Here is the spec range will have on our matched packs. As we get more batches in these specs may change.


365+, 1.16 + , 1.9-2.2

This cell is .005 lower in average voltage compared to the GP3300 but I beieve it's due to the lower IR and how the cell is made.

Danny, Let me see if I have this right . . .

1) SMC is the sole distributor in North America for IB cells.
2) SMC will not be releasing the new IB cells for a few weeks
3) You think Mike should have allowed these cells to be legal at the Birds.

What is it that I'm missing here? That's right I forgot, its all in the chassis.

Seriously though, if these batteries are even slightly better then the readily available GP3300's, then don't you think this gives your team drivers a slight advantage over the field?

Danny, Let me see if I have this right . . .

1) SMC is the sole distributor in North America for IB cells.
2) SMC will not be releasing the new IB cells for a few weeks
3) You think Mike should have allowed these cells to be legal at the Birds.

What is it that I'm missing here? That's right I forgot, its all in the chassis.

Seriously though, if these batteries are even slightly better then the readily available GP3300's, then don't you think this gives your team drivers a slight advantage over the field?
He said he'd have a 1000 packs to sell, so everyone who thought they needed them could get em'.

As I said in my earlier posts we could of gotten 1000 + packs at the Snowbirds easily. I also said that they should of been allowed in the Mod classes only which would of helped the unsponsored racer.

When Trinity released the Panasonic SMH cells they were the only ones to have them at the SNowbirds that year. That didn't seem to cause any issues then.

I believe that is exactly the situation that Mike was trying to avoid. I think he stated that in order to keep an even playing field, he was only going to allow 3300's as they are readily available to all racers. I think he made the right decision. If it had gone the other way and he allowed them, then I guarantee he would have had 100 guys complaining about it. I have a lot of respect for you. I just disagree with you on this point.

We all have our opinions. To me open mod should be open mod not limited mod. Stock and 19t are limited classes. It happened in the past and with the SMH and no one really cared. One of the cool things of the Snowbirds was that you had some basic rules but it wasn't like a ROAR Nats where there is allot of rules. Now it has become like another sanctioned race.

I wouldn't go that far. I doubt whether Mike will ever disallow painted windshields or manufaturers decals in stock.

I doubt he will go that far but still he has changed some since the race has become more popular.

Anyway we will be there with GP3300's. We will also continue matching the GP3300 the only we won't match is the GP3700.

Seeing that all the sanctioning groups rules are set for this yr. 33's are good all yr.

Danny,

Thank you for sharing your point of view. You may well be correct on the mod issue but the line has to be drawn somewhere and, well, it is Mike's sandbox....LOL Will you have any available in Florida for us to take home and play with?

DK47,

Most tracks we in the PA, NJ, DE area race at follow the "general" ROAR rules. If the new cells prove to be of sufficient quality and value to the racer without providing an exceptional advantage, I would think many tracks would allow them in some classes.

Just my .02 cents.

Why stir the pot!!!!
I think the decission was definately the right one!And so does most of the battery industry!!!
So what you are saying,is that you are upset with the decission!
Unless you thought you had an unfair advantage over the rest,why would you be upset? :confused: I think this hooby is expensive enough!!!!!
And the decission to only allow 3300"s,is helping out ALL the racers that attend the SNOW BIRDS!!!
Because now when they arrive,they DON"T have to spend hundreds of dollars
for batteries to keep up!!Because like most of us,we have been getting ready for the last month or more,with tires,bodies,hotel bills,travel arrangments
and OH YAH!!! Getting the best 3300"s we could find!!!!!
SO,can you imagine doing all that,just to show up and find they need the new GP3700"s,that YOU have for sale there!!

And as for your OPEN MOD comment,it shares the same views!
Racing is an awesome sport,take NASCAR for example!!!!!
They are ALL teched,and they" ALL" "MUST"!! use the SAME FUEL!!!
So stop complaining,and get yourself ready for the BIGGEST race of the year!
THE SNOWBIRD NATIONALS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :tongue: :wave:

It is not about "unfair advantages"...SMC does fine at the races, thank you. It is about business. If we wanted an unfair advantage we would not offer them for sale. We want to sell packs because that is our BUSINESS. Racing what we sell only legitimizes our product. We could have shown up at the race with the 3600's and created a huge controversy because at the time they WERE legal. After all, the entry form said "3600's". It was only after we informed Mike that we had a new cell and ASKED his opinion, that the rules were CHANGED. Mike made the decision he felt was in the best interest of his race. We all don't have to agree, but quit calling Danny a complainer. We look at things from a different perspective because this is our livelihood. We are acutely aware of the rising costs associated with racing. That is why we are offering these cells for $100 retail instead of $150 retail. We have watched our cost on the GP3300 rise over 30% in the last two years, yet the price of packs has risen only 5%. The new GP3700 is over 50% more expensive than the first 3300's we bought two years ago. In the end, I hope everyone realizes the performance per dollar ratio of the Intellect cell is a good thing.

Gator: I just like to voice my opinion. If we weren't accepting Mikes decision we would of dropped our sponsorship and asked for our racers to not compete at the race. Those who would of went to the race we would of not supported them. FYI we offered to help one of the leading car manufacturers at the Snowbirds with IB cells if they would of been legal. If you think we only focus on winning races then you don't understand what were about.


As far as the guys spending hundreds of dollars on new packs for the race that is because they believe that is what will give them an advantage. As I said earlier our stk and 19t guys will run one pack for all qualifiers and the main and our mod guys will run 2. We have done thousands of GP cells leading up to the Snowbirds so were don't think we will be at a disadvantage.

I Feel That The New Battery Would Make Little Or No Difference.
I Have Some Smc Cells That Run Out To 3590 Milliamps Already. I Don't Think All This Fuss Is Necessary. What's Done Is Done, Though. It Seems That There Are Some Anti-smc People Out There Doing All The Complaining. Danny And Jack Are Trying Their Best To Give Us Their Best.

Thanks,

Mac

You said>>>>As far as the guys spending hundreds of dollars on new packs for the race that is because they believe that is what will give them an advantage!!!!!!!!!!???????


Like I said before,most guys already had packs purchased from YOU and others for the BIRDS!!!Mike made the correct decission,and the decission was made with the AVERAGE RACER in mind!!!You need to step back and realise ,it is the AVERAGE RACER that buys YOUR batteries!!!!!
So don't worry,you can flood the market AFTER the SNOWBIRDS!!! :wave:

Danny or Jack,

What's the status of these new cells as it pertains to ROAR or Norrca ? ..... are they approved ?

As far as them being allowed at the snowbirds ..... IMHO Mike made his call for what he thought would be best for the race. Whether it would have helped most guys out or not, just the CHANCE they thought they were getting beat by the new batteries would have caused them to buy them afterall this is one of, if not the biggest race of the year for both oval and on-road and everyone is looking for just the slightest advantage.... Even if they are just the slightest little bit better than the 3300's on the track.... people would have felt compelled to have a pack in their pits.

Personally, If I thought I needed too I would have bought one pack and run them all week, because i would want to make sure i did everything I could to run as best as possible at the big race (thankfully the days of needing alot of packs are gone) but then what to do with that pack when ya get home? What if your local track doesnt allow them is another thing to consider, if they arent approved yet? thats why i asked my first question.

It will not help the sport by not allowing new cells. You guys need to remember when GP first came out the cells weren't legal but they soon became legal because everyone bought some and they were bette than Sanyo and Panasonic and the best of all they were cheaper. Read Jacks post about how GP has gradually increased the price of their cells. That is simply not healthy for the sport. If local tracks and clubs don't allow other cells this means GP will be the only cell and they will be able to dictate the price they want for their cells.

It will not help the sport by not allowing new cells. You guys need to remember when GP first came out the cells weren't legal but they soon became legal because everyone bought some and they were bette than Sanyo and Panasonic and the best of all they were cheaper. Read Jacks post about how GP has gradually increased the price of their cells. That is simply not healthy for the sport. If local tracks and clubs don't allow other cells this means GP will be the only cell and they will be able to dictate the price they want for their cells.

I'm all for better and cheaper batteries..who wouldnt be?..... Competition (between cell manufacturer's) benefits the consumer....very much like in any other business. I agree if GP has a competitior they can't be so demanding price wise, otherwise matchers and racers alike will migrate to the IB Cells..... which is going to happen eventually, just a bunch of stuff factors into when i guess.

This thread has been an interesting read. I think we need to look at a couple of factors. I first want to state that this it just a general observation from this racers point of view.

The first factor is racers that remember the steady stream of new and improved cells that were introduced a few years back. With ROAR legalizing them almost immediately and most tracks allowing them to run, racers almost had to purchase them whither they needed new cells or not. Almost all of these cells were from a single "sole importer" that appeared to cram all of these different cells down the racers throat.

Because of this racers, and even some matchers, screamed to slow down the introduction and legalization of new cells. ROAR implemented the rules limiting when new cells can be approved and many tracks also limited what cells could be run.

Then over the past couple years racers have enjoyed the relative calmness in cells. Sure GP improved their cells but the improvements from version to version was minimal and the vast majority of racers never even knew there were different versions (other then the change from the original "big" cell). They just replaced cells as needed during their normal usage and got the improvements as their old cells wore out.

Basically, most racers think that the battery situation is now better then it has been for many years and enjoy the relative stability rather then the battery wars of the not to distant past.

We now have a new battery on the market. There is an importer that appears to be the only one that has this cell available and that appears to be trying to cram this cell down the racers throat. Racers remember the way it used to be a few years back and voice their displeasure... can we see a pattern here?

I am not saying that we have sole importer or that they are in fact trying to cram this cell down racers throat... just that from the racers point of view, it could appear this way. Some even remember the mistake some tracks made when allowing the 4 magnet Binary motor to be allowed to run with "legal" stock motors. Private comments I have gotten is that some racers are wondering if this well respected company is turning into another "Big T".

What do I think will happen? The new cell will be introduced. Some tracks/races will allow them and some racers that like to be on the cutting will use them. During this time racers will learn how to best to use the cell, how best to maintain them, how long they last and if they are any better then the present "legal" cells. Those that don’t have to run them or don’t have the resources to buy them will learn from those that do.

This gives racers some time to figure out their personal needs and when 2006 rolls around the vast majority of racers will have an idea if they need to buy them during their normal cells replacement timeframe. IMHO, this is a win-win for the racer. Those that want to be on the cutting edge can be, those that want to wait can learn for those don’t.

Also during this time, it fosters competition from the battery manufacturers. We may in fact see a lowering of the price or improvement of GP cells if the IB cell is any good. The down side is we may see a number of new cell introductions in the next year. As long as the legality of any new cells is held in check, those that want to be on the cutting edge with the new cells can , those that don’t can wait until the end of the year just to see what shakes out.

The way I see it, the restriction on making new cells legal only once per year has little to no negitive effect on the racer. While the new cell may currently be less expensive then GP cells, if left unchecked we could in fact see a new GP cell that is better (and more expensive) then the IB in a couple of months and racers would be forced to buy them to stay competitive no matter what the price. The unrestricted introduction and legality of new cells could quickly lead to the confusing and expensive downward spiral of the battery wars of the past.

Cramming the cell down people's throats?? You've gotta be kidding. We have dealers and distributors lined up wanting anything they can get their hands on. We aren't trying to drive the market, the market dictates the direction we head. This cell is big in Japan, the far east, and is already legal for racing in Europe. We have customers in all these places and we need to keep pace. If we don't bring it in someone else will. I hardly think we have become like the "big T". That arguement has no basis and is ridiculous. We are still the same battery-only company founded by Danny years ago in Canada. With the same fundamental philosophy of providing the best cells we can to the consumer. If this new cell is less expensive and better, then we owe it to our customers to offer it for sale.

Private comments I have gotten is that some racers are wondering if this well respected company is turning into another "Big T".



WOW!!!!! the "private" racer has not gotten a chance to meet danny face to face..he is not that kind of guy in my humble oppinion. yes danny is in the business to make money and yes that requires him to sell alot of batteries but i think this whole deal is getting out of hand now? in the end it will be "us" the racers that decide what batteries are good or bad and we will vote with our wallets.

if the hobby shop sells smc gp 3300 matched packs at 50.00 and they also sell the smc IB packs at 35.00 and the IB cells have better numbers and let's say they also hold up better..maybe the IB cells will hold there numbers for another 50 charges more than the GP cells... how long before you think "we" the racer holds a fire under roars butt to get them legalized in 2005???

almost every racer i meet has one thing in common...were cheap..we want to pay as little as possible for our stuff.

what is bothering you guys is the fact that danny jumped on these little gems and has become the distributor for them? yup danny is the devil aint he? god forbid he find a better product for us..make it cheaper than the current stuff we use and damn him for asking us to try them out? WOW! (sarcasm)

i'm on the fence with new cells only because i understand most of us have a few fresh packs in our boxes..i'm hoping that maybe by june we will have used them up enough to open up the rules in florida for the new IB cells..most of the oval raing in florida is not roar only. so in the end the racers will determine if the IB cells will be the way to go in 2005. if there cheaper and better than the GP cell i would bet we will be using them sometime in 2005 at florida oval tracks?

danny has been found guilty of trying to sell more batteries and at the same time he is guilty of finding a better cell that is cheaper and better than the one we currently use. he has been honest with us and is entitled to his oppinion. nothing happened mike boylan set his rules for his race and we all have to abide by them. mike has a super hard job of trying to keep us all happy and i know for a fact that he can't do that. let's all relax, stop slinging mud and concentrate on having fun at the birds. we will all deal with the new batteries down the road i'm sure. i know none of us will pay more for less! see all you knuckle heads at the birds..leave the blue cells at home,lol.........

To all of those who told Hank were becoming the next Trinity you can rest assured were not. SMC is a business and when there is a new cell that has potential and we have a chance to be the importer its' the normal thing to do. If we don't do it than someone else will. At the end of this week we will have a new shipment that we will release to he matchers who want to buy some.

Do you think that battery manufacturers will stop improving cell technology because RC racers want to use the same type of cells for many years. To try to limit cell technology is ridiculous evolution happens in everything.


People on these message boards are typically racers but this is only one part of the hobby. Don't you think the backyard bashers can profit from a cell that has the same capacity as the GP3700 and retails for half the price. I know how many stick pack versus how many matched packs we sell and let me tell you stick packs are a big part of the hobby.

I can see why some people might view SMC as becoming like Trinity. As soon as a company says they are the EXCLUSIVE importers of something, that sounds just like Trinity with Sanyo. Right now GP has an open market to everyone. All matchers across the country can buy directly from GP. Now these same companies will have to go through SMC to get the IB cells. Sure the IB cells are cheaper, but what about the other companies that have to buy from SMC and then sell them. With a middleman, the price has a tendency to go up. But, if the prices stay down then there shouldn't be any problems. Having to buy directly from SMC may lead some companies to only offer GP.

Z-Main: Actually only 3 or 4 companies buy from GPINA in San Diego. Most other matchers don't have the volume required to buy direct.


IB doesn't have a US branch like GP so it makes sense that they need a distributor to bring them in from Hong Kong. That is why they have worked an agreement with us. We will do our best to supply the serious matchers.

This question has turned into ,a poor Danny thread!!!!
Poor Danny,he is only trying to help the racers!!(BS<WHAT)!!!!
This hole thread was started because of the SNOWBIRD ruling to NOT allow them at the race!!
YES,we would all love to have them ,if they are better and cheaper than what we have now.But,not until AFTER the SNOWBIRDS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I can't believe that you guys let this get turned around!
Yes,the battery wars between companies does get ugly,but most racers never hear about it.As far as this thread,I don't understand why it was started at all!!
I mean,everyone was given ample time to prepare for this ruling,why start a bunch of rumors and finger pointing,when OBVIOUSLY SMC is the ONLY ones that have a real problem with it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!

BESIDES,they CAN"T be ROAR approved until 2006!!!!!!
so why push them so hard,and get your panties in wad now for???
The more this thread goes on,the worse SMC is looking!!!!!!
Learn how to market your stuff in a MORE positive way!!!!! :wave: :cool:

As I said, this is the perception that I have gotten some feedback on... take it or leave it at that, but don't shoot the messager. I know Danny and respect him too but I can also see from the racers side where it could have been seen as being a little pushy. Racers, for the most part, don't want to go back to the old "cell of the week" that was common a few years back.

to be honest rich i think some got upset because the snowbird web site had stated 3600 and under for a few months. than after danny asked about the IB cells mike had to change what was posted on the web site and turn down the 3600 cells. i know how much flak changing rules and dates and anything else is like.

the new cells will be released...the majority of florida oval tracks do not follow roar rules nor do alot of tracks throughout the coutry. if we dont decide quickly what cells will be allowed at club races soon, it may be too late? it's only poor danny when he is called the next big T ,lol. that is a low blow........ c u at the birds i'll show you my cell if you show me yours! peace this whole thing has gotten stupid........

Let's try to keep this thread positive and not go off the deep end. Thanks!

Amen to that (I know I am guilty of that)! Actually, I think it is we want to pay as little as possible for the best stuff. :)

-Rich


almost every racer i meet has one thing in common...were cheap..we want to pay as little as possible for our stuff.

Why release the IB cell when you can't use them at your local tracks,maybe for practice. I Have some IB cells in my possession right now and I zapped them with a DCX3300 Xapper and "let me tell U some cells actually turned out.
But not all of them. BUt that's the only zapper I could find. Where can I Find a
Good Xapper.

I don't think anyone is trying to stop progress but would like to see orderly introduction of new technology into racing. Bashers now use all types of LiPo batteries and super powerful brushless motors but that doesn't mean they should be used in racing.

Gator: I don't really see what this thread has to do with the Snowbirds. I have always used Hobbytalk to give out information. Since were shipping out this new cell later this week I decided to use the message boards to let people know about them. The thread isn't called Mike will not allow IB3600s.

Check your facts Gator. Snowbirds weren't mentioned until page 3. This is being made into a huge deal. We have the IB cell if anyone wants it. That's it. You don't have to run it. We still sell GP. I stand behind Mike's decision for the Snowbirds so let's move on.

I thought this thread was started to get info on the new IB cells? I just want to know how these cells perform. Its my decsion and each individials decsion to buy the cells I want. I appreciate Danny for finding something new and giving everyone info and specs on these cells. If they perform the same as GP then I'm not going to run out and buy a lot of them. Even if they are better I might 2 or 3 packs. But Danny and his drivers are saving everyone money now by testing them for us. How many times has a new cell or motor came out and you bought one just to find out they are worth the money? As long as the price on these cells, from SMC or whoever, isn't more than GP, then whats the problem.

Z-Main: There should be no problem but for some it seems that everytime a new cell comes out it creates one.


If racers want to buy this cell it's fine with me if they want to keep buying GP cells it's fine with me although we will not carry the GP3700 the price is to expensive and we feel that the IB3600 is a better cell.

If you go out and buy an IB pack it will most likely run as well our a bit better than the GP3300 but I don't think we will ever see a new cell that will obsolete the current cell. The cells capacity will still improve but voltage and IR is getting as good as it can get.

Hey'Danny-SMC can you sell me one of those zappers you use.

Not legal...YET. I want mine NOW so I can learn about them before everyone has them :thumbsup: .
Everyone loves the GP, well it's the same deal as before...Better, cheaper cell. Count me in, I'm all for it :thumbsup: .

Please heep us posted on the runtime issues, as in loss of it, and info on dead shorting as you receive more.

Thanks, Bret

Weapon: Sorry our zapper isn't for sale. At one time Eric Anderson of EA motorsports was building zappers. You may want to contact him.


So far early reports seem like they don't respond well to deadshorting. As far as drop in runtime it seems like they hold up fairly well. Rick Talbot has had good luck with the packs I have sent him with no noticeable drop in runtime. I'm also aware of another pack dropping 15 seconds at 35 amps. We need to have more time on them and get some out there to get a better idea.

Yeah... I guess the thread did get a little sidetracked ;)

Would be interesting to know how best to store them, .9v... with a little charge... full charge... do they require weekly/monthly/etc. cycling.. that kind of stuff. I know no one knows for sure until they have been in use for awhile.

Not to but in on this very interesting new cell, but I just heard there is a new cell out by VTEC as well? Heard anything about this one Danny?

So there could be a 3 brand choice in the future GP, IB, & VTEC? Never thought I wouldn't see Sanyo not in the mix.... Could be good for us racers having competition. I too am cheap and a lower cost cell that works great is looked forward to! I was real happy when the GP cells came out & I look forward to more info on the IB cells.

Better cells cheaper... sounds good. It will be interesting to see if GP will lower their pricing if/when the IB cells start to take off. Since neither the latest GP cells, or these IB cells will be ROAR aproved for anohter year, there is alot of time for things to shake out. If IB has a distinct advantage, or even a equal in proformance cell (to GP's products) there are basicly only two things that could happen... The GP cells come down in price, or the IB cells go up... Well I guess there could be a third... IP goes up and GP comes down and the pricing meets in the middle...

A third cell would do pretty much the same.

Buy em if you want em... don't buy em if you don't... it's capitalisim.

I have seen the VTEC cell and it's most likely an IB cell in different shrink. Just like the Yokomo 3300 is a GP cell and their 3600 is a Sanyo cell.

We chose to sell the IB cell in 3600 but could easily of had them in 3700 shrink but in our test reults we were seeing 3500-3700 under a 35 amp discharge so we feltit was fair to call it a 3600.

Sounds fair to me!

there now were all happy again! lol

count down to the birds continues... woooooooooooooooooooooo

First batch of IB cells shipping out tomorrow. So far Stormer Hobbies has ordered some and SpeedWorld Raceway in California.

when will you update your website its way out of date ???

To busy talking on the web. Just jokeing we will launch a new site real soon.

Danny

Where can someone buy your gp 3300's on the internet? Are local shop that carried your batteries is no longer in business.

Thanks for your help

Jason

We will start shipping them late next week so if your local track or shop deals with Horizon , Great Planes, Competition Products they should have them by the end of the following week.
superior hobbies in orlando does mail order as well.......

http://www.horizonhobby.com/Search/Default.aspx?SearchTerm=batteries&OverallCatID=C&CatID=&SearchType=Standard&BrandID=SUM