Well I'm glad I just bought my 4200's for the season and before I even ran them once their outdated !!! :confused:

IB has a new "world edition " 4200 cell out with even better #'s , an easy 1.24 -1.25 volts @ 35 amps and IR 's of 1.2 -1.4 .

Come on guys , how many can really afford to buy the battery of the week.

I think this is the 3rd generation of just the 4200 cell alone.

Obviously ROAR has no real controll on this sport and you know some racers are going to have to have the latest and greatest. :cry:

IB has done some great things for this sport , but I think the've done as many poor things to prolong its life also !!!!!!!!!!!!

Just in time for the indoor carpet season...what a coincidence!!!

This is the exact reason that I stick to dirt oval racing....I thought about buying another pancar for this fall/winter, but stuff like this is the exact reason why I will not.

IB has done some great things for this sport , but I think the've done as many poor things to prolong its life also !!!!!!!!!!!!

WRONG...IB, IP, SANYO, PANASONIC, I don't care WHO it is...does NOTHING "For This Sport"

They do things to advance their products and have a market edge on the competition.

It's OUR job as race promoters, directors, racers and R/C Hobby people in general to STOP how these batteries affect US.

There are batteries that SHOULD Never even hit a track with the NiMh technology moving so rapidly...but just because a NEW cell comes out people think they have to HAVE IT.

That's the NICE thing about rules that don't allow it. It gives time for matchers to play with new cells, see whats good or bad, and it allows at least a little time to see if a cell has staying power to be around a while.

How many different versions of a 3000 were there? WAY TOO MANY.

Did anyone run 3600? Hardly
3700's? Too many
3800's EVERYONE
4200's?, 4300's? Will 4700's be out by FEBRUARY when our WEST COAST season starts? WHO KNOWS~

I'm trying to gather as MUCH info as possible as to what will be out NEXT year so when I make our rules change this November...the battery of choice WON'T become OBSOLETE 8 months later.

According to a very reliable IB source this latest cell released almost became a 4600 cell , but for some reason they decided to keep the 4200 shrinkwrap.

Curious to the actual discharge mah ??? :confused:

And we all know whats next.

More reason we stayed with a 3800 max mah for this season !!! :thumbsup:

Well I'm glad I just bought my 4200's for the season and before I even ran them once their outdated !!! :confused:

IB has a new "world edition " 4200 cell out with even better #'s , an easy 1.24 -1.25 volts @ 35 amps and IR 's of 1.2 -1.4 .

Come on guys , how many can really afford to buy the battery of the week.

I think this is the 3rd generation of just the 4200 cell alone.

Obviously ROAR has no real controll on this sport and you know some racers are going to have to have the latest and greatest. :cry:

IB has done some great things for this sport , but I think the've done as many poor things to prolong its life also !!!!!!!!!!!!

IVe tested these cells on the track and machines for almost 2 weeks now. I can tell you that these cells are the most consistant IB cell to date to match. What I can also tell you is I let some of the TOP on-road drivers in the country run them this past weekend at a big race and NONE of them could tell the difference between this cell and an SHV on the track or by looking at Lap times.

You do NOT HAVE to have these cells.....Regular SHV's will run just as good. The problem now is that the batteries have far surpased the motors and the motors can not use all the extra voltage. So you will NOT have to have these cells unless someone comes out with a new motor to take advantage of the extra voltage and power.

ALso there are NOT any 1.25 cells other than shorted cells. The top stuff I have seen has been 1.245 with most of the stuff being in the 1.235-1.240 range.

EA

Also just to give you an Idea on weight of cells vrs mAh. When a company makes a larger mAh cell the weight increases. They can not make a larger mAh cell without the weight increasing. A 3800 weigh's around 66grams, a 4200SHV weighs 69.5 grams and the new 4200WC weighs 69.7grams. If this were a 4600 cell it would be around 73 grams.

At least IB puts the new cells in new shrink and doest just keep putting them in the same old shrink as they could have easly done this with the 4200's...keep them in 3800 shrink wrap and no one would have known.

EA

What does ROAR have to do with the Battery companies anyway ...All ROAR does is say if they are legal after being submitted...You personally bought cells that were not legal or approved yet so that is ROARs fault now ...When IB submittes cells to ROAR then it is there problem...

Humpty I agree with you, about it not being ROAR's problem. Until the MFG stops making the approved cell, and only produces the newer version. Then it's ROAR and our problem.

Well I'm glad I just bought my 4200's for the season and before I even ran them once their outdated !!! :confused:

IB has a new "world edition " 4200 cell out with even better #'s , an easy 1.24 -1.25 volts @ 35 amps and IR 's of 1.2 -1.4 .

Come on guys , how many can really afford to buy the battery of the week.

I think this is the 3rd generation of just the 4200 cell alone.

Obviously ROAR has no real controll on this sport and you know some racers are going to have to have the latest and greatest. :cry:

IB has done some great things for this sport , but I think the've done as many poor things to prolong its life also !!!!!!!!!!!!

Fool me once shame on you. Fool me twice shame on me.

This has been going on for years. Simply accept that fact that there will be incremental improvements to the batteries and adapt to it.

Buy two packs. Run twice a day for 2 months. Repeat....

Do that and you'll run fine, at least for weekly shows, and you'll always be relatively on top of the latest and greatest batch of cells.

Honestly if you went out and bought 8 packs or something for the indoor season I really don't feel sorry for you.

The only people to blame for the way batteries are , is the racers and the tracks. Tracks don't have to allow new packs the day they come out. Racers should not have to spend 2 to 3 hundred every other month on new batteries just to keepup with the jones. Make the chassis work and the motor work for the speed. Not just batteries. I have seen so many peolpe buy horse power. Myself being in the hobby for alittle over 2 yrs has seen this done by alot of people. They don't take the time to learn the chassis or motor work. they just want to lay down fast laps. You can have all the motor and battery in the world, but if you car isn't handling you might as well stay at home.


Just my 2 cents. :o

According to a very reliable IB source this latest cell released almost became a 4600 cell , but for some reason they decided to keep the 4200 shrinkwrap........ !!! :thumbsup:

I'm sure for obvious reasons that if IB declared this cell a 4600, then it most likely would not be approved by Roar until first of the year or there about, and not available for up coming major events, IIC, Cleveland, etc. :mad:

Good luck to all that recently purchased the SHV cells, hard to imagine your cells would be outdated that quick with no notification, except for dealers so they could sell off exisiting stock and have racers stuck with the cells and not them.

Anchor :freak:

The only people to blame for the way batteries are , is the racers and the tracks. Tracks don't have to allow new packs the day they come out. Racers should not have to spend 2 to 3 hundred every other month on new batteries just to keepup with the jones. Make the chassis work and the motor work for the speed. Not just batteries. I have seen so many peolpe buy horse power. Myself being in the hobby for alittle over 2 yrs has seen this done by alot of people. They don't take the time to learn the chassis or motor work. they just want to lay down fast laps. You can have all the motor and battery in the world, but if you car isn't handling you might as well stay at home.


Just my 2 cents. :o


AMEN AMEN AMEN CHASSIS CHASSIS CHASSIS all you have to do is apply it to BIG CARS give me a setup pinto with a v6 and a v8 pinto not setup hhhhhhmmmmmmm one would think the v8 but NOT TRUE........

WHY DO YOU THINK NASCAR WORKS SO MUCH ON THE CHASSIS AND AERODYNAMICS

COME ON GUYS, buy what you want or don't You can win with the "old" IB3800's that are still out there......

The only people to blame for the way batteries are , is the racers and the tracks. Tracks don't have to allow new packs the day they come out. Racers should not have to spend 2 to 3 hundred every other month on new batteries just to keepup with the jones. Make the chassis work and the motor work for the speed. Not just batteries. I have seen so many peolpe buy horse power. Myself being in the hobby for alittle over 2 yrs has seen this done by alot of people. They don't take the time to learn the chassis or motor work. they just want to lay down fast laps. You can have all the motor and battery in the world, but if you car isn't handling you might as well stay at home.


Just my 2 cents. :o

Unfortunately an IB4200 is an IB4200 in the eyes of the rule book. There is nothing anyone can do to control or stop them from making incremental improvements within a type of cell.

You and Cody haven't been around long, but believe me the playing field is a lot more level and a lot less expensive than it was years ago.

Back when we ran 6 cell with the Sanyo 2000s I used to help someone match cells. I would take the best 6-18 cells in each case as my payment for helping and for my sponsorship. I don't for sure remember the numbers that the packs would cycle at back then, but I think this will be close. I had packs that cycled at 7.13 and I paid 0 dollars for them. Best case scenario for guys without that advantage was paying $80 for a 7.00 pack. Believe me that made a difference on the track.

Things are good now and more fair than they have ever been.

Every couple months spend $80-90 for a couple fresh packs. That isn't that bad.

Here's an idea for LEGALIZING batteries for the use in ROAR.

ALL Batteries used at Regional or National EVENTS must have been sold by a Major Distributor and at least 250,000 cells must be available for retail purchase.

I've heard that IB quit MFG'ing the 3800's in August, but if thier supply is in warehouses, who really cares when it went out of production...as long as there is still a supply available to purchase and match. How many Motors and Batteries are still on the shelf at a lot of Hobbyshops across the country that NOBODY will ever use to race with? You have to hope the backyard bashers pick some of them up...or else....OPPPPS another Hobbyshop Closed w/ a obsolete inventory.

There is NO simple answer, so let's have ONE class UNLIMITED for the "big dogs" and keep the rest of us WILD PUPPIES on a short leash...

Here's an idea for LEGALIZING batteries for the use in ROAR.

ALL Batteries used at Regional or National EVENTS must have been sold by a Major Distributor and at least 250,000 cells must be available for retail purchase.

I've heard that IB quit MFG'ing the 3800's in August, but if thier supply is in warehouses, who really cares when it went out of production...as long as there is still a supply available to purchase and match. How many Motors and Batteries are still on the shelf at a lot of Hobbyshops across the country that NOBODY will ever use to race with? You have to hope the backyard bashers pick some of them up...or else....OPPPPS another Hobbyshop Closed w/ a obsolete inventory.

There is NO simple answer, so let's have ONE class UNLIMITED for the "big dogs" and keep the rest of us WILD PUPPIES on a short leash...

See you fail to get the point. IB manufactures cells as they are ordered as they are ONLY made for RC and no other industry. When they come off the assembly line they get boxed up and shipped with in days. There is no "warehouse" full of IB3800's. When they stopped running them there supply was empty within a few days to a week max.

SMC brings in around 25-30,000 cells in a week....so they would meet that withing a few months.....So your senario doesnt really work there.

There is no way to stop the battery manufactures.....As someone said it is up to the Tracks and Racers to do that. But if the tracks do it and piss their racers off they will just go else where to race and use their new super duper voltage batteries.

I will say this again. The USA is 1 of only about 3-4 countries in the world that actually has a "battery approval" each year.....I have customers in all parts of the world I deal with and none of them bitch when a new cell comes out. Most other countries race 2-5 times each week as well!!

EA

We used to go by date codes when buying batteries. Even though we may have ran a 2000 ma there were date codes that had better volts, IR and run time. We did not run out and get the latest until we needed to replace packs. Then we looked for the best code. The codes changed about 5 times a year. GP keep updating the 3300 just did not change the name or use a code.

No different to day. Instead of a date code we get the SHV or the Worlds.
After almost 20 years at this it has never really changed. Just work on the car. Read the post on this site, asked question here and at the track. Instead of thinking that .001 of a volt will get you beat.

I have learned more in the last 4 years than before using internet sites. Today people are happy to help, not like in the past. Take that knowledge and get a better understanding of what to do.

I have been running Nitro oval all summer, no batteries needed. I plan to run indoors this fall and winter and have not purchased my packs yet, but will in the next week or so. I only plan to by 2 new packs. Then by the time the Bird,s come around, I can get 2 of what ever is out.

Be willing to use older packs for practice and repeat use of the good ones for racing. Put the extra money into tires and things that make the chassis better. Go and have fun and try not to think you have to win. You may be surprised at how much you improve.

The only people to blame for the way batteries are , is the racers and the tracks. Tracks don't have to allow new packs the day they come out. Racers should not have to spend 2 to 3 hundred every other month on new batteries just to keepup with the jones. Make the chassis work and the motor work for the speed. Not just batteries. I have seen so many peolpe buy horse power. Myself being in the hobby for alittle over 2 yrs has seen this done by alot of people. They don't take the time to learn the chassis or motor work. they just want to lay down fast laps. You can have all the motor and battery in the world, but if you car isn't handling you might as well stay at home.


Just my 2 cents. :o

Thats the key , Tracks don't have to allow new packs the day they come out ! The 4200 isn't even approved yet.
I agree , 2/3 of the speed is in the chassis but lets play fair.
No , I didn't buy 6 / 4200 packs but the quantity doesn't really matter its just the point that batteries are changing faster than computers.

Guys this is all much ado about nothing.

As anyone who works in manufacturing knows companies are always striving to make continual improvements to the design of their product and to their manufacturing process. Sometimes the improvements make the product better, sometimes they make it cheaper to manufacture and sometimes both.

Do people expect that IB or any other battery company is not going to implement design tweeks or process improvements as soon as they realize the opportunity? They have to, there is no choice for them. They have to or they are dealing unfairly to all of their employees as well as investors, if it is a public company.

Even if the batteries never ever ever changed at all the fast guys would still be on fresh packs periodically. People act like if the batteries didn't change they would never have to buy new packs. When we had 3300s for several years if you were running two year old packs you were just as uncompetitive as if you were running 2400s. I guess I just don't see how anything has changed.

The only thing that has changed over the years is that now anyone with $45 can buy a pack that will run competitively at a national event. That is the best thing that has ever happened for the hobby in my opinion.

All i have to say is, YEAH!!!!!!! for once i didn't run out and buy 4200's when they first came out,

The bottom line is that all this additional spending doesn't help the future of this sport one bit.

Yes , alot of racers are used to buying many packs thru out the season but try and explain that to someone looking to get into this sport, he'll think your nuts.

The only feasable answer is to let your "por , I mean Pro " classes run any sub c and limit your entry level ones.

NCFRC, You right about having a class for limited or spec batteries for some local racing classes.

It would give the budget racer and the new guy a way to buy good used packs at a savings from the people that want run the new ones.

Thoes racres are looking for faster classes or they may attend races, orginized events at other tracks where the newer batteries are used.

Now days everyone wins. Lower priced new good packs and the budget racer can get fairly fresh packs by shoping.

In my Eyes, IB is the smartest out of all of us.......
From a business stand point, they release a cell, they go like Hotcakes, they improve a cell and call it "World Champion", they ARE going to go like Hotcakes....
The handfull on this thread, really doesn't matter to IB, it's the THOUSANDS around the globe, that are hungry, and are in the mood for Hotcakes.....

Point is, I'm not saying if it's right or wrong, but in todays world, it's all about business to a big Corporation, and they'll slice the throats of anyone who tries to stand in there way, and so far it's working....... :cool:

In my Eyes, IB is the smartest out of all of us.......
From a business stand point, they release a cell, they go like Hotcakes, they improve a cell and call it "World Champion", they ARE going to go like Hotcakes....
The handfull on this thread, really doesn't matter to IB, it's the THOUSANDS around the globe, that are hungry, and are in the mood for Hotcakes.....

Point is, I'm not saying if it's right or wrong, but in todays world, it's all about business to a big Corporation, and they'll slice the throats of anyone who tries to stand in there way, and so far it's working....... :cool:

That being said, There will for sure be a better cell sometime this indoor season.....

it will be called the Super World Champion cell, then a few month and they will come out with the Super Duper World celll you get the point

Bill "The Apprentice" Johnson......good one! You figured it out - pretty simple, huh?

The bottom line is that all this additional spending doesn't help the future of this sport one bit.

Yes , alot of racers are used to buying many packs thru out the season but try and explain that to someone looking to get into this sport, he'll think your nuts.

The only feasable answer is to let your "por , I mean Pro " classes run any sub c and limit your entry level ones.
I just dont see the "additional spending".... who doesnt buy a pack or two at the beginning of the indoor season? The Worlds dont cost anymore than the SHV did and have slightly better numbers. As I and others have stated, buy a couple of packs at the beginning of the season and another a few months later to keep up with the advancements. Name some other part of racing that has gotten way better over the last ten years and has gone down in price?

Figured it out when IB snuffed the GP 3700's existance right off the bat.......

Just making sure people don't lose touch that the CEO of IB probably doesn't give a damn about anything but counting his ching in his hot tub at the Spa he probably owns as well....... :thumbsup:

Figured it out when IB snuffed the GP 3700's existance right off the bat.......

Just making sure people don't lose touch that the CEO of IB probably doesn't give a damn about anything but counting his ching in his hot tub at the Spa he probably owns as well....... :thumbsup:

thats is some funny stuff, and absolutely frigin true. hey If I was IB I would do the same thing. Just like walmart did-slapped the hell out of, ames,bradleys etc... put them right on there you know what. and didnt give to SHHHHHH. ahh yea get it.

The bottom line is that all this additional spending doesn't help the future of this sport one bit.

Yes , alot of racers are used to buying many packs thru out the season but try and explain that to someone looking to get into this sport, he'll think your nuts.

The only feasable answer is to let your "por , I mean Pro " classes run any sub c and limit your entry level ones.

Yeah you're right and practically every track has some sort of entry level class. There are many spec classes that have various battery controls. More often than not they don't end up working for a vareity of reasons. That is beside the point though. There are spec classes out there. If you want to run it run it. If your track doesn't offer one take some iniative and get it going.

One thing I'm sure of is that complaining about it on the internet won't do much.

You could also replace internet time with working 3-4 hours a week at a second part time job, which would earn you more than enough to get all the batts you'd need.

Figured it out when IB snuffed the GP 3700's existance right off the bat.......

Just making sure people don't lose touch that the CEO of IB probably doesn't give a damn about anything but counting his ching in his hot tub at the Spa he probably owns as well....... :thumbsup:

What do you expect out of a company? They supply you a product that performs as advertised and they do it at a reasonable price.

If they figure out a way to improve their product at the same price they are going to do it. They are obligated to do it.

What exactly would you like them to do? Not improve their product? Guess what, if they don't a different company will step up with a better product and put them and all of their employees out of work. Since RC is IB's bread and butter they have to stay on top and if they don't they're done.

I don't have a problem with battery companies inproving their product, but they could do it in some sort of time frame. Most auto manufacturers only come out with the new car models ounce a year. And that is usually in Oct. they don't change in Feb. and then again in Oct. Just once a year!!!!


Also, what about the hobby store that stocks batteries? I have to buy a certian amount per order, well when the batteries change 3 months after my last order, what do you do with all the extra packs you buy? It is just a hit in the pants.Thank god that the local track has a battery rule for the entry level class. Or I hight have to eat $500 to $600 in batteries. :confused:

There has to be something that we as racers can do to control the battery issue.

EA Says:See you fail to get the point. IB manufactures cells as they are ordered as they are ONLY made for RC and no other industry. When they come off the assembly line they get boxed up and shipped with in days. There is no "warehouse" full of IB3800's. When they stopped running them there supply was empty within a few days to a week max.

EA, I didn't MISS the point...I created a point. If there were a Minimum number of cells that HAD to be produced, and NO New cell could be introduced until THAT battery were depleted to 8 - 10% of that supply...there MIGHT be more control.

Where-as I have NO CLUE as to how many cells are gone through in a year with OnRoad/OffRoad/Oval, etc. But toss a number I think I said 250,000 cells. That would be what...50,000 packs (4 and 6 cell combined) , but you say SMC does 25,000 per week...so that's close to 1.3 MILLION cells per year...just for one matcher. (That's close to 260,000 PACKS a year) So if we add all the matchers together that's got to be at least another 10,000 cells a year right?(LOL)

The other thing...since you say THEY MFG. the battery "FOR" the market...why not tell them what WE want instead of letting them tell YOU what YOU get.

I also understand about the OTHER COUNTRY Markets...and just like Wal*Mart, you have to sell the product that FITS the individual markets. (Not sure how many of those countries are spending 1500-2000 a month House Payment on a 3bd rm house either, not that THAT is relevant either...)

I Think most everybody on here understands the "business " aspect of selling RC batterys but as a track dirrector and who's seen many a racer come and go over the years its another racer excuse why they can't compete and may quit. Most racers have the mentallity that its the deepest pockets that win and you know , their probably right. A neg. that goes along with any form of competition.

Our track doesn't have a battery rule, and while at first I didn't think that was a good thing, I understand why he did it. 1.) As a hobby shop owner, it doesn't limit what he can sell 2.) People don't have to constantly worry whether or not a battery will become legal, they know for a fact if something new comes out they can run it. Most of the people who run at our track have been around the block and know that Setup is what separates the fast guys from the not fast, not 1000 more maH. I personally like to the technology going forward, but can anyone honestly say that there is a significant difference between a 4200 SHV or a 4200W? If we were comparing a Sanyo 3000HV to a 4200W I could agree with the argument. Nothing has dramaticlly changed from the last 3800 cell to the 4200, except for durability from what I am hearing, and these 4200's are supposed to be the longest lasting batteries yet (when treated right) Even in modified the larger capacity is not going to make that big of a difference beace the amp draw on out low wind modified motors is so high I guarentee you people are still going to dump them, and they are only going to get a couple of extra seconds.

... Most racers have the mentallity that its the deepest pockets that win and you know , their probably right. A neg. that goes along with any form of competition.


Absolutely :thumbsup:, and if they recently purchased shv cells, then they might not have the means to buy any 'WC' version and thus submit that they have lost the race before getting to the track and possibly quit or not race. This change is not good for matcher, racer, or track, and hope it does not discourage or deviate anyones plan to race.


Anchor :thumbsup:

You Have to ask yourself WHY do people want more voltage??? Simple, Speed. It seems that everyone wants to go faster...RIGHT???

You can eliminate battery problems by having faster motors, fast enough that you cant use all the power (everuone wants to go faster, right???) If you cant use all the power, no need for faster batteries...SO RACE MODIFIED!!!
Thats why other countries don't have battery wars, we're the only country with a STOCK following :rolleyes:.

Stop running STOCK, and you'll stop your battery problem.

Stock is where it is at, at this very moment, and yes, i do believe that everyone see's .02v as an advantage, but i really dont buy it. I run almost the same lap times thru a 4 min main, and sometimes even faster at the end because you get smoother and more used to it. You cant tell me, that that battery has not dropped .1v or even more. If you were racing a series that the top three were finishing 4.01.67 66 / 4.01.87 66/ 4.01.96 66 than i would say that .01v is gonna help, but if you are loosing by laps, look elsewhere, it is either gonna be your car setup, or maybe come to grips with your driving and spend some more time PRATICING instead of coming here and complaining.

FreAAK

What do you expect out of a company? They supply you a product that performs as advertised and they do it at a reasonable price.

If they figure out a way to improve their product at the same price they are going to do it. They are obligated to do it.

What exactly would you like them to do? Not improve their product? Guess what, if they don't a different company will step up with a better product and put them and all of their employees out of work. Since RC is IB's bread and butter they have to stay on top and if they don't they're done.

Thank you for successfully re-iterating my point in my posts.......
But, understand you missed something, and Brett nailed it, no other country has the Stock following like us, no other country has this problem. Someone said it maybe in another thread somewhere here at somepoint, but I'll put it into terms everyone can understand....we are the .030 in IB's inch of playground........

Have a good day guys, this will flatten all out soon enough, where everyone can be happy...

SWTOUR,

I am not sure but I think that SMC is the US importer for the cells. They match some and distribute them to matchers around the country. I do not believe that there facility and number of workers could do that many batteries. They distribute as good a product to the matchers as they have. They have built an import and matching business by making the product more available to many matchers to meet the demand here in the US. I believe they have done a good and fair job, not like other importers ( NO I am not a SMC driver, just been around a long time).

In an effort to not lose racers in the US market they have asked the manufactures to not change the batteries so fast, but were told that the US is not their biggest market. Others battery markets around the word dictate the changes. Others around the world look forward to getting new an improved cells.

Larry B

EA Says:

EA, I didn't MISS the point...I created a point. If there were a Minimum number of cells that HAD to be produced, and NO New cell could be introduced until THAT battery were depleted to 8 - 10% of that supply...there MIGHT be more control.

Where-as I have NO CLUE as to how many cells are gone through in a year with OnRoad/OffRoad/Oval, etc. But toss a number I think I said 250,000 cells. That would be what...50,000 packs (4 and 6 cell combined) , but you say SMC does 25,000 per week...so that's close to 1.3 MILLION cells per year...just for one matcher. (That's close to 260,000 PACKS a year) So if we add all the matchers together that's got to be at least another 10,000 cells a year right?(LOL)

The other thing...since you say THEY MFG. the battery "FOR" the market...why not tell them what WE want instead of letting them tell YOU what YOU get.

I also understand about the OTHER COUNTRY Markets...and just like Wal*Mart, you have to sell the product that FITS the individual markets. (Not sure how many of those countries are spending 1500-2000 a month House Payment on a 3bd rm house either, not that THAT is relevant either...)

If you think IB will base everything they do off of the US market you are sadly mistaken.... the US is just probably around 20-25% of their total market!! So for us to THINK that they would do everything we say reguarding new batteries is pretty naive (sp?).

Making batteries is like anything else....Do you have any idea how much battery prices would increase if we (the US) had IB start making a cell just for us (not that they would even consider it anyway)? Or keep making a cell for us after introducing a new cell (hence the 3800)...Its just to expensive to setup lines to make these things and then switch over.

Most of the cost in having something mass produced is the actually setup and dissasembly time of the line........The actual materials cost very little.

EA

Thank you for successfully re-iterating my point in my posts.......
But, understand you missed something, and Brett nailed it, no other country has the Stock following like us, no other country has this problem. Someone said it maybe in another thread somewhere here at somepoint, but I'll put it into terms everyone can understand....we are the .030 in IB's inch of playground........

Have a good day guys, this will flatten all out soon enough, where everyone can be happy...

I never disagreed with your point on the US not being the biggest market, although we do have more than 3%. What I quoted and disagreed with was the rant about the CEO counting his money at your expense blah blah.

Maybe if we spent a little more time racing fairly and having fun and a little less time complaining we'd have the largest market share. Just a thought.

Look if you want to run a spec battery class and your track does not have one then do a little work and start one. Yeah it'll suck at first only having a couple guys to race with, but if you promote it, show that it's fun and that the racing is good before long many will be joining you. That is what happened with BL.

If you don't want to start or run in a spec battery class than simply buy a couple packs every couple months. It's not a huge investment.

Problem SOLVED!!!!! No need for more complaining!

Here are some test results from Testing a pack of these cells for the past week and a half. These were not matched that closely as they were just used for testing and abusing to see how they would hold up. Original numbers at 35 amps were 450-459RT, 1.24-1.244Volts, 1.3-1.5IR's.

1st cycle on GFX at 35 amps.

437RT
7.43Voltage
9.4AIR.

This pack was then ran this past weekend 4 times on Friday, 4 times on Saturday and 3 times on Sunday.

I did NOT discharge the pack after the last stock run in TC Sunday. Tuesday I discharged the pack on the Much More CTX-D and then cycled it. So this cycle would be the 12th cycle on the pack.

12th cycle on GFX at 35 amps. It seems that with a little charge left in it the next cycle was just a tick lower...but very good!!

430RT
7.42Voltage
9.4IR

13th cycle on GFX at 35 amps on Wednesday.

438RT
7.44 Voltage
8.6 IR.

14th cycle on a GFX at 35 amps this afternoon

440RT
7.44 Voltage
9.0IR

15th cycle on a GFX at 35 amps tonight (4 hours after 14th cycle).

439RT
7.44 Voltage
8.8 IR

I know this is a short term test but the pack is what I would consider borerline abused by being ran and cycled that many times in such a short period of time. So who's to say you dont need just 2 packs of these bad johnny's in your box and nothing else? We shall see in the long run I guess.

EA

The battery rotation has always been a rough rocky road to travel at times. Look at the bright side though. We ran the GP 3300 for almost 4 years. That is one of the longest running cells in recent times with out one batch to another causing much trouble. The current situation is out of the US matchers hands really because the manufactures of the cells are going to do what they want.

The only way to put a stop to all this is for tracks to work together and say no more. or ride the wave and do the best we can with it. The thing that everyone needs to get over is that a 1.21 is faster than a 1.20 cell. It is a number and that is all. Not the sky is falling. yes there are certain packs or cells that perform better sometime but that number above isnt the complete answer to that. Your car set up and driving skill is far more important.

With all that said, look at the bright side. The cells of today have taken runtime completely out of the picture because we have way more than enough to do 4 or 5 min races. And voltage is not the overall determining factors either. So the way I see it we are ahead of the game right now and should accept it and have fun. Think back to the days when 10 seconds on a battery was large difference and did matter. Dont have that worry no more. We are using 1.21 and 1.22 cells in stick packs now. Holly cow that is awesome. I dont like to spend the bucks anymore than the next guys but it could be worse

Others have said it... and I have suggested the same before... Just buy two packs for each class you intend on running (ex stock, 19t, mod) at the beginning of "your" season. Get two new ones half way through the season and you are good. There is just no need to go out and buy eight packs for one class... that is just plain foolish... unless you are lucky enough to race seven days a week.

The chassis and keeping reasonably fresh batteries is key. No matter the miah or voltage if your battery is old it is going to be flat. Even with spec you can not expect to get the same performance out of old batteries that you do with new ones.

I have been racing for a total of twenty years now (most of it dirt) you can not stop the progress of new batteries and there is no need to. You guys have a lot be thankful here... look at the positve side...

Be thankful you have the internet to keep up to date... Like Larry B said earlier I have learned more in the last few years with the internet than what I could on my own for years..
Be thankful you have a company like IB and many of the matchers out there that are keeping the price down... you are getting a better quality product for the same price you were probably paying for batteries five years ago... if you take into a count the inflation rate... How much were you paying for gas five years ago? Humm I rest my case!
Be thankful you have matchers like EA on here giving you data on the testing they are doing. You can use their data for your knowledge and spend your time going over your chassis making sure everything is well maintained.

Bottom line don't worry be happy! lol... Spend less time worring about batteries and more on your chassis. Let's stop moaning and groaning and just go racing! If we do feel the need to complain focus it on the gas companies...

I know this is a short term test but the pack is what I would consider borerline abused by being ran and cycled that many times in such a short period of time. So who's to say you dont need just 2 packs of these bad johnny's in your box and nothing else? We shall see in the long run I guess.

EA


Wow, pretty consistent. Sad to say it but, those are along the lines of the 3300's that could be abused and keep on ticking just the same in some ways........ :thumbsup:

Borderline abused...Meaning, if you didn't conduct this test yourself, but knew someone had run it into the ground like this, you wouldn't warranty it by no means EA?.... :tongue: :jest:

Wow, pretty consistent. Sad to say it but, those are along the lines of the 3300's that could be abused and keep on ticking just the same in some ways........ :thumbsup:

Borderline abused...Meaning, if you didn't conduct this test yourself, but knew someone had run it into the ground like this, you wouldn't warranty it by no means EA?.... :tongue: :jest:

Yes so far this cell seems to be as consistant as the GP3300 EXCEPT that you must keep 500 seconds of charge in it between weekly shows. I cycled it again today (2 days since the last cycle with NO charge in it) and it was 439RT, 7.44voltage and 8.9IR. So it's still holding. I'll keep the results posted here everytime I cycle it and keep up with the numbers. Althought I am not for a new cell or revised cell every few months BUT if they can make cells like this and improve the quality/durability I am ALL for it!!

Honestly I have yet to refuse to warranty a cell for guys.....Sometimes it takes a few weeks to get a cell to match up for them but I always replace cells when people contact me. With the start of the WC Cells I have also started matching by charge time and have also put a date code on the labels so I can tell how old a pack is if its returned to me. But in doing this test I wanted to go to the extreme as I highly doubt anyone could race this many times in a week with a pack so I know it will hold up at a big race being run 2 times a day for 3-4 days straight.

EA

Yeah, I hear ya.....I was just pokin fun at the scenario.....

Thanks for the info, and progress reports. I'll be looking forward to seeing more as you test......

Here are some test results from Testing a pack of these cells for the past week and a half.

This pack was then ran this past weekend 4 times on Friday, 4 times on Saturday and 3 times on Sunday.

EA

Am I getting this right?

This is saying, that if you had time, between races,
you could actually use one pack... as you ran one pack, 4 times...
(not that many ever would)

Are you discaharging after every race, or just putting it back
on the charger to "top it off"?

just want to get clear on what you are saying... thnx. :confused:

Am I getting this right?

This is saying, that if you had time, between races,
you could actually use one pack... as you ran one pack, 4 times...
(not that many ever would)

Are you discaharging after every race, or just putting it back
on the charger to "top it off"?

just want to get clear on what you are saying... thnx. :confused:

Hi Dan,

Only time will tell how long this pack will last treating it like this but I plan on abusing this pack to see how long it takes for it to fall off.

I would run the pack, discharge it to 5.4, let it cool and recharge it once it reached room temp or sometimes later in the day. It was usually run 1st in the morning, once afternoon, once late afternoon, and then at night. So it had around 2-3 hours between each run most of the time.

EA

I'm surprised that your IR numbers are that high as most 4200's "I've tested" seem to be in the low 7's.