Why do we need so many different classes at big races? Why not go back to the way oval was when it started with just two classes stock and modified like the old days.

There are several reasons,I think the cost factor is what got it all started,then there were the flood of racers that were quitting because they couldn't compete when we went to 4 cell racing and chassis set up & driving skill became so critical,that's when I noticed a huge downturn in oval.

This has been debated a thousand times. It will never go back to just two classes. We are too accustomed to choice and we want to be able to chose that which appeals to us specifically.

When I started racing it was 6-cell Stock and 7-cell Modified. Stock was SUPPOSED to be the beginners class, (yeah right), and Mod. was for experienced. Unfortunately there were more "sponsored" drivers in stock than Mod. and that ran off the real beginers or those who didn't have unlimited resources to be able to compete. So other "beginner" class were created to give the budget racer or non-blood thirsty racer a place to race and not have to mortgage the farm to be competitive. Hence classes like SPEC racing, Legends and others.

Now the choices are endless. It's up to the tracks to find which classes best suit their clientel and make the race program work and be conducive to growth and fun.

Well, the BRL race series only
3 classes: 13.5, 4300, Mod. and is well
organized.
KJ

Well, the BRL race series only
3 classes: 13.5, 4300, Mod. and is well
organized.
KJ

And like in the "old" days brushless is still new give it time and you will see the same thing happen.

Why do we need so many different classes at big races? Why not go back to the way oval was when it started with just two classes stock and modified like the old days.


In order for things to go back to 'the old days' and only run (I never saw only 2 classes, there were always at least 3) they way it USE TO BE.

"Specialty Cars" need to go away, and we'd need to go back to a ONE CAR Fits all types of tracks car (RC10, aluminum tub or YOKOMO DogFighter 4wd car)

These were run Indoors, Outdoors, Oval, Off-Road, etc.

This was just 1/10th scale, while there was still 1/8th scale and 1/12th scale back then too (I REMEMBER those guys asking WHY WE NEEDED 1/10th scale cars in the first place)

When 1/10th scale went to the old WIDE Pan Cars, the RC Progression jumped on a FAST TRACK of "specialty" cars, which came just after but almost the same time as the Custom Works 4wd DOMINATOR which also changed the face of DIRT OVAL RACING.

At that time Off-Road was about the only 1/10th venue NOT faced w/ MAJOR changes....but after the RC10t came out, they also faced changes w/ "Specialty" vehicles and rapid "TECHNOLOGY" improvements.

ALL these things drive NEW BLOOD out of this hobby...and increase the INTENSITY level of competition amongst the OLD TIMERS who stay up with it...because the cars just keep getting FASTER and FASTER and FASTER...and NEW guys too often have no clue where to even start...and/or are intimidated to try.

OR LIKE MY SON SAYS..."Dad, why would ANYONE want to spend $1000.00+ on RC Cars when the could buy the PS2, Multiple Games and Controls...and NEVER NEED TO LEAVE the HOUSE...and deal with all these people."

Well I got out of the hobby 11 years ago when it was becoming a money hobby and it wasn't fun anymore. You would think there was a million dollars at stake the way people acted.

I just got back into it and have started new classes at the local track to keep the cost down and do it for fun. We run stock touring car oval and stock 4 cell pan with nastruck bodies and the guys that run with us are just fun type guys and don't go off if someone bumps them or spins them out. We are even geting kids in our classes and we really help eachother out to get everyone up to speed so we can all be competive.. There are still those guys with all the money at the track with their computers and dynos etc that run 4 cell stock and turn 3 laps more than we do but they are not having as much fun.. Now it feels like the old days being fun and not stressful.

Just wanted to add some things.

I just started racing pan cars a bout 6 months ago started with 4 cell stock 27 turn.At first I ran 70 laps other guys running 78 laps.So went out bought several motors f brushed puttum brushes 767 brushes bushing reamer hood alinement tool dyno lathe brush cutter ect and with the best motor I could build could only run 75 laps 5 laps better but sill 3 to 4 laps down.

Then we started running 13.5 first time 78 laps and the better drivers 79 to 80.

So what I am saying is brushless made the untouchable with in toughing distance and made the whole field very close in times.

And in 4300 I am right there with the guys that have been racing for years.

Brushless is so close and befor it gets out of control we should keep it that way.

If you want to blow your whole paycheck then do it in mod.

Jake

Just wanted to add some things.

I just started racing pan cars a bout 6 months ago started with 4 cell stock 27 turn.At first I ran 70 laps other guys running 78 laps.So went out bought several motors f brushed puttum brushes 767 brushes bushing reamer hood alinement tool dyno lathe brush cutter ect and with the best motor I could build could only run 75 laps 5 laps better but sill 3 to 4 laps down.

Then we started running 13.5 first time 78 laps and the better drivers 79 to 80.

So what I am saying is brushless made the untouchable with in toughing distance and made the whole field very close in times.

And in 4300 I am right there with the guys that have been racing for years.

Brushless is so close and befor it gets out of control we should keep it that way.

If you want to blow your whole paycheck then do it in mod.

Jake

I agree with you Jake!
That's the problem with brushed motors. Its too easy to bend the rules!

I think we are seeing a gradual shift again,the tracks i have raced at in the past year are leaning more towards the stock-spec-truck-rtr type classes.there is a 2-1 split on heats there,with pro stock and 19t-mod classes barely enough to race. and now with this brushless stuff,it may get more refined yet. we'll see.

There are a lot of great points made above. But, having been in this hobby for almost 30 years now I really believe that what needs to happen is for tracks to have the same rules for each class more than anything. Used to be that ROAR rules were standard issue. Either nobody respects roar or just dont want to follow their rules anymore. BRL has a great thing going but my home track for example (not kicking them in the chops really) is a BRL race track and weekly rules are not being followed or teched. So that adds to body expense, motor expense just to name a couple. ARCOR has all the right ideas and good leadership but is not large enough to cover the country. But even with all that said, to many track have different rules and to go from one to another may require a different motor, body, # of cells, mah of cells and the list can go on. WE NEED A STANDARD to follow again or at least get the tracks around the country on board the same train and on the same set of tracks to make an impact. This I would like to think would help things for those who have limited budgets, or some (like me) who just simply want the same rules everywhere I go. And possibly at the same time limit classes to around 3 in most cases

LOL,Rob i didn't think you were that old!!!!

I know, I know. Now is where the cracks like "you been in this so long, a hop up for a grasshopper was a speed secret". As a matter of fact it was :D


Rob


For you younglings out here that may not know. The Grasshopper came with a 380 mabuchi and the hop up kit was a 540 mabuchi motor with a 19 tooth pinion gear. Woo hoo:freak:

ALL these things drive NEW BLOOD out of this hobby...and increase the INTENSITY level of competition amongst the OLD TIMERS who stay up with it...because the cars just keep getting FASTER and FASTER and FASTER...and NEW guys too often have no clue where to even start...and/or are intimidated to try.



I agree 100% on this, biggest problem is rules, not that there are 4-5 people trying to make them, or the dozen or so "nationals", but that when there is a spec class built it often gets exploited by the "old timers" in this sense. New guy never has a chance even in the beginners class. 2nd problem is transponders, every is worried how fast they are running to the tenth, every week.

i agree im a new driver i bought a l4 and im juming in head first and its hard to keep up with these guys with their fat wallets my brother race din the 80s and hes my mechanic..oh goody for him lol anyway i agree whole hearted with you guys the guys i race run a 6.5 lap and i run a 7 sec ond lap next year ill be running a 6 and they'll be runnning 5s when will they stop getting faster

Everyone likes to win, but not everyone can. The solution is for the fast racers in any class to help get the slower racers up to speed. If you can help make the last place racer's car better than it was when he showed up, chances are he will have fun. If you can help people see that like anything it is going to take time to get better running oval, then chances are they might stick. In our instant gratification world people want to see immediate results. Get people to look at their lap times not to just compare to the fast driver, but to also compare to themselves week by week. I learned this lesson in off-road that I'm not going to win by being on my lid. I look at my lap times for consistency. If I can string 10+ laps in a row with the same exact time then I'm getting the most out of my driving and my car at that moment. If it is faster than I went last week then it is even better. If you help the racers in YOUR class get better, chances are they won't move to another class or create a new class to try and win.

I would guess the reason "the old days" were more fun wasn't because there were fewer classes but because the racers were more of a family. It is the win at all costs attitude that hurts racing, which I'm just as guilty of.

Well, here is some good news. The oval series in Glenn Burnie MD (http://mdhobbytown.com), has a "rookie" class which is attracting some attention from racers of all ages. Its also not unusual to see one of the better drivers helping a rookie.

In addition, there are also some drivers (like myself) that consistently make up the "B" and "C" mains who are in it for the fun. Sure there's a big gap between the faster guys and us goofballs. But the "C" main is where the action is.

It also seems like there's some good attendance at this race. Coincidence?

The people who can't come to grips with the fact that they aren't being beaten by money are destined to quit. I think that is inevitable.

Also, when people think someone has out spent them to win they always focus on the motors and batteries. In reality the only area where there is a real advantage in outspending is tires. Tires are the real expense in oval racing and having the right tires at the right sizes is probably the biggest difference between the "haves" and "have nots". If you show up at the track with one set of tires and that's all you've got for the day it'll be tough to compete with the typical experienced guy and his big box of tires. This is much more true for foam racing then caps though.

The biggest thing in racing is maintenance. If you look at the cars in last main you won't see too many pristine carefully assembled rides. If you look at the cars in the A-main you will see nothing but pristine carefully assembled rides. It takes a fair amount of work to become good and stay good at this hobby and those unwilling to put in the time or accept being in the lower mains will quit.

No matter what kind of class someone comes up with you can't stop another racer from simply working harder than you and that guy will ultimately win.

The old days were great, But with todays technology. Cars are faster handle better and cost more than 15+ years ago. I recently raced 13.5, had the best time. Been racing 4300 and getting slayed. I beleive listening to the amainers, will help you. Find out what works for them and only buy what you need. I remember 20 years ago, newbies could buy a new offroad car. And kick our butts. Thats just not the same anymore. Look at 1/8 scale buggys, every week theres something new you have to have.

shadow you here?????

I don't think that the cars are that much faster, it's the available information that's made everyone faster,overall oval racing is much cheaper than it was 15-16 years ago.

I don't think that the cars are that much faster, it's the available information that's made everyone faster,overall oval racing is much cheaper than it was 15-16 years ago.


I tend to agree that most things are really cheaper. Motors are more expensive, but last and run much longer, so cheaper in the long run...batteries (for GOOD ones) are actually cheaper because MORE of them are good... bodies are about the same give or take 2-4 bucks...

TIRES seem to be more expensive...but that may be because I had a TIRE deal at one time...and during that time the prices went up, and I didn't notice it for quite a while.

(TIRES are my #1 HATED purchase)

(..speaking of TIRES....what the HECK happened to the Quality of WHEELS. In 21 years I've NEVER had the wheel issues I had in 2006. FIRST RUN Broken BSR, JACO and BLACK TRC Wheels. These are all SHINY Black wheels...the old DULL/SATIN "nylon looking" wheels NEVER had this kind of issue. TIRES didn't chunk...but wheels SHATTERED~)

I'd love to try some RC4LESS (But I hate the ORANGE), and/or MURDOCKS...but I still have too many of these others I need to use up. (AT the breakage rate...it will only take 3 or 4 more races.)

i agree im a new driver i bought a l4 and im juming in head first and its hard to keep up with these guys with their fat wallets my brother race din the 80s and hes my mechanic..oh goody for him lol anyway i agree whole hearted with you guys the guys i race run a 6.5 lap and i run a 7 sec ond lap next year ill be running a 6 and they'll be runnning 5s when will they stop getting faster

hey macrac.. i also race at the grove in spec truck, and 7 second car class. i think don has gone in the right direction with the break-out classes. the only thing i want to add is a class for cars that are also a 6 sec. break-out class. i think this year should feature...

a truck class with 8 sec. breakout
a car class with a 7 sec breakout and
a 6 second car class breakout. i was running the later part of 06 and i, with a 19 turn, was running 6.60 laps and the car was pushing. i was also a big oval guy in the early 90's when it became a money fest. i like the idea of a breakout...... i think it makes the racing more fun to know you do not have to be the fastest.

In allout heads up racing, money will ALWAYS be the main driving force behind speed. Two drivers of equal ability will be divided by who can keep the freshest tires or motors or batteries in their car. Money buys the best. You most magic chassis setup won't compensate for worn out tires or old batteries. I get so tired of the BS about "it's all in the chassis". Yeah right, tell me that as you bolt on the third set of tires for the day. Just be honest, once ability has been equaled out, hardware will win.
And to be competitive costs money. Plain and simple.

That is why you see so many classes. Tracks and racers are trying to create that perfect class that has mass appeal to the casual racer without disintegrating their wallet.

Craig,Mike Moore told me years ago that"it's a $100.00 a tenth".that was after he won the roar nats at peach bowl!!!

....
(TIRES are my #1 HATED purchase)

(..speaking of TIRES....what the HECK happened to the Quality of WHEELS. In 21 years I've NEVER had the wheel issues I had in 2006. FIRST RUN Broken BSR, JACO and BLACK TRC Wheels. These are all SHINY Black wheels...the old DULL/SATIN "nylon looking" wheels NEVER had this kind of issue. TIRES didn't chunk...but wheels SHATTERED~)



Tires mfgrs. were catering to their team drivers for lighter rims, less rolling mass. Forget about the out of pocket racer who has to pay for those things. One slight touch to the wall and the tire is trashed. So you get to buy another. Good marketing ploy, ya think?

The ridiculous cost of tires is probably the biggest complaint of racers.

That's why I don't understand these guys that want to run foams outdoors? the cost is rediculois(sp) Caps are expensive enough,but nowhere near foams?

AMEN Pepe! One set of foams vs. one set of caps.....about the same retail price. One set of foams .... good for two weekends of racing IF YOUR LUCKY! One set of caps ... good for most of the summer!

If your paved track stays on foams, don't complain about the cost of racing!

I have been there, I finally decided to run TM's and have never looked back.I tend to agree that most things are really cheaper. Motors are more expensive, but last and run much longer, so cheaper in the long run...batteries (for GOOD ones) are actually cheaper because MORE of them are good... bodies are about the same give or take 2-4 bucks...

TIRES seem to be more expensive...but that may be because I had a TIRE deal at one time...and during that time the prices went up, and I didn't notice it for quite a while.

(TIRES are my #1 HATED purchase)

(..speaking of TIRES....what the HECK happened to the Quality of WHEELS. In 21 years I've NEVER had the wheel issues I had in 2006. FIRST RUN Broken BSR, JACO and BLACK TRC Wheels. These are all SHINY Black wheels...the old DULL/SATIN "nylon looking" wheels NEVER had this kind of issue. TIRES didn't chunk...but wheels SHATTERED~)

I'd love to try some RC4LESS (But I hate the ORANGE), and/or MURDOCKS...but I still have too many of these others I need to use up. (AT the breakage rate...it will only take 3 or 4 more races.)

The cost of tires are killing the sport, foams or caps.
$15.00-$20.00 a pair is very high.

I think the rims need to be made thicker for strength, to much
emphasis on weight.

Just my two cents...

As far as tires there are so many compounds and combinations to choose from esp foams. Then you go and buy a new tire and cut half the rubber off of it before it sees the track. But tires are the most important part of the cars performance so what do you do. You could run a spec class but I'd rather run with the fast guysif I can. Caps are expensive but they last so much longer and you don't have to true them up all the time. Don't matter if it's a toy car or a real car tires prob will always be the biggest cost the only way to cut it would be like IMCA and other org do is have a tire rule but I doubt that would ever happen unless you run a spec class.

They are, TM Makes themThe cost of tires are killing the sport, foams or caps.
$15.00-$20.00 a pair is very high.

I think the rims need to be made thicker for strength, to much
emphasis on weight.

Just my two cents...

I really haven't seen or experienced much of a problem with breaking foam tire rims in years. Persoanlly I will stay with the stiffer "breakable" rims. I bought 3 or 4 sets of one of the soft brands and they deformed with only moderate tightening of the screws.

Cap tires present there own set of hassles. Yes, they last much longer but when you do wear one out you need to have a replacement scrubbed in and run multiple times or you won't be fast again that race day. Caps are much less consistent than foams. When I'm running foams and I wear out a set I can be confident I'll put a new set on be just as fast. When I wear out a set of caps I think oh god I might be out to lunch for the next 3 race days until I can manage to get another set of caps on the car that feel right.

We race mostly caps and some drivers say the same as you, myself included but I try not to get caught unprepared. If I know I have a tire getting ready to wear out I will practice a new one and put it up until I need it. I race foams too but they chunk and wear quickly ultimately costing more to run than caps but you can recover from a tire change almost immediately. It all boils down to if you love to race you will deal with the tires no matter what they are as long as they are true. Right before John took over BSR the radials were the worst tire ever made, properly colored they would have made great Easter eggs. Now the BSR radials are as close to perfect as anyone could expect.

Caps. My dremel tool does a excellent job preparing a new BSR to be just about where it needs to be. without seeing the track.

I would have to agree with all of you. Wow, have things changed. I just got back into racing after a 15 year hiatus. Tires, batteries, motors, and of course money is the determining factor. I just spent to much money to get back into racing at a very basic class. I had to throw away all my old rc supplies (outdated). I understand that. But I was not prepared for what all I need to just go racing in 2007. I used to race all of the east coast, everything was consistent. Stock in Pa. was stock in Va. I was at three different tracks in the last month and every track had their own rules and classes. What? How does this help the sport. There needs to be a consistent general rule that every track must obey or not be sactioned to run races or events. Someone or some company need to stand up for this sport and make someting happen. But what, then he/she or them would loose money. I guess I will just have to adjust.

Yes, it certainly was nice in the 6 cell stock days when it was the same class at 97% of country and almost everyone raced it, at least for weekly races.

One thing I've noticed is that most tracks have a core group of guys who refuse to travel anywhere. Which is fine, that is their perrogative. The problem is they refuse to conform to any uniform rules. They'll say "I don't run ROAR races so who cares about those rules" or "I don't run BRL races so who cares about those rules". Unfortunately this group of guys is the majority at a lot of tracks hence no uniform rules anymore in a lot of places. Luckily for me this isn't a huge problem in my area, but we still have some of it. I don't see what we can really do about this.

Pmsimkins, I take the other side of that issue. We had ROAR rules, But then some guys in the midwest decide to start doing there own thing, and as it grows in there area, they expect the rest of the country to follow them. You may have not liked ROAR rules and they may not have worked in your area of the country but why do you expect others to conform to them. I don't know where you live or your personal racing, I was just using you and the midwest as a example.

Pmsimkins, I take the other side of that issue. We had ROAR rules, But then some guys in the midwest decide to start doing there own thing, and as it grows in there area, they expect the rest of the country to follow them. You may have not liked ROAR rules and they may not have worked in your area of the country but why do you expect others to conform to them. I don't know where you live or your personal racing, I was just using you and the midwest as a example.


I'm not quite sure how that is the other side from what I said. It sounds about the same. I do race in the midwest by the way. i would not necessarily expect say Florida racers to conform to what Wisconsin racers do or vice versa. But, there are places with 5 tracks within 200 miles and they are using 5 sets of rules, to me that is crazy.

If you're racing brushed there is ROAR or ARCOR and if you're racing brushless there is BRL. There are established rules out there the problem is the guys who don't travel don't want to conform to anything. Unfortunately that kind of sucks for those of us who do travel. But, that is the way it goes and if the majority of guys at a lot of tracks want to have different and varying rules then that is the way it'll be I guess.

Personally I don't expect anyone to conform to what I think is best. I just would like more tracks to conform to something throughout the country. Racing is racing and as long as we are all playing by the same rules I don't care what the rules are.

The nice thing about the BRL right now is omnipotent leadership. Someone has said here are the rules they are not changing midseason and either conform to them or don't race. Honestly that is what oval racers need.

In a perfect world there would be just one set of rules and each year there would be a meeting with the head office (who ever that might be) and either tweek, fix, or add some adjustments to the guidelines. This would at least equal out the playing field (track) some what. Like I mentioned before, I am getting back into this sport and I have to buy a different motor, speed controler, and body for each track. There is no general class. How is that helping this sport? The young child that recieves a car for christmas might want to go to his/her friends track to race with them, but they need to ask the parents for another motor, or special unit. This is just making the sport geared for the older people and not allowing a the young to get involved unless the parent is willing to deal out some coin. Just my opinion.

Racing Raider, I can sure understand the delima that a new person can get into these days. If I were in your shoes and starting over again, I would give brushless a hard look. All the speed in what ever class you run it in. Only three classes to deal with; 13.5, 4300 and modified and one speed control to carry all the load. AND ONLY ONE MOTOR needed per class.

I have been racing on (more on) and off for almost 20 years.

We raced dirt oval and had several classes and this was true through out the state of FL.

Jap box stock..this class was grasshoppers, bullfrog.
Then we had 6 cell stock. (I think these cars ran any kind body)
6-cell modified (Mod motors and full body)
7-cell Mod motor sprint cars.
4 wheel drive Mod (7 cell mod motors)
4 wheel drive Stock (6 cell stk motor)

This first class to die was 4wd stk then whent Jap box stock. The Ultima dominated when it came out and the cheap cars died off fast. The ultima would run with the RC10.

But R/C racing is a lot differant today. It is hard to get started. The start up cost is high. But it was when I started back in the day too.

The start up cost is less than $500,not bad when compared to other hobbies.

The start up cost is less than $500,not bad when compared to other hobbies.


Not much of a start up for $500. By cheap stuff right away and before a few races it is time for better stuff.
High end servo.
Top-end chassis.
A real radio instead of Junk.
For most, better shock's
A top end speedo
At least 2 good batt packs.
A good charger to take care of new cells.
The List goes on.

To say a start up cost $500, way low better move to $700 Plus unless like alot do buy cheaper to get going and then end up double dippin getting the real stuff. My .02

Ya, $500 is not enough. I just spent more than $700 just to get started. I bought a 3pks and a raptor car. Together that along is more than $700. PLus you add batteries, motors, TIRES, oil, gears, tools, charger, power supply, servo, speed control, body, paint, and little odd and end. And thats easly closer to a grand. Like someone mentioned earlier, if you want to compete, you better be willing to pay. The days of the grasshopper racing is over. There really is no more beginner classes, or buget racing. The closest thing to that now is the Ready Race Packages. But that still requires some upgrades to race at the drivers track of choice.

...one of the problems I see with NEWBIES is when they look to old timers for assistance on what to purchase...too many times I see and hear guys tell them they need to BUY The NEWEST GREATEST car/product from that particular drivers SPONSOR.

It would make much more sense to get these 'newbies' set up with a perfectly decent 'used' car w/ plenty of spare commonly broken parts ie: t-plates, body posts, axles, etc. There is a HUGE 'used' R/C market, and while getting NEW guys in w/ used stuff doesn't appear to help the hobby retailer, it actually DOES in the long term. (MORE people involved in RC, more people BUY RC...even if the NEW guy doesn't..the guy who SOLD the used stuff, now has Cash in Hand to buy NEW stuff)

Oval is simply a tough class to get started in and the emergence of the really good RTR offroad kits that are out there makes it even tougher to attract guys.

When I started oval was huge and that is what I wanted to race, but the people at our local club steered me towards starting off with an offroad buggy and learning to drive for a season. Then I graduated to oval racing. Unfortunately that's not how it's really done anymore. One thing that has really helped beginners is the internet. If I had had all the information that's on Hobbytalk back when I started i bet my learning curve would have been years shorter.

.02 cents on the issue....

The cost of racing is too high to get into a competitive setup for a 1/10th pan car, you need to spend $700-$1200. I Started my racing almost 12 yrs ago, and I started at the low end and made my way up the ladder, and looking back I cant believe the amounts of money I spent. I have been out of it for almost 3 1/2 yrs now, but from what I see Brushless racing may draw me back in.

I am big into Rc Airplane now, and the strides that Brushless has made in the past 2 yrs is downright amazing! Just to give you an idea I will be flying a 50cc size gas Aerobatic plane Electric(15 pound, 87 inch wingpan), with a large outrunner, and 12s Lipo`s, the total cost will be around $2500.00 not counting the radio, but a radio to fly something this size might cost $250.00, so at most $2750.00 One Time cost until you want something better!

Now Figure an Smaller .40 size Gas/Electric Conversion/Primary Trainer plane, might run you about $700.00 to $800.00 One Time Cost until you upgrade.

Now figure out how much to get started in Oval Carpet racing in a Competitive Form

Car=$275.00+
Good Speedo=$200.00+
3 good Batteries at least $150.00+
Good radio system $350.00+
Couple sets of tires $200.00+
Couple Good Stock Motors $150.00+
Descent Charger $175.00+

Thats $1500.00 right there to start off!!!
Not to mention all the tools and equipment needed to work and repair the car.

Now like others have said now the recurrent tire bill every couple weeks, could be as much as $100.00 depending on what you buy.

Now the batteries are not good enough so 6 months later you have to buy 3 new packs another $150.00

Now you need new motors, so theres maybe another $75.00

All the brushes, and motor equipment every other week $$$$$$$$

It all adds up! Trust me I did the math last year and just about fell over when I got the total Cost of my 12 yr racing career

This is why I think brushless will change the hobby as we know it sooner than later, look at it this way you pay $250.oo upfront for the motor and speedo, but that motor will never go thru brushes, you wont have to buy arms & Such. I think that in all reality the brushed motor will never die off, but take more of a backseat in the future, same with the nicad/Nimh, lipo wont kill them only make them take a back seat.

As I say to all whatever you want to do is your preference, I only speak of truth and the facts when asked.

my .02 cents!
Fastaljr *Retired*

I was shocked when I added up my figures when I just recently got back into racing. Wow, they add up fast. Brushless might be the future, but you know, these companies will find some way to make up the money from not selling as many motors or brushes. I just read were one compnay is going to offer different arms to place inside the brushless can for different torques, rpm, and amps. Believe me. These componies will not loose money. In two years or less, we will be writing in a forum about the old days about 4200 batteries, brushed motors, and the cost of getting started was around $800- $1200. We will laugh and wish it could be like that again. The truth is that the more tracks that close, fewer shops to supply the raciers, and the lack of a national media support, there will be a monoply on rc racing and it will raise the cost of everything even more.
Just my opinion.

The initial cost of RC racing has always been out of hand. When I got started about 20 years ago, yes, you could get started for around a grand but that was considered to be “out of hand” just as the amount it cost to get started today. We play in a very expensive hobby and there is not a lot we can do about it.

Brushless will help if we let it stay like it is with a limited amount of classes and only allow a limited amount of manufacturers to supply the parts. It will cause somewhat of a monopoly but it will also take out the “better” motors and speed controls that companies will come out with to out do their competition. The BRL has addressed this very well so far. Let them come out with anything they want for Off Road or any of the other forms of RC racing but Oval does not need to go down that road again.

I really think that brushless is our future and as of right now, it is the only thing that I can see that will hold the cost down in what we do.