsoil saber at 70 to 1 mix. That is 1.85 ounces per gallon. To much oil will gum a engine up And make it not perform right and stick a ring. But how lean it the fuel air mixture. Is it gaulding the piston any or scratching it. What color is your plug burning.

OK, maybe I souldn't stick my nose in here since I am very new to 1/4 pounders. But I have worked in the L&G repair business for the past 5 years working ONLY on 2-cycle engines.... and for the most part a 2-cycle engine is a 2-cycle engine :)

The wrong ring would be an issue if that is the case. Also, did you competely clean the ring groove before installing the new ring. If that is all OK I have foumd that two other things can cause sticking rings. First is the type of fuel/oil mix used and second is engine overheating. Not overheating enough to trash the engine but (I theorize) enough to vaporize the mix before it has a chance to properly lube the cyl/piston. We see it a lot when people use reguar motor oil in the fuel mix.

OK, maybe I'm off here, just offering up another opinion ;)

We run CAM 2 ful with a 40 to 1 Amsoil mixture. Thanks for the help

proper ring and stay away from cam 2. thats all i got.

could be the Cam 2 and the oil with the combo of it sitting too long between runs . When I first started out I used Cam 2 and the regular AMS OIL and fouled plugs and had a sticky mess . Then again the second time around could be the wrong ring .

We run every week at MPR have not missed a saturday since start of the season, so it's not sitting to long. I do seem to go through alot of plugs. Would changing the oil mixture help IF i stayed with the cam 2?

I'm a bit new too, but my engine is 3 years old, never had it apart, and I'm running in front most of the time (if I hit the setup anyway). I have been running VP C16 with 2.5 - 3 Oz of Amsoil Dominator oil to one gallon fuel. It don't smoke, it starts first or second pull after I've had it running that day and the plug is changed about every 3rd or 4th race day. I don't know if that is a good test or not. The last plug I had, it was running just a touch lean, so I changed the plug and opened up the high side (2 flats). I just found out that means the thickness of a flat head screw driver. You don't want the plug to be black and you don't want it to be too grey. Grey is lean and black is way too rich. Again, I'm no expert and I'm still learning.So with that all said, and the fact you have two rings that have stuck, I would look at the heat of the engine when it just comes off the track. I think Randy, Fred, and Hank all have some great things to look at first. Then change your fuel/oil combo and see what happens for the next ring.

I would recommend the amsoil saber professional of 70to 1.
Most everyone uses VP-C 16 and amsoil professional. and I doubt anyone sticks a ring. unless they lean it so much it galls a piston.

This is a know combination that works.

Run the Amsoil and C16 fuel. You will like it. I have the same motor in my sprinter that has been in there since red cap motors became avalible. I have never had it apart. With proper oil and fuel you should not have to rebuild these motors for a loooooooooong time. If you must rebuild make sure to lube the piston and ring lightly prior to installing. Make sure the ring land or grove is clean no nickes or damaged areas. Also make sure the proper ring is used. This should result in a good runing motor. The longer it runs the stronger it should get. A good trick for breaking in a motor is to run it thru a few heat cycles. Run it till it gets up to temp and then let it cool down and do this a few times to help seat the ring to the cylinder. I have run my motors in with straight motor oil and a prop and let them come up to temp and run wide open till it runs out a 16 oz tank of fuel, let it cool down and then do it again and again. 6oz. of straight 30 weight motor oil to a gallon of pump gas. This works better than synthetic oil for break in. (This is not a recommended mix for racing , just to break in a motor.) With synthetic oil it takes a long, long time to seat the ring. :wave:

Fred

I agree with Hank. Cleaning the groove is important. There is a tool made for this purpose in full size pistons. I'm sure there is one made for motorcycles & should work for the 230's.

As far as the over heating goes... what would be the maximum heat range before the nuking starts?

There is alot of ways to break in a motor and many fuel - oil combinations . All have their merits . When I used CAM 2 and 100-1 Amsoil I used 1 once per gallon , even tried Klotz 50-1 oil . Always ended up with Fouled plugs and a gunked up motor . Once I went to c-16 or c-12 and Amsoil 2000 Series Racing oil and used a good NGK plug the problems seemed to go away . Reason I still use the 2000 Series oil instead of the Sabre is because I'm still working on my last Quart and too cheap to go out and buy the new stuff yet . Anyways for the RED cap 230 , use c-16 or c-12 , Sabre oil ( 2.5 -3 oz to a gallon ) a NGK CR8HIX Platnum plug . Change your fuel lines and tank . Some oils and fuels don't mix .( Could be Cam 2 is one of those types of fuel ) . Simple insurance . Put a basic set up on the carb , put it in the car and run it . Personally that's the way I break in a motor , under an actuall load . Not saying that using a prop or dyno is wrong , I just prefer using the actuall load of the car and the natural use of acceleration and deceleration on the track . The motor I have in the sprinter is on it's 4th season . I wore out one carb , still have the same stock clutch shoes , and change the plug about once a year . If your carb is set up right it , the plug should have a light cocoa brown color to it . Using the c-16 , Sabre oil and platnum plugs might seam a little pricy at first but the results you'll be happy with . Works for me anyways .

one guy at our track tried cam 2 and foul plugs all the time. and couldn't get
rid of the problem once it started until he took motor apart and cleaned it out and clean the junk off the piston.

he was the guinea pig. once he did that nobody wanted to get any cam2.
lol
seems to be the result be others here as well. i rarely ever foul a plug.
doesn't matter what plug it is either.

Could use a little help here fellow racers. I bought a red cap 230 rc motor
2 winters ago. The first year racing it I had alot of problems getting horse power Come to find out i had a stuck piston ring. I replaced the ring and rebroke the motor in. It took until about 1/4 of the season this year for the ponys to kick in. Now about 2 weeks ago lost power, That maybe a bad carberator. Today I went ahead and checked the ring again and it was stuck.
Are any of you experiencing the same problems. if so what did you do to correct. We run CAM 2 ful with a 40 to 1 Amsoil mixture. Thanks for the help

Didn't Butch have the same trouble...
Why don't you guys bite "The Fish" (bullet) and get the right gas and oil!!!...

DD

because we dont have a billion dollars for gas. mayde DD can sponsor us with a 55gal drum of c16 :thumbsup: :woohoo:

because we dont have a billion dollars for gas. mayde DD can sponsor us with a 55gal drum of c16 :thumbsup: :woohoo:

Poor Dave can't even sponcer his own racer with the high dollar stuff that some guys are running on a weekly basis!!!...

DD

we dont need high dollar stuff to race :freak:

i see hilber lurking in the background :wave:

we dont need high dollar stuff to race :freak:

True, you don't need it to race, but I cannot help but wonder if the CAM2 has been the problem some of the MPR regulars have experienced.

I think the piston ring height is a definite issue; I will be curious to measure the extra ring I have along with the groove width in the piston when it comes time for refreshing the engine.

Joe Brooks
...just someone who uses the same track
:thumbsup:

hilber dosent use the $$$ stuff, i think he still uses some race pump gas, come on greg spill your guts, not all of it just some of it :thumbsup: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo:

i like those little guys (woohoo)

Sunoco at 50:1 (dominator oil)

Also, for better compression, we use a thin coat of peanut butter on the cylinder walls.

:jest: :lol: :D :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo:

Also, for better compression, we use a thin coat of peanut butter on the cylinder walls.

Now that's what I'm talkin' about!!!

Joe Brooks
...just someone who uses the same track
:thumbsup:

what do you do if you are allergic to peanutbutter!!!!!just put jelly on the cylinder walls!!!!LOL

I don't recommend using Cam-2. I used that gas when I was a new 1/4 scaler in the late 90's and fouled plug after plug. Use VP gas...(c-16 or 12) it's only sold out of a barrel vs. being pumped from the ground at a gas station. Go to a local speed shop, they will have it.

~John Foster