Guys; aren't we getting a bit overly excited about battery "numbers"? If you do the math, the percentage difference in voltage between (as an example) a 1.18 pack and a 1.19 pack, is only .0085. How many of us can really claim to feel a less than one percent difference in battery voltage on the track? Considering what you have to pay for the higher number pack, is it really worth it?

At Thunder Road, we buy matched packs from SMC. Great numbers and price. For my money, *any* matched pack they provide will do me just fine. The numbers on the SMC packs are equal to anything out there; and, I know their numbers are real.

The worst pack I've seen from SMC is better than I'll ever be able to use; so I'll let the rest of you pay the inflated prices for the very top numbers. For my personal racing, I'll just take the lowest (and cheapest) numbers. Just a thought; and your mileage may vary. Thanks; Ernie P. :cool:

Good post.
On the track say a pack cycled at a 4.69 versus a 4.73. On a perfect run I was only able to see about a second difference between the 2 packs. How often do you get a perfect run with no bobbles, wrecks, letting off to avoid a wreck etc

It's all about battery regiment. Charging , discharging etc. :)

What charging/ discharging system do you think is the best??

Good post.
On the track say a pack cycled at a 4.69 versus a 4.73. On a perfect run I was only able to see about a second difference between the 2 packs. How often do you get a perfect run with no bobbles, wrecks, letting off to avoid a wreck etc


But was is not to say, motor? temp.? There are always to many varibles to every now for sure what gave you that extra sec.!!!!

It could just all be in our heads!!!!

Sticker Shock...... I would rather save that extra $7 and put it towards the next tire bill, or some new front end parts.

I have no idea what battery regimen works best. I charge them, run them, discharge them, put them on an Integy 2030 until they're dead, and short them.

When you start looking at the actual performance difference between a lowly 1.17 pack (that could be a 1.179) and a mighty 1.19 pack (that could be a 1.191), its hard for me to justify the extra you pay for the higher packs.

All that having been said, I sell the higher packs; and use the leftovers for my personal packs. I know I won't ever be able to run well enough to feel the difference. Thanks; Ernie P. :cool:

Never say Never Ernie. I thought that once and then discovered that stock motors were so much faster when they only had 23 turns.....OOPS, forget I said that.....lol

Yes, I'm just joking......kind of........lol ;)

I have no idea what battery regimen works best. I charge them, run them, discharge them, put them on an Integy 2030 until they're dead, and short them.

When you start looking at the actual performance difference between a lowly 1.17 pack (that could be a 1.179) and a mighty 1.19 pack (that could be a 1.191), its hard for me to justify the extra you pay for the higher packs.

All that having been said, I sell the higher packs; and use the leftovers for my personal packs. I know I won't ever be able to run well enough to feel the difference. Thanks; Ernie P. :cool:
I couldn't agree more. At SPC we sell packs in the lower 1.18 volt range for bargain prices, yet once people see the 1.190+ cells they become convinced they must have those to race competitively. For local club-type racing I run the 1.180+ volt packs and they are more than adequate and much less expensive. :thumbsup:

Tom Himes

Hopefully the IB's will level off soon. Consider the guys who paid a premium for 1.18+ cells not that long ago, now they are the bargain basement cells. How long before the 1.20+ batterys they want a premium for now are the bargain cells. Sure we can just keep buying a couple of packs but it still is annoying. It has happened before but it seems like it is coming every month now. I also don't figure GP is done quite yet and IP is trying to get a foothold. Cell of the month is going to last how long??

But that 8.5 thousands of a volt is just what I need to make the D main.

Good post.
On the track say a pack cycled at a 4.69 versus a 4.73. On a perfect run I was only able to see about a second difference between the 2 packs. How often do you get a perfect run with no bobbles, wrecks, letting off to avoid a wreck etc


yah but that can be as much as 2 mains @ the birds

well i read all 10 posts and i conclude that smc packs are indeed the very best your money can buy! shameless plug woooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

I personally would never buy the top spec packs beause the extra money for them is not worth the gain but then were racing and many feel they need the best possible to compete.

At the moment our high end packs are 1.19+ and the mid levels are 1.185-1.189 and you save 20-25 bucks on a 6 cell mid level pack.

Danny, are you seeing that the new 3800's are a "one run" battery or can we get more than one run from them in a days racing? Also, what is your opinion on dead shorting them?

If your concerned about keeping your runtime numbers as high as possible then racing them only once per day is reccomended. If runtime isn't an issue then twice per day is fine. I don't reccomend deadshorting as it seems to give small voltage gains for a huge drop in runtime.

Also, what is your opinion on dead shorting them?

Lin not sure if you seen my post on the TQ thread but I did some tests on shorting vs not shorting. I pasted it below and added some new results from the new date codes for comparison.

Cycle Procedure:
Peak 1 - 6 amps .02 cutback
120 second delay
Peak 2 - 6 amps .01 cutback
Discharge - 35 amps
Shorted packs: used Integy Zero 30 then short bar to store
Unshorted packs: used Integy Zero 30 until lights went out before charging
Room Temp: 6/16/05 & 9/1/05 - 72 degrees.....10/19/05 - 71 degrees

--------------Unshorted**--------Shorted------Unshorted
Cycle date----6/16/2005----------9/1/2005-----10/19/05
Date code:-----AABSV-------------AABSV-------BACWV
Runtime---------399----------------346----------404
Avg Voltage-----4.65---------------4.74---------4.75
Volt @1v--------4.69---------------4.75 --------4.77
IR---------------9.2-----------------9.3 ---------8.2

Discharge Curve
15 seconds------5.13-----------------5.12--------5.17
30 sec-----------5.02----------------5.05--------5.07
60 sec-----------4.91----------------4.92--------4.96
90 sec-----------4.87----------------4.87--------4.93
120 sec----------4.82----------------4.83--------4.90
150 sec----------4.77----------------4.78--------4.86
180 sec----------4.72----------------4.73--------4.82
210 sec----------4.66----------------4.69--------4.78
240 sec-----------N/A-----------------N/A-------4.73
270 sec------------------------------------------4.68
300 sec------------------------------------------4.62
330 sec------------------------------------------4.53
360 sec------------------------------------------4.38
390 sec------------------------------------------4.03

**Pack was ran 3 times unshorted then shorted.

Hey Danny I have a question about the integy 0 30 discharger. I few months back after the races were over I put my main pack on the discharger but it was late and I didn't have time to let it cool so I could discharge it. so i left it on there. well I forgot about it for like 3 weeks till i returned to the track. so I dead shorted it and then used it for the main as always and the pack ran like a raped ape. I have since just kept doing it and that pack is by far the best I have. Why?

my other pack all get discharged on the tray then shorted when cool. BTW these are GP3300 packs

It's impossible for me to know what everything does. I would think it's the same as deadshorting.

Hey Danny I have a question about the integy 0 30 discharger. I few months back after the races were over I put my main pack on the discharger but it was late and I didn't have time to let it cool so I could discharge it. so i left it on there. well I forgot about it for like 3 weeks till i returned to the track. so I dead shorted it and then used it for the main as always and the pack ran like a raped ape. I have since just kept doing it and that pack is by far the best I have. Why?

my other pack all get discharged on the tray then shorted when cool. BTW these are GP3300 packs

Permanent 0V traying is (in my book) preferable than DS ... since there are no possibilities for any cell to go reverse voltage ... do the test ... take your DS pack and measure each cell after you DS it, you'll find that you do get some cells that go reverse voltage ... it might be why you got better results.

I recommend not to DS latest cells though ... they're so good unDS.

Steve.
tqcells.com

Permanent 0V traying is (in my book) preferable than DS ... since there are no possibilities for any cell to go reverse voltage ... do the test ... take your DS pack and measure each cell after you DS it, you'll find that you do get some cells that go reverse voltage ... it might be why you got better results.

I recommend not to DS latest cells though ... they're so good unDS.

Steve.
tqcells.com

I have some older resistor trays that I took the resistors off and replaced with a single wire. It deadshorts *each* individual cell in a pack. Once it sits in there for about 2 days, then I DS....... Seems to work great for me.

P.S. I don't put into the DS tray until after I bring'em down in the 0V tray first.

Permanent 0V traying is (in my book) preferable than DS ... since there are no possibilities for any cell to go reverse voltage ... do the test ... take your DS pack and measure each cell after you DS it, you'll find that you do get some cells that go reverse voltage ... it might be why you got better results.

I recommend not to DS latest cells though ... they're so good unDS.

Steve.
tqcells.com

man I tell yah that integy 030 is the bomb I was I could have done all my packs that way. thanks for the info on the IB's I just ordered 4 packs.

the latest batch of Ib cells makes the other cells look like cordless drill batteries! 1.205 plus volts at 35 amps???????? WOW!!!!!!!! i have heard GP has a 3900 cell coming.....i want voltage not run time ...IB is king of volts for now....... zoooooom zoooom zoooom

The GP3900 released is a stick pack. Not sure what they can come up with but so far they have been slow to react. IB is comtitted to doing the best possible RC cell and we have all our confidence in them to keep doing so.

So... have IB and/or GP submited new cells for ROAR aproval for the 2006 season? If so, what cell have they submited? (will they call it 3700, 3800, 3900, etc...)

way to go, kat. remind all of us pee ons that we can never get that kind of voltage. all i run is smc cells, and according to the hobby shop that i buy them at, "danny isn't going to release any 1.20+ cells to the hobby shops". as paul sr. from OCC says..... "that just gripes my ass...." :mad:

honestly pancartom, these new IB cells are all so close and consistent on the discharge curve I dont think the labels even matter.

for instance I cycled 5 packs the other day. Voltage ranged from 1.192 packs up to 1.199 packs every pack was within .01 voltage on the curve. You are never going to feel that on the track. Now say a .05 voltage difference on the curve and you might gain 1/4 to 1/2 a track on a perfect run. But how many times do we see a perfect run with no driving errors, no run-in's with other car, avoiding wrecks, etc

eric, i hear you. i haven't even run my new 3800's yet. i finally built them last weekend to use this saturday. i agree that the discharge curves are awesome with these packs, as i cycled a couple of mine. but my point is that the battery wars are still alive and well in the oval world. that'll never change...

It's always the racers hope... to have a perfect run... and if the guy behind them has a perfect run as well... then they both whish they had another .05 volts (or 5 inches shorter wire, etc... :) ) So, there will always be those that want the highest voltage they can find.

why not put the best packs in the hobby shops and give the team drivers the second best stuff since it really doesnt matter? how about it! :) lol

joe ivo

Wait a minute. The last 2 weeks we have been shipping out 1.198+ in our 4 cell packs. The pack mentioned above was not handpicked for anyone it was bought through one of our customers.

I don't know what you guys think but were not in this business to keep cells set aside for racers who get them free. When a major race rolls around we will keep the top 1-2% cells for that race but we do so many cells every week that we will save these cells from the previous weeks shipment.

LOL some people will never get it Danny. keep up the good work.
question

do you need to let the pack cool before you put 500 sec in them to store? and if I am going to use the cells every 3 to 4 weeks should I do it?

If your not going to use it for 3-4 weeks it should be fine without charge but if you want to be sure you can put 500 seconds back in it. I would do this when the pack is cool.

thanks danny good to see the wireless conection works in the gentlemens club lol

ouch I AM A PEE ON i promise. there are more than a few of those packs floating around i promise. i haven't gotten a pack from danny since august. those were 1.17 packs. rc 4 less jakes performance hobbies and left hander r/c all have those high volt sticks for 50.00 or less. danny goes through a zillion cells a month ..the only time a team smc driver gets great stuff is at a major race and than they each get one pack for the weekend. i promise this is the truth. give one of those companies a call ..the new Ib cells have serious volts...... smc 4 life

just so you know im not saying anything bad about danny or any other company. im just sayin someone said somthing about not shipping to the hobbyshops the best packs. and i would think it would be smart to have the best possible packs available to everyone since a extra 10th doesnt really matter anyways. the fast guys will always be fast even with 2nd best stuff.

once again not bashing anyone i hope it didnt come across that way. sorry!

joe ivo

no bro.....most matchers release alot of there best cells to the public. what happens when they get to the hobby shops is out of dannys hands. but you gotta admit a 1.20 at 35 amps is something i thought i would ever see on a cell of any kind. i can't imagine any other cell hitting that mark?

hey has anybody used that dyna pulse discharger thing on the trinity site?

your right Katfish i didnt think a 4.80 @ 35 was possible. i dont personaly have any yet but i have close and its amazing how the cells are these days. nice job to whoever is involved!

way to go, kat. remind all of us pee ons that we can never get that kind of voltage. all i run is smc cells, and according to the hobby shop that i buy them at, "danny isn't going to release any 1.20+ cells to the hobby shops". as paul sr. from OCC says..... "that just gripes my ass...." :mad:

We have many 1.20+ packs at our shop right now from SMC. That line is total BS. Anything 1.195+ is stout. I can tell you though that the difference between a 1.195 cell pack and a 1.205 cell pack is the mental difference. But since they all cost then same why not, but dont worry if you dont have 1.200+ cells.

Dave

If your not going to use it for 3-4 weeks it should be fine without charge but if you want to be sure you can put 500 seconds back in it. I would do this when the pack is cool.

Hey Danny,

When are the new 3900 batteries comming to America??

More than likely the day after you buy the 3800s...... This battery thing is and always has been ridiculous. :rolleyes: Honestly I don't know how you battery matchers can stand it the way batteries are coming out right now.

More than likely the day after you buy the 3800s...... This battery thing is and always has been ridiculous. :rolleyes: Honestly I don't know how you battery matchers can stand it the way batteries are coming out right now.

You know thats the case with running R/C electric.
Just when you think you have a good pack of batteries a new higher cell
hits the stores...

I guess you have to keep up with the Jones!!! :hat:

There is no plans of a 3900 from IB. Not sure what the other cell manufacturers have planned but capacity isn't always the key. IB is working hard on the voltage curve and have been successful so far.

Why would a cell manufacturer stop doing R&D on cells ? The job of any manufacturer is to try and improve and make the best product. For those who don't like changes you can always run in spec classes but it seems like most racers like the regular opne classes.

Why would a cell manufacturer stop doing R&D on cells ? The job of any manufacturer is to try and improve and make the best product. For those who don't like changes you can always run in spec classes but it seems like most racers like the regular open classes.

I agree...manufactures shouldn't stop R&D on cells.

Everyone knows that voltage is speed!
But not everyone gets the good packs.

Race time should be limited to 4 minutes regardless how good the batteries become to level the playing field.

How many cells do you need to go throught to get a really good 4 cell pack??

I have been racing RC cars for 20 years and with the newer generation cells there is plenty of great packs for everyone. So when your at a race and someone beats you it's most likely your car setup.

We have confidence in the packs we sell and I would not hesitate to buy one of our own packs in a counter and put them in one of our top racers car at a major race. In fact when Ralph Burch won the Snowbirds a few years back we had forgot to put him on our list of racers. When we realised this we took spare packs we had and he used those to win. These weren't the best voltage and runtime numbers but they were good enough to help him win a major race. At other races he has had the best packs we have and he ends up 7th so in the end batteries are not the only thing that counts. Setup and driving is key.

5 minutes is fine and doesn't really make a difference since most classes aren't runtime oriented.