We're here to help in any way...answer questions, give tuning tips, etc;
If you have any questions, feel free to post them here...:thumbsup:

looking 4 someone to hook me up w/some hp
you gave me some brushes at last years nats in ohio :dude:

We've rec'd a lot of email and calls regarding "what's the best Outlaw-19 turn setup to run at Marshall's?" Let me try to help in this post...

Since Marshall's current rules is "any marked 19 turn arm," many are confused on what to run...especially since the rule introduces many variables we don't face under ROAR/ARCOR 19 turn Oval rules.
I can offer this: Frank Polimeda TQ'd, Won and put 2 laps on the track record this past weekend running one of our ROAR/ARCOR-legal 19 turn arms. One of the racers posted that Marshall's is considering adopting either the ROAR/ARCOR rules or utilizing an Ultrabird handout motor for their 19 turn class in the future. With that being said, I'd focus on running the ROAR/ARCOR legal combinations. Here's why:

1) It's fast enough to TQ/WIN/Set Record even against hemi-winds, milled arms, short stacks, etc; so do the Outlaw Arms really matter? Frank and Bill both sat on the front row with ARCOR/ROAR legal arms.

2)If that is what you'll be racing everywhere else, you can continue to tune on your program by using the legal stuff at Marshall's as well.

3) Keeps the costs down: no need to purchase odd-ball parts, build hybrids, etc, for one track.

4)If Marshall's does adopt the ARCOR/ROAR rules, you'll already have a head start since you've been running it all along...:thumbsup:

Hope that helps clarify some of your questions...Oh, and Congrats to that Polimeda kid for an awesome weekend...:thumbsup:

where can i buy your parts and motors my hobby shop dont stock them

js: check the following:

-rc4less.com
-lefthander-rc.com
-stormerhobbies.com

Using the Putnam X brush in 19T.. What if anything do you recommend doing to them..Ie drilling holes, Cutting, slotting??

I Normally run a full face brush in my 19 turns, but have experimented with a Number 32 hole in the middle of the brush. It all depends on the track. I typically run a full face brush, a red positive spring and a green negative spring, with between 24-28 degrees on timing, and it seems pretty competitive anywhere I go. Hope this helps.

Jeff Patch
Putnam Propulsion
TQ Cells

Number 32 hole, wow, the largest I drill is Number 47. I'll have to give it a try.

Yup, a 32, lol. I don't think you need to listen to me though mikey, you seem to be plenty fast wherever you go, lol.

Long time no see, hows the family been?? give everyone my best, take care.

Ok TP time for another round of the great debate in 19t....24 deg. or 36 deg? Is there any type of track that seams to favor one or the other?

Also I've been reading that some people are changing there motor setup for stoc with the new IB batteries. Have you seen anything different in tuning when using these batteries? I mean this more in regards to on-raod TC and 12th. Also which stock motor and what brush/spring setup do you recommend for 12th on-road and gearing about? Sorr for the on-road questions and I hope the oval racers don't tar and feather me. Thanks

Brian

Ok TP time for another round of the great debate in 19t....24 deg. or 36 deg? Is there any type of track that seams to favor one or the other?

Also I've been reading that some people are changing there motor setup for stoc with the new IB batteries. Have you seen anything different in tuning when using these batteries? I mean this more in regards to on-raod TC and 12th. Also which stock motor and what brush/spring setup do you recommend for 12th on-road and gearing about? Sorr for the on-road questions and I hope the oval racers don't tar and feather me. Thanks

Brian

Not to step on toes but, Todd is a firm believer of 24 degrees, especially since he set a track record last week @ 24 degrees.
Even with the larger gear, 24 degrees pretty much always run cooler, resulting in better finishing times.
I'm sure TP will elaborate further :thumbsup: .

Later, Bret

Ok TP time for another round of the great debate in 19t....24 deg. or 36 deg? Is there any type of track that seams to favor one or the other?
-I like 24, but both have been proven to be fast.

I've been reading that some people are changing there motor setup for stoc with the new IB batteries. Have you seen anything different in tuning when using these batteries?
-You don't neccesarily need to change your setup, just pay more attention to amp draw. Excessive amp draw can be more dangerous/damaging with the new IB cells.

I mean this more in regards to on-raod TC and 12th. Also which stock motor and what brush/spring setup do you recommend for 12th on-road and gearing about? Sorr for the on-road questions and I hope the oval racers don't tar and feather me. Thanks
-Stock motor of choice for 1/12 is the EPIC/Binary 2 magnet motor. Depending on layout, start at around a 1.60-1.70 rollout.

Brian

-Hope this helps...:thumbsup:

-Hope this helps...:thumbsup:

TP for Prez...oh wait you have to be a regional director first now.

Also what about brush spring setup for 12th. I've only used your brushes for TC but never 12th. Thanks Todd.

Brian

im pretty sure Frank Polimeda could of won this weekend with a stock motor. hes a bad example of whats fast. lol you should of seen his Mini T. that thing broke the track record by 10 laps in that class. :)

joe ivo

TP, waz up man. I gotta get with ya this week to stock up for some upcoming races. :thumbsup:

Frank,
You and your bro's making it to the Oval Masters ?

Hey E, We been crazy busy work'n but Im 95% sure we can skate outta here for that race.

Joe: I get what your saying, but I've never heard anyone say that Frank Polimeda's a bad example of what's fast...:freak: heh heh

Frank: Just have your people call my people... and tell the family I said hello...:dude:

TP hay what’s that stuff you use to clean your bodies

It's called "Uncle Sonny's Magic Elixer" :thumbsup:
I sent you a PM yesterday..Thanks!

thanks for giving reasons why the arcor/roar legal motor is better then the ultrabirds. i kinda think that Frank could of won with a ultrabird though. his car was perfect, his batteries were good, and ofcourse the motors you shipped to the track for him played a part :)

we will have to see what everyone at Marshalls feels is best for the track this weekend. i really dont mind what rule we go with. there was never any complaints till this weekend about the open rule but i can see where it could be a problem down the road.

i do agree that me saying he is a bad example of whats fast is wrong. i used the wrong words. oops sorry

anyways have a good week and thanks for your input. seeya

joe ivo :)

Frank U.
What email can I reach you at now ?

ryanroofingco@yahoo.com

TP you have PM

News Flash TQ-Cells and Putnam propulsion dominate at Actionhobbies this past week-end, top 3 qualifiers and top 3 finishers in the 1/10 19 turn pancar A-main
1st--Jeff Carapellatti-TQ and winner with a new track record!
2nd--Derreck Carapellatti qualified 2nd finished 2nd
3rd--Jeff Patch qualified 3rd finished 3rd

Keep up the great work and service Steve and Todd !!!!!!!!!!!!!

www.cwactionhobbies.com

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Does that constitute a hat trick?
Nice job guys, thanks for the awesome results...
and how about Derreck running 2nd!!! Nice job kid...:thumbsup: Be careful Jeff, or Ron your team owner might boot ya and give the kid your seat...:cool:

Todd: What are the main numbers to look for in 19T oval on the Turbo Dyno?

I bought a 19t ex.force tia based .the thing hoas no power 88 at the most tried the x brush w/hole same results my other tia cans run around 92-97 on power .what do yuo recomend to do to get better #'s

larry eichner
spfld, mo.

I bought a 19t ex.force tia based .the thing hoas no power 88 at the most tried the x brush w/hole same results my other tia cans run around 92-97 on power .what do yuo recomend to do to get better #'s

larry eichner
spfld, mo.


Did you run it on the track?, Short little story, I usally look for 68-70 on a stock, in the last 2 weeks i finally got what everone is saying don't go by a dyno, 3 weeks ago My car broke the track record at the Arcor States race with a 59 power motor, and i had some of my best runs at classic with a 58 and 59 power motor, i also ran a 68 power motor was about the same, so dynos are just for fun if you like the noise.....LOL

lol, good call Me21. I don't use my dyno much anymore, just to check and see if the motor is consistent from re-build to re-build, but I agree, my best runs have been with motors that were less then steller on my dyno. LDE racing, tell me what the motor is pulling at 1.5 with a small fan, what brushes and springs, and I will help if I can.

Jeff Patch
Putnam Propulsion

P.S. Todd, you have mail, give you a call tomorrow around noon.

that is in stock and i know what you mean,buy in 19 you need the power when running a 180ft runline most of it straight away.

that is in stock and i know what you mean,buy in 19 you need the power when running a 180ft runline most of it straight away.


Enen then, I have seen National Champions TQ and win big events with 19T all under 90, My point is a Fantom Dyno for sure will not tell you anything. There are only 2 dyno's that are worth anything, COMPITITION ELECTRONICS, And THOR, the rest FOR SURE dont tell you squat on how a motor will preform under a load, and that is not Theroy, that is FACT,

Does that constitute a hat trick?
Nice job guys, thanks for the awesome results...
and how about Derreck running 2nd!!! Nice job kid...:thumbsup: Be careful Jeff, or Ron your team owner might boot ya and give the kid your seat...:cool:
Hat Trick it is.........!
Yeah Stinky is improving every week, but still doesnt want to build his own cars yet! I don't think I'll be off the payroll for awhile.

T.P you have a PM

TS: For 19 turn, I like to look at the 30 amps #'s @ 5 volts, when testing in amp steps. 108 are very good, 110+ on mine are killer.

Larry: Sounds like you're using a Fantom dyno. I wouldn't suggest you use this, as they will give more false results than accurate ones. They used to be OK to use years ago, but with today's arms, magnets, etc, they have proven to be very misleading.
For instance, if you check a 19 turn at 24 degrees vs. 36 degrees, chances are that you will see about 10-15 less watts @ 24 degrees. On a CE Turbo Dyno, they will be similar in power at a 30 amp load, but show an increase in performance under the lighter loads, (20-28 amps.) We have TQ'd/Won the ROAR 19 turn Oval Nats more than once by running 24 degrees instead of running 36 degrees. Point being, you're never gonna lap the field if you're leaving 10-15 watts on the bench. This proves that the Fantom dyno isn't accurate.
There were some values I used to look at on the Fantom that were more accurate than the max power values in determining how good your motor would actually perform on the track. The most useful for me was the Low and High Power Factors on the right margin of the screen. The higher you could get the low power factor, the better the brushes were seated and better your bottom end punch would be. The high power factor was good in determining how broad the power band would be. The higher the factor, the more top end the motor would have. I ignored the Mid Power factor as it went hand in hand with the other two.
Also, if you had a motor that made max power in 4-5 tenths of a second, they seemed to run better than motors that made power in 6-8 tenths of a second. This wasn't fool proof, but if you had two motors with identical Low/High Power Factors, I'd use this to make my decision.
Fantoms are pretty good at selecting a rollout after you plug in the data from a known, working motor with on-track results. Gearing being as crucial as it is, it can be a valuable tool in that way.
Hope this helps...:thumbsup:

Todd Putnam
Putnam Propulsion
518-452-0422

Hay TP now that you have taken up a new hobby, I was wondering when your next event is? Brent and I might want to stop buy and check it out. :thumbsup:

http://national-shuffleboard-association.us/schedule.htm

Thanks Todd! So on carpet, most guys use less than 36 degrees....

TP ~ would you suggest 24deg in the Ultra Chicken as well?

Sonny: Love to have you...maybe you'd consider joining my team at the next event instead of running 3700's at an R/C race?!? :cool: heh heh

TS/Greg: There's no difinitive answer, as we have run fast at 24, 36 and about everything in between. The rollout is more crucial at the lower timing, but I feel if you can hit it, you'll finish better. 36 seems to be more user-friendly, as you can be a bit off in gear and still be fast. Our best runs have come at 24 +/-, but you have to hit the roll out...

Todd
Got an urgent email for ya. check it, lol

thanks
Eric

Sonny: Love to have you...maybe you'd consider joining my team at the next event instead of running 3700's at an R/C race?!? :cool: heh heh

TS/Greg: There's no difinitive answer, as we have run fast at 24, 36 and about everything in between. The rollout is more crucial at the lower timing, but I feel if you can hit it, you'll finish better. 36 seems to be more user-friendly, as you can be a bit off in gear and still be fast. Our best runs have come at 24 +/-, but you have to hit the roll out...

Well, what about turning right and left with 6-cells? :p

tanks todd for the info. will try that out and see if it is better.

approx how much diff is the rollout between 36 degrees and 24 degrees? thanks

When I experimented with 36 vs. 24 I changed about .35 to .4 in roll out and it was close. I haven't been using 24 much lately because I am on a new chassis and am still learning the set-up, but it is going to depend on the size of your track, there is going to be a bigger difference in rollout on a large track vs. a small track. The track I have been running at has a 175 to 180 ft runline, so you could probably guage accordingly from there.

TP ~ See you next week...

do you add teeth or subtract teeth on the pinion when switching from 36 to 24?

Add pinion, or decrease spur, either or.

k7king: When going from 36 to 24 degrees, increase your rollout by .30 points. That will get you very close, fine tune from there.

Todd, you still stocking parts for the cw car broke the shock tower and no where has them. gonna need some other stuff to. well talk to ya soon.

Brad,
We have them in stock...:thumbsup:

cool sounds good i'll get ahold of you on on monday. gonna need some other stuff too. thanks, Brad