The ARCOR site has Rules for brushless/LIPO classes for 2008 and there is a 21.5 NOVAK motor listed in the "LIPO SPEC 21.5 (COT)" class. Anyone done any testing of this motor? Anyone know when IT might be available, it is not listed yet on NOVAK's site.

I don't think that the people testing have completed all of the tests they want to do. Novak needs an "official" ok to start up the procedures for making this a real product offered for sale.

Ralf,

The motor is in the proper hands and being tested over the next few weeks...

Should know something really soon~

is the 17.5 in "real" production yet?

Yes the 17.5 is on Novaks website. look under buy Novak it's in there. We have 5-6 here in AZ!

Raymond

it's in production..and available exclusively on NOVAKS web site. Go to the BUY NOVAK section, I believe its under NEW products.

If you scroll to the bottom of that page...you can also find the bulk purchase discount (buy 4 and save $5.00 each, plus get combined shipping...saving about another $8.00 per motor)

17.5's
http://www.lefthander-rc.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=50&products_id=1268

Hays

GOOD JOB!!

17.5 li-po is awsome we ran them this past week and it was a blast! Almost dead on 10.5 4cell speeds!

Cliff, we have sold 30 and have 22 more on the way, should be here monday.

barry

great news Barry~

Sweet! Lipo is on it's way!

Now we need the BRL to make a 17.5 4 cell class instead of another 13.5 class! Sonny?

I am hoping that 4-cell 17.5 will catch on, I have one of the motors and hopeto get down to Easley SC with it soon. What experience I have has been in brushed stock on flat carpet tracks, ran a couple of times on a steeply banked concrete 1/4 midget track on caps. Tried the 13.5 on a flat carpet track after 3 + years away from the hobby and between beeing rusty (more like corroded!), trying to sort out the car, and the extra speed from the brushless 13.5 I was tearing up the car (broken servo gears, bent kingpin, can't remember how many bearings, and finally a broken receiver all in two weekends of racing) the carpet season finally ended. LSS I am have had a lot going on family wise and I hope to get down to Easley SC next weekend. ANYONE at Easley running the 17.5 yet?

No one has ran a 17.5 at easly, were looking into the 17.5 or the 21.5 and run the lipo and start a new class. After the nats there will be some testing for the new class with lipo/ Brushless.

I think there should be a 23.7, 26.2, 30.1, 33.4, 35.8. motors, this way you'll all have about 5 racer's to compete against. That should get you closer to the podium

LOL, the goal is NOT to have a TON of motors...it's to have a SEPARATION of motors that can make 3 good classes.

LONG Term on this end - is MOVE to LIPO based classes... But, for those places that WON'T move to LIPO there will be 3 well spread motors for 4 cell as well (Unlike the 13.5 and 10.5's which are soooo close in all reality)

4 cell

17.5
10.5
OPEN MOD (Brushed or Brushless)

Very different speed classes.

LIPO
21.5
17.5
10.5 (DROP ALL BRUSHED cause this things screams plenty fast on LIPO to be all that and a cup of tea)

Those 2 groupings will net virtually the SAME exact speed - but the guys who have tried the LIPOS will tell you - THEY NEVER WANT TO GO BACK TO A NIMH pack again~

I think there should be a 23.7, 26.2, 30.1, 33.4, 35.8. motors, this way you'll all have about 5 racer's to compete against. That should get you closer to the podium

That's some funny stuff right there! Everyone in there own class and they all get trophies!!! lmao

For you guys that don't want to run lipo's just run 6-cell :wave: :wave: :wave:

Their are to many classes now looks like to me ............

.I actually don't think there are ENOUGH classes...cause we still have good ol Americans NOT racing - so apparently we haven't found a CLASS for everybody.

we got

STOCK CARS that have 6 or 7 different variations in speed
NASTRUCKS that have a few different variations...
INDYCARS
S/K MODS
1/12th Scales
COT's

some places have BOMBERS (one of my personal favorites) 55/56 Ford/Chevy bodies...woohoo

I also like the classics - old BOLINK CLASSIC BODIES (ie: TORINO, CHEVELLES what ever)

Or the MUSCLE CAR type bodies - MUSTANG, CUDA, CAMARO

...then theres the IMCA Mod type body or the Jalopy type coupe bodies...

or maybe a OVAL BODY on a TOURING CAR

Did you ever think that people might have to work or be a little burned out on spending the good old dollar.

Did you ever think that people might have to work or be a little burned out on spending the good old dollar.

Yeah they have that's why they are tring to make a motor to run with lipos. How much have you spent on cells this year? 300.00-500.00 if you race at all!

I guess you don't understand :confused: :confused: :wave:

Yeah....what Raymond Said...

JHRacing - I'm ONE of those guys. You should see the PILE of CRAP I've had to spend money on during the 22 years I've been doing this...

90% of the time RACERS waste money cause they are SHEEP - and THINK they have to have a product cause it's a different color...and different shape...or it's the NEWEST version, where there was NOTHING wrong with what they had.

..then (because of the HYPE and stuff) other people see those people WINNING a race with that stuff..and THINK They HAVE to have it too...or they can't WIN....and even after they buy it, they are still the 3rd place car - cause they can't OUT DRIVE the other guy because although he's running that pretty NEW product...he KNOWS the key is CAR SET UP and not the BLING that's winning the races... that coupled with TALENT.

Well, I don't fall victim to that...and I ABUSE the heck out of my stuff - and have a great time racing - but I'm always looking for ways to make it CHEAPER "IN THE LONG HAUL" for guys like me who do this on a very short shoestring.

LIPO/B.L. fits that bill. Don't like it? Don't Run it - with what we are trying to put together for a class grouping...you'll be able to mix BOTH together...(actually ALL 3 BRUSHED, BL and BL LIPO) how much CHEAPER can that be?

With the way things WERE structured....you couldn't do that. There was no Parody in the speeds of the classes...and nobody seemed to give a RATS Patooty.

Some kept trying to say

13.5 runs just like stock - make 13.5 the B/L stock equiv. class DIDN'T Take long to PROVE those guys wrong.

Then some said 13.5 is a little faster, but it's a good speed and while this may be true...it's TOO fast to allow it to run WITH stock...so what about finding a B/L Combo that COULD run with STOCK?

10.5 was supposed to be pretty equal to 19t - again WRONG! Once guys figure it out...it will be faster, has been faster...and will continue to get faster as guys get better. Granted..not a LOT faster, but fast enough the average 19t guy would probably be a 5th place car based on motor...on a good day. (A really good driver might be able to run in the top 3, but his motor builder would be busy keeping that motor PERFECT all day long)

Sometimes we need to look a little further down the road.

Personally, I'm not asking YOU or anyone else who is on the fence to change ONE THING about what you are doing... BUT, for those who are SICK and TIRED of babysitting 4200 batteries...charging, discharging...cycling...buying NEW - etc. We are finding a lot of PEACE and HARMONY with the 3200 LIPO and having a nice relaxing day at the track...NOT worrying about if the battery is going to run FLAT this run, etc.

The number of hours you can free up if you had a battery maintenance program in the past...will probably save you 15 hours between races. (Oh, I got a report from one of the guys who ran his LIPO for the first time last weekend..and he told me I was wrong about the voltage not falling off after running the same pack OVER and OVER and OVER and OVER and OVER on the same day..cause after he ran it...he ran a discharge on it...and it did drop .001 volts from the start of the day.)

I would like to see a stock speed Lipo motor but 21.5 is most likely not it. I would think based on my running the 17.5 and Lipo that the 21.5/lipo would be as fast as 13.5/4cell which is great but not as slow as it needs to be to apeal to everyone. I personally like the 13.5/4cell speed but seems like many think it is to fast. What ever happened to that 25.5 or whatever it was that was supposed to be tested and was said to be to slow? How slow was it and were the people testing sure they got everything out of it?

Frustrating to me that it takes months to get a motor tested. Some of us see this and think "man 1 day is all I would need to know", or maybe that's just me!

Brian,

Testing is SLOW for me...cause I only get to race, or be at a track every couple weeks...and one of those races I'm the director...

The 25.5's were REALLY SLOW (Slower than 4 cell SPEC) using the lipo.

The 21.5's will be tested on the 18th on the METRO TRACK (capped tire) in Bakersfield, CA and again on the 8th of Sept. at the Bending Corners Raceway in Orange County CA. (Carpet) We might get some data this weekend too - if we can swing it...

It SHOULD be inline w/ current 4 cell STOCK speeds however. I don't think it will be as fast as the 13.5's but we'll soon find out.

Hey guys if novak would send us a couple of the 21.5 motors we could tell them in one weekend. how they preformed on a concrete oval track we have several racers that are fast weekend and weekout. run line is 245 ft. with plenty of banking with lots of bite.

Lee Ricker
Lailspeedway

Lee,

That would be between you and Novak. As is the deal we're working on...and JB(ARCOR) is working on.

I know we are not the only ones testing "NEW" stuff - but to my knowledge...we are the only ones that requested SLOWER stuff. (everybody else wants FASTER stuff... ie : a 2.5 motor and such.)

Lee,

That would be between you and Novak. As is the deal we're working on...and JB(ARCOR) is working on.

I know we are not the only ones testing "NEW" stuff - but to my knowledge...we are the only ones that requested SLOWER stuff. (everybody else wants FASTER stuff... ie : a 2.5 motor and such.)


I believe that was an offer of assistance to you that Lee was offering so that you might get an answer that doesn't take 2 or 3 months to find out something that can be found out in 1 day.

I guess it is more important for the people doing the testing to do it than for it to be done!

You are fighting setup at different tracks while testing motors??? Just doesn't seem like the best of circumstances.

Any how good luck!

brian,

I sent you a PM

as far as the 21.5 motors - I have a very specific way and very specific things I'm looking for in the testing. I tried letting it be done outside of MY control and it didn't get tested the way I wanted it done...so as they say "If you want something done...do it yourself"

I don't DRIVE them - I put them in the hands of the guys who I feel have the BEST car setups at the tracks I want them tested at. And/or guys who I feel can run with those guys who are THE Best.

I crunch numbers, find the ratios I want to see tested...then put them on the track under actual RACE conditions (not on the track under 'test' conditions) that way you get to see how they actually compare on a RACE prepared track against guys racing to WIN not just trying to run laps.

I may be selfish on some of this - but I'm trying to find an application for OUR needs as a primary function...so seeing what they will do by somebody I don't know, on a track I'll never see - doesn't fit with my tests at this time. However, if we have the results I want to see - then I try to make sure others have access to be able to test for their application as well (ie: Humpty has one of the 17.5 TEST motors and has run the heck out of it I hear...in the AZ area...with very close and similar results to what we've found) Now that the 17.5's are available to EVERYONE..anyone can get one to test....in the way they need to.

JB has approved the 21.5 motor for ARCOR'S needs - hopefully (I'm not sure, cause I haven't talked to her this week) she's let NOVAK know this..and they will start building them - and by the time I'm finished with our next 2 test dates...the motor will be close to being in production.

...it's kind of funny some guys have got so impatient on this deal...

Nothing was supposed to be even released about most of these tests...until we had data (SOLID DATA) since originally nothing was going to go into affect until 2008. But with the areas of the country that get COLD (unlike CA) you guys have an INDOOR SEASON and a OUTDOOR Season....so things were moved a little quicker than I had planned.

My original goals for the final test data was Oct. 1st. and we're right on track, actually about 2 weeks early.

you have an E-mail Joe!

back at ya Brian....

Brian is one fast dude in Brushless, if you need something tested I would send it his way.

Brian is one fast dude in Brushless, if you need something tested I would send it his way.


Ah shucks!! Are you trying to build me up for a butt whippin at the nats. lol :thumbsup:

Ah shucks!! Are you trying to build me up for a butt whippin at the nats. lol :thumbsup:

You tore our azz Saturday! See ya next week.

brian0525

Good Call~

Our track conditions this weekend were NOT very good - there is a HUGE 100K+ acre forest fire just about 100 miles away and blowing so much ash and smoke into town it made race conditions really slippery...and even with that...the 21.5 motor w/ LIPO ran .5 seconds a lap quicker on the VERY FIRST run than the normal STOCK quick laps.

By the end of the day - the 21.5's FASTEST LAP was a 4.99 vs. the quickest "STOCK" lap of a 5.40

The cars were easy to drive with the way the accelerated, and once it was determined how much quicker they were than the STOCK class the test drivers didn't try pushing them really any harder the rest of the day - and instead did things like a 20+ lap HOTLAP prior to the start of a heat race...then just line up and GO.

The 4 cell RECORD at this track for 10.5/4 cell is 62 laps, I have no doubt with the track in the condition it was that weekend (just a couple weeks ago) the 21.5/LIPO would/could have run a quick 60...with enough battery left to do close to another 60 w/o dumping.

Is there any release date yet for the 21.5?

Robert,

I have not seen a release date yet for the 21.5

The 17.5 was just announced NATIONALLY with an official release and will be available through NORMAL hobby channels.

Yesterday, I checked with Charlie and he said the 21.5T motor had not yet been officially approved by the testers.

I'm not sure just what that approval entails, but I believe ARCOR and SWTour have to finish the testing and notify Charlie that the motor is acceptable.

The soonest Novak can have this motor available is sometime in September. We can offer it on Shopatron first and then make it available to the distributors who want to carry these motors.

whats the hold up we need these motors indooor racing starts soon!!!

iroczcec,

The hold up is GOOD data. The first test we did on the 21.5 motor showed the motor to be a lot faster than a 4 cell STOCK class motor (4.99's vs. 5.4's) on the FIRST run on the track. No real attempts were made to make the 21.5 any FASTER because it smoked the stock field.

This was on a CAPPED TIRE track and the driver who TQ'd STOCK is generally one of THE fastest in STOCK at this track. However, the track conditions were very poor on this test day, due to a HUGE forest fire dumping ash and smoke in the air and on the track...taking a lot of traction away.

MORE testing over the next 3 weekends.

This motor HAS been approved by ARCOR - but we have not approved it yet for OUR needs. We may still be looking more toward the 25.5 or maybe even a 23.5 or something, depending on what we find over the next 3 weeks.

As far as test timing - it has always been my schedule to have tests conclude by the mid/end of Sept, and to have solid data by Oct. 1st. (But being in CALIF - our events run FEB - DEC.)

sorry for being impatience i know you have to take care of buisness we are just looking for a motor that would be close to 1600 4cell spec brushless 4300 that will go good with a 3200 lipo battery 21.5 motor sounded like it would be perfect! but only you the tester really know what will work and what wont! keep up the good work just a little faster if you can stand it!lol iroc

LOL - Impatient...Racers

Racers...being 'racers' want everything FAST but that's why they are RACERS...LOL

i know good luck testing!!! i will stop bugging you now....

any updates on the 21.5 motor being released? thanks iroc

any updates on the 21.5 motor being released? thanks iroc

Since the last "update" was 6 days ago, I have to say----Nope.

never hurts to ask?

One thing I'd like to see Novak come out with would be a (brushless spec motor) easily identifyable as different than the current line, and perhaps being a sealed motor. It would probably have to be close to stock speeds on Lipo. As we send our 4-cell packs off to the great beyond which I am currently doing in the spec truck class. It would be great to have a non tamper or upgrade type, inexpensive B/L motor to keep the spec truck class or whatever people are running similar to that going, after lipo takes over. Just my 2 cents........

The pro SS motors have color coded rings for the 13.5 and the 10.5. You can't really exchange them between motors. If and when this "spec" racing takes off big enough to justify us doing another color I'm sure we can. But Quantity has to be there. Currently ALL forms of electric racing use 13.5 and 10.5, so that was easy. But only some classes are looking for this "new" slower motor.

Also, inexpensive and racing, do not go hand and hand. You can't race a "cheap" anythying. :) They become disposable at that stage. So you'll be paying more but the motor will last for ever type of thing. I've got guys that have raced the original 10.5 (4300) motors since they came out.

Iroc Good Man. I See Your Coming To The Li-po Side. Lol

It Did Not Take Long For The Word To Get Out. Li-po Is The Best.

Now All You Need Is A Car A Controller And Tire Goop And Go Racing. Also No One Has The Advantage Of Higher Voltage Batteries. Every One Is Equal Now.

It Is Good On The Other Side. Lol

You Just Saved Alot Of Money On Batteries And Chargers And Tape And Working On Batteries And Watching Batteries. Just Give Them To The Guy That Likes To Watch Batteries Charge.

Li-po Man