Hello everyone: I read most of the threads and replies on Hobbytalk. I don't have the time to reply to everyone individually but there are some common issues so I thought I would reply to everyone at the same time.

1) Quality Control: We are continuing to work with our factory in China to make the highest quality cars that we can for the money. Keep in mind these are mass produced and don't include expensive hop up parts. AW cars are far from perfect but I think they are a good value for the money.

2) AW Direct: We will continue to build the Auto World brand name by selling products direct to the consumer (we are not the only collectibles company doing this by the way). If you don't like that we are doing this (whether you are a distributor of AW or a consumer) then you don't have to buy from us. You are in COMPLETE Control!

3) Variations: Auto World is not telling you what you have to buy. In release 2 a lot of variations were produced in various LE quantities. If you don't like some of the colors or color combinations then don't buy the cars! If you think they are too expensevie then don't buy the cars! If you don't like the bodies we chose then don't buy the cars! If the quality does not meet your expectations then don't buy the cars! If you think we are wrong by selling products direct to consumers then don't buy the cars. I can tell you that a lot of folks ARE BUYING THE CARS but don't feel bad if you don't. It's YOUR MONEY SO IN THE LONG RUN YOU ARE IN COMPLETE CONTROL!

For those of you that are our customers, like what we do and purchase our products...Thank you for the business!

For those of you who don't like what we do (for whatever reason) I welcome the criticism as long as it is POSITIVE (of course I realize that most of the "flaming" comes from a selected few with alias names with hidden agendas!). We will do our best to earn your business but keep in mind that it is IMPOSSIBLE to please everybody!

Thanks.

Tom Lowe

You are right. And that is what I'm doing. I really like the cars and i want to see more coming. I am now just buying what I really like and enjoying the cars I do buy more than when I used to buy full cases.

Keep them comming!!!!!

Build them Tom and most will come, Those who don't can buy them from me in two years at inflated ebay prices because theyare missing them, I was kind of looking at this as a long term send my kid to University thing.. (Yes University not a college College is a trade school get it right people lol)

Dave Scott
Absolutly no agenda other then to race little toy cars.

Tom,

I agree with your post, only thing I would suggest is to Thank Those that buy your cars first... Beyond that, I just picked up 8 of the new cars and am waiting on two more, it seems they are selling well from what the Hobby shop owner told me and the fact he was out of several of the body styles. I for one would like to also thank you for the new cars I was able to purchase, and I think they are pretty darn good and look great as well.

Thanks Again.
Tom

( If you don't like some of the colors or color combinations then don't buy the cars! If you think they are too expensevie then don't buy the cars! If you don't like the bodies we chose then don't buy the cars! If the quality does not meet your expectations then don't buy the cars! If you think we are wrong by selling products direct to consumers then don't buy the cars. }

Hey Tom
You seem to be getting alittle cocky..Remember if it was not for little guys like us there would be no you..If I was you I would think before saying THEN DON"T BUY so many times..Remember its your dealers who promote your product for free....Keep hurting them & you will have to spend your own money on advertising ..You say you did this iHobby thing for the collector..All you did was stick your hand in the dealers pocket for 75,000.00 plus $..Now the real collector will pay dearly once these things hit the bay....You say things are good but I see people shying away from your cars..Orders are getting smaller & smaller..Get advise from real people not the Butt sniffer you have around you now..
Remember Piss enough people off & Hobbytalk that always helped you can also turn around & hurt you..
Peace out
Bob Dugan

2) AW Direct: We will continue to build the Auto World brand name by selling products direct to the consumer (we are not the only collectibles company doing this by the way). If you don't like that we are doing this (whether you are a distributor of AW or a consumer) then you don't have to buy from us. You are in COMPLETE Control!

3) Variations: Auto World is not telling you what you have to buy. In release 2 a lot of variations were produced in various LE quantities. If you don't like some of the colors or color combinations then don't buy the cars! If you think they are too expensevie then don't buy the cars! If you don't like the bodies we chose then don't buy the cars! If the quality does not meet your expectations then don't buy the cars! If you think we are wrong by selling products direct to consumers then don't buy the cars. I can tell you that a lot of folks ARE BUYING THE CARS but don't feel bad if you don't. It's YOUR MONEY SO IN THE LONG RUN YOU ARE IN COMPLETE CONTROL!

For those of you that are our customers, like what we do and purchase our products...Thank you for the business!

For those of you who don't like what we do (for whatever reason) I welcome the criticism as long as it is POSITIVE (of course I realize that most of the "flaming" comes from a selected few with alias names with hidden agendas!). We will do our best to earn your business but keep in mind that it is IMPOSSIBLE to please everybody!


Tom,
I'm really disappointed at the tone of your post. I do not think you did yourself any favors with the attitude which is coming through. I have been reading and posting on a number of the threads. I do not really recall anyone saying the standard price of the cars was outlandish. What I have seen is questions being raised (maybe not in the most politically correct language) about the prices being charged, and the packages you need to buy, for the specialty cars. You have a right to charge whatever you deem is fair; the consumer has the right to make a determination on that price.
Many of us have supported you from the JLs through the latest releases. We bought at least one, if not more, of every car even if we didn't care for it. Personally, I have over 1,000 of your cars. Why? Mostly because we are collectors and have not yet been cured. But also part of it is to support your efforts so you can keep going and to thank you for doing something for the hobby.
However, if you did read through the posts, you should have realized that you made an error by making a White Thunder of every car in release 1 and giving the collector and SUPPORTER of your product no real chance of adding them to the collection. Of course, it's possible to get them all, but the time required and the price that would need to be paid is beyond what most people will be willing to do.
It should also be apparent that a majority seem to feel there are way too many "manufactured" variations in release 2.
So, you should have said "Hey look guys, thanks for buying all these cars all these years. I made an error by not taking into account that many people want to collect these cars and I made a marketing blunder. I've learned and let me find a way to correct this".
Instead, you posted a message which basically says "Hey guys, it's my company and I'll run it any way I want. If you didn't or can't get all the cars you want, too bad. You don't have to buy my product, I'll be fine without you".
It's a very small hobby and a very small customer base. It's an even smaller rabid customer base. I need this hobby to grow as much as anyone in order for our track sales to continue. You didn't do yourself any favors with your post.

Joe

P.S. No alias and no hidden agenda. Just a guy who wanted to continue his collection.

I'm not gonna' make any friends here, but I understand where Tom Lowe is coming from, and I'm not surprised that he seems frustrated. I've been reading this group for a long time. It doesn't matter what he does, somebody gets bent out of shape.

First of all, how many presidents of companies take the time to reply to the consumer??? Coke? Ford? NOT! Sure, Round 2 is a small company but still, Tom takes it upon himself to talk to us. Everybody talks as if he's the guy next door making slot cars in his garage.

As for the variations, nobody is obligating me to buy them all. I just buy the ones I like and the heck with the rest. If you think a couple "manufactured variations" of each car is bad, look at what Mattel does with Hot Wheels. And look at the prices they want for $1.00 cars that they release in limited quantities in the Red Line club. It's crazy! If I really dig a car, I might buy both body colors and try to get one that I think has the more rare window color. But I don't take it more seriously than that!

I for one like the choice of being able to buy the iWheels directly from Auto World, rather than waiting for a dealer to rifle them from a case and put them on eBay. That SUCKS. The guys that are crying the loudest have something to lose by Auto World trying to level the playing field for consumers.

And I think they did the variations to at least keep something to look for in the regular cars, but in a way that makes it hard to rifle the good ones. I would think that hardcore collectors would try and find only the most rare version of each model - not take it upon themselves to buy each and every variation. I don't think that's the point.

I have now jumped into my asbestos underwear, ready for the replies. Remember, it's only MY point of view.

Jerome

Wow. That is an interesting post by Tom. It doesn't bother me because I just usually buy two or three cars from each series that I like. But if I was one of these obsessive compulsive types who feel they have to have every car in every color, I think I might be offended and insulted at the tone of his rant. Bite the hand that feeds you. Dave.

Thanks for the reply Tom. :thumbsup:

Keep making those X-Tracs and I'll keep buying them. The new GT is terrific! When are we going to see the C5R or C6 Corvettes?

Just a couple obvservations:

1 -- This is the Round 2/AutoWorld HobbyTalk area -- I think it would show a little more class to keep the negativity in check and just present any concerns about AW products in a constructive way.

2 -- I generally couldn't care less about variations and what perceived value they add to my slot cars. If I see a car with smoked windows, a car with blue windows and a car with red windows, I'll buy the one I think is the coolest looking. Tom is right when he says AW is not telling you what to buy. AW is actually giving us options. How many people would piss & moan if a Nomad or Ford GT only came with blue windows? All of the 'clear window' guys and 'black window' guys would be crying a river.

This is not a dig at anyone and I am not an AW cheerleader. I just think sometimes a little bit too much is made of some of this.

Flame me if you wish but that's my $.02 worth.

'doba

Too funny. Tom I guess next you should offer a 12-step thingy like AA or something.

:lol:

Tom,

I understand how you may feel today. You just brought another batch of Slotcars with new molds to market, launched a new way (for you) of marketing and all you are hearing on this and probably other Boards are negative comments.

So your frustration is taken into account.

We here are, by and large, mechanical Geeks by nature, we will find something wrong with the wheel if you give us enough time/Beers :)

That being said, I like the new cars overall, have bought some and will buy more, and have no problem with how you want to market them.

Now, here comes the constructive criticism concerning quality control of the AW Tjet chassis.
I, myself will Gladly pay $1 more for a chassis with better torlerances. Better/Thicker Gears, less slop in axle holes and rims that are mounted true.

$1 does not sound like much to most people, but if that $1 is spent at production level, it is a huge amount on a product in this price range.

I can tweak a car and fix most for little if any money, but people like my Brother-In-Law Steve would send a AW slot car back if it sat on the track and squealed because the gear is mis-alinged and either your dealers or you would get a return.

No-one likes returns. Say what you want about Life-Like/Mattel/Tomy, but 95% of the time if you buy their slot cars, it will run and run good the first time out of the package.
No, they do not have the Pizzaz of the Tjets, but the kids spend more time driving them and Dad spends less time fixing them or hearing about it from his Wife.

Speaking of Wives, they LOVE to return anything that does not live up to their expectations. Just sayin.

Anyway, I hope China can step up and we can all enjoy driving your cars.
Thanks for all you do for the hobby,

Keith

No matter what way these cars are marketed, someone will whine and bitch. Tom, just keep making them. Sure I don't like every choice, but your lowest of ugliest cars (lets say the green Avanti) I would still buy before anything tyco/mattel, lifelike or tomy put out in the last few years.
I don't have to kiss Toms butt, he don't make me special cars or give me discounts, but he's doing a damn good job in the slot car world, And I agree, If you don't like it don't buy it.
I usually don't get pissed, and anyone who has met me or deals with me on a more personal level knows I am very fair, easy to deal with, ect. But it annoys me post after post to hear people bitch about Tom's cars or his marketing methods.

I'm glad he spoke up, now I'm off to order my white thunders and blue first laps from his website...........

Ed

No matter what way these cars are marketed, someone will whine and bitch. Tom, just keep making them. Sure I don't like every choice, but your lowest of ugliest cars (lets say the green Avanti) I would still buy before anything tyco/mattel, lifelike or tomy put out in the last few years.
I don't have to kiss Toms butt, he don't make me special cars or give me discounts, but he's doing a damn good job in the slot car world, And I agree, If you don't like it don't buy it.
I usually don't get pissed, and anyone who has met me or deals with me on a more personal level knows I am very fair, easy to deal with, ect. But it annoys me post after post to hear people bitch about Tom's cars or his marketing methods.

I'm glad he spoke up, now I'm off to order my white thunders and blue first laps from his website...........

Ed
Ed I asume you are a distributor or a dealer..Can you honestly tell me that you don't mind that Tom has put his hand in your pocket with the iHobby Cars..I know my profit margin has dropped considerably..Then to hear him say if you don't like it to bad..That rubs me the wrong way..I have spent many of Hours, Days , Weeks , months & years getting his stuff out in public view at no cost to him..To have him stick in in our backs like this , its not right..At this point I feel all the distributors should cancell all their back orders & let him market & sell it all himself..If you so called distributors would show alittle backbone he would'nt be walking all over us like he is..Remember we are the guys getting it out there..He has forgotten this..He looks like he thinks this stuff sells itself , it don't..Let him sell it all himself , he don't have enough of a following , They could'nt even sell 150 sets of whites today..I'll bet you all of us could have..
Sorry if I sound hostile , but what he has done is outright wrong..
I'm done now..

I am not a distributor or dealer at all. I love slot cars, I usually buy a master case of each release, pick out one set for myself, let the kids pick out a few cars they like, then sell the rest for about one dollar over what I paid per car. thats it. I keep the whites I like, sell the ones I don't. thats all, the GOOD in all Toms efforts are always overlooked, and the micro wheel tolerance is thrown in his face. There are great slot car tips to easily tune these cars up that lots of people here share all the time.

The old saying applies, If you can't say anything nice, don't say anything. (but I guess I just went against that, whoops)

Its a hobby, enjoy it.

ps: my order just went to Tom for $518.75.

thanks

But it's ok for dealers to put the knife in the consumer's back by pulling white's and pricing them wayyyyy over SRP?

But if you don't like the price, you don't have to buy it, right?

Why does that sound so familiar, like I just saw it somewhere else....:rolleyes:

You want to sell product...promote racing, they are slot cars after all, not diecast. These cars are capable and it's done all over. How many JL/AW race reports are on this board? Anyone?




......(crickets)......

Thats fine , but thats what I'm taking about..You just sent him 518.75 that should have gone to a dealer who just spent 20 or 30,000.00 on new inventory that he will now get stuck with usless he wants to sell it for cost..Thats not right..Yes dealers would sell the whites to the collectors for a nice price & then sell the others for an honest price to the real racers..Everyone was happy..Now Tom is scalping the whites hinself & at the same time forcing the collector to buy cars they don't want at retail..This forces the dealers to try to sell the regular cars at a higher price..Looks to me like he is sticking it to everyone ..Tom has really screwed things up now..I trully believe this is the beginning of a downward spirl for AW..
Done ranting..
BD

Another big problem is the way Tom sells to so called distributors that really are not distributors..Take slots-n-stuff for instince..He is suppose to be a distributor but he only sells to the public not to Hobby stores or dealers..He opens every case he gets sells the whites at a crazy price , then dumps the rest..A distributor is not suppose to sell to the public .only to stores & dealers..That does not create a fair playing ground..Tom has really screwed things up with greed..These are slot cars not Kiddy Litter..

Maybe we could explore both sides of this post.

I've been buying slot cars for three decades. I remember the bad old days of the mid 90's when all we had was NOS chassis from REH and one or two resin casters. The HO Slot Cars DL went nuts when the first set of pull backs came out. They were hard to get. I have been collecting Tom’s cars since then.

A funny thing happened along the way. I have about 1000 Thunderjets and Xtractions now. Every one of them is a runner. Every pull back has a JL slot chassis. I have about 1000 still in inventory and I've probably sold over 2000.

It was not always easy to find the cars. I eventually found a distributor and started buying master cases and selling to the locals. It was a break even proposition at best but it kept the cars flowing. It was good to see the hobby grow instead of shrink.

The best part was the steady improvement in quality along the way. The bad part was the price increase. Eventually, the cars were showing up on Ebay cheaper than I could buy them from my distributor. Enough was enough, the local kids could get their own slot cars.

While I have been happy to collect the cars, I think there are a couple valid criticisms and they are both related to the difference in the slot car market and the die cast market. The slot car market is much smaller and most of the collectors are concerned with quality castings not odd variations. I think the high number of variations make it more likely that collectors will give up and stop buying sets of cars. Slot cars are also mechanical devices that are expected to work. If I need to spend a lot of time getting each car to run or buy a bunch of parts to make them work right, I'm inclined to stop collecting.

Joe and I have traded JLs since we were trying to get all of the 57 'vette variations. I can relate to the large numbers of variations. I have enough of these cars for a life time. I only buy the new ones to keep up the set.

I'm glad Tom is experiencing success with the new release. I'm glad my favorite memory from childhood can still be bought new. I just hope that he keeps in mind those of us that have been along from the start. It is much easier to keep a customer than find a new one, especially in a hobby as small as this.

--
cordially,
Marty Milligan PO Box 434, Falling Waters, WV 25419
http://milligansisland.com/ http://adventureswithbuck.com/ http://byteslinger.com/ http://creepinglunacy.com/ http://mopedia.org/ http://mill-co.com/ http://oarl.org/ http://virtualgarage.net/

Tom saw a need (producing slot cars at an affordable price) and took the steps to fill that need. Along the way Tom's company has had learning curves and it's own bumps and bruises, for which he has paid. Are the cars perfect? no, but their better than nothing, which is what we had until Tom popped on scene. Tom has earned the right to do things his way, with or with out your support and I applaud him for saying so and doing so.

IMO - Distributors/dealers for the most part are in this business for the cash. Now some may be in this for the love of the hobby, but anyone that ponies up $25,000 or more for a set of cars is looking to recoup that and then some. I don't have an issue with dealers making money, but let's call a spade a spade, it's about the cash. I can understand how they may not like the new policies and how it may cost them some money, but if you take of the end users they'll take of you.

Now for the end user, I just ordered a complete set of Whities at $25.00 per car or more importantly about $25.00 less than the dealers were requiring me to pony up per car. I have heard many dealers say, "If you don't like the price don't buy it" or "If you don't buy it someone else will". So tonight I feel like Tom saved me $300.00 dollars by removing the dealers from my pocket. Now, I still bought 36 cars from Motor City Toyz and picked up another 12 from another dealer. I have always chosen to support the fair guys in this business that I have meet along the way. (Motor City Toyz, Slot Car Johnnie, ect...)

As far as I'm concerned I buy what I like, from who I like, when I can and I have no issues supporting those that have my interest in slot cars at heart or a least fain that they do. :thumbsup:

Bob

When I buy my brand new slot car and it wont run out of the box can I return it for a full refund? In my experience with your product approx 20 % suck out of the box. It gets frustrating to have to fix a NEW CAR. I do like most of the cars you have made, I disagree with the new marketing plan, I will buy from a dealer or on e-bid, not from the factory store, my choice, I personally would pay 20.00 per car if the quality took a much needed LEAP forward. Also what is with pink was there a special on that paint??? I am not a dealer I am a elevator mech who likes his toys, no hidden agendas. I gladly pay 45 for the special cars on the road race replica site (nu-rora cars injected with color.) I am a customer who is starting to shy away from your product, unfortunatly if there are more like me you will find it dificult to sell your product, if you know what I mean. Please try and keep a level head, listen to the b.s. and try to be proactive. Good luck with your venture I hope thing improve for all of us.
Regards,
Chris Marren

I will throw my 2 cents in here.

I just bought the set of First Lap and iWheels from Tom and I am happy he offered them to us. I bought my regular sets from Jeff and am happy they will be here soon.


I see where the "dealers" that make their money from selling the white thunders are going to be upset, but at the same time I don't think they were too worried about other smaller dealers when they turned around and sold the rest of the cars for 3 or 4 dollars less than cost because they made a killing on the whites. I guess it is only unfair when it is you personally, not when you are doing it to someone else.

And I don't believe that the dealers would have sold 150 SETS of iWheel cars either.. maybe broken up, but NOT as sets which is why I am happy Tom is doing it, I get the full set without being raped on "Ebay" by someone who pulled them from a case instead of randomly sending them out to their cusotmers in orders as was the intent.

Ebey has changed everything, and business owners are going to have to figure how to deal with it. It seems to me that is what Tom is trying to do.

As much as I like the AW's cars, I tend to agree ... the harder iwheels cars are to get, the less I want them. I don't like being forced to buy what I don't like, just to get the few cars that I do want. In the past, I always bought a complete sets of everything they put out, usually more than one set... but not anymore. Too many variations, too many restrictions, too much hassle. So instead of buying the usual 24-30 plus cars, I bought 12, spent almost as much as when I would buy complete sets, only this time I feel like I couldn't get the cars I really wanted, and it leaves a bit of bad taste in my mouth.

I miss the JL days when you get a case of 12 for 110 bucks. Now, that same 12 will cost you 160 bucks, or more... so naturally OUR expectations are higher, as well they should be. The more money we spend, the higher our expectations are going to be.
We're WORKING class guys, get it? We're not uber rich men like Tom, who are also fortunate enough to make millions on the hobbies we love ... so cut us some slack.

But Tom is right about one thing, it is our money and his "take it or leave it" approach is typical of most CEO's...so no one should be surprised by that. I for one, choose not to buy as many cars and I can see myself buying less and less ... not because of Tom's attitude, I expect CEO's to be unsympathetic and out of touch with the customer ... but because I don't have unlimited resources and as the prices increase, my money buys less. Now, add in AW's marketing tactics and the product becomes less appealing to me. So, like many others here... I will take his advise, and buy less.

And here's the real kicker... have you seen what White Lightning have been going for on ebay lately? Cars that once commanded 75 bucks, like the JL WL Mustang, are going for as little as 20 bucks... so it might be best to wait a year or two, or even three years before paying extortionist's rates on ebay

Dealing with the "new" AW is like going to your favorite restaurant wanting to order a steak, and then being told you have to buy 4 orders of boiled squid and 2 tofu burgers before you're "allowed" to order the steak you came there for.

Hey Tom ... instead of pushing people like me into buying complete sets when we only want one, two or three cars from that set, why not sell ALL the cars individually ... keep the standard cars at 15 bucks and make the first lap cars and iwheels at 30 bucks a car? In the end, I bet you will sell more cars, you can remake only the cars that sell the best, making the less popular cars more desirable to collectors for their rarity ... and everyone is happy.

In my case, instead of buying the 3 first lap cars I REALLY wanted and the 3 iwheels cars I REALLY REALLY wanted... I won't be allowed to buy ANY of them, unless I pay for the other 6 cars I don't want ... and your response is "take it or leave it" ?

Ok, it's your world rock star.

But be careful, you might get what you wish for. Maybe the folks at Tomy will take notice of your booming business and get back into the game on a bigger scale.... then what?

Will you still be telling us to "take it or leave it"?

Also, man in your position should learn to have a thicker skin. Condescending attitudes to your loyal customers is the height of CEO arrogance.

But be careful, you might get what you wish for. Maybe the folks at Tomy will take notice of your booming business and get back into the game on a bigger scale.... then what?




There are posts about just this in another group. I will post links on the collecting forum.

As much as I like the AW's cars, I tend to agree ... the harder iwheels cars are to get, the less I want them. I don't like being forced to buy what I don't like, just to get the few cars that I do want. In the past, I always bought a complete sets of everything they put out, usually more than one set... but not anymore. Too many variations, too many restrictions, too much hassle. So instead of buying the usual 24-30 plus cars, I bought 12, spent almost as much as when I would buy complete sets, only this time I feel like I couldn't get the cars I really wanted, and it leaves a bit of bad taste in my mouth.

I miss the JL days when you get a case of 12 for 110 bucks. Now, that same 12 will cost you 160 bucks, or more... so naturally OUR expectations are higher, as well they should be. The more money we spend, the higher our expectations are going to be.
We're WORKING class guys, get it? We're not uber rich men like Tom, who are also fortunate enough to make millions on the hobbies we love ... so cut us some slack.

But Tom is right about one thing, it is our money and his "take it or leave it" approach is typical of most CEO's...so no one should be surprised by that. I for one, choose not to buy as many cars and I can see myself buying less and less ... not because of Tom's attitude, I expect CEO's to be unsympathetic and out of touch with the customer ... but because I don't have unlimited resources and as the prices increase, my money buys less. Now, add in AW's marketing tactics and the product becomes less appealing to me. So, like many others here... I will take his advise, and buy less.

And here's the real kicker... have you seen what White Lightning have been going for on ebay lately? Cars that once commanded 75 bucks, like the JL WL Mustang, are going for as little as 20 bucks... so it might be best to wait a year or two, or even three years before paying extortionist's rates on ebay

Dealing with the "new" AW is like going to your favorite restaurant wanting to order a steak, and then being told you have to buy 4 orders of boiled squid and 2 tofu burgers before you're "allowed" to order the steak you came there for.

Hey Tom ... instead of pushing people like me into buying complete sets when we only want one, two or three cars from that set, why not sell ALL the cars individually ... keep the standard cars at 15 bucks and make the first lap cars and iwheels at 30 bucks a car? In the end, I bet you will sell more cars, you can remake only the cars that sell the best, making the less popular cars more desirable to collectors for their rarity ... and everyone is happy.

In my case, instead of buying the 3 first lap cars I REALLY wanted and the 3 iwheels cars I REALLY REALLY wanted... I won't be allowed to buy ANY of them, unless I pay for the other 6 cars I don't want ... and your response is "take it or leave it" ?

Ok, it's your world rock star.

But be careful, you might get what you wish for. Maybe the folks at Tomy will take notice of your booming business and get back into the game on a bigger scale.... then what?

Will you still be telling us to "take it or leave it"?

Also, man with your money should learn to have a thicker skin. Condescending attitudes to your loyal customers is the height of CEO arrogance.

Well put, you obviously are better at expressing the feeling than I was...

Total nonsense! We NEVER could buy just the WLs we wanted direct from the factory so we haven't lost anything. We now have the added option of buying ALL the WLs if we so choose. So we have more options now than before.

The steak dinner analogy is ridiculous. The AW restaurant NEVER offered steak dinners before. Here's a better analogy. We got their steaks in the back alley from scalping waiters who scarfed them off of plates before they were served to others. Now the waiters are PO'd.

With the popularity and ease of online auctions, AW could simply be acknowledging that people who really want a few of the chase cars can buy a set and auction off those they don't want as much. The choices are still ours.

Total nonsense! We NEVER could buy just the WLs we wanted direct from the factory so we haven't lost anything. We now have the added option of buying ALL the WLs if we so choose. So we have more options now than before.

With the popularity and ease of online auctions, AW could simply be acknowledging that people who really want a few of the chase cars can buy a set and auction off those they don't want as much. The choices are still ours.

EXACTLY, well said. I am not loving throwing around 500.00 for a set of cars, but when you break it down to about 25.00 a car (about what you pay for tomys cars in the hobbyshops) I'll just sell of the ones I don't want at the price I bought them at.

And just one more thing we all have to keep in mind. Tom has been flamed and praised on this board from time to time, he has tried different marketing techniques to please everyone, and for once he speaks up to basically say "Guys I'm trying to please you all, buy if you want, keep your money if you want". I don't think he will lose his customer base.

No Tk... they just hang steaks in the window, put up a sign that says steaks for sale, and then when you get inside you find out that you have to buy the tofu burgers and squid before you're granted the priviledge of buying the steak. Sorry, but if my mouth is watering for steak, tofu ain't gonna get it done.

How could it hurt anyone... AW, hobby shops, collectors or racers if the cars were sold individually? AW could still offer discounts on complete sets, while still getting their mark up on chase cars. Hobby shops and dealers can decide which cars their customers want and stock up on those accordingly, the less popular cars would wind up being produced in lower numbers which would only serve to increase their value over time, making collectors happy and racers can buy only the cars they wanted.

Everyone wins, right?

I am not loving throwing around 500.00 for a set of cars, but when you break it down to about 25.00 a car (about what you pay for tomys cars in the hobbyshops) I'll just sell of the ones I don't want at the price I bought them at.

It's great you have an extra 500 bucks lying around, so YOU have those options... but about those who don't have that kind of extra coin laying around? Does that make them, their opinions and desires for the cars they want less valid? Some of you guys sure make it sound that way.

Also, for 25 bucks, you get a much better chassis from Tomy... so that point is moot.

Also, what makes you think people are going to buy the cars you don't want?
I see the less popular cars going for as little as 6 bucks on ebay... so much for getting back what you paid for them, huh?

Give the people what they want, cars sold individually and in discounted sets, that way EVERYONE is happy

It's great you have an extra 500 bucks lying around, so YOU have those options... but about those who don't have that kind of extra coin laying around? Does that make them, their opinions and desires for the cars they want less valid? Some of you guys sure make it sound that way.

Also, for 25 bucks, you get a much better chassis from Tomy... so that point is moot.

Also, what makes you think people are going to buy the cars you don't want?
I see the less popular cars going for as little as 6 bucks on ebay... so much for getting back what you paid for them, huh?

Give the people what they want, cars sold individually and in discounted sets, that way EVERYONE is happy

In trying to hit on every point, I don't have 500.00 laying around, I use paypal, which is essentially mastercard.
To me a white thunder car for 25.00 IS a far better deal then any Tomy car, but then again, I am all about the tjet/afx racing style. so this points a push.
If people don't want the white thunders I don't want, I'll keep them and pay mr.mastercard his money.

And your last point. sell cars individually and offer a discount for full sets. I agree, this would be a dream come true. And I would have bought 6 Nomads and 12 55 chevys. :)

My 2 cents
I see that more people are unhappy than happy about his new marketing..Hope Tom reads all the feedback..Hopefully things will get better for all.

I don't tend to the run the chassis as I modify and fit the bodies to Tomy chassis, so the QC issue does not affect me. But I will say if the Super III does not have better quality control then it will crash and burn.

I'm not saying that because AW chose not to incorporate my magnet idea into it, just that it an attempt at a seriously quick in line and should have QC and a price to match those asperations.

The other thing is the situation where occasionally a body ends up sitting way too high, such as with the recent Can-Am. I really would like to see that stop. I can see where a lot of Tom's frustration comes from, but on that one issue any criticism that comes is deserved.

When a company has the chance to see how bad a first article body sits and does nothing about it, it suggests they do not care. I'm sure that is not the case with AW, but you can see how it might look like it.

When in this world did it become nessasary that "everyone" was able to get just what they wanted? Your "happiness" is up to you. If there is something that you really want, it's up to you to do what you have to to get it, freedom doesn't mean it's free!

I've been following along, meddling a bit, and really enjoying this thread. Perhaps order will come from chaos.

Lets be real guys! The pancake design has more monkey motion than the ape house. Thats not Tom's fault, I credit him solely for keeping it alive.

Think about it. The pancake has many critical close tolerance points, and the whole shebang has to snap together like a perfect Oreo cookie. We all know that close tolerance work takes more time and therefore costs extra dough.

I've got some Tomy/AFX China chassis that just flat rip the track up right out'a the box. The tolerances are tighter than a frogs butt. So I'm not buying the whole blame it on "China Syndrome".

I will however concede that AW is trying to produce an affordable product and the kind of close tolerance work required to bring the ancient chassis design around could easily double retail cost. Lest we forget a looming, monstrous engineering and retooling expense.

It came to me that AW is caught in the crossfire between the collector
"leave it on the shelf types", the racers who expect some grunt and performance, the ever rising costs of trying to do business and still trying to keep it affordable for the average Joe slot head.

Again lets be real. There's always gonna be some nit picking over this car, or that color, and why in the heck did ya put blue glass in that one? It has always been such in slot land. Take a trip in the Wayback Machine and remember some of the abominations of the past, if you need a quick reminder. snicker.

There's no doubt that AW produces some finely detailed bodies. What you don't like can be painted, decal plastered, glass swapped to your own personal liking. Again as it has always been in slot land.

I'll now climb further out on a limb and proffer the idea that perhaps a retooled, closer tolerance chassis, for the performance crowd is in order. For myself, and from what others have stated, I'd be willing to pony up for quality. In essence you'd have a shelf version and a street/strip version of the venerable pancake design. Many guys already convert gearsets, arms & magnets, wheels and axles just like it has always been. The underlying problem is that no matter how many parts you throw at it, the chassis and the gear rack are the weak link. Yeah, I know it's a pipe dream. :rolleyes:

Seems like some newspeak Oxy-moron, so I'm not really sure what the term "positive criticism" means, but perhaps one of you new agers can educate an old dog and help me to candy coat my critiques to make them more palatable for the more sensitive types. :p

We're not criticizing Toms humanity! We're pickin apart his little cars, such as slot heads have done since the beginning. If there was no whining we'd all still be racing vibes! The AW chassis are irregular and have been for some time!???? an' dat's da truth! :p

How these cars are marketed is Tom's decision, we all live and die by the sword. Sins of omission and commission as it were. The ensuing chaos of circumnavigating the "sales chain of command" has ruffled the pecking order a bit.

Sure the gotta do this before ya do that marketing plan is too convoluted for a nimrod like me that wants what I want and doesnt like to navigate an obstacle course to get it.

Be it right or wrong, some how Tom got it in his head that he needed to excercise some control on scalping, stratospheric dealer markups, and auction piracy. As a former businessman I would see this more of in the perspective of what's right then what's wrong. "Hey people really like my cars!"

I do not agree with trying to control whats beyond my own bottom line, in the thought that it could directly and adversly affect another affiliated businessmens bottom line. Provide a good product, make your sales, and go to the bank if your lucky!

In trying to please all of the people all the time, and police slotcar piracy;
Tom made some unpopular decisions, and only time will tell.

I would like to point out that by enlarge, if you look back in the AW forum, you'll find an overwhelming amount of positive critiques and kudos. Myself included. I would hope that Tom takes the time to revisit this and realize that the bulk of the flak will pass. ;)

This forum is an oppurtinity to share ideas, techniques, and opinions. From time to time your gonna get a shot across your bow. I see fire, passion, intelelct, and experience gushing at all times. Granted it's not always politically correct, gracious or candy coated.

I would again hope that Tom would see that like Bobzilla intimated, slotheads are his greatest development asset/focus group and find a way to glean the nuggets..... and then forgive us....after all we're only human....and like most slotters are goverened by that original ten year old child who got his first car. :tongue:

[QUOTE=Bill Hall]I've been following along, meddling a bit, and really enjoying this thread. Perhaps order will come from chaos.

Seems like some newspeak Oxy-moron, so I'm not really sure what the term "positive criticism" means, but perhaps one of you new agers can educate an old dog and help me to candy coat my critiques to make them more palatable for the more sensitive types. :p

/QUOTE]


Bil lit replaces "No Offence" as the new age way of saying "I will say what I please and don't you dare get your nose out of joint" :rolleyes:

another excuse for people to be rude to each other and suffer no moral guilt. Or as real people say.... The Term used so they can act like a baby and they shouldn't be spanked.. VERY HARD.. lol....Take responsibilty is now a foreign concept.


Coach HARD RIGHT :wave:


Oh mylord this thread got old real fast...All those not impressed by AW please let it go? And lets get back to small TOY cars we all love to race around lil TOY tracks.. Thank you very very much for at least considering it before you flame me for saying stop your bloody whinning...I can't take the laughing at you anymore my belly hurts...

BTW No offense... :wave:

Well, I read through this thread and it would appear that more people are happy, or unconcerned, with the current marketing and production strategy than are bothered by it; at least from those who have written and expressed an opinion. The marketplace will be the true test.
I only wish to make a couple points:

1) I want to thank anyone who puts up their own money and time to produce something for this hobby. This includes Tom Lowe. He did something no one attempted in about 30 years - reproduce the Aurora compatible cars and chassis. I think he's done a fine job. We may bicker about the quality ( I really am not qualified to make a judgement), but they are mass produced toys and cheaper than any other slot car available.

2) I have no problem with the cost of standard cars. In fact, we should all expect significant price increases as the price of oil rises. Add to that the fact that the US dollar is falling in comparision with other foreign currency means that it costs more in US dollars to produce the same item this year as opposed to last. I remember less than 2 years ago a US dollar was worth almost $2 Australian. Now it's worth about $1.20.

3) I believe the new marketing strategy for AW will fail on a couple levels. And if it does, it could effect the future outlook for continuing production and bringing new product to market. This is just my opinion.

3a) Making the special cars only available as part of a package which needs to bought directly from AW will mean that sets of cars bought from vendors will not entitle you to buy the limited edition cars. This will mean less sales for vendors, vendors will buy less stock and the outlets for the cars will dry up.

3b) I go to a lot of shows. I have yet to see a vendor driving a Porsche he bought from the profits of a White Lightning. IF YOU HONESTLY BELIEVE THAT YOU CAN MAKE MONEY BY BUYING MASTER CASES OF CARS, TAKING OUT THE WLs AND SELLING THEM, THEN YOU SHOULD BE DOING IT. From all the posts, it sounds like a no-brainer. I personally never had a problem with being charged extra for a WL. It saved me from having to buy cases of cars I did not want. And I could decide what I considered to be a fair price.

3c) It seems the new plan for producing many variations is popular, as may be the upcoming policy of random case lots. However, I think you will find it is popular only with those who buy a very limited number of cars in each release. The guys who bought at least one, and maybe more, complete sets of cars will not be happy. So, you have ticked off the guys who were buying one or two cases of each release in favor of those who may buy three or four cars.

4) No one says you have to buy one of everything or even anything. You are in charge of what you buy. It's true. I am in charge.

5) When the slow selling cars start backing up on vendors and they no longer have the WLs to help bail them out, don't expect to see your favorite vendor carrying the next release.

6) When the vendors no longer have their regular customers buying case loads of cars, don't be surprised when they no longer consider it a viable product. At that point, the AW website may be your only outlet, which will mean full retail pricing.

7) I personally like to support my favorite vendors. After the manufacturers, it's because of them that we even have product we can buy. Some do it as a sideline, others do it as a business and have family to support. They have to make the decisions that are right for them, not me or you.


Only time will tell what will happen to the AW line. I could be very wrong and this marketing stategy will have either a positive or neutral impact. However, I just don't see that happening. Time and the market will tell.

Joe

I think where you stand on these issues depends on how important you think the small dealer is to the hobby. If you came back after the internet you might not remember the days of small mail order companies or the guys that set up at the shows. It was guys like EJs Hobbies that kept a life line open.

Now that Model Motoring is on the ropes and Auto World has changed direction so only the biggest dealers can survive, the fate of the small dealer is in danger. If you have only bought off of ebay or an internet dealer this might not matter to you. If you worry about who will sell cars and parts when the hobby eventually retracts, then you see things that hurt dealers as things that hurt the hobby and hurt you.

Nowhere is it written that Tom has to be in this for the health of the hobby or the health of the small dealers. Just remember that if the vendors aren't happy, as a consumer you are probably going to see your buying choices reduced.

how happy would we be if tom quit making these things? think about that.no buisnes will please everyone.people go into buisness to make a profit.bottom line.we're talking TOY cars here,not 10-100 thousand dollar classic cars their his product he can do as he chooses,,its your money ,,,do as you choose.

When in this world did it become nessasary that "everyone" was able to get just what they wanted? Your "happiness" is up to you. If there is something that you really want, it's up to you to do what you have to to get it, freedom doesn't mean it's free!


true enough ... but it also means that we can speak out about the things we're unhappy with as well.

No one is saying that AW can't do what they want ... we're just exercising our right to express dissatisfaction. I love AW's cars, but I won't pretend to be happy about their marketing tactics just to appease a multi millionaire who's fortunate enough to make even more millions off the hobby we all love.

I think there's a real disconnect between the rich and the working the class in America ... and the "buy them all, or don't buy any" or the "take it or leave" attitudes expressed here is a microcosm of that gap.

"what if AW stopped making the cars, would you be happy then?"

Is anyone here actually dellusional enough to think that AW is making these cars just to make us happy? If they weren't making a profit, they wouldn't be making them at all ... so get real guys. Tom is not the Wizard of Oz, Santa or the Easter Bunny... he's a BUSINESS MAN, and profit is the bottom line. If he was the great benefactor some of you are trying to make him out to be, this thread wouldn't even exist.

AW is making us buy whole sets to get the fews cars we want because he's doing us a favor? Really? I have a bridge for sale for anyone who believes that.

1) I want to thank anyone who puts up their own money and time to produce something for this hobby. This includes Tom Lowe. He did something no one attempted in about 30 years - reproduce the Aurora compatible cars and chassis. I think he's done a fine job. We may bicker about the quality ( I really am not qualified to make a judgement), but they are mass produced toys and cheaper than any other slot car available.


I guess that Model Motoring was just chopped liver?

Scott

Well Tom...Since you started selling them out of your Website on Tuseday dealer sales have almost completly stopped..By now I would have had to put in additional orders for more cases , but that is not happening this time..Looks like us dealers are taking a beaten..I trully believe that you have actually hurt sales with your new get rich scheme..Only time & you will know the truth..Sales for Rel 1 were very swift & lasted for months..Reorders were up , not this time..Hobby stores & speedways no longer want to carry your product..Guys like motorcitytoyz & Steve F are already dumping because they are taking a beaten on these & don't want to get stuck with multi thousands in dead inventory..Remember its the dealers that layout all the money to finance your operation..It looks like all the dead inventory will sit in your warehouse now instead of theirs....It looks like a domino effect here..Good Luck on screwing up a good thing....
Bob Dugan

I guess that Model Motoring was just chopped liver?

Scott

Scott,
I stand corrected, I forgot all about them.

Joe

Hi Guys one point and the reason I choose to stand were I am. Dealers have always pulled WL, and then marked the hell out them, Tom saw this and said hey my investment I get the majority of the profit I took the chance, you know what he's right... I Feel for Guys like Joe is a bonafide collector most of us are not we just like to bitch and moan. Lets boycot is about the stupidist thing I have ever heard, Lets only Buy Dash, as much as I dislike Dans Buissness practices and attitude you guys still buy and he used to post a lot worse crap then Don't buy 'em. But you all went liek sheep to him, Tom also saw this and is a smart guy whine all you want its smoke and mirrors. I was pushed off the fence as I truely do not care about what color my hchassis is or anything. by a SELLER on here that refused to sell me GT 40's Why? He wanted to try and sell them at inflated prices is all I can figure.. you shot yourself guys live with it...No pity party here...But Hey I do truely respect your right to say Hey I do not like this. I am unsure how this Plan works and have to agree its very strange and not likely to succeed. BUT I do know we'll all be buying again in 3 weeks.

Dealer tip... Log on to AW buy all the cases and Ipod wheels or whatevers and go sell them at inflated prices on ebay like you always have.. you may just not be able to make the product look bad by doing a dump of what ya have left.. Sell smarter not dumber...


Good luck guys.. peace and love.

how happy would we be if tom quit making these things? think about that.no buisnes will please everyone.people go into buisness to make a profit.bottom line.we're talking TOY cars here,not 10-100 thousand dollar classic cars their his product he can do as he chooses,,its your money ,,,do as you choose.

Not to be argumentitive, but how happy are you going to be if you have to buy a minimum of 6 cars at a time at full retail, including some you don't want? A collector would buy all six, I'm guessing most people would not. You'd sell the one's you don't like? My guess is that would get real old real fast. Plus, you'd have to sell the undesireable cars for far less than what you paid (otherwise, why buy from you?), thereby raising the cost of the one's you keep. You'll go through the hassle of eBay or buy a table at a show. Seems like a lot of work to get the one or two cars you wanted.
How happy are you going to be if no new cars are produced because there's too much dead stock lying around? Vendors need to make money (or at least break even) too. None of them are going to buy a full case just so you can get your favorite car.
Look how cheap the JL cars are and how many small vendors still have them. If Tom stopped making cars, it would be too bad. However, there are still untold thousands of JL cars still around. Maybe then those small vendors could recoup their investment.
Make it easy and affordale for the collector to buy one or two sets of cars and you move a lot of stock. Put the stock solely in the hands of vendors and watch the orders continue to come.
And remember, although vendors pulled WLs from the cases, you didn't have to buy them unless you liked the price. And then you could buy only the one's you liked. Personally, I think $25 is the highest I ever paid for a WL. That $25 was sure cheaper than buying another case hoping it contained the car I wanted. I passed on the release 1 WLs.
We'll see how it plays out.

Joe

?"

Is anyone here actually dellusional enough to think that AW is making these cars just to make us happy? If they weren't making a profit, they wouldn't be making them at all ... so get real guys. Tom is not the Wizard of Oz, Santa or the Easter Bunny... he's a BUSINESS MAN, and profit is the bottom line. If he was the great benefactor some of you are trying to make him out to be, this thread wouldn't even exist.

AW is making us buy whole sets to get the fews cars we want because he's doing us a favor? Really? I have a bridge for sale for anyone who believes that.

VJ, You make my point, Tom Lowe is a business man who has to look out for himself and is not doing this as a favor to us. I commend him for trying to make money at something he likes doing. No, I wouldn't want him to stop making cars and actually hope he comes through with 1/32 cars too.
I guess it is because I don't have to have every variation that his marketing strategy doesn't bother me. I'm just glad he isn't forcing me to buy a slot car for $20 like Model Motoring did that wouldn't run at all when I can get a car for $12-15 that I can tweak to run really well. I'm also glad there is a deverse group of dedicated sloters such as yourself that believes we should hash out all there is in the slot car universe. 'Nuf said?

Maybe the easist solution would be to stop making the whites.This is just a marketing tool to get you to buy every car made.No iw's,no dealers complaining about not being able to make a profit.No consumers saying they are getting ripped off by dealers or ebay.One of the things that you get stuck with as a dealer is that you have to order complete sets of cars, not single models.You can bet in the next few weeks you will see the Ford GT's on ebay and the Chaparral's on dusty shelves.I think the dealersshould be able to order 50 Ford GT's or 25 Nomads or 5 Chaparrals.Years ago the hobby shops could buy t-jets or afx 6 to a box.I ordered the whites just to get the nomad.I'll probably sell the other whites when they come in.The most important thing is to buy these cars because you like them,not as an investment. Tom Stumpf

Guys like motorcitytoyz & Steve F are already dumping because they are taking a beaten on these & don't want to get stuck with multi thousands in dead inventory.
Bob Dugan


Same with Bud's. I just bought two cars from him, one t-jet chaparral and one X-trac yellow firebird... for 10 bucks each.

Listen, no one is saying that AW can't make a profit, or run their biz anyway they want... and we can choose not buy them. It's shame it's coming down to that though. All AW had to do was make every car available individually, charging different rates for standard and chase cars... and this thread wouldn't have a life.

GIVE THE PEOPLE WANT THEY WANT! .... or face the wrath of we peasants :wave:

And what are we debating... the ablity to spend MORE money with AW?
They left at least 200 bucks of my money on the table with this new scheme, pennies to Tom... but that's real money to us working stiffs.

Maybe the easist solution would be to stop making the whites.This is just a marketing tool to get you to buy every car made.No iw's,no dealers complaining about not being able to make a profit.No consumers saying they are getting ripped off by dealers or ebay.One of the things that you get stuck with as a dealer is that you have to order complete sets of cars, not single models.You can bet in the next few weeks you will see the Ford GT's on ebay and the Chaparral's on dusty shelves.I think the dealersshould be able to order 50 Ford GT's or 25 Nomads or 5 Chaparrals.Years ago the hobby shops could buy t-jets or afx 6 to a box.I ordered the whites just to get the nomad.I'll probably sell the other whites when they come in.The most important thing is to buy these cars because you like them,not as an investment. Tom Stumpf


I like that Idea..I have white paint and even white resin dye, who wants a white Porsche 500 spyder from Stinkwerks? lol.... :wave:

I like that Idea..I have white paint and even white resin dye, who wants a white Porsche 500 spyder from Stinkwerks? lol.... :wave:


ME!.. got pics?