From another board:
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PART !
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Lucas WILL release all the films in a special boxset which is set to released in November this year although rumours state it may be pushed back until May 2006. He will also release a Prequel boxset seperatly for those who already have the original trilogy boxset. The biggest news is however that many more changes HAVE been made to the films (mainly episodes IV-VI).

Below is the details for every disk being released in the boxset containing all the films.

THE PHANTOM MENACE:
New Digital and Audio transfer
The Changes:-
1. Some of Jar Jar Binks's lines have been removed and changed
2. Improved CGI backgrounds in certain scenes
3. Yoda's facial expressions are now mostly CGI (Body still puppet)
4. Darth Sidious digitally shadowed so his face is more hidden

Running Time Before: 133mins New Running Time: 131mins

Features:-
Slightly altered audio commentary
Deleted Scenes
Original Theatrical Trailers
TV Spots
Duel Of The Fates Music Video Featuring John Williams
Collection of Photographs of Cast,Crew & Production

ATTACK OF THE CLONES:
New Digital and Audio transfer
The Changes:-
1. The Jedi Raid on the Droid Control ship has been completed and added to the film (orginal scene filmed during episode II, additional footage shot during episode III)
2. The noises Yoda makes while fighting Dooko have been changed
3. One of C-3PO's lines has been changed and another one has been removed
4. Darth Sidious digitally shadowed so his face is more hidden
5. When Mace Windu shows up on Genosis, the shots showing him slowly walk up to Dooku and Jango is cut.
6. A short scene has been added where Anakin talks with Owen Lars (filmed during episode II)

Running Time Before: 142mins New Running Time: 145mins

Features:-
Slightly longer audio commentary (beacuse film will be slighly longer)
Deleted Scenes
Theatrical Teasers
Launch Trailer
TV Spots
Collection of Photographs of Cast,Crew & Production

REVENGE OF THE SITH:
The Additions:
1. A scene has been added where Yoda explains to Obi-Wan who erased Kamino from the Jedi files and that he is going to await contact on the planet Dagabah (filmed during episode III)
2. An extended battle on Kassakk which shows more battling & Yoda and Chewbacca fighting (filmed during episode III)
3. The Dooko Vs Anakin & Obi-Wan duel is slighly longer (filmed during episode III)
Running Time Before: 140mins New Running Time: 144mins

Features:-
Audio commentary
Deleted Scenes
Theatrical Trailers
TV Spots
John Williams Music Video
Collection of Photographs of Cast,Crew & Production

PART 2
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EPISODES I-III BONUS DISK:
'From Dreams to Reality' (in depth making of the Prequel Trilogy including interviews with George Lucas, Rick Macallum, John Williams, Ewan Mc Gregor, Natalie Portman, Hayden Christian, Samuel L. Jackson, Frank Oz, Anthony Daniels & Christopher Lee) It runs at about 2hrs 40mins

Preview of 'Clone Wars 3D' television series

Blooper Reel (over 6 & a half mins)

'Extending the Saga' (an in-depth look at how the Lucas's orginal plot for Star Wars has changed)

'CGI'ing the Movies' (an in-depth look at how CGI has had a dramatic effect on the Prequel Trilogy)

'Saber Fights' (A documentary regarding all the lightsaber fights in the Prequel Trilogy. Presented by Nick Gillard)

R2-D2: Beneath the Dome

44 Web-Docs chronicling the making of the Prequel Trilogy: 12 from Episode I, 12 from Episode II and 20 from Episode III

Exclusive DVD-ROM Content


A NEW HOPE:
New Digital and Audio transfer
The Changes:-
1. The 'Imperial March' music has been added to Vader's first appearence
2. When Obi-Wan is talking to Luke about his father Anakin’s theme music can heard in the background and when Obi-Wan starts talking about Vader it changes to the Imperial March
3. Luke’s lightasber is blue throughout the film
4. In several scenes where creatures are seen (e.g. The Cantina) some have been replaced by creatures seen in the prequels
5. The bleeding arm Obi-Wan slices off a creature in the Cantina does not have blood seen on it
6. Just before the Death Star destroys Alderaan there is a new scene added where different places on the planet can be seen along with Bail Organa. Shots include Bail being warned of the Death Star, the destrution on the planet which includes massive earthquakes, fire and peopele frantically trying to escape, you see Bail looking up into the blackend sky before the planet totally blows up (filmed during episode III)
7. The Death Star’s computers and screens have been improved
8. The opening text crawl's last paragraph has changed slightly. The line 'headed by Governor Tarkin and the evil sith lord Darth Vader' has been added into it.
9. Luke looks upset when Biggs dies and he sheds a tear (all CGI & PRT)
10. The duel between Vader & Obi-Wan is roughly a minute longer as there are more shots of the lightsabers clashing and them moving about (done using CGI, PRT & Stuntmen playing Vader & Obi-Wan). Music has been added to the scene as well (deatails unknown yet)
11. Just before the medal ceromony at the end, a scene has been added where Vader lands his damaged ship on Coruscant to meet Palpatine. They discuss the destruction of the Death Star, Obi-Wan, & finding the Rebels (filmed during Episode III)
12. Vader's mask eyes remain black throughout the film and his suit is shinier.
13. John Williams has rescored the music for some of the scenes (details unknown yet apart from changes 1 & 2 in this list)
14. a shot of a Rebel ship crashing into Death Star has been removed and replaced with better effects
15. The 20th Century Fox Fanfare & Logo have been updated
16. The end credits have been updated
Running Time Before: 125mins New Running Time: 130mins

Features:-
Alterd Audio Commentary (because of changes)
'A Completed Saga' (interview with George Lucas about the new changes to A New Hope, why he made them and comparing them to the previous versions)
Deleted Scenes
Theatrical Trailer
TV Spots
Collection of Photographs of Cast,Crew & Production

THE EMPIRE STRIKES BACK:
New Digital and Audio transfer
The Changes:-
1. Some shots where Taun-taun’s can be seen have been changed so the Tuan-tuan’s have more movement and look more realistic
2. While the battle of Hoth is going on Imperial ships land near the Rebel base and a few more shots of ships flying and being destroyed have been added
3. Some of the views of Bespin (for example the background where Luke is holding on to the metal poles beneath a building) have been improved to look more realistic and ships can be seen flying around in the distance
4. A scene has been added where Yoda is teaching Luke how to fight with a lightasber made possible by Luke wearing a helmet while training (a stunt double plays him, Mark Hamill provides the voice although it is digitaly dubbed)
5. The Wampa scenes have been edited and restored into the film as well as new scenes added. We see a Wampa being brought into the Rebel base and locked into a room with other Wampa’s. Later C-3PO rips the sign off the door the Wampa’s are behind stating their there and when the Stormtroopers enter the base they open the door only to be attacked by the Wampa’s who then can be seen escaping as the Millennium Falcon blasts off out of Hoth
6. Lightsaber effects improved
7. The sound of Luke’s lightasber turning off as he exits the cave has been removed
8. Some of Yoda's facial expressions have been improved with CGI
9. John Williams has rescored the music for some of the scenes (details unknown yet)
10. There is a line added and one changed in the hologram scene (details unknown yet)
11. The landscape of Dagobah through the fog has been extended using CGI.
12. In the opening text crawl the words “The evil lord Darth Vader” has changed to “The evil Sith Lord Darth Vader”
13. The line Vader says 'Set your course for the Hoth system, I am sure Skywalker is with them' has been changed to 'Set your course for the Hoth system, the rebels have no escape this time' (My Comment: Good, fixes that continuity error)
14. The 20th Century Fox Fanfare & Logo have been updated
15. The end credits have been updated
Running Time Before: 129mins New Running Time: 134mins

Features:-
Alterd Audio Commentary (because of changes)
'A Completed Saga' (interview with George Lucas about the new changes to The Empire Strikes Back, why he made them and comparing them to the previous versions)
Theatrical Trailers
TV Spots
Collection of Photographs of Cast,Crew & Production

RETURN OF THE JEDI:
New Digital and Audio transfer
The Changes:
1. In the battle on Endor more Ewoks and Stormtroopers can be seen fighting and dieing and some parts of the battle have been edited out, members of Han’s team can be seen fighting as well (these scenes were shot during the production of Episode I, 7 years ago)
2. Vader uses the force to reclaim his lightasber after he throws it at Luke and the sound of him turning it on again has been removed
3. The lightasber duel between Luke and Vader is slightly longer (just more shots of clshing lightsabers)
4. The lightsaber effects have been improved
5. Vader has a flashback of Padme after his talk with Luke when he first meets him on Endor (filmed during Episode III) (My Comment: Ughhhh, the talk was one of my favourite scenes from the film, that will ruin it)
6. Kassykk & Utapau have been added to the end celebration scenes
7. Some of Yoda's facial expressions have been improved beacuse of CGI
8. Boba Fett's scream has been changed
9. Chewbacca's Tarzan call has been removed and replaced with a different sound
10. John Williams has rescored the music for some of the scenes (details unknown yet)
11. Some of the battle shots have been cut and replaced with longer improved ones
12. Some shots with Ewoks are now partially CG (mainly facial expressions)
13. The 20th Century Fox Fanfare & Logo have been updated
14. The end credits have been updated
Running Time Before: 135mins New Running Time: 138mins

Features:-
Alterd Audio Commentary (because of changes)
'A Completed Saga' (interview with George Lucas about the new changes to Return of the Jedi, why he made them and comparing them to the previous versions)
Theatrical Trailers
TV Spots
Deleted Scenes
Collection of Photographs of Cast,Crew & Production

PART 3
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EPISODES IV-VI BONUS DISK:
'Empire of Dreams' (in depth making of the 0rginal Trilogy documentary that traces the evolution of Star Wars from a low-budget, labour-of-love space saga to a movie phenomenon that defied the odds and reinvented the rules. At its core, Empire of Dreams tells the story of an independent filmmaker who had to innovate and invent an entirely new way of creating motion pictures. Featuring all-new interviews with George Lucas and more than 40 members of the cast and crew from all three films, Empire of Dreams also includes appearances by a host of filmmakers and media personalities, along with never-before-seen behind-the-scenes footage from the making of the three films. This new documentary brings viewers the most comprehensive look at a pioneer who triumphed against the odds to create an enduring modern fairy tale that has captivated the world) It runs at about 2hrs 30mins

Blooper Reel (over 7 mins)

'The Birth of the Lightsaber' (Its unforgettable hum and scintillating glow are instantly recognizable around the world, and now viewers will discover the origins of this elegant weapon from a more civilized age. This documentary, devoted to the lightsaber, features insight from George Lucas, cast and crew into the history of the iconic laser sword. It showcases the genesis of the lightsaber stunt and special-effects work and illustrates how each film in the Star Wars saga has surpassed the previous one with spectacular action set pieces featuring the Jedi's most trusted weapon)

'The Characters of Star Wars' (An in-depth look at how favourite characters came to be, featuring rare concept art, behind-the-scenes footage and interviews with George Lucas and the cast and crew who shaped the screen's favorite heroes--Luke Skywalker, Princess Leia, Han Solo, Chewbacca, R2-D2 and C-3PO--and the greatest villain of all, Darth Vader)

'The Force Is With Them: 'The Legacy of Star Wars' (Star Wars opened up a galaxy of possibilities to a generation of filmmakers and creative talents. Viewers will hear first-hand from some of the most notable filmmakers of our time about how influential the Star Wars movies have been to their lives)

‘Inspiration to an epic' (A look at the many inspirations George Lucas had to create the world of 'Star Wars')

Saga Trailer (A Trailer for the entire whole Saga)

15 Featureless: 4 from Episode IV chronicling storyline, design, costumes and visual effects, 5 from Episode v chronicling storyline, action scenes, fight sequences, darkness and love story,6 from Episode VI chronicling storyline, design, action scenes, ending the saga, visual effects and fight sequences

Exclusive DVD-ROM Content

I assure you this information 100 percent true. Sources were previously found at the following websites and info will start reamerging on them soon :-
www.theforce.net (http://www.theforce.net/)
www.comingsoon.net (http://www.comingsoon.net/)
www.thedigitalbits.com/rumormill.html (http://www.thedigitalbits.com/rumormill.html)
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Has anyone seen this confirmed yet?

James :)

Just remake the damn movies... jesus christ. We all know he wants to. Maybe then we can get the perfectly fine originals on dvd. I dont really mind some of the changes to the prequels though, especially the digital yoda in phantom menace... that particular puppet was HORRIBLE!

He just cant leave it alone,can he

It's like a scab, and it'll always be bleeding.

NOW,IF ONLY HE'D GET RID OF THE EWOKS! lol

Seriously When are we gonna be able to get the DVD of the good old Prehistoric 1977 Version of Star Wars? When can I finally own a DVD of Empire Strikes Back as it appeared to me on the Big Screen at age 16? sheesh louise

John/Lonfan

So, it IS true. This is the long-rumored Archive Edition. How many versions of the films will have been created before it's all over? I still have the real originals on laserdisc. You can still find DVDs mastered from these occasionally.

these are only rumors

How else is Lucas going to make money! We have to buy new versions every couple of years. The chance for the ORIGINAL SW movie to be put on DVD is ZERO! I have had enough of Lucas's BS! The only reason he put out the Trilogy od DVD,was to get the fans off his back. I think I will stick with what I have. When Revenge of the Sith come out, that finishes Episodes 1-6 for me.

Any truth to the rumor that he intends to re-release ALL the films to the theaters, in 3-D versions? I heard that awhile back. God, he REALLY is destroying what caught me as a child. Eventually, the purity of the original films will be lost, and only those with VCRs, and GOOD memories, will remember the magic that caught us all, a long time ago, in a theater far, far, away.

Stop the madness George. You've made great films, and made MORE than a profit. Leave them alone as we originally remember them, and stop trying to tie the stroyline together. We get it......we CAN figure some of the details out for ourselves.

( Steps off soapbox, and returns to his modelbuilding duties )

"Boldly Go!"
Sincerely,
Scorp :thumbsup: :wave:

Can he digitally add emotion and passion to some aspects of the films that seem stiff and stilted?

actually sounds kinda cool.

How many times has ROTJ been redone, and they still leave in the black matte line around the Rancor? That botch should've been fixed long ago.

After this, I am certain we can expect the 3-D DVD version.


It will never end.

Huzz

these are only rumors

Pretty darned detailed for rumors, ain't it?

Like a lot of sci-fi fans, or fans in general for that matter, I love the Star Wars films. With whatever shortcomings they may have they are fine, well crafted sets of moviemaking. The issues ,for me, have never been ones of a technical nature but rather some shortcomings in writing, dialog and character interaction.

On the technical side, you'd be hard pressed to find better-in fact, I think Mr. Lucas should actually cut back on some of the CG. It's almost a matter of too much information and almost overwhelms you as to what you should focus on in some shots.

As a fan, I would prefer to see Mr. Lucas and the powers in charge of the upcoming TV series (time will tell if that's a good thing) put their energies toward the future of the franchise rather than endless reworkings. Though I may grumble, I'm sure I'll be standing at the checkout when these new versions are released-and I'm sure I'll like them. But 'perfection' is nearly unobtainable-in anything. What he has delivered in the Star Wars saga has come pretty close.

More than anybody else, George Lucas knows that filmmaking is an art-as such, it can be over-worked.

How many times has ROTJ been redone, and they still leave in the black matte line around the Rancor? That botch should've been fixed long ago.

Actually, they finally fixed that on the DVD's.

Any truth to the rumor that he intends to re-release ALL the films to the theaters, in 3-D versions?

Does it really count as "rumor" when it's George Lucas quoted in various sources? Yes, it's all part of the transition to digital projection technology; Lucas and Spielberg are both part of the big push for this, along with, I believe, Peter Jackson (and of course distributors, who'd love to not have to make thousands of prints of each film). The theater owners are the ones not so happy with it, since they don't think they ought to have to pay tens of thousands of dollars for all-new equipment.

Lucas wants to do the 3D versions, one a year for six years, since digital projection will allow for better 3D movies. He didn't specify, though, which movie he'll start with.

Lucas and Spielberg are both part of the big push for this,

Actually, Spielberg has said he will continue to use film as long as it is produced. In a recent interview, Lucas said he is trying to convince Spielberg to shoot the new Indiana Jones movie in digital.

I think the biggest problem with "improving" old movies like this is the same problem with colorization and dubbing. Rather than the viewer recognizing that not everything is made specifically for them, the filmmakers adjust the film to conform with what they are comfortable with. This just encourages the attitude of too many people that what they are used to is the only acceptable approach. If someone can't get into a movie because they find the effects "old fashioned," that is their failing. In other words, alterations like this make people stupid.

In an odd way I'm encouraged. Once he figures out he can't alter his movies anymore, maybe he'll release the original trilogy in their prehistoric 1977, 1980 and 1983 form. The man can't revisit his past any more and it's obvious he can't move on to other new projects. How else will he feed his family? ;)

José

I prefer to watch the originals. I bought a laser disk player just for this purpose (and for the original ST:TMP).

Ooooooooooooooooooo........... Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh. :drunk:

I wouldn't consider these to be rumors. I would expect most or all of these changes, and maybe even a few more, by the time these are released. Probably even more changes by the time the HiDef DVD versions are released.

I wouldn't be at all surprised if all this is nothing more than revenue generation for episodes 7 through 9 which Lucas denies that he ever planned. And I think he also said that about episodes 1, 2 and 3.

Just wait for the press release around 2015 or so from Lucasfilms.

"In response to overwhelming fan demand, Lucasfilms is delighted to announce that the Star Wars series of films wil continue with three new episodes telling the story of the rise of that great Jedi master, Jar Jar binks........."

Huzz :drunk:

Yes, it's all part of the transition to digital projection technology; Lucas and Spielberg are both part of the big push for this, along with, I believe, Peter Jackson (and of course distributors, who'd love to not have to make thousands of prints of each film).Not sure about Spielberg, but I know James Cameron (along with Lucas and Jackson) is also a booster for whatever process they've developed that will allow existing movies to be altered to 3D. This will not be the old red/green glasses process, by the way -- it will use polarized glasses. Based on what I've seen of similar 3D films using polarized glasses at Disney and Universal theme parks, it will be much better than the old process.

I'm still massively curious about exactly how this will be done to existing 2D films. I mean, in the case of the Star Wars films where the effects were already CGI, those particular parts could be rerendered, but the rest ... I'm dying to know how they do it.

The whole thing with digital projection and 3D films could be a good thing -- I'm a little excited to see how these older films will play in 3D, because they weren't made with the sort of 3D gimmick scenes often thrown in when movies are made in 3D from the get-go. But some of this strikes me as a response to people saying they'd rather stay home and watch DVDs, especially those with HDTV-ready widescreen sets. When TV started siphoning off audience numbers from theatrical films, movie studios responded with widescreen films and the like. This might be the same basic idea -- if you want people to come to theaters to see movies, give 'em something they can't see at home.

Qapla'

SSB

The whole thing with digital projection and 3D films could be a good thing -- I'm a little excited to see how these older films will play in 3D, because they weren't made with the sort of 3D gimmick scenes often thrown in when movies are made in 3D from the get-go. But some of this strikes me as a response to people saying they'd rather stay home and watch DVDs, especially those with HDTV-ready widescreen sets. When TV started siphoning off audience numbers from theatrical films, movie studios responded with widescreen films and the like. This might be the same basic idea -- if you want people to come to theaters to see movies, give 'em something they can't see at home.

Qapla'

SSB

There are still PLENTY of people who don't have the widescreen E/HDTV screens at home. I'd love one, but they're just way to pricey, even now that the technology has "aged" the prices down. And whoever thinks that when they "flip the switch" to require all broadcasts to be in HDTV that everyone will go out and buy new HD-ready TV's has another thing coming...there are a lot of people who won't be able to afford them, again, myself included, and until decent sized HD-ready widescreen plasma or LCD TV's are in the same price-range as comparably-sized non-HD CRT TV's are now, that will continue to be the case.

Sorry...got slightly off-topic. I, myself, am looking forward to seeing the complete saga in one box. I'm not as big a Star WARS fan as I am a Star TREK fan, but I do like them well enough that a complete set would be welcome in my DVD collection...which I watch on my plain-old 25" TV, with the black bands across the top and bottom of the screen during widescreen shows. ;-)

Actually, Spielberg has said he will continue to use film as long as it is produced. In a recent interview, Lucas said he is trying to convince Spielberg to shoot the new Indiana Jones movie in digital.

Yeah, but what's going to allow the 3D flicks is digital PROJECTION, not necessarily movies being SHOT in digital format (which, of course, has been happening for a while now). The thing about which I'm most curious with the switchover to digital projection is what happens to IMAX, which is becoming a more popular venue for current flicks?

And Scott, I, too, am curious about what exactly is going to allow for the 3D projection. I'd guess it's a matter of digitzing the film and then assigning some sort of value on a foreground-to-background scale for each item in the shot, then adjusting the projected image accordingly.

One thing I wish he would change is erasing any hint of Ahmet "Jar Jar" Best's voice acting from Ep 1 and replace him with someone who has some talent. If he got rid of that, it would be a great film.

Actually, Spielberg has said he will continue to use film as long as it is produced. In a recent interview, Lucas said he is trying to convince Spielberg to shoot the new Indiana Jones movie in digital.


Speaking of Indiana Jones.........
I remember Mr. Harrison Ford telling them (Speilberg & Lucas) to hurry up on I.J.4 becase Mr. Sean Connery is getting to old to play his dad. :lol:

Agreed and agreed. However I'll forgive GK everything if he just fixes that shot from Ep. 6 where Vader's Star Destroyer crashes into the DS2. I always hated how cheesy that one looked and couldn't believe he didn't fix it back in '97.

Speaking of the TV series,in the latest issue of SW Homing Beacon, production has begun on a new animated series coming fall 2007.

Not sure about Spielberg, but I know James Cameron (along with Lucas and Jackson) is also a booster for whatever process they've developed that will allow existing movies to be altered to 3D. This will not be the old red/green glasses process, by the way -- it will use polarized glasses. Based on what I've seen of similar 3D films using polarized glasses at Disney and Universal theme parks, it will be much better than the old process.
Actually, most 3-D movies ever since "Bwana Devil" and "House of Wax" have been projected using a polarized-light process. The inferior red/green or anaglyph process was only used for ultra-cheapie 3-D flicks and comic books, as well as a few inept attempts at broadcasting 3-D movies on TV some years back.

This is something I posted a while back. I created this with Paint Shop Pro from a frame grab from Planet of the Apes. I'm sure Lucas has access to much more sophisticated software and more computing power, but the principle is probably the same:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v687/bebruns/POTA3d1.jpg

Actually, most 3-D movies ever since "Bwana Devil" and "House of Wax" have been projected using a polarized-light process. The inferior red/green or anaglyph process was only used for ultra-cheapie 3-D flicks and comic books, as well as a few inept attempts at broadcasting 3-D movies on TV some years back.I know; I posted that mainly because some people to whom I've mentioned this think the red/green process is what Lucas, et. al., intend.

Qapla'

SSB

I prefer to watch the originals. I bought a laser disk player just for this purpose (and for the original ST:TMP).

Pretty much same story here -- there are a few flicks I have on laser that haven't hit DVD, like TWILIGHT'S LAST GLEAMING, plus a few on DVD that have been altered (TMP and SW and EMPIRE and the last 2 sides of JEDI), and I'll keep buying up LD players as the old ones die.

The 3-D movie Shark Boy and Lava Girl, used red/blue glasses. It was bad. I could not get it to work, so I left the movie. I don't think I will see the 3-D SW.

i just cant get over how some of you can hate the man today that gave you something you love so dearly yesterday.

must be like a old girlfriend who used to love you!

i guess.

as far as i'm concerned he can do what ever he wants to Star Wars. they are his movies not ours.

now dont be throwing rocks at me.
just explain what is so bad about what he does!

He's taken something iconic, something that millions of people loved exactly as they first saw it, something evocative of the times in which it was made and groundbreaking in the way in which it was made, something that spoke of innocence and adventure, an achievment by a young and promising filmmaker who was trying to revive the innocent adventure films of the past in a time when dirty and gritty realism was king of the theater -- and then he's continually effed with it over and over until the sweet little film we all loved has been turned into an unstable, ever-changing, never-definitive advertisement for George's latest filmmaking product, for his latest film, for his pathological inability to leave anything the hell alone, and for his obsessive-compulsive disorder.

The people who say "they're his films, he can do anything with them" are half-right, of course. He owns the rights, legally, he can do anything he wants with them. But Morally and historically, he put a movie out there in 1977 that uncounted millions of people loved, took into their hearts, lived the fantasy, watched over and over, knew all the trivia... Those people (of whom I'm one) feel a very personal stake in that first film. Lucas GAVE us that movie like a present, like an "I love you" greeting card. Yes, we feel pretty damn possessive of that present.

Then he took the present back and screwed with it! He thought maybe we'd like it more if it had some modern attachments. But we really loved it the way he first gave it to us. Oh but wait, he discovered some MORE modern attachments, so he took it back again and "fixed" it. Dammit, it wasn't broken in the first place!! Then wait, two decades later he gave us some new presents! They weren't really as good as the first present, though. But since he thinks they are, he decided to take back the very first present yet AGAIN, and try to "fix" it yet AGAIN to make it more like the new presents that we don't like as much. Now we're sitting here longing for that neat present he first gave us in 1977, but he's effed with it so much it's unrecognizable and worthless to us.

That's what's so bad.

John, part of that problem is that this latest generation of fans....and I'm talking the ones born after ROTJ's run in theaters in 1983 WANT these changes. The fan-boards seem to be somewhat full of threads on anticipation of new changes to these films. They WANT it.

We are of another time...and we like our stuff untouched. As for me, the only changes I would have wanted to A New Hope would have been just the restoration of the original negative itself, correction of 'garbage mattes' and matte lines and a little touch up of the lightsaber rotoscoping. Other than that, the original film, to me was just perfect as it was.

As to TESB, replacing the old Emperor HoloNet effect with Ian McDiarmid is a change I not only can live with, but appreciate for 'continuity' purposes.

I think Lucas is partially just responding to those fans who, rather than enjoy already-great films, see fit to nitpick every little detail. Those 'fans' are their own worst enemies.

The fx changes I can understand but why didn't he plan the whole story out ahead of time so that the continuity didn't suck and have to be changed and tweaked everytime a new movie came out.

A cohesive script that didn't start with the phrase "I wonder what special effect I can throw in here" would have been a start.

Jim

The fx changes I can understand but why didn't he plan the whole story out ahead of time so that the continuity didn't suck and have to be changed and tweaked everytime a new movie came out.


I take it you have never actually written a screenplay. Lucas had no idea that the original STAR WARS would be successful. The only way he could have worked it all out ahead of time would have been to write the other five screenplays on his own time for no pay. But he could have at least planned it out ahead of time, right? Sorry. What actually ends up in the final screenplay usually bears little resemblance to what is originally planned. When you get to the actual job of making individual scenes work, of making scenes flow together, of creating characters that behave realistically, you can't be locked down to a few lines you wrote years ago.

I remember reading about J. Michael Straczynski's experience when writing BABYLON 5. He was working on the episode where the mad Centauri Emperor was killed. He had always planned for Londo to do it. He set it up for Londo to do it. He was in the middle of writing the scene, when he suddenly realized, "No. Vir has to do it."

The fact of the matter is that fans are a lot more concerned about continuity than writers all. I always like to give the example of the Sherlock Holmes stories and Watson's Wandering War Wound. Conan Doyle established that Watson had been wounded in Afghanistan in the first story. In later stories, he referred to the wound, but never thought it was important to verify where the wound actually was. So we have a wound that moves from the arm to the leg.

I always find it a bit arrogant when STAR TREK fans insist that certain stories shouldn't have been told because they contradict a single throw-away line of dialogue from an early episode of the original season. Personally, I think it is a much more serious continuity problem that in the early episodes Kirk was an introverted intellectual and Spock would often be the first person to suggest destroying the enemy.

I like the changes. As long as the movies are made more interesting.

I wish he'd convert the animated "Clone Wars" to CGI--now THAT would be cool!

I remember reading about J. Michael Straczynski's experience when writing BABYLON 5. He was working on the episode where the mad Centauri Emperor was killed. He had always planned for Londo to do it. He set it up for Londo to do it. He was in the middle of writing the scene, when he suddenly realized, "No. Vir has to do it."

Excellent examples, but not for the reasons you think. There's a difference between what JMS did and what Lucas is doing. Changing things while you're still setting it down is one thing. Going back and changing it after it's presented is another.

So JMS originally wanted Londo to kill the Emperor, then changed his mind and had Vir do it. OK, us fans didn't know any better because we didn't know it. JMS had to tell us that's not how he originally envisioned it, that's how we know better.

The important part, though, is that JMS lived with the consequences to the storyline after he wrote it, shot it and presented it. He did not make an attempt to change the Emperor's killer in later episodes or reissue a "Babylon 5: Special Edition" where the Emperor backed into a butter knife and killed himself. Vir being the killer was pivotal to his character development, and the viewer's perception of his character changed afterwards. He became a stronger, more self assured individual. A change that was necessary for him to assume the throne later.

Lucas is changing Eps IV-VI after the fact to make it fit Eps I-III. After we knew better. He did it backwards: he should've lived with the constraints of what came before and made the newer movies to fit the older ones.

José

He already got seventy bucks out of me for the first boxed set, I don't see any listed changes that I feel the need to pay more bucks for. A big part of the reason Lucas does this over and over is because he makes a fortune every time he does. So every few years he has to ponder the very hard question, 'Do I piss off my original core audience and the fanboys, or do I make another 70 gajillion dollars? Hmmmmmm..."

I'm never much shocked by his decision anymore.

He already got seventy bucks out of me for the first boxed set, I don't see any listed changes that I feel the need to pay more bucks for. A big part of the reason Lucas does this over and over is because he makes a fortune every time he does.

He got my $70 10 years ago on a "definitive" VHS set and he's not getting another penny out of me until he re-releases the originals on DVD as they were released theatrically. That's the way they were and we liked it. ;)

Now I'm leaving to go to school in waist-deep snow, uphill both ways...

José

Excellent examples, but not for the reasons you think. There's a difference between what JMS did and what Lucas is doing. Changing things while you're still setting it down is one thing. Going back and changing it after it's presented is another.

So JMS originally wanted Londo to kill the Emperor, then changed his mind and had Vir do it. OK, us fans didn't know any better because we didn't know it. JMS had to tell us that's not how he originally envisioned it, that's how we know better.

The important part, though, is that JMS lived with the consequences to the storyline after he wrote it, shot it and presented it. He did not make an attempt to change the Emperor's killer in later episodes or reissue a "Babylon 5: Special Edition" where the Emperor backed into a butter knife and killed himself. Vir being the killer was pivotal to his character development, and the viewer's perception of his character changed afterwards. He became a stronger, more self assured individual. A change that was necessary for him to assume the throne later.

Lucas is changing Eps IV-VI after the fact to make it fit Eps I-III. After we knew better. He did it backwards: he should've lived with the constraints of what came before and made the newer movies to fit the older ones.

José

Well that's what happens when you start in the middle of the story.

But as long as we're talking about BABYLON 5, JMS actually did with his pilot the same thing Lucas is doing. I'm not exactly sure what changes he made, but I know he made changes to make it fit in better with the series proper.

And I think the episodes "Babylon Squared" and "War Without End" actually support Lucas's approach. "Babylon Squared" is the one where Babylon 4 is discovered in some sort of time warp. We learn that future versions of the characters are involved. "War Without End" then shows what was actually going on. The only trouble is that our lead character left and was replaced between the two episodes. Obviously, there were changes in JMS's plan and in my opinion it hurts the latter episode. There is strong continuity between the two episodes, but much of it seems forced. For instance, Sinclair's older appearance was very clumsily explained.

So what it comes down to is do you put priority on strong drama or on perfect continuity?

And just to be clear, I'm not buying the original trilogy of STAR WARS on DVD until the original versions are released. But I am renting the new versions. And will probably rent the newer versions when they are released. I think the best approach to all this is just admit there are going to be continuity problems and tell the audience to grow up and accept it.

As far as I know, the changes JMS did to the original pilot have to do with the score, adding background sounds from "And the Sky Full of Stars" when Sinclair retold the story from the Battle of the Line and altering the sequence of some scenes to improve the pacing (I didn't see the pilot when it first aired but my understanding was that it was much slower than the newer cut version). The story itself was not altered.

I agree that "War Without End" seems forced on some parts to make it conform to both the events from "Babylon Squared" and what had happened to the changes in the cast. But, the fact is that JMS didn't go back and alter "Babylon Squared" to make it fit with what happened later in the series. That would've been the Lucas approach.

José

He got my $70 10 years ago on a "definitive" VHS set and he's not getting another penny out of me until he re-releases the originals on DVD as they were released theatrically. That's the way they were and we liked it.

José

Doh! Ok, George Lucas got $140.00 bucks oughta me so far. But not another dime!....... unless maybe there's some good out-takes of Carrie in the slave gal outfit.

Doh! Ok, George Lucas got $140.00 bucks oughta me so far. But not another dime!....... unless maybe there's some good out-takes of Carrie in the slave gal outfit.

Or out of it! :p