The 2006
Adirondack Ice Breaker
A ROAR State Championship Event
Saturday MARCH 25
Track opens at 9 a.m.
Registration & Signups 9 a.m. - 2 p.m.
Open practice 9 a.m. - 2:30 p.m.
1st race @ 3 p.m.

3 heats and the mains for:
1/10 scale Stock, 19 turn, Modified ,
1/12 scale 19 turn
***Local Rule - 38oz weight for 1/10 pan cars - Co27 motors OK***
All other ROAR rules apply.

All heats and mains are 4 min. per ROAR rules
Awards to all in A-Mains and winners of all lower mains

Roar membership required.
May be purchased at event, $30 annual or $15 single event
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Entry Fee - 1st entry $25.00
2nd entry or Jr. family member (age 16 or under)$15.00

you can not change a ROAR rule, for a ROAR race, the weight for ROAR 1/10 pan is 40oz.

There is a space on the sanctioning form for "Rules deviation requested", and instructions that say that "Minor rule changes may be authorized with widespread announcement to potential entrants". We requested this deviation on the sanctining form. Hope it is not too big of a problem for out of town racers. We ran 40 oz. for a season and everbody, even guys with older cars and electronics were having to add 2 oz. of lead. Also a couple of other nearby tracks/clubs run 38oz.

I just dont see any reason for the change, if you are trying to be a ROAR track, why change the rules?? almost every track in the North East runs ROAR rules and they all run the 40oz rule. adding 2oz, 3oz who cares if its the rule so be it! I just hate to have to change the car from the normal weight, that almost every track runs...
38oz is the lightest i have ever herd of, even Snow birds is 39oz, but they are NOT
running ROAR rules. Not looking to make trouble, just looking for unity amoung tracks...

PUF - as Ken stated in his last post, the decision WAS made to provide unity between neighboring tracks. Many were unhappy about the weight and IMO it's ridiculous - to spend the amount of $ we do on our rides only to put more wheel weights on them than a passenger car. Come join us for a fast, fun weekend. If you've never been here before then you don't have a proven starting setup anyway(I apologize if you have been here) - plus you'll spend less money on tires!!

Jason

PUF doesn't mind weighing a little more...:cool: :tongue:

Later, Bret

Well maybe the 2 tracks that are doing this will join the REST of the region, and use the correct weight!
And the "ridiculous" part is that you will have the same people as usall and not many out of towners...
Thanks JET...
NIck

I know for a fact that the weight rule has kept a local racer that wanted to get back in full racing mode this year away from the glens falls track, he has a perfectly good disruptor that he has been competitive with but with no weight on the car and light electronics he is still almost at 40 oz, he does not want to have to buy a new car just to be competitive at the 38 oz weight, and a few of the patts burg guys did not race because they did not want to rip off 8chunks of lead and have to put it back on the next week, the weight rule is a real issue and with the low attendance at the previous race it may make sense for you to consider running the 40 oz rule and risk upsetting 1 or 2 local racers for the chance to bring in a larger group for this (roar event)


I apreciate having a hobby shop within local driving distance but I am afraid that at some point it will no longer be there.

just my 2-cents

After being away from this for more than ten years, the last four years we have been running 38 oz with the exception of the first half of this season. Honest question - When did the "rest of the world" go to 40 oz.? I'm just trying to see the timeline here. Isn't a Disruptor more than four years old? I missed some history but didn't four cell stem from the desire to spend less on tires and motors. Two more oz. is a lot of lead - why not just run 6 cell? I wouldn't have a problem running the weight if someone could justify the reason for it. Please keep in mind that this is a sincere question. As far as the hobby shops existence goes, there was less attendance before the weight was dropped back down.

racin you have a private message

we run 40oz because it is the weight rule!! The same as nascar has a rule for weight,
so does ROAR. Who cares why, if that is the rule, we run it...didnt say we like it, but it is the rule. and yes the newer cars weigh less then older ones...

I travel to many tracks, there are not many weeks in a race season that I do not race atleast twice a week and many of them are 3 times a week, all tracks I have raced on this year,meaning the 2005/2006 season except for gf. and rens. are all at 40 oz or above, this includes plattsburg, st.rock, massena, barre, rc toy box, maximus and some others, IT is not fun scraping the weight off and back on the car two or three times a week, as far as the cost of things, the battery voltage of the 6 cell is what hurt the motors compared to the 4 cell, the weight does have some impacted,but I do not have to rebuild my motors that are run at the tracks of 40 oz more than the tracks of 38 oz, tire wear is as much of a speed issue as it is a weight issue, thus the heavy car may ofset some of the speed and the wear is not much different.

again
just my-2-cents

oh ya, almost forgot, someone said ealier in the year when the weight was 40 oz that the track was slower, 2 oz slower, but every other track I mentioned above has had the track records broken at the 40 oz weight, the only reason that kens track is even close to the older runs at the 38 oz weight is the newer packs have that much more power, your not comparing equal track conditions from year to year with as much track wear as it has.

Back at ya, Slikstr.

Puf - you're right, they're ROAR rules that the majority chooses to be governed by. I just can't believe that so many follow them instead of seeking alternatives. Is there really that much support there? I've heard of many locals traveling hundreds of miles just to race with same guys they see every week - so maybe it's more than just a weight issue here. Of course the exception is tracks like St.Roch where any rules would draw a crowd.

racin,the bridge was low i would think about it hahahahaha how much is the payout that roar gives for finishing??

my point is its a family orientated sport/hobby and we want to have fun doing it. they also have a spot for revisions. to say attendence is down only because of the 2 ounces is crazy.

My 2 cents on this is if you are calling it a Roar event then run it using Roar rules. I enjoyed running at your track for the last Roar event. I drove the 6.5 hours plus to race there because it was a Roar event. I don't know, but I think this race will lose it's appeal to alot of racers if we deviate from Roar rules, not only weight but also with motors, stock and 19 turn. For you guy's to say tire wear is due to 2 oz's of weight. I say it has more to do with how well your chassis is set up. Priddles cars don't burn off much tire, look at there body next time there done racing. Steve

There's alot to be said for conformity, I'm not sure which way to go..Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

But here's the deal, when I'm headed to another track, the weight rule isn't one of my concerns. When I get there, I find out what the weight rule is, and go for it, add weight, remove it...Whatever.

The big problem is for people who race multiple tracks weekly, adding, removing a couple times a week can be a plain ole hassel...Maybe velcro...:lol:

Later, Bret

That's not my point Brett my point is for a Roar event you should run Roar rules. There weekly shows they can set there weight to what ever I don't have a problem with that. When you give a race a title and charge extra because you give it that title you should at least run by there rules.

That's not my point Brett my point is for a Roar event you should run Roar rules. There weekly shows they can set there weight to what ever I don't have a problem with that. When you give a race a title and charge extra because you give it that title you should at least run by there rules.

Oh yea, no argument by any means :) .
I wasn't saying people need to conform to this track, I was saying, I don't think twice about adding or removing weight when I go somewhere else :thumbsup: .

Personally I think 40oz is a bit heavy though. My car with a modified motor (Heavier than stock) receiver pack, and a wing, weighs in at 38oz on the money.

But I'll conform to whatever weight a track mandates.

I wish we'd heard some of these opinions when we were discussing what to do about the weight rule last fall. At that time we were not affiliated with ROAR. We only became a ROAR track a couple of months ago. Everyone we talked to was in favor of going back to the 38oz. rule that we have run for years because many of them ran at Renns. the next day and did not want to change it back every week. We did not make this decision to infuriate everyone and cause an uproar. We simply made the decision that we thought was in everyones best interest at that time. I don't feel we should change it now that the season is so far along, and we can't change it for the ROAR event now that the variance was requested on the sanctioning form and it has been advertised. It would be very dissapointing if some of you choose not to come just because of that. I'm looking forward to seeing you guys. How about if I supply the "GOO GONE" and some new lead to put back on after :p
Maybe it was the right choice or maybe it wasn't but we have to live with it for the time being. We will certainly go with the ROAR weight rule for future ROAR events and maybe for weekly racing next season.
Now this is just my opinion, but it makes no sense to me that now that the cars are lighter and the electronics are lighter(even cheap low end electronics) the weight rule is higher. I used to run a Disruptor(with nothing cut away to lighten it) with a Tempest ESC(4 times the size of anything any of you are running now) and that car was not much over 38oz. I even came up light a couple of times because one of my battery packs was a little lighter than the others.
We value everyones opinion. Don't stop letting us know how you feel, but if we make a decision you don't agree with don't get the idea that we did it to upset some of you.
By the way in case you didn't read your NEW ROAR rulebook the weight is now 41oz. That's just 1oz. less than when we used to run with 6 cells :confused:

Funny Steve, I qualified about 1 second within Dan Priddle and so did you. I'm not sure what you're trying to say about chassis - I lost .005" all day on L sides and R/R - .008" on RF. I'm not trying to drive the tire issue home, just saying it's a small perk to lower weight. You're making an issue around one detail that I mentioned. Whatever - let's run 40 oz. I hardly even care anymore.....

I'm glad to see when talking about weight rules, you only consider stock. How about the other classes 19 turn and mod where the motors weight more and wings are added, also reciever packs. I have commented on your local weight rule before, and all it does is keep out of towners from attending your local races.

Well I will NOT be going, or will the 5 guys that I travel with. it is just too much of a PITA to mess with the weights, and then get the chassis right again. Good Luck All,
maybe see you at the next one.
Nick

Oh yea, no argument by any means :) .
I wasn't saying people need to conform to this track, I was saying, I don't think twice about adding or removing weight when I go somewhere else :thumbsup: .

Personally I think 40oz is a bit heavy though. My car with a modified motor (Heavier than stock) receiver pack, and a wing, weighs in at 38oz on the money.

But I'll conform to whatever weight a track mandates.

'man Jet....38 ounces...with a mod...wing and receiver pack...thats awfull light....i run my car with full alu screws...no receiver pack...and barely made the 39 ounces at the birds....there is no way i can take it down to 38...and thats witout a reciever pack...i think,,,in taht area...your in a league of your own...

Eric(i'm in favor of 40 ounces...this way...even newcomer with steel screws and full electronics are ok...)lets keep it leveled...no need to diet the cars ...

You are all miss reading into my posts. I don't have a problem with home track rules, if I come to your track for a weekly race then I should play by your rules. My point was just if it is called a Roar race I thought Roar would want the rules to be what they set out. I didn't realize you could ask for variance in them. Racin what I was saying about chassis is a bad setup weighing 38 ozs will burn off far more tire then a good setup weighing 40 ozs that is what some one said that the reason you went back to 38 ozs was because tire wear. I was fortunite enough to win your last race so really it is not that big of a deal, Puffy my friend you need to suck it up, attend this race not only for yourself but for your sponsers. I am sure you change your car setup when you switch from banked to flat so what does it matter if you have to pull some lead off your car for a weekend. I just wish the track was closer if the race isn't on Saturday there is no way I can attend. Steve

Steve this race IS on Saturday, and I have a different car for the banks ;0).
But now that you are going to show, some effort will be made to be there.
If I do not go to the NATS as they are the same weekend.
Nick

WOW my head is spinning!!!!!! Are you guys kidding me!!!!!!! I can't believe that some of you would actually consider not going to a race just because you have to remove a piece of weight from your cars. Isn't it the end of the racing season for most of you? Will it really matter at that point? Did it ever occur to any of you that this track might be different than another track in a different area and whatever setup is under the car won't work, and the weight change is only 1 of maybe 10 or more different changes you'd be making that weekend (shocks, springs all 5 positions, gear, tires (black, gray, silver, blue, green, double blue, silver, pink, double pink, and my personal favorite plaid plus a zillion other I'm sure I left out), body (Chevy, Ford, or Dodge, Charger or Intrepid (Ask Penske Racing South on that one) Proline or Bandit , motor (binary, monster, co27), battery (IB or IP, blue or red). ARRGHH!!!!! Does any one see where I'm going here? You know, I'd love to race HALF races most of you do. I work 7 days a week (family business) and if I'm lucky I'm able to make it to 1 race a week, and even that causes some kind of conflict from time to time. I under stand the ROAR rule is 41oz but, like Ken pointed out above we hemmed and hawed for weeks about this "problem" and this seemed like the right solution considering the area that we are in and it can't be changed back now that the variance is in place. Sorry that some of you don't care for it, but it was what needed to be done at the time with the input we had received. Next year will be a whole different deal and we will welcome the input then.


I'm so dejected,
John

Wow! Please forgive John. He got to ranting there a little bit there. I think he had an information overload. He reached crirical mass and had to let his brain vent a little.

'man Jet....38 ounces...with a mod...wing and receiver pack...thats awfull light....i run my car with full alu screws...no receiver pack...and barely made the 39 ounces at the birds....there is no way i can take it down to 38...and thats witout a reciever pack...i think,,,in taht area...your in a league of your own...

Eric(i'm in favor of 40 ounces...this way...even newcomer with steel screws and full electronics are ok...)lets keep it leveled...no need to diet the cars ...

I thought so too Eric, I was a bit confused when I was told my car barley made weight last time. Maybe I'm mixing something up...
KENNY, what was the weight at the last ROAR race???

hey bret, must be the lithium polymer packs you been running:eek:


just kidding, it's the helium filled tires

Big Sexy and Nick Leone: Don't be a little weight conscious, we like you two just the way you are...lol:D

Answer me this: If the weight rule was exactly the same as where you run, but when you got to the track and weighed your car on Glens Falls scales, their scales said your car was 1 or 2 ounces heavy, your saying you wouldn't take lead off?!? Any serious racer would, and I'm sure you would too. What's the difference?

If that's keeping out of towners away, I think it's ridiculous... And if that was the case, no out of towners should ever attend the Snowbirds, because it has been common knowledge for years that the scale down there reads waaaay heavy...like 2-3 ounces...:thumbsup:

I thought so too Eric, I was a bit confused when I was told my car barley made weight last time. Maybe I'm mixing something up...
KENNY, what was the weight at the last ROAR race???

Bret, we used 38oz. for all the classes at the ROAR race. Amazing that with wing, rx pack and all you could be that close. Do you have an anti-gravity device?

I'm stuck in the middle here. 38oz, 40oz. Opinion seems to be split 50/50. Damned if we do, damned if we don't. I definitely see where mod & 19t should be 40 or 41, but there probably shouldn't be a different weight rule for stock vs. 19t/mod.

John and TP> I don't think the problem is removing weight, most don't mind that, it's not being able to get down to 38 ounces that is the problem. I know my car is 39 1/4 oz. without a reciever pack. It kinda sucks going to a race knowing you won't be on a level playing field.

No smart azz comments to my last sentence! :)

hey bret, must be the lithium polymer packs you been running:eek:


just kidding, it's the helium filled tires

Thats funny, Mythbusters not to long ago did a show on filling footballs with Helium to see if they go further--NOPE. Good show. sorry thought I would share.

Bret, we used 38oz. for all the classes at the ROAR race. Amazing that with wing, rx pack and all you could be that close. Do you have an anti-gravity device?

I'm stuck in the middle here. 38oz, 40oz. Opinion seems to be split 50/50. Damned if we do, damned if we don't. I definitely see where mod & 19t should be 40 or 41, but there probably shouldn't be a different weight rule for stock vs. 19t/mod.

WOW, thats suprises me...Chris will remember, it was dead on, without body screws, so I added 1/4 oz.

'man Jet....38 ounces...with a mod...wing and receiver pack...thats awfull light....i run my car with full alu screws...no receiver pack...and barely made the 39 ounces at the birds....there is no way i can take it down to 38...and thats witout a reciever pack...i think,,,in taht area...your in a league of your own...

Eric(i'm in favor of 40 ounces...this way...even newcomer with steel screws and full electronics are ok...)lets keep it leveled...no need to diet the cars ...

Eric, I think I read somewhere that at the birds the scale weighed real heavy, I'm talking a couple ounces :eek:, so you would weigh 37 ounces, and did you run a Tekin :p ???

See you soon.

Brett may be correct...My car had 1.5 oz. added to it last night in stock to make 38 ounces, (no reciever pack.)
The CW cars have many extra screws vs. others, and many of mine are steel...

just a refresh

Ttt...

Who's going.....Who's got it.... Who's gonna take it down?

Who's going from CT - a few of us are thinking of coming...... Just curious who would be going - maybe car pool?

Eric, I think I read somewhere that at the birds the scale weighed real heavy, I'm talking a couple ounces :eek:, so you would weigh 37 ounces, and did you run a Tekin :p ???

See you soon.

jet...nope i had a keyence...but...to my surprise...my new g11 pros are ...4 grams lighter...when both were scale without wires...

and..the snowbird scale was right...well...if not...my own scales would be out of range too...

Eric(see ya at the ROCK!)...better be ready..my 19t was screaming when i practice it last week...turned 1 lap faster than last year pole...i went 64 4:02

ERic,

i not 100% sure but i think MY last years pole was with a 63 in 4:02....just 1 tenth in front of you... :thumbsup:

Pace

pace, got your pm, tried to reply, said your pm box is full

Well, who showed and what are the results???

Later, Bret

Only 7 cars were able to show up. All of them ran stock and all were put into one main. Results were:
1. Dan Priddle 2. Rod Priddle 3. Mike Murphy 4. Jim Calvery 5. Gerd Wolny 6. Ray Beland 7. Jason Nick
Jason won the race on the track but was 2 grams light. He was also top qualifier w/ 86 5:01 and definitely had the car to beat.

Later,
Dan