what tray do you use for four cell 3800 and 4200 and why
integy
novak?

lol novak tray= to much money. if you get that tray basicaly your just rubbing it in peoples faces. its not worth it. if You are going to get a discarge tray either get the new trinity d-90 the dpd or the tekin battery doctor. I have the battery doctor and I love mine. the only difference between it and the d-90 is that the d-90 is polorized so it matters wich way you put the cells in. and the d-90 consists of two decks the lower deck has all the resistors on it and the upper deck holds the batterys away from the resistors so that they dont get as hot. so basicly its just personal preference but the novak tray is junk. If you are going to get a super expensive and outragious tray get the dpd from trinity. it does everything dicharges @30 amps then equalizes the cells. and it gives you a readout on every cell. also I hear that much more racing is coming out with something similar. but its not cheap. but like i said the novak tray is out of date and is not worth the cash

HOPE THIS HELPS
Sean Scott

thats exactly what i was wanting to know i already have a zero 30 didnt know about others

the zero thirty is a good tray but it does not realy equalize the cells. it does to a point but to realy get a good equalization you will need to put them on a battery tray like the tekin or the trinity. the zero thirty is good for bringing them down whith charge still left on them. just put em on that till all the lights go out then put them on an equalizing tray. and after they are equalized then store them for a week tray them before charging charge and repeat. at least thats how I do it

HOPE THIS HELPS
Sean Scott

well thats the kinda thing i wanted to know.thanks alot

the zero thirty is a good tray but it does not realy equalize the cells. it does to a point but to realy get a good equalization you will need to put them on a battery tray like the tekin or the trinity. the zero thirty is good for bringing them down whith charge still left on them. just put em on that till all the lights go out then put them on an equalizing tray. and after they are equalized then store them for a week tray them before charging charge and repeat. at least thats how I do it

HOPE THIS HELPS
Sean Scott
If you have 3800s or 4200s and you "put them in until the lights go out" you will kill runtime on those packs. The only way you can safely use the zero thirty with those cells is to stare at the bulbs and remove the pack from the tray as soon as the FIRST light goes out. Then use the end positions to discharge the other cells one at a time until the light just goes out. This was described the the TQ Cells support thread.

Sean,

How can you possibly say that the only difference between a D90 and a Tekin battery doctor is polarization? The Batt. doc is a linear 2 amp discharge diode based tray that cuts off @ 0.5 volts. The D90 is a DYNA PULSE 30 AMP MICROPROCESSOR CONTROLLED PROGRAMMABLE CUTOFF UNIT. Not even close to comparing similar entities. While we are at it, the Zero Thirty is a LINEAR 30 amp discharge tray with a nominal cutoff of ZERO volts. Also, at half the cost of the D90, the NOVAK SE tray is an excellent choice and far from obsolete. Since most utilize the discharge capability of their Turbo's to bring the pack down to 3.6v - it's only a matter of 4-5 minutes to equalize in a NOVAK tray. It's also highly accurate....2 decimal places according to my FLUKE. Of course everything has it's drawback and that is that the NOVAK needs a power source, but to say buying one = rubbing it in people's faces? Educate the newbie with credible information and let them make their own decision - don't bash good equipment because you don't understand the benefits.

ok whell I hate to tell you but the d-90 is not what you think it is. the d-90 is an equalization tray, it is not the dpd. the dpd is what you are thinking of. and it is a discharger and equalizer. also the tekin battery doctor 8.0 is not just a resistor tray. It has a microprocesor controled cutoff of .5v per cell as with the d-90. Google it. I promise you the d-90 is a equalizaton tray very similar to my tekin tray only it has to levals to seperate the resistors from the batts and it is polorized and it can only accept 6 cells. I have no clue why on the tekin they thought 8 cells was a good idea. because even with 4 cell packs I never need to equalize 2 at a time. ok now what you are calling the d-90 is actualy called the dpd (or dina pulse discharger) and it not only is a discharger but it is also an equalizing tray. also ontop of doing those things it gives you instantanious readouts on not only the whole pack but ever single individual cell so it is totaly worth it. now yes I know that I bashed the novak tray. but thats because im a teen and basicly anything we dont use we throw in terms to make it sound like garbage. the only thing i dont like about the n-tray is that it is basicly a very very nice equalizing tray that makes cool sounds. yes its nice to be able to adjust your cutoff but most people only use the .75-.5v per cell cutoff anyways so I just went with the tekin for 50 bucks and it does exactly what I want at half the space of the n-tray. now that said I am going to sound like a hypocrit. I want one of those dpd dischargers. and yes they are very nice and I have been recomended one quite a few times. but luckely for me with all the dicharge devices I have bought in the past I have enough money to pay for one. lol


HOPE THIS HELPS
Sean Scott

P.S. I hope my post dident seem to mean. I was kind of rushing it and I dident realy know what to say. so im sory if it insulted you.

All good, Sean...I guess when I can't even keep track of all the names of units on the market there may be too many! I guess the point is they all have different benefits and one should purchase based on the added value it provides for their program.

Jason

yep. I still need a high amp discharge thingy so Im gona get me one. and I like all the features it has. so im gona get one and tell ya guys what I think. I shure wish that hobby talk had a review section on this site. that would be nice


THANKS
Sean Scott

Popular "equalizing" trays
Tekin - lights cut off at .70v discharge completes at .50v
Novak - can be programmed to cut off discharge at .1-1.2v and has a nice feature of being able to hold the voltage at that setting
Trinity - has a couple different trays/units - As mentioned above the DPD can do a straight discharge or be used as a equalization tray - the D90 is a equalization tray that cuts off at .90v per cell, hence the "90"

I personally use a Tekin tray for my equalization duties. Now if you are talking strictly "discharge tray" and not equalization. Then you are talking about a different animal. Duratrax, Trinity, Integy, and others offer trays that have a higher discharge voltage for discharging your packs before equalizing.

I like my much more unit it discharges and EQ's at the same time,BEWARE don't go below .7 with the newer cells 38's and especially now with the 42's which as I understand don't like to go below .9.The advantage of a unit like the much more and the Trinity is they cutoff automatically,unlike the Tekin and some of the other units mentioned,the D90 would probably be a good choice also,I personly never take my cells below .9.

The advantage of a unit like the much more and the Trinity is they cutoff automatically,unlike the Tekin and some of the other units mentioned

That statment can be somewhat "misleading". The Tekin tray does cut off but it does so at .5 at each cell. As long as you take the newer packs off when the lights go out (.7) you should be fine.

That statment can be somewhat "misleading". The Tekin tray does cut off but it does so at .5 at each cell. As long as you take the newer packs off when the lights go out (.7) you should be fine.

.5 & .7 both are to low a cutoff for todays cells.Also like you "as long as you are there to take them off the tray":( with the MM unit yo don't have to sit there and monitor the cells:)

The MM unit hands down is the best one out.. To compare it to a tekin is a waste of time..BUT the tekin only costs about 50 bucks.. However The thing cuts off too low.. I think tekin should have given you an adjustable setting like the novak tray..

I sold my novak tray an bought the MM unit.. Kind of like a Ferrari.. If you have the Means I highly recommend it..

that much more unit does look pretty cool. by about how much more is it going to be than the dpd? because if its alot I think im just gona just go ahead and get the dpd. becuase I think they do about the same thing only the mm unit looks a little more dark and sleek than the dpd. but I could be wrong I havent realy looked into the mm unit. also where can I get one of the mm units


THANKS
Sean Scott

Here is a couple of places to buy one.

http://nexusracing.net/index.php?cPath=21&osCsid=ecb62ad8d9e27f1db2f674ba8e5ef82d

http://www.speedtechrc.com/store/ebproduct.asp?catmainid=60

allright guys so im gona be getting one of those new dichargers. probably the dpd but I wanted to know the much more what makes it that much better? and is it worth the extra 100 bucks? becuase Im kinda on a budget and the only reason im getting the dpd is because i will be swiching to 3800's (lol ive been using 33's) and I need something that has a higher cutoff voltage and I need a high amp discharger so that I can keep the cells ar and voltage up high. so can you tell me if the dpd will do all these things and also tell me a bit more about the much more unit. I want to know

THANKS
Sean Scott

Sean, what kind of charger do you have right now, does it discharge? if so you can just use the charger/discharge to make sure each cell is equal. It takes little time but costs no extra money. Just discharge the pack to 1 volt per cell 4.00 4 cell, 6.00 6 cell. Then hook up the wires to each cell and discharge. All the newer digital discharger either discharge at a low rate or pulse discahrge.

the dpd is the way to go

right now I have a reactor 20 and a tekin battery doctor 8.0. but the 8.0 takes the cells down to far so I need a new equalizer tray. and I want a 30 amp discharger so Im just gona go ahead and get the dpd and sell all my old discharging equipment.


THANKS
Sean Scott

Good call but the dpd is slow but the cells stay cool

Good call but the dpd is slow but the cells stay cool

I'm personally getting very good results with the DPD!!

I guess that's why there 're on the back order list everywhere. :thumbsup:

so with the dpd can I use it as my soul discharge unit or will I still need a high amp linear discharger?


THANKS
Sean Scott

Another reason to go with the MM unit,you have the choice of a 30 amp discharge or a 5 amp discharge,no need for anything else.

Another reason to go with the MM unit,you have the choice of a 30 amp discharge or a 5 amp discharge,no need for anything else.

The DPD does both also but it is slower. I have both and one thing about the MM that I don't like is that when in the pulse 30 amp discharge it doesn't show the current voltage it just says something like "PDCH" and then tells you when it it is done and gives IR and run time only not voltage readings. The PDP gives you more info but is slower.

Has anyone used the new Special Edition Novak unit ? as it has a hold function , which was a major flaw in the first edition , I'm not a big Novak fan but it is adjustible for the cutoff / hold point and $80 isn't too bad either.

I use a Tekin 8.0 now and I've seen higher voltages later in the discharge curve compared to a 0-30 , a 0-30 usually starts off with slightly higher voltage but falls faster.

The 0-30 is a good unit but after thinking about it ,,, it's really too fast to be called an equalization unit , 2-3 amps is good and slowly drains the cells.

Just my 2 cents , there's too many choices these days . :o

I agree there's just to many choices for someone that really doesn't know what he needs,but if you really know what to look for there are only about two choices.

I'm not totally convinced on this voltage cutoff NEED .

I've been using the tekin and think it works fine , but just as an experiment I took one of our practice 3800 packs and left it in a 0-30 for over an hour after the lights went out and you know what , it tested almost identical to the last test data that I had charted. Hmmm , maybe their not as sensitive as what these discharger companys want you to think.

Would I dead short for days ,,,,, NO WAY

Just a little feedback to confuse everything , I'm sticking with the Tekin and no big deal if I get busy at the track and it stays in the tray for a hour.

The cost of these bells and whistles is rediculous ! Try explaining the cost to someone thinking of getting into RC racing, wer'e all a little wacked .

I had the Much More tray and liked it but I sold it after I tried a DPD tray. I like the DPD better and they do about the same things but I bought 2 DPD's for the price of a Much More (my sponsor sold them to team guys for under $100) Now I can discharge my pack after a run and equalize my next pack before charging on the second unit.

A lot of this stuff doesn't matter if you rotate and keep fresh cells,but for those that use the same packs all season like most guys that race strictly at the local level do then you will see a big deterioration over the course of the season and by the end of the season you will be racing with junk.Me personally,I would just rather keep fresh cells and try to keep them in as best shape as possible with my MM.I bought my MM wayyy before the dpd came out so it was the best thing on the market at the time,but the DPD has since been introduced and gives the racer another less expensive choice which is a good thing,Either unit will work fine.

I'm not totally convinced on this voltage cutoff NEED .

I've been using the tekin and think it works fine , but just as an experiment I took one of our practice 3800 packs and left it in a 0-30 for over an hour after the lights went out and you know what , it tested almost identical to the last test data that I had charted. Hmmm , maybe their not as sensitive as what these discharger companys want you to think.

Would I dead short for days ,,,,, NO WAY

Just a little feedback to confuse everything , I'm sticking with the Tekin and no big deal if I get busy at the track and it stays in the tray for a hour.

The cost of these bells and whistles is rediculous ! Try explaining the cost to someone thinking of getting into RC racing, wer'e all a little wacked .

Think about it guys , you spend hundreds of dollars trying to preserve a few extra charges , hmmm . These manufactures sure love our plastic.
A Tekin , 0-30 ,or novak all under $80.00 is all you really need !! WHAT YOU WANT IS A DIFFERENT STORY.

It's no problem for me I'm sponsored by visa anyway,LOL.

What about the new tray Integy is comming out wwith? From the ad, it looks like it will be like the Trinity Dpd.

Think about it guys , you spend hundreds of dollars trying to preserve a few extra charges , hmmm . These manufactures sure love our plastic.
A Tekin , 0-30 ,or novak all under $80.00 is all you really need !! WHAT YOU WANT IS A DIFFERENT STORY.

Well said !

I personally don't see anything wrong with discharging the pack at 30 amps on my GFX down to 4 volts, and then sticking it on a Novak SE Smart Tray to equalize the cells before charging.

Can someone shoot holes in this method ? What am I missing ? Why this would not be effective (and cost less) ??

Thx

Not trying to shoot holes in your method, but the new Trinity tray will give you info on each cell within the pack, easier to spot a failing cell before it affects the entire pack. The new tray from Integy will not be on the market for a few weeks.

Not trying to shoot holes in your method, but the new Trinity tray will give you info on each cell within the pack, easier to spot a failing cell before it affects the entire pack. The new tray from Integy will not be on the market for a few weeks.

Yes I know it spits out a bunch of numbers. I replace all my packs every couple of months anyway. I honestly don't have the time at the track on race day to sit and go through all of the numbers anyway (who does ?).

If a pack seems like it isn't performing like it should, I'll pull the pack apart and cycle the individual cells on the GFX anyway.

So if that's the ONLY thing I missed, then my procedure still gets the same job done (for less money) right ? What I'm getting at is what does the DPD do that increases the pack - PERFORMANCE - MORE than the method I suggested ?

Yes I know it spits out a bunch of numbers. I replace all my packs every couple of months anyway. I honestly don't have the time at the track on race day to sit and go through all of the numbers anyway (who does ?).

If a pack seems like it isn't performing like it should, I'll pull the pack apart and cycle the individual cells on the GFX anyway.

So if that's the ONLY thing I missed, then my procedure still gets the same job done (for less money) right ? What I'm getting at is what does the DPD do that increases the pack - PERFORMANCE - MORE than the method I suggested ?

I immedeitly(sp) spotted a bad cell in one of my packs with my MMCTXD which with the DPD you should be able to do the same,performance wise you will be able to keep your packs in better shape by keeping a better match on them,but if you buy new packs on a regular basis it really won't matter, I like to be able to keep my GFX's free for other things also like working on motors and charging.Besides the more toys the better,LOL.

I immedeitly(sp) spotted a bad cell in one of my packs with my MMCTXD which with the DPD you should be able to do the same,performance wise you will be able to keep your packs in better shape by keeping a better match on them,but if you buy new packs on a regular basis it really won't matter, I like to be able to keep my GFX's free for other things also like working on motors and charging.Besides the more toys the better,LOL.

LOL.. yes.. I hear you on the "more toys" thing... we all like them :)

but.. RE: "performance wise you will be able to keep your packs in better shape by keeping a better match on them" -- how does the DPD do this "better" ? and how do you know ??

the DPD does basically the same thing as my ctxd,which is individually discharge your cells which prevents you from overdischarging a cell and getting the pack out of match,but like I said if you buy your cells on a regular basis it won't matter.I personally buy a new pack once a month and delegate my older packs to practice packs,this keeps me with fresh voltage at all times.I've ran much better this past year using this method.

the DPD does basically the same thing as my ctxd,which is individually discharge your cells which prevents you from overdischarging a cell and getting the pack out of match,but like I said if you buy your cells on a regular basis it won't matter.I personally buy a new pack once a month and delegate my older packs to practice packs,this keeps me with fresh voltage at all times.I've ran much better this past year using this method.


Yep - agreed -- but whether you use the DPD or ctxd or Novak SE or ? -- really doesn't matter. You are accomplishing the same thing.

The DPD, ctxd, Novak SE -ALL- discharge the cells individually and -ALL- prevent over-discharging. But the Novak (and others) cost 1/2 as much.

My point is.. no one has provided any -concrete data- that shows that using the DPD or ctxd tray to equalize before charging is better than a less expensive microprocessor-controlled tray that has a voltage cut-off -- and why.

I like to be able to cut through the "bling" factor and marketing hype and get at the -demonstratable-, -data-backed-, performance difference :)

TeamGoodwrench, Yes your right, the way the units discharge doesn't make any difference to the cells, and it doesn't improve the quality of the cells any. The only thing the higher priced units do is tell you if theirs a problem with a cell.

TeamGoodwrench, Yes your right, the way the units discharge doesn't make any difference to the cells, and it doesn't improve the quality of the cells any. The only thing the higher priced units do is tell you if theirs a problem with a cell.

Thank you Mike. That's what I assumed -- just trying to separate the hype from the facts.

I agree,discharing is discharging for the most part,however, I like to know if there is a problem with a pack as soon as possible,And like I said before the more toys the better,IE:"The one that dies with the most toys wins"

I agree,discharing is discharging for the most part,however, I like to know if there is a problem with a pack as soon as possible,And like I said before the more toys the better,IE:"The one that dies with the most toys wins"

Hey - Just out of curiosity ... how many IB 3800 or IB 4200s have you found problem cells in ?

Two 38 packs,none in 42 packs,but I'm sponsored by a different better matcher now since going to 42's,my avatar gives it away I guess,LOL.