Thought I'd open this up as the first episode is airing today, right? I have it coming on a 1am tomorrow morning. Anyone who watches, post your thoughts and opinions on how it came out, now that you will have seen it. I hope it's good!

I've been unable to locate which station "Trek" will be broadcast over in the Los Angeles area.

Does anyone know?

I've been unable to locate which station "Trek" will be broadcast over in the Los Angeles area.

Does anyone know?

http://trekmovie.com/tos-in-hd/hdtv-star-trek-tos-channel-list/

Despite the text in the URL, my local station is not an HD station, so don't let the posie fool you.

L.A. Mon, 12:05AM. KNBC.

Much obliged, Zorro.

It would also be of interest to note what has been cut out to make room for extra commercials. Also note anything besides the FX sequences that has been reworked. Re-editing scenes, new sound FX, music cues, etc. I know they rerecorded the opening theme, but the trailer implied that ALL the music was being redone to bring it into the digital age.

I heard that all the music has been re-recorded, played note-for-note from the original score sheets with nothing changed except the improvement in sound quality you'd expect with today's digital audio. I wonder, though, if perhaps they've smoothed out some of the more awkward or abrupt music edits where music cues originally recorded for previous episodes were pieced together. Now, if they could only do something about the godawful folk singing in "The Way to Eden"!

Now, if they could only do something about the godawful folk singing in "The Way to Eden"!

Maybe they can edit in some newly re-recorded Nimoy ("The Ballad of Bilbo Baggins") or Shatner ("Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds") singing in it's place!

We need to be able to buy these masterpieces in fully digital, state-of-the-art glory!

Here in the Twin Cities, they showed it at 6:00. A few quick impressions. I was surprised at how little they changed of the effects. They pretty much kept the the same angles, including the too small radius in the orbit scenes:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v687/bebruns/BOT1.jpg

My overall impression was they replaced mediocre '60s effects with mediocre CGI effects.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v687/bebruns/BOT2.jpg

In terms of what was cut out, the only scene I noticed that was missing was the one between the couple that was going to be married while they were waiting for combat. There were a couple of continuity jumps with characters suddenly changing position and the lights changing.

One thing I noticed was that they didn't change the footage in the closing credits:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v687/bebruns/BOT4.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v687/bebruns/BOT5.jpg

Also, they didn't fix all the goofs (Romulus and Romii?):

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v687/bebruns/BOT3.jpg

All in all, although I'm still opposed to the concept of doing this, at least they didn't pull a Lucas and make wholesale changes in shots and pacing.

We got "Miri" tonight - hopefully we'll have "Balance of Terror" tomorrow - but I liked the redo. It's not at all out of place, but it has a more believable look (Miri's Earth looks like a real planet, not a plastic globe). And my biggest nit to pick from the original series, we no longer have mixed-together shots of the pilot-version 11-footer with the series version.

While I was gone my wife stoppped TiVo from recording it so she could watch "Mythbusters". :freak:

*sigh* I guess I'll wait until next week....

While I was gone my wife stoppped TiVo from recording it so she could watch "Mythbusters". :freak:

*sigh* I guess I'll wait until next week....

I'm glad you got bail. When is your next court appearance?

James :lol:

They pretty much kept the the same angles, including the too small radius in the orbit scenes.The original stock shots of the Enterprise in orbit were meant to be stylized rather than realistic. If the shots had been done realistically, the Enterprise would be oriented with its bottom, not its side, facing toward the planet's surface — and it would be too tiny to see anyway.My overall impression was they replaced mediocre '60s effects with mediocre CGI effects.Well, here's to mediocrity! If it weren't for mediocrity, we would have no way of knowing what's excellent — and what's crap! :p In terms of what was cut out, the only scene I noticed that was missing was the one between the couple that was going to be married while they were waiting for combat.Maybe just as well, since Scotty is seen adjusting an obvious 20th-century camera lens in that scene. Or did they leave that part in?

I thought it was pretty good, they actually tweaked it less than I expected. I liked the shots of the Enterprise firing the phaser volleys, it looked a lot more 'real' with the reflections on the hull. Didn't get any benefit from the HD makeover, the affiliate that carried it here has a horrible signal even on digital cable and the picture was pretty soft.

Good episode, Mark Lenard was pretty memorable.

The original stock shots of the Enterprise in orbit were meant to be stylized rather than realistic.

Thanks for setting the record straight.

Correct if I'm wrong BEBruns, but I gather the point of your earlier post was to provide a yard-stick with which to measure conceptual (as opposed to technical) distinctions between the two versions.

We got "Miri" tonight - hopefully we'll have "Balance of Terror" tomorrow - but I liked the redo.

Yep I got Miri tonight and they are listing Balance of Terror for Tomorrow afternoon and Devil in the Dark next Saturday.

Queued up my DVD for side-by-side comparison. Quite a few cuts. Yes, the dialogue between the engaged couple, but also dialogue on the bridges of both ships, bits in the briefing room, etc. And possibly the worst cut of all is the intro to the exchange between Kirk and McCoy in his quarters before Kirk begins his self-doubt speech similar to Pike's in the Cage. I would have left that intact, but I'm sure it was cut in syndication many times over many years.

Overall, this Trek has better color range, but is quite a bit darker. It does appear more film-like. I don't have any of my VHS copies left, but I did a similar comparison between them and the DVDs a while back. At that time, I thought the new DVD transfers seemed contrasty and less film-like, so we have moved back towards the film direction with greater resolution.

I too was surprised how much the new FX sequences duplicated the originals. There are certainly some areas I would have made improvements. I was very surprised that they kept one obvious error. Even though the command on the Enterprise is repeatedly to fire phasers, the phaser crews keep firing photon torpedoes instead. Tomlinson must have had his honeymoon night on his mind and just kept pushing the wrong buttons. :p

As far as the redone FX stuff goes, my first impression is similar to one already posted.

I think in this day and age where viewers are spoiled by realistic CGI of BSG or even Firefly, the new Enterprise shots just don't hold up.

The mediocre visual effects of the 60's actually seemed to add character and weathered looks to the ship, and the CGI is a bit of a let down.

I loved the concept, I actually thought of the same thing a few years back. The possibilites for redoing the visual effects for the old trek was limitless, but what I saw seemed more prototypical than finished. Maybe they were under budget constraints.

As for the cuts, I think they aired what are the 40 minute cut versions to accomodate the 20 minutes of commercial breaks vs. the 10 minutes in the 60s. Another letdown, but I'm sure the full 50 minute versions will be available in the DVD release!

suppose to be on in a few minutes, thing is were under a tornado watch and T Storm heading our way, nothing like constant interruptions.)-:

Well after have review the EFX shots in Miri after the episode was over, I have to say I'm not all that impressed, I mean if you are going through the trouble to re-do the effects I think they could have stepped it up a bit. The colors in the original footage did seem a bit more "film like" but overall I can't say I am over the top impressed...maybe after I see Balance or the Doomsday Machine.

I'm writing my review before reading the others. I just got done watching.

First of all, the effects were MUCH more true to the original than many might have expected. I sort of had a clue they were leaning that way, but it was still interesting. I haven't seen this episode in awhile so I'll avoid comparing the two specifically. I thought the quality of the effects overall was very very good. I was only watching in standard definition, but it was easily the some of the best TOS style CG work I've seen. There was one shot of the ship adrift that was a little smooth, but still very nice. I thought the phaser effects were very cool. The reflection off the hull when firing is probably what stood out most of all the effects. I liked it a lot and had no problem with it. As opposed to some here, I wouldn't have minded if flightlines and camera moves were straightened up, smoothed out, but neither can I complain that they didn't do that here. I thought, overall, excellent work. Most impressive.

Now having read some other reviews, I should point out that I'm evaluating it based on trying to make the effects look similar to the original ones but cleaner. It would be a different story if the goal was to create the most amazing looking effects around, or on television.

I was very surprised that they kept one obvious error. Even though the command on the Enterprise is repeatedly to fire phasers, the phaser crews keep firing photon torpedoes instead. Tomlinson must have had his honeymoon night on his mind and just kept pushing the wrong buttons. :p

Check the show again when they ready for battle styles reports to kirk "phasers are ready set for proximity blasts"

Did this show on 21 in Dallas? Because TiVo didn't record it and it's now going to show at 9pm CST on 52?

It doesn't air 'til tonight here in the Greater Little Rock area, so I've not seen it yet. They're starting us off with "Balance of Terror" and then "Miri" runs later in the night.

I find it interesting, tho, that some of the people who were complaining about the CGI stuff being added in the first place are some of the same folks complaining that the visuals are the same as the originals! :cool:

^Well, I think maybe they're thinking "what was the point,then?" :shrug:

This is what state-of-the-art computer generated special effects
from a major television network looks like?

It was like viewing a video game!


As for the "Phasers", don't you guys know?
Starfleet had these weapons they called Phasers. Then,
someone invented a beam weapon. Starfleet realized that
was truly PHASed Energy Rectification. So, they called
the beam weapon "Phaser" and the old pulse weapon was
re-named "Photon Torpedo". ;)

Man in 1966: "This is what state-of-the-art model special effects from major television network look like? It was like viewing a televisual entertainment device that uh, is being developed somewhere...?"

Actually, CaptFrank, I don't think there's anything state-of-the-art in particular going on. Also, this isn't a very high-profile, big budget program either. By the way, I had the chance to replay the episode and scrutinized the effects. First....I think I have a crappy TV. I don't know if this bodes ill for whenever I might get to see it at DVD or HD resolution, but I did see some comparisons online. I still think they look pretty good, but from shot to shot, there's room for improvement. Maybe in 10 years there'll be another update. One thing I realized however, is that I've never given the TOS effects this much scrutiny before, and it would suffer the same criticisms, so relative to that, I find little to be disappointed in, personally.

Biggest nit I have is that on my second viewing, I didn't much care for the panelling effect seen in one of the Romulan BoP shots. First time around, I liked the shot, but I hadn't gotten a good look at it.

I too am writing this before reading all previoius posts.

I'm disapointed; especially after seeing the test shot submitted by the effects house that did Enterprise in their bid to get the gig. That footage, available via link somewhere here in the forum, had CG grit, grain and emulsion added in to a very convincing and sharply defined, shaded, and modeled Enterprise.

The CG E in these two episodes were definitely cartoonish on my 30" inch hotel TV (I'm on a business trip now) and maybe might come across better on my home reference system or DVD ultimately. But it seems like it could have been much better with something more added...

Check the show again when they ready for battle styles reports to kirk "phasers are ready set for proximity blasts"

Nah, the show was brand new and they were figuring out what the various effects would be. However, it's plain to see that what they call phasers here became photon torpedoes (complete with sound FX) later. They could have remedied this continuity issue with the remastered version, but the same number of people would have complained that they altered the original. Can't win.

I'll offer my observations as an average non-Trekkie television viewer who heretofore has only watched TOS via syndicated airings on local television stations during the 70s, 80s, and 90s. I watched tonight's episode (Balance of Terror) on a 37-inch HD monitor with Stereo sound. I received the show on digital cable from a local station that broadcasts analog only:

1. If I weren't already aware, it never would have occured to me that the visual effects had been re-done. I mean, it wouldn't have crossed my mind.

2. The audio improvement is obvious. Even if I had no prior knowledge that the show had been re-mastered, the audio would have tipped me immediately that something was up. Again, I'm listening in Stereo. I'm sure 5.1 is even more dramatic.

3. The color seemed extremely over-saturated and the blacks were crushed. Kirk's skin-tone especially looks like he'd been made up for a high school dramatization of "Hiawatha". Too much luminance and saturation.

4. Most noticable, and most disconcerting - there was a strange "ghosting" or "trailing" effect any time an actor engaged in physical movement. I can't even guess at the explanation for this but it was distracting and irritating.

Zorro,

The ghosting, do you have an LCD?

Zorro,

The ghosting, do you have an LCD?

I do. But I've never noticed this effect on anything else I've ever watched on it.

Then, do you have LSD?

Then, do you have LSD?

ZING! ;)

Agree somewhat with the saturation. Agree completely about the blacks. The whole thing was too dark and the shadows really blocked up. The DVD reveals there is more info there. But, now we run into the whole issue of monitor calibration. I think mine is decently calibrated, but I'd hardly call it a reference monitor. So, possibly mine is set too dark? Of course, if that's the case, the TOS DVD transfers are REALLY washed out. :p

I can see what they were trying to do with the FX sequences. They were so afraid of backlash that they opted to copy the original FX with CG. So we get very few changes except better resolution. However, one can argue that the change is so small that we could have lived with them as is. Personally, I would have loved to see hi-res transfers of the original FX scenes. I also have to agree that in a couple shots, the Enterprise looked too CG. It could have used some more dirt, noise, something.

I'm just wondering if the coloring, brightness, looks awesome in HD and somewhat off in SD....you think that might be part of it?

I didn't get the ghosting when watching Miri last night. BoT is showing right now.

To my eyes the blacks and shadows are just about right. I think we've gotten too used to watching faded prints...I've never seen the TOS colors this vibrant.

I'm surprised that they didn't change the sector maps on the main viewscreen. Considering that Okuda has hinted at some surprises with the F/X in upcoming episodes, this seems like an odd place to leave things intact.

Just saw the Romulan ship, cloaking effect and the plasma weapon. I like.

Well I finally saw 'Balance' I agree that the Romulan vessel looks better (but do we really need to aztec everything???), I had hoped for more but I guess we'll see what is yet to come.

After being one of the strongest supporters of the CG makeover and sometimes intentionally trying to push Johns buttons.....:devil: I have to say I'm fairly disappointed. Though I did also say that it may indeed suck.

First let me say, If I were Okuda, I probably wouldn't have taken the job. Because its a loosing battle right from the start. Trek is sooo personal to everyone and what it means to them individually, you'd NEVER please everyone.

I remember that when they were trying to cast the TV movie of the 'Shining', no one wanted Nicholson's role because every actor knew that they would be compared to Nicholson. I think the same here, everyone has their own take on how the new effects compare to the original FX.

I'd like to get out of the way that the editing was HORRIBLE, its like they gave it to a green editing student. I could go into detail here, but this is about the effects.

For me personally, they matched the effects TOO closely. Stars moving when they clearly shouldn't have been and goofy sweeping-in flight paths. I also felt that the lighting was flat and without any drama. Again, matching the shot (lighting in this case) too closely. So I guess that they were successful in mimicing the original effects.

As for the color saturation, I think I've dialed my color down a little bit, I think I'll look into that. But having recently bought the original theatrical Star Wars DVD and compared it to the digitaly remastred version, I feel that they think if they crank up the color saturation, the more the better. For me, watching the more muted colors in the original Star Wars simply seemed more 'natural'.

In the case of the ST effects, I thought (again, it might be my TV but I'm curious to see what others think) that they matched the 'whiteish look' of the Enterprise too much rather than try to do a color more 'correct' to the model. Also, the bussard collector effect seemed just really 'blanded' out. Just a pale pink with a few pops of light rather than the colorful and distsinctive Orange, Red and Blue lights. While the glow on the hull from the Phaser/Photon Torpedo added a little to the effect, the blue 'torpedo' itself lacked the charactor of the 'original' torpedo proper.

I believe that work on some of the fan films (Exeter-yes New Voyages-No) depicts a more realistic view of what the effects COULD have been, and what MIGHT have been had better techniques been available at the time.

So, as I said, since Trek is soooo personal to everyone, I believe that I will continue my own endeavors to make my own realistic replacement CG effects for my own enjoyment.

I just feel that instead of reusing the same phasers shot over they could have given a bit more, and why fix the planet on Miri on the viewscreen and the comet in Balance and not update the graphics on the Neutral Zone?

. . . there was a strange "ghosting" or "trailing" effect any time an actor engaged in physical movement. I can't even guess at the explanation for this but it was distracting and irritating.Have you checked the following possibilities:
[IMG-LEFT]http://www.halloweenonlinemagazine.com/sfx/Window_FXvideo_105.jpg[/IMG-LEFT]

1. Your house is haunted
2. Your TV set is haunted
3. You're dead

My house was built in '84 so it ain't old enough. My TV's a Flat Screen so there ain't room for no haints unless they're real skinny. And I ain't dead - I'm just real laid back.

Just found this thread (I'll quit posting in the other one, now). I just rewatched "Balance" today, And I enjoyed it more the second time. Last night, I was quite disappointed. Today, still somewhat disappointed but not as much. I still think they should've fixed the flight path of the ship on some of the shots, and the bussard collectors still look off to me. I hope it gets better...

Brad.

Aaugh. Just rewatched novadesigns' 2003 tribute to Matt Jeffries (the shot of the TOS Enterprise leaving orbit and going to warp). There might the odd nit about that work, but that, to me, says "Enterprise." Graceful, powerful, that ship looks more real to me than much of what I saw last night and again today. :-) And it was done three years ago!

Oops. Double post. :drunk:

I just feel that instead of reusing the same phasers shot over they could have given a bit more, and why fix the planet on Miri on the viewscreen and the comet in Balance and not update the graphics on the Neutral Zone?

I've been scratching my head about that. It wouldn't have been too hard to come up with a better tactical display that still had the retro TOS feel.

I'm watching BoT on my recorded DVD right now to time it and see how much my local station cut. No ghosting.

I love the new look of the planet in the opening credits. It looks gorgeous and totally inhospitable. The original one looked like a lollypop.

Just saw "Balance of Terror" on KNBC Channel 4 here in L.A.

The color looks good. The new CGI effects don't really look any better or worse than the old physical models and opticals, just different. Some bad edits really screwed up the pacing and rhythm of the story.

The verdict? NO BIG FREAKIN' DEAL. YMMV.

No ghosts, BTW. :eek:

Well, NBC in NYC had it listed at 3:35AM this morning, so out of laziness I set my VCR to record from 3AM to 5AM. When I checked the tape this morning, the episode had already started before 3AM!! :rolleyes: So I missed from the opening thru the discussion of invisibility between Spock and Kirk.

I only had time to skim thru a few scenes, but I really didn't see anything that warranted screwing with the originals.

I got BOTH Miri and Balance Saturday evening. Overall, I liked the improvement in picture and sound quality. I liked the new planet shots, and the CGI ships were well done.

Things I'm suprised they didn't update:

The neutral zone graphic
Phasers vs photons
Kirk's hand-help phaser shot in Miri

I have to say they changed a lot less than I expected. Overall, fun to watch, but not nearly as big a deal as I expected.

Eric

I think the entire goal was to NOT make it such a big deal. They just wanted the ship shots to look good in HD, both for broadcast and presumably for HD-DVD and/or Blu-Ray.

After seeing some of the stills ahead of time, I was curious about whether the Bussard collectors would look cartoon-ish, but they looked really good to me on screen.

A couple of the shots in the opening credits were SO true to the original, I wasn't sure they'd even been replaced.

It was a little jarring to see the same odd angles in some of the shots, but they weren't trying to replace the original effects as much as just clean up what was there.

And I have to say, the Romulan plasma weapon shots looked really good.

Was there a shot in the opening credits of the pilot version nacelle aft end (no balls) or was it just in shadow? :confused: