Nope, John Colosky

in a lot of the races i have been at somebodys buddy or buddys end up seeing things one sided . not that they mean to it just happens , so two cars need to go back .
also EVERYONE needs to back the race dirctor remember the pay doesn't match the job


Amen to that . Been There , right John ?

OK, Here is another "pot stiring thing"

How come you can't put somthing on the exaust to vent the fumes to the rear or side of the car.

If we're worried about a tuning pipe from the Hili muffler, (are you kidding me?) what does it do?

If we're worried about heat, this is 2007. There are materials that disipate heat pretty good. I've burned myself on the rail of some cars because they don't vent it anywhere.

If we're doing this because this is the way we've always done it, I have a story that will convince you otherwise. Let me know if you want to hear it...

Let the games begin.

OK, Here is another "pot stiring thing"

How come you can't put somthing on the exaust to vent the fumes to the rear or side of the car.

If we're worried about a tuning pipe from the Hili muffler, (are you kidding me?) what does it do?

If we're worried about heat, this is 2007. There are materials that disipate heat pretty good. I've burned myself on the rail of some cars because they don't vent it anywhere.

If we're doing this because this is the way we've always done it, I have a story that will convince you otherwise. Let me know if you want to hear it...

Let the games begin.

Perfect time to recommend a change or amendment to the rules. Send it to Scott Schramske and it will be evaluated.

:)

Regards,
Joe

OK, Here is another "pot stiring thinAs much stirring as you do jbell, I think you need a cauldron. hehehe :tongue: Seriously, do you mean having something tight fitting around the exhaust stinger? If so, wouldn't that create more power in the engine? I may be mistaken, not an engine guru, but heard that's possible. :wave:

Yep, that is what I'm talking about. I'm no engine guru either, but I got to tell ya. If it makes that much horse power, I'm straping hoses on my truck's tail pipe!!! Come on, are you kidding me? I would think if anything, it would make less horsepower.

Engines are what? Air pumps. If you restrict the flow, you make a less efficient air pump. So how the heck does adding a tail pipe add horspower? The muffler is already creating enough back pressure.

Just questions I like to ask. Taking a dip in the cauldron to see if I can stir up some trouble...lol

Yep, that is what I'm talking about. I'm no engine guru either, but I got to tell ya. If it makes that much horse power, I'm straping hoses on my truck's tail pipe!!! Come on, are you kidding me? I would think if anything, it would make less horsepower.

Engines are what? Air pumps. If you restrict the flow, you make a less efficient air pump. So how the heck does adding a tail pipe add horspower? The muffler is already creating enough back pressure.

Just questions I like to ask. Taking a dip in the cauldron to see if I can stir up some trouble...lol

With that rationale, there would be no need for headers or pipes of any variety in the "racing" world, yet they run both headers and pipes of some nature.

Just $.02 worth. ;)

go buy tuned pipe for the Zenoha and then tell me it doesn't make
more horse power.


the rule doesn't say you can't vent exhaust. just can't attacht it so
the pressure can't go anywhere but in the exhauset venting pipe.

to make the rule simple to understand and simple to impliment, is why
it is worded and designed that way.
if you just take a hose within the size limits in the rules, and butt it
up against the exhaust outlet , its not a problem. they prefer it doesn't
even touch the muffler , to make it that much easier to tech.
NOW take a hose clamp and crimp in down tight onto the little tube coming out of muffler and
NOW you got a problem. The rule is written so we don't have to
debate if your design for getting the exhaust out of the car is increasing
horsepower or decreasing it. simply don't attach it and we all are the same.
and legal. simple

I hear ya, the thing is the ones I've seen are all dirctly connected to the engine, not the Heli muffler you have to run. I could be wrong, I just don't see how you could add horsepower using the same diamiter tube to vent the exaust with say a high temp silicone tube clamped on the heli stinger.

I was thinking that some tracks may have a noise problem and can't run during the week or whatever. Having a tube vented to the back and pointing down will greatly reduce the noise and not affect the horsepower.

Just a thought. i really don't have a problem with the rule, but i do like to ask questions and get people thinking outside the box...

I guess your right. once it goes thur the muffler it probably won't do
anything for horse power . if its too small i could see it choking the engine.
but not increase its horse power. but im not an engine know it all either so
what do i know. but i think the rule is designed to take all this guessing
and wondering out of it. some guy could be flying and you might think
his fancy exhaust is the trick. and maybe it does help. so i think they
just said hey, lets say don't attach it and we don't have to worry about
weather it helps or hurts.

I'd like to take a pick of mine and send it to ya. i've raced at QSAC
events with it this way and nobody said diddly about it in tech.

speaking of noise, 8 to 10 cars going by on front straight with exhaust exitingon passager side of cars. all i can say is its VERY LOUD.

it was actually quieter when nobody vented it out. but its nice to get the
dirt out . make a mess on the side of your body on the inside

here is my exhaust left side exit ,i was told to make a small change to it ..the diameter of my pipe is 1" OD and the rule says 1" ID so
i have to redo it :confused:


http://photos.hobbytalk.com/data/500/Picture_033.jpg

Also, I checked with QSAC on those chrome RC230 motor covers (plastic), you know the ones you see on the net (Dave's), they are NOT QSAC legal.

"Zenoah is not the OEM of the chrome motor parts. The rules state no addition or removal of materials. Chrome plating or using "after market" parts that have been modified is not allowed."

Would that be a rule that would really be inforced if someone won with it? It's not a "speed" inhancer or any benifit other than looking good. What if you cracked a cover and bought one of those because it's cheaper and looks better? If it does'nt effect the car I don't think that is a fair rule. I understand the no modifications rules but to add a cover to the engine is not modification. People don't have anywhere to individualize there cars other than painting the bodies. I just think if it does'nt make it faster than it should be allowed no matter what it is. I mean look at spark plugs. The "stock" zenoah plug does'nt cost $11.00 but people use the iridium plugs anyway. That is a modification is'nt it?

I know way back when that Lance Love had chrome engines in his cars, I have a couple of them.

My 2 cents on the matter :tongue:

That is exactly the conversation I am trying to invoke here with this thread. Before I put an official request to look at a rule. I'd like to know what your thoughts are. I think this is good for the sport and gets people involved with the process.

Keep it coming!

Jim, I agree 100%. The problem I have is that I know QSAC wants to keep cost down. I am glad that is at the top of the list. The problem I see is we are loosing what racing is really about. We are basically running a very large "spec" class. Telling someone they can't run something that has zero effect on performance is pointless. Worry about real rule infractions. I like having different things than other people. I don't want my car to look like everyone elses. Back in the late 80's I loved it when I looked in the magazines at the king 8 races and other big races you seen all kinds of different cars. The super class was my favorite you had Raco's, WCM's,New era's, Auto engineering, Quick draws and others in the class. They all looked different. We dont have that anymore thats for sure. I know we dont have enough national participation in 1/4 scale to have 200 cars at the big races but what can the organization do to change that. I would love to see the outlaw LM class return. I know there was'nt a huge amount of particpation in that class years ago, but I think today that calss would be completely different. The money people spend on 1/5 scale bashers today is crazy. People want realistic FAST cars and they will spend the money to have both.
Anyway I know this post is'nt going to do any good but I thought I would share my thoughts about this. I just think 1/4 scale needs that WOW factor like it used to have. The size alone isnt going to cut it. I am glad magazines and QSAC are finally together again. I think that will help alot. Also people like Freddy taking the chance and building a facility for these great cars. I applaude him for that and hope to make a trip up there to race for that reason.

NEXT :)

no chrome. aw.. that sucks. i wonder about that rule. does it apply to paint, basicly.

"The rules state no addition or removal of materials."

Painting would be an "addition" of a material.....................

:-(

Gentlemen:
Back in the day I was fortunate enough to race Go-Karts and we had McCullough engines. We took great measures to restrict the air flow under the cover by the flywheel around the block and over the head as that air pumping action sucked horsepower and the airflow wasn't needed for proper performance. My point here is if the powers to be allowed aftermarket covers that could be the start of an engine performance increase. I believe the governing body has the right idea in mind and I agree with their rules.
Stuch

[QUOTE=big maestro] I mean look at spark plugs. The "stock" zenoah plug does'nt cost $11.00 but people use the iridium plugs anyway. That is a modification is'nt it?


I will agree 100% on this one. The Iridium spark plug "is" a performance enhancer.

But we are more worried about a plastic cover that has crome on it. that has no performance enhancement. Crome does not make one go faster.

At that rate those nice little filters people use on the pull start cover would be called a performance enhancer. instead of a preventative overheat measure.

But i do understand without strict rules it would not take long before alot of stuff would have huge issues. Bend a inch and take a mile. MY 01 worth

[QUOTE=Slider
But i do understand without strict rules it would not take long before alot of stuff would have huge issues. Bend a inch and take a mile. MY 01 worth[/QUOTE]

thats is correct.

i don't believe the rules say anything about which plug you have to use,
so that is one thing you can play with. be happy about it . :)

I agree, that it does'nt say anything about the plug. BUT! the piont is the plugs cost $11.00 or more. Also not everyone can get them. I had to wait almost three weeks to get some because my local parts house did'nt have them and could'nt find them. Point is it is a performance inhancer, a chrome cover is not. The covers are identical except for the material they are made of. But I do understand give an inch take a mile. I'm just saying there are other areas that are more problematic than others. Either way I'm not going to quit because of it. Just keepin the pot stirring. :thumbsup:

the piont is the plugs cost $11.00 or more. Also not everyone can get them. I had to wait almost three weeks to get some because my local parts house did'nt have them and could'nt find them.

You need to think beyond your local parts store. There are numerous "ebusiness" sites that sell the plugs. You can have them within three-to-five business days.

And with regard to the "local parts store", none of the following could supply the plugs I wanted/needed; AutoZone, Advance Auto Parts, CarQuest and the NAPA store.

Joe

Where do I find these 11.00 plugs? Do they really make a difference? I'm still new to this sport / hobby and never heard of the iridium plugs??? :confused:

wow that sucks i guess i have to take my motor out of my predator sprint car now and put ugly black plastic back on that sucks i did not know this rule i just wanted to make my car look nice and different what about my blue aluminum pull start handle.that makes it start faster lol. i dont agree with this rule the chrome plastic does not do anything the stock does . better or worse just looks this is what this sport is all about doing things to your car.to be unique your own.i like to have my cars to look good and be different i guess i wont race my sprint then i wonder why sport is going down hill .its just plastic change rule.imo.

Daves motor has the NGK CR8 HIX Iridium and theNGK CR7 HIX in stock for a mear $9.50 Plus shipping.
Man I don't see how they can sell em so cheap. LMBO I will stick with the cheap units myself.

You need to think beyond your local parts store. There are numerous "ebusiness" sites that sell the plugs. You can have them within three-to-five business days.

And with regard to the "local parts store", none of the following could supply the plugs I wanted/needed; AutoZone, Advance Auto Parts, CarQuest and the NAPA store.

Joe

getting high quality proformance plugs has always been a problem getting them locally. have always had to buy mine online or through someone else when they were getting some. and they aren't cheap. but they do last quite awhile. have gotten two years out of 5 plugs and still have 3 i use out of the 5. with the iridiums plugs. once it fouls, throw it out. it won't be
run good after that.

why do we still have a regulation on the amount of fuel line you can use when we don't do green flag or even yellow fuel stops. but i guess if they ever go back to it they have it covered. or if your local track does something different with stops.

Where do I find these 11.00 plugs? Do they really make a difference? I'm still new to this sport / hobby and never heard of the iridium plugs??? :confused:

Try www.ngk.com

Sheldon - Were you planning on racing your Sprint at all the QSAC Nationals?

Your local track might not have a problem with the "chrome" motor cover.

Also, Here is the link for QSAC rule suggestions, I used it before, they do listen:

http://www.qsac.org/pdfs/2008/2008%20QSAC%20Suggestions.pdf

SG

getting high quality proformance plugs has always been a problem getting them locally. have always had to buy mine online or through someone else when they were getting some. and they aren't cheap. but they do last quite awhile. have gotten two years out of 5 plugs and still have 3 i use out of the 5. with the iridiums plugs. once it fouls, throw it out. it won't be
run good after that.

why do we still have a regulation on the amount of fuel line you can use when we don't do green flag or even yellow fuel stops. but i guess if they ever go back to it they have it covered. or if your local track does something different with stops.

And the fuel line rule is a prime example of a rule that really has no bearing as long as we run with red flag fuel stops. It would make an excellent rule change suggestion.

Joe

Joe - Not all tracks have red flag fuel stops.

And the fuel line rule is a prime example of a rule that really has no bearing as long as we run with red flag fuel stops. It would make an excellent rule change suggestion.

Joe


no reason to change it. since we run red flag stops , its not an issue.
but if anything changes in future, the rule is already in place.

my point was not all the rules may seem to make sense or appear nessasary but there is a reason behind all them. and as IN2racin says, certain tracks may want to run green or yellow stops. so if anyone comes to the race, and they say QSAC rules apply with expection of fuel stops, then they already know how the car should be setup to pass inspection. vegas runs
green stop on their weekly show. and think freddies is going to try some here and there.

Fuel stops. I wonder how many tracks have red flag fuel stops vs. green or yellow flag fuel stops. Are we using a rule that is outside what is needed or are we doing it because my great grand mother passed it down to her daughter and so on? Opps, I got my stories mixed up...lol

I think I lost the point on this topic....... lol

That's one of those rules (red pit stops) you should remember or think about the times you raced . How many people were there not working that could or would help fuel cars ? Also with the drivers stand w/ stairs with green flag fueling . OUCH !!!!!

Everybody should remember the safety factor with this fuel stop issue . Most tracks I've been to ,the hot pit lane is hardly wide enough for two cars to pass each other slowly let alone at reasonable speed , let alone the fact trying to dodge a human bending over to pick up a car to get it out of the way of traffic . Who is gonna monitor the pit road speed ? Every car would have to have their own pit space , or the pit guys will be chasing down cars with no brakes or broke parts . Think of this , ever been hit by a car while marshalling in the smaller classes ? Then think about getting smoked by a thirty pounder at any speed . Been there done that , besides I'm too old ,too fat and too lazy to chase down cars in the pit lane and try to dodge cars and other people while trying to pit for somebody . SAFETY is the factor and the reason QSAC has deamed it necessary to revert back to red flag fuel stops . A few years back this fuel stops under the green or cautions was tried , sometimes it worked out ok and most not . Somebody said it's hard to get somebody to fuel for ya or for somebody who needs a pit man . Try being a race director and get the people to take their turn to corner marshal when it's their turn . Here's another thought , the insurance we have covers basically spectators , just in case a car goes wild and hits somebody watching us . Safety First is the reason for the QSAC ruling .

Randy Baker
QSAC Great Lakes Regional Director

My point exactly Randy. Thank you for the comment.

Then Rule 11.12.05 #1 does not make sense. #2 could be a Safty factor rule, but if the fuel amount is not an issue, then the amount of line you have shoulden't either. I'm sure that 60 inches is more than enough, but there are different size fuel tanks.

My point exactly Randy. Thank you for the comment.

Then Rule 11.12.05 #1 does not make sense. #2 could be a Safty factor rule, but if the fuel amount is not an issue, then the amount of line you have shoulden't either. I'm sure that 60 inches is more than enough, but there are different size fuel tanks.

And your point is EXACTLY the point I was trying to make.

Well put.

Joe

Classic has red flag stops..... Makes sence... Most of us are to old and to wise to want to be on a pit road without some sort of control. Also Classic has no pit lane OUCH!

Also, I checked with QSAC on those chrome RC230 motor covers (plastic), you know the ones you see on the net (Dave's), they are NOT QSAC legal.

"Zenoah is not the OEM of the chrome motor parts. The rules state no addition or removal of materials. Chrome plating or using "after market" parts that have been modified is not allowed."
I guess QSAC doesn't want any of us slow guys looking good..... lol

Your stuff always looks good Chuck! LOL