57 at Madness in race#1 can we up the attendance?alot of talk going around and this will be a night to show your support for K/N.Track records have dropped a few times in the last few months in almost all the classes.expect some changes at the track and EVERYONE should be ready to go FAST and have a GREAT time.looking forward to getting onthis tour.

Good luck John, wish I could show my support but that weekend I'll be racing Midwest oval championships in IOWA, but I'll be there soon.

Later, Bret

NSW will be there ."And you can take that to the bank " Ken

I'll be there and I'm looking forward to it; I had a great time at the last race.

S/K guys will be there... looking forward to it.

S/K guys will be there... looking forward to it. I plan to bring my 6-cell SK along this time in case others want to race that class as well.

Sounds good... I'll let them know

I think it should be a great race if we can keep the chat flying and get some if not many of the needed changes underway at K&N.
If anyone needs info, needs help with accomidations, etc - let me know - I will be happy to help out. Im going to find out what the extended hours are -- and post them asap.
Hope to see you all there it should be (cross your fingers) the start of the bigger & better races at K&N.

I'm there!
Rick<><

Sounds like the plan is in works . Keep the chat going guy's . good job chads better half :jest: See you at the track Ken

we'll be running 19T only so i told Chad if he needs help and no one objects to it i'll tech the stock class as needed after each qualifier and mains.the race Fee sounds like its gonna be $20 and since its a points race and not a trophy race Chad and Danielle said they will order Pizza and soda for a mid afternoon food break.Danielle will be posting more on this race very soon.

:wave:

For those interested ............after the meeting tonight we will begin the overhaul at K&N starting on March 4th and finish up by the 9th - everything BUT the carpet will be completed at that point. Carpet will come after NEOT...if possible before Spring Sizzler - but it may not be - we still have to talk to Steve. We hope to get the carpet by the latest - this spring...

K&N will NOT close for these dates - however we will close off sections for painting, repair, change, etc - and restrict those areas to people. We will do 1 to 2 sections at a time - thus allowing those who wish to continue and practice/race without too much inconvenience.

Please spread the word!!! And lastly, with this news if you're willing to help PLEASE email me - we can feed those who volunteer and will forever appreciate your gift of time & energy!
:wave:

JOHN - READ YOUR POSTING - you have a TYPO - ITS NOT 19 Turn only - maybe thats what your running...dont scare away everyone! LOL

If you need to review whats being run - check the offical NEOT thread....

We feel bad that theres not going to be trophies - so we will buy pizza - for a reasonable number (meaning we wont buy one pizza per person) but we will make every effort to fill everyone.

Everyone will also get a soda coupon - allowing for one free soda/water at our expense.....

And because its Chads 30th (LOL!!!! :hat: ) I plan to have some SWEETS on hand for everyone (such as cupcakes)...dont get me wrong - Im far from making some special presentation! Just a little bit to embarass him!

Lunch is just our way of showing our appreciation for eveyone whos making the trip...everyone who continues to show support for K&N.

One thing we truly need is people to talk with Chad in person (maybe at this event)... he needs/wants suggestions, ideas, etc - also wants to know if any classes want to be added to K&N - such as the SK's. He's willing to accomidate all racers, add them to scheduled days, add NEW MONTHLY events and even consider NEW open days....... for ANY class looking to run at K&N - even trucks if they so desire... so take the extra step & give Chad your two cents at the NEOT!

Again - if anyone wants help with accomidations Im looking into options as we speak.

I will do my best to keep the threads up to date about our overhaulin' progress - and those who wish can email for further details or just to keep in touch.

See ya soon everyone!

Danielle :wave:

I meant we'll as in Craig and I will be running 19T only, but all the classes Nick posted are gonna be running as by the NEOT listing.that would leave me free time to help Chad with tech during the race for the stock class.

I will volunteer to tech for 19T as I won't be running that class.
Rick<><

Seeing as we're talking about tech. Will there be a weight requirment this time around for the SK cars? I know at madness there was than they decided not to. I believe it was due to the lower weight of the SK's. If so what is the mim weight going to be?

Chads going to look into the answer to that. At K&N its always been 2.30 on his scale - but he wants to make sure that will still be used in this race. Thats for 4cell....

I dont have that answer yet - I will get it out asap.

In the meanwhile, As Danielle reported weve made some steps to starting the changes at K&N. Danielles got a list of things to do - and some of you have voluntered to help her - THANK YOU Very much, I appreciate it.

Does anyone have any (other) questions for me?

I spoke with Nick breifly on this issue. I believe the final decision was 2.2. If you guys run 2.3, It won't be big deal either way. My car was 2.3 with 2 small peices of lead, so there shouldn't be a big deal with making weight. Don't quote me on this, we only spoke breifly, he was very busy running the show.

getting those cars to weigh in at 2.5-umm nobody was happy about that from what I herd. 2.3 is in reach for sure and that should be the rule for every track but let him decide. not sure if I will make the rest of the tour but will race with you guys at madness and k/n. Jon you gonna make it down to steves sometime or what? something you might be intrested in is--steve is starting a super modified class--basicaly anything goes, chassis tires batterys motors--bla bla. Might be a neat class. Since I have a car thats not legal--I guess I will be the first--lol, probably the only.

Right now I am working on SK rules in general. You have to take into account that I am looking at the sk class as a whole. People race the cars along the east coast. The excalibur car kit was produced and unleashed on the masses without a solid rulebook like Bolink had given with every kit. Being a new car and class, it needs a rukebook. Coupled with the fact that you could strap on the latest and greatest hop ups for pan cars made it more difficult to keep it a spec class. The orig SK class (JCAR) had/has rules and a club setting. The class is localized, not because of the any other reason than exposure. SK racin at K/N was the best way to get into racing, based on cost and simplicity. The Excalibur car was sold to Marshalls, K/N, Madness, Radical Ricks, just to name a few. In quantities where 10 can show up to those tracks on any given night. The problem is the rules. As you can see. They vary from track to track. It is my belief as a track owner that there needs to be a solid set of rules. Sure other classes can stem from the basics as we do everyday with pan cars, but not coming up with the basics is what is hurting the turnout for this class. Also, with multiple chasssis options and total differance from the 4 cell to the 6 cell cars, you can have 5 cars in the building and 4 different chassis. Im not saying this to offend anyone, I am looking at what racers want to do RACE. I know this is off topic, but it does need to be addressed. From my end, I am addressing it. If you have any questions comments , please call me track me down thru here, my beautiful better half or at the track. Im here for you guys as well as everyone in the industry. Thanks for your time

Chad Sewell
KN RC SPEEDWAY

Very true chad, I think it is difficult to set certain rules for this class because of the choices in chassis. I think the only rules now that I know of is madness and thats 6 cell that stick with it. Steve doesnt realy have a rule other than 4 cell stock motor. With the choice of tires,chassis,batts etc etc, its tuff to control that when things like 3300's are hard to get and taking tire dots off wheels to pass as greens or blues is found. keep it simple or people will not join. The last thing you want to do is tell a new racer well you have to get this this and that otherwise you cant race. how are you going to tell someone you cant race because of a certain rule-like tires or batts. up to the track owner and its there job to make sure its known before hand so there is no issues at the time. what we have been doing for 4 cell stock seems to work-- weight rule--2.2 or 2.3, any tires, any stock legal motor, 3800 limit batts,any electronics, axle legnth and I could be wrong I think it was 7 3/4 both front and back. no drilling of chassis-either solid or t-plate car. bolink,steve k,beefy, body and now rob murdock -(bolink cavalier)

My point is t-plate cars and solid chassis cars can race in the same class. But under what rules and is it really fair? Does a guy have to carry both 6 and 4 cell packs? Does he have to own both types of cars in order to race? That is where it comes about. Get the rules defined and build a bigger class instead of thinning the field. Im not trying to play god, I am just looking to make it easier for the new guys. Im looking at this as rc growth not picking apart the class. Please look at it from that angle.

Chad

any angle is fine with me, if you were to ask me if I care---I would say no--it does not matter to me what anyone runs,t-plate solid lets just race, obviously classes would be split when there was 4 and 6 cell. I am saying the 6 cell guys go by there own rules--it works for them. Its possible to split the classes up but I dont see that happening because like you said there could be 4 or 5 differnet types of chassis and there is no telling how many there are until the day of the race, tplate cars ran in the first neot race and worked out well-4cell--tplate car. I dont think it will work in 6 cell because of the battery space. What I ment by track owner decides--is at the time of event--either go by rules-in genral or your own but make it known--at drivers meeting or in flyer. or run it as if it was like stock and 19t--ex. east coast super modified-i dont know-its ideas. jon had there sk rules posted and we could go by that-bolinks rules are out of date and I dont think people would agree to certain speedos,tires,radios etc.

The darn chassis is versitale, in that by moving one battery cup, you now have a 4-cell/6-cell s/k. I don't know about cost, but the darn chassis is pretty cheap. The class of 6-cell carws, is the class from K/N. They went to Madness when the previous owners threw them out of K/N. Granted the rules have changed, but the core is still the same. I think the design of the solid chassis, simplifies the car, eliminating one more adjustment. Chad, I will mail you a set of the rules from Madness.
Like ken says, you don't want to chase people away, by telling them they can't use certain parts. On the other hand, you don't want to chase the others away, by deviating from the rules. What we have done in the past is, allow a grace period for a new racer to conform to the rules. We have never chased anyone away, only helped them conform, and be competitive. Whatever the rules are, is what you need to stick with. Make them strict, yet easy to tech and conform to. We have recently updated our rules to allow 3800 unmatched stick packs, and any 1/10 tire. We did some testing, and there is no significant advantage to exotic compounds, and we felt that might have kept people away. Especially pancar racers who have an s/k, but don't want to buy new tires just to race it. The reason we went with 3800's, is that 3300's are becoming unavailible, and Chris is selling them for the same price. We ran 3300's for 3 years without a problem, and some of us were running 3 year old packs this year, myself included. We feel that we will be able to go another 3 years on 38's. If we could all work together and get a uniform set of rules, we could have some big shows with all these different s/ks out there.

it would be nice if they would set the rules up so all the tracks use the same chassis rule weight,batt rule etc.

Jon- Im not trying to argue one chassis against another. I am looking to conform to rules. I am trying to make it easier on both the old racer and the new guy, all the way down to the tech guy. I hope you can see that I am trying to help conform rules. This has nothing to do with which chassis to run. If a racer comes into town from Marshalls, for one day of club racing, I want him to know what the rules are ahead of time. He will more than likely have an excalibur chassis. Again, it has nothing to do with which class is better or which chassis, it comes down to if the racer goes to a track, how much does he have to change?

I understand. I am not trying to argue which is better either. All I am saying is to change from 4-6 cell is easier. There are anywhere from 10-20 6-cell racers at Madness, who could easily switch to 4-cell by moving one battery cup. There are also 20+ 4-cell s/k's in montville, who could easily switch to 6-cell the same way. There are also a handful of guys racing excaliber cars on the neot that I heard say they were planning on changing to a solid chassis. I have mailed solid chassis to florida, Ohio, Maine, PA, and NY so far, since the car action article. All I'm saying is, I think the wave of the future may be DARN chassis.
If we could get half the montville cars and half the Madness cars, plus a few stragglers from Misc. tracks to show up at K/N for a show, you might end up with close to 30 cars, mostly solid chassis.
There is also another chassis, I heard mentioned and I don't know much about. It was referred to as a "stone" chassis. I believe it was from NJ. I'm not sure if it has a t-plate or not, but it may be something to look into. Anyway, I will send you a copy of the rules we run at madness, and maybe you can get some ideas from that. -Jon

dont forget about my "contraption" chassis LOL. I am pretty sure I could get some guys from montville to come again since its on a sunday. They would be racing 4 cell. These guys go by steves rules wich basicaly is nothing, stock motor 4 cell,NO Tplate car. The 6 cell class they have there own rules and works for them and it should stay that way.Can you fit 6cell on a beefy car? We need to focus on the 4cell rule if any. It is going to be hard to get rules in place all over again not just for your track but any track and agree on it, sometracks might have theres set in stone and not willing to change for anyone I dont know, After running my car wich is a combo of DARN solid and Tplate there is an advantage--tune it to what you want. (aka pan car) Solid chassis more about tires,wedge,front springs, thats about it.nothing else you can do but twist the chassis. Not sure how to approach this since you will have to get everyone to agree on the rules like track owners/directors and racers. 6cell guys have meetings about there rules and agree to them-votes etc. Maybe this should be an option. Like you said when bolink sold them it came with rules, kind of hard to enforce it now since that isnt the case when chassis are being sold. The two of us jon and I cant speak for everyone. It doesnt matter to me what is ran for a chassis I am easy going on the rules I just need to know ahead of time, my only complaint is if there are rules -weight,axle length,brushes etc etc-it needs to be enforced--through tech. also this might steer away people from racing the class.Too many rules that is. These brushes,tires(spec tires) and whatever else would have to be stocked in the shop-incase somone was to show up not having any idea to the rules and not racing because they didnt have it or no money to buy it.

Just to throw my $.02 in.

The N.E.O.T. tour gives you a perfect opportunity and reason to come up with a standard set of rules for the S/K's. We don't run them in the ORL and I don't have one so I'm just speaking as a neutral observer after following this issues for some time.

I think having separate classes for 4 cell & 6 cell is a mistake. Separating classes is just thinning classes. Why would you want 2 classes with 10 cars each when you could have 1 class with 20 cars. That sounds like alot more fun to me. I think the different tracks should adopt the N.E.O.T. rules and stick with them. Make that the standard for all S/K racing. Thou, the N.E.O.T. rules may need a few revisions. Like adding a min. weight rule-2.3.

At each N.E.O.T. race, you should only allow the classes that the N.E.O.T. runs to be run that day. Guys want to run with the series, most will adjust as needed to participate. Also, thinning out classes also makes the day longer because there are that many more heats, thin heats thou.

I like the idea of making it a solid chassis only but I don't know enough about them to know if that would really be feasible.

The ORL rules have helped many tracks adopt the same consistant rules for several classes over the years. It really helps both the track owner and the racer. It's nice when the racer knows what to expect when going to a different track.

Just my 2 cents, for what it's worth.
Bill Henning
Outlaw Racing League (http://www.outlawracingleague.com/)


N.E.O.T. - SK Mod's

Chassis:
30.01 Xcalibier Chassis or Yellowbird
30.02 2 wheel drive.

Body:
31.01 Any SK body may be used, Body must be painted and numbered.

Batteries:
32.01 Any R.O.A.R. legal 3800mah or less (4cell) sub-C size batteries shall be used.

Motor:
33.01 R.O.A.R. legal rebuildable stock motors. 27 turns of 22Awg. 24 degree timing. Locked commutator.

You cant put 4 cell and 6 cell together thats like running stock and 19t together, is that what your talking about? I dont see a problem with running tplate and solid together but there has been many concerns on that issue.At the first tour race I think only one tplate car was in the A main that I know of.. Could be a number of things why. I am not sure what is ran anywhere else-probably the tplate cars. Yes there needs to be a set of rules in place ASAP. Something we can talk to nick about when he gets back from snowbirds. weight is going to be a slight differnece between 4 and 6 cell. The other thing to is ANY SK body to be used in the tour according to the tour rules, I know mcalister has a new eastcoast body that has been sold and seen one at madness at the last event someone had painted up-now these cars are more like 12th scale cars-is it fair to put a body like that on these cars-just about a full fender body and I think its for 1/10th scale cars--though realy cool looking and also someone has made there own that looks very close to it. its not the traditional SK body, just like the tplate cars are not traditional either. everything needs to be addressed if you want a solid set of rules.

You cant put 4 cell and 6 cell together, is that what your talking about?
No, need to just run one or the other. Not both. Personally I think 4 cell since that has pretty much become the standard for oval racing.

No, need to just run one or the other. Not both. Personally I think 4 cell since that has pretty much become the standard for oval racing.

Well I cant see that happening since your basicaly telling people either run this or nothing. Nothing standard these days. Tour is intended for people to come and race, a track like K/N they will not say this class only, they are trying to attract as many racers as possible. and that should be the standard of any racing attracting as many as possible. This is part of the reason why this disscusion came about on the tour race at K/N because there were issues of rules at the winterblast for SK's. there will be two classes if the 6 cell guys come and race I can gurantee that.

You cant put 4 cell and 6 cell together thats like running stock and 19t together, is that what your talking about? I dont see a problem with running tplate and solid together but there has been many concerns on that issue.At the first tour race I think only one tplate car was in the A main that I know of.. Could be a number of things why. I am not sure what is ran anywhere else-probably the tplate cars. Yes there needs to be a set of rules in place ASAP. Something we can talk to nick about when he gets back from snowbirds. weight is going to be a slight differnece between 4 and 6 cell. The other thing to is ANY SK body to be used in the tour according to the tour rules, I know mcalister has a new eastcoast body that has been sold and seen one at madness at the last event someone had painted up-now these cars are more like 12th scale cars-is it fair to put a body like that on these cars-just about a full fender body and I think its for 1/10th scale cars--though realy cool looking and also someone has made there own that looks very close to it. its not the traditional SK body, just like the tplate cars are not traditional either. everything needs to be addressed if you want a solid set of rules.

Actually Ken, there weren't any t-plate cars in the A. I'm not sure so don't qoute me on this, but I think a solid car one the B as well.

That's fine, trust me, I'm not trying to tell anyone what to do. That is far from my intension. Besides, I rarely get to race in that area either. I'm just giving my thoughts on the situation.

Maybe I'm just spending too much time on this computer being snowed in and not racing. :rolleyes:

Actually Ken, there weren't any t-plate cars in the A. I'm not sure so don't qoute me on this, but I think a solid car one the B as well.
I thought you had told me there was one tplate car in the A. The older guy next to fuji who sat in the back with me not sure what his name was, I dont know, the point is like you said you were a little worried about tplate cars--its not happening against the solid as of now.

I don't have an SK, but I am thinking about it. If I have to run 6 cell, I probablly won't get one because I don't want to buy more batteries. Batteries cost more than anything. The only other thing that costs as much as batteries are tires. I want to be able to use the same tires and battery packs as my pan car.
Rick<><

I don't have an SK, but I am thinking about it. If I have to run 6 cell, I probablly won't get one because I don't want to buy more batteries. Batteries cost more than anything. The only other thing that costs as much as batteries are tires. I want to be able to use the same tires and battery packs as my pan car.
Rick<><
And thats why madness guys opended up there tire rule--is because they want to see the pan car guys race to--when they can use the same tires from sk to pan car, and yes adding on 2 more cells or buy 6 cell packs just for that class is not feasible for most. Thats why there is two classes,pick and choose. not that much different in 4 to 6 anyways when it comes to laps--4 cell being off maybe a lap or 2. There flying down the straight away but slowing down big time in the corners.

I thought you had told me there was one tplate car in the A. The older guy next to fuji who sat in the back with me not sure what his name was, I dont know, the point is like you said you were a little worried about tplate cars--its not happening against the solid as of now.

He was in the A until Kempesty bumped him in the 3rd qualifier. And he ended up 3rd in the B.

I don't have an SK, but I am thinking about it. If I have to run 6 cell, I probablly won't get one because I don't want to buy more batteries. Batteries cost more than anything. The only other thing that costs as much as batteries are tires. I want to be able to use the same tires and battery packs as my pan car.
Rick<><

There were 2 of us with 4-cell s/k's last night. If 1 more showed up, we would have raced. Lets get them down there, chris will run 4-cell s/k if there are enought of us. The only rules for 4-cell is pretty much the neot rules. That means you can use your pan car stuff. Chris said, he expects a bunch of 4-cell s/k's next week. I can garauntee 2 will be there.

Just remember this. Some of the tracks in the neot dont have sk rules. I am trying to make this easier. I'm trying to make it better.

Chad Sewell
KN RC SPEEDWAY
www.knrcspeedway.com

I like the NEOT rules for the 4-cell class. It's not to hard to conform. I understand having more and stricter rules for a weekly class, but at leaste it's easy to mix all the s/k's from track to track, without any hassle.

I may make it to madness sat the 18th. 4cell SK Solid chassis. That needs Flat track set up help.

I may make it to madness sat the 18th. 4cell SK Solid chassis. That needs Flat track set up help.
We got ya covered. I'll set you up the best I can.

WOW ok I am back from Snowbirds, an See that things are getting out of control in my absense! first of all I make all final desissions about the tour and no one else.
See how well the first event went? this will continue with the entire tour, and in the future, not that I do not need the help, but please DO NOT start a tread about the tour, as that is what started this arguement and is NOT NEEDED!
Jmarsh, I understand you trying to help K&N, but this was not needed at all!


I talked to the SK crowd @ Madness and as a collective we came up with the weight that was easly attatainable to all. there is 2 classes of SK...SK and SK mod tour.
I would love them to all be 4-cell, but told the 6cell guys, if they wanted to run what they have that would be fine. See the Idea behind this tour is to bring MORE racers to the tracks in the North East.
The rules are on the tour website, any track that does not like them or wish to NOT follow them for the tour race, will simply be taken OFF the tour!
After all I am trying to help with the attendence, not cause problems....
Bill thank you for your imput, as it is always welcome.
Rickster, thanks but NO, you do not know enough about the 19 Turn motors being used on the tour.
More on this later, sorry if it came across harsh, I'm bit worn out from the birds and the 27'' of snow I came home to...
Nick

I was asked to start the thead, but i don't plan on posting on this thread again.

Nick...How was the Birds........Thinking of making the trip next year...If money allows

WOW ok I am back from Snowbirds, an See that things are getting out of control in my absense!
Rickster, thanks but NO, you do not know enough about the 19 Turn motors being used on the tour.


Oh really......

Rickster, was NOT trying to diss you, we are not running the same 19T motors as you run @ K&N. We are using the Ultrabirds 19T, hence my comment.

As this is NOT a trophy race, the race fee will be the usall 12$ + 2$ for the tour.